Advise on talk with adult daughter . aspergers in granddaughter

[Kat w]

Oh sbgrace....I love you lol :) thank you for that

 

I so agree.

 

And momathwk. Yea. I'm not sure how or what to do about thst.

I could sure use more time for my boys and will need to around end if Jan.

 

When they have others keep her. It's a problem. For someone. The caregiver , dd and Sil perception of what anyone may be saying.

 

I think he really wants to be a better dad right now. I think if he will step up to the plate ( and we....let them work it out with out any input from us.

 

I did not want to go there with anyone.

O was jus around if they needed ys.

 

They soent a year and a half in ky. That's where she had her baby. I went there a lil before and some after , after they were good.

 

The military docs have been saying things since she was in utero.

She has a document that says it.

 

They have done somethings when she was smaller but, we made them make the decisions. Leave and cleave. Good for a marriage. Was hard for em tbo.

[Kat w]

Oh. My daughter has her on film from things she does with her.

They are way worse with her but I think because I'm a looser parent. You have to be flexible or go nuts.

 

So right now they have all the doors wide open. ( driving hubby nuts lol)

 

Running through the house. Havin a blast. Tracking in sand. ( we run fl)

The radio on the porch too high for my liking. But. Hey. I guess I'll deal for awhile .

 

Music and fresh air and ru ning over n over again?

 

Love it lol.my daughter would never let her DD do it. My daughter straight up says...her ocd is getting to her. So, I'm helping. More than I did before and I wish they would purse other options too.

 

But as long as she/they are in this amount of need, we have to assist. There's letting them find their own way..lime when they were in ky and first got home. Big transition . see felt it was some of our early hard times they put us where we are today ( I don't always like what he says or does but ..he I too I'm sure lol)

So, they did and they did good and they have done alot together.

 

Right now. So much going on. Thwy are more stressed than ever.

 

Whata the line if letting them go find their own way( they bend)

 

Or not throwing our a life preserver when u see hey....they are seriously sinkin here. And they are not opposed to the help and actually ask. My Sil is always careful to not or wait

[Kat w]

Tries/ thinks he being careful about not overloading us, his mom cNt deal w it and sends her back early. Well if that's been their childcare solution at the time. They depend on it.

 

It's hard to call in sick sometimes b/c you have no childcare for that shift. When they r both on nights for days at a time. ....and a child who doesn't sleep...yea. That's tough.

 

But. They have to make other arrangements and right now for both of them and where they are....i think help is warranted.

 

Lime. Thwy r both ready to break. I don't want to see them break. So.

 

We thru life preserver to em lol

[Kat w]

Esp. When she already gets sick enough as it is. My daughter thinks its because in their jobs they bring home alot of gtundhe. May be. Who knows

So they need their sicktime for their own sick RSS and hers when its bad cuz my daughter calls in.

[Kat w]

She didn't get el. I'm sad about it. What can I do? Nothing.

 

That's what I'm saying. I sit here and watch the train in a collision course. Bigtime

[Kat w]

Sbgrace,

 

I've thought alot today and carefully considering all of it.

 

I am gonna make a prediction on what my daughter might say. Mama, was wondering when you were gonna say something. Lime, she will think what I'm doing with her, is satisfactory at this point where she and there child both are.

 

Maybe not, but I could see it going that way . I can now. Thinking ...helps. Thanks guys

 

Ps. I'll die a thousand deaths if that's what she says. Then, I shoulda said something sooner.

Ugh. I want the exact scripted manual! Lol. Not as easy as a curriculum anymore with the adult children.

Edited December 6, 2015 by Kat w

[Kat w]

They were a lil mifded when we had them do more on their own. I think it was mostly sil. But daui sometimes yes sometimes no I think

[Kat w]

Sbgrace , honestly, she's so classic everything my 11 yo was when he was little. And an important thing to nite here is,

This , my ,11 yo is the one my daughter makes me promise she vets if something happens to her dad and I. They were close.

 

She helped him and me with stuff. We all pitched in. She knows, she's been thru it all with us. Hence, she knows I'm capable to help her in this right situation and she needs it. So... I do what I can. We all do. My 11 yo included. My daughter helped me with him. He's helping with her daughter .

 

My daughter made that analogy thanksgiving . was a really good day. Best ive had in a long long time. :)

 

So, I think right now? May daughter thinks the dmamage is at a minimum being mittigated to some point anyway.

Vs. Other stressors that direction need ATTN right now.

[Kat w]

Momathawk.

 

I've really o ly done what asked to do. My daughter hates asking for help. Thsts why if she's coming to me this way repeatedly , she needs it.

 

I'd love for the granddaughter to be with her mom more and dad more.

 

Just right now. Not happening and I'm asked so....

 

I do what I can and hope they will do more when thy have her.

 

At times , I've almost begged her to spend more time with her DD.

 

What am I supposed to do??

Rollin with it right now and trying to figure out best way .

Edited December 6, 2015 by Kat w

[Kat w]

Example:

 

Sil calls ( and this has happened several times) and says I have a test tmrw or a final to study for and I can't. She's cryin n screaming and I need to focus. Can you please meet me and get her for the night.

 

What are we supposed to say? No?

 

I mentioned earlier uo, they are both in school . like...rwal college. 2 jobs and a house , all ,= work.

 

They are spread thin asking for help.

 

Sil , academics do t come naturally to him lime they do my DD so he works extra hard. Bes trying to prove I to her and himself he can do it. And be a contributor to the family.

 

You know this situation s where one spouce is more successful than the other?

Hes trying to do well too.

Edited December 6, 2015 by Kat w

[PeterPan]

My MIL has helped us out a lot.  I didn't realize, as we were doing it though, that the *reason* we needed so much help was because something was wrong.

 

It sounds like they have a lot more complicated situation than can be solved here.  Either you want to help out in the ways they want or you don't.  And I know some families where that's an ok dynamic, exactly what you're describing, and some where it wouldn't be an ok dynamic.  So it's more just a question of how you family works.

 

I think there's an issue if she wants you to watch the dc and the dc is having challenging behaviors.  It's all fine to say a grandparent can do as much as the professionals would, but that's not necessarily true.  The grandparents might be able to facilitate a lot IF the dc had a behavioral plan or the grandparents had background in precisely what was going on.  But with no information to make a game plan, love only takes you so far.  It sounds like this dc has some seriously challenging behavior.  She may need speech therapy.  Have they had her speech eval'd?  If she has some communication issues, then she might escalate in the face of non-response (or non-desired response) by the parents.  So then what the parents are frustrated over could be a communication problem or something else, not just a so whatever dc, kwim?  

 

And to me, I go back to if *I'm* going to watch the dc, *I'm* not willing to put up with things that are behaviors needing treatment, behaviors needing therapies.  I'm cool watching a dc, but if you dump a dc with me you better give me the tools to handle the dc. For instance, my ds would go to my MILs and hide under the table.  That meant they didn't have the skill set to handle his behavior at that time.  They needed more tools.  So if she is having inappropriate or unexpected behavior when you watch her, then I think it's right to DEMAND the do something before you watch her or say you can't watch her.  In reality it's THEIR problem to deal with at that point.  Tough love and all that.

 

So I'm mean.  I'd say sorry, her behavior is beyond me, you're gonna have to solve this one Babes. And that would be the end of it.  But I'm mean.  I wouldn't care if she dropped out of school, because in reality with unattended asd, with both parents mentally checked out and behavioral problems growing, this is gonna get much worse, not better.  Are they going to STARVE if one of them has to drop out to care for this child?  I'm assuming they really, really need to do all this work or they wouldn't be doing it?  If they won't starve, me, I'd just be pulling the plug.  But I'm mean.

Edited December 6, 2015 by OhElizabeth

[kolamum]

You might find it beneficial to look into Irlen Filters for the eye darting & "checking out" you've mentioned.

[kolamum]

Example:

 

Sil calls ( and this has happened several times) and says I have a test tmrw or a final to study for and I can't. She's cryin n screaming and I need to focus. Can you please meet me and get her for the night.

 

What are we supposed to say? No?

 

What you choose to say is up to you. Nothing anyone else tells you will matter because your heart is going to be conflicted no matter what path you choose. Speaking as the daughter of a parent who didn't ever say No, can I at least, gently, suggest you set boundaries?

 

You need a sit down with your grandaughters parents & an agreement to make an appointment by a specific time. Perhaps you could even offer to take the child in. As the parent of a child with special needs, it's one thing to know there's something wrong & it's another to get confirmation. Confirmation is both alarming & relieving all at once.

 

It's a relief to know that something IS going on & that you CAN get help, but it's also gut wrenchingly painful to sit there & realise that there IS something wrong. That may sound completely insane, but that's how it is. Having said that, the biggest priority should most certainly be the sake & health of the child..

 

My previous post still stands. Irlen Tints are not for vision problems but neurological & they have been known to help many people with Autism, Aspergers, Seizures, & more. Three people in our home wear them all for a variety of reasons..

[Kat w]

Yea. She doesn't do alot of this stuff for me I think a big part if it is styles in living.

 

Ex:

Right now I have 2 box communities lol. Each boy made a series of comex ( to them) towns. Complete with an elevator lol.

 

Then I have playdoh that the grd loves on the floor with her tools. She's playing with it. Then there is the recycled bed board where we measure their heights and date it.

 

The boys are coloring the board with markers decorating it.

 

This would drive my daughter insane. She just now was able to handle play doh in her house. So...

 

It's partly...the grd isn't enganged at home. We really don't see much at all of the fits here. And I make her take turns etc.

 

The ocd is vetting the best of my DD at the moment so.

Do what I can.

I'm going to go the question route Tues. And the gifted route. I think my daughter would be way more willing to make that first call....have me get the ball rolling...something.

Hopefully she can make a decision.

[Kat w]

Kolamum,

 

That sounds like something to look into for sure. Thank you. Never heard of thst.

I will Google it.

 

Yes. I do feel like sometimes my hands are tied cuz she's not my child, yet, daughter is...ugh. Idk

 

I'm going to talk to DD and have hubby talk to sil.

Sil in the beginning couldn't understand why we wouldn't pay their ins lol. And got mad ugh.

My daughter was of the mindset. Why would they pay our ins???

 

We cut the umbilical cord for him and he wasn't happy ha-ha.

His parents just threw money at everything . no time spent together etc.

 

He understand s now, we support them and will help where we can, but cuz we love him....and them...we let them have their building time as a couple together. So. He's good with that now.

 

So, we don't want to alientate him. But...ugh. I'll talk with her Tues. In question form and hopefully she will decide what she wants or needs help with and what they are going to do about it.

 

Honestly?, I'm seriously afraid when she hits private prescho? They are going to look at it n go...hmmm.

Why? You 2 county workers who see alot?? Haven't gotten your child services?

 

That's a big fear of mine.

[Kat w]

I do think she has seizures. I think that's what the eye darting is.

 

They just got her glasses. Haven't seen a diff but its only been almost 2 weeks. I have no vision therapy exp. But I'm going g to be investing more with my 11 yo in Jan.

I think it was missed by ppl and I didn't know it existed fil these boards. The therapists said they didn't see where he would need it but I could purseu personally but was very expensive .

Gonna pursue in the new year

[Lecka]

Okay, I totally agree with sbgrace on many, many levels.

 

I think the autism spectrum is so broad. I think there are many, countless kids who have no real need or benefit from outside help of a more formal kind. Or who can get help and not need to go through a school district.

 

I totally agree.

 

If I read into this and it seems like, from my context and life, it seems like this situation, then I agree.

 

But, in that huge spectrum, are kids who have a greater need for intervention. There are situations that get to be a crisis level.

 

One does not have any bearing on the other. Things are so, so broad.

 

I know a few people who have been in crisis or near it. That is me.

 

Then I know many more people who have never been in or near crisis.

 

It is a combination of the child's profile, and the family situation.

 

It is just so broad and situations can be so different.

 

I totally agree that it is a totally appropriate and desirable decision for many, many families.

 

For what hwk says, that is my personal-life position. However -- I communicated it to the family members in question. It does not sound to me like this is being communicated here. But, I really agree, too. For most situations it would be my firm opinion.

 

Separately, maybe I am misreading this. But I have been to a speaker who is an adult women who has Aspergers and she was (from my memory) in an emotionally abusive relationship. She is saying, some traits of Aspergers can make some women at risk of emotional abuse. She has written a book about it. I had never heard of this issue before, but it was part of the workshop. I think it might be worth checking out if there are concerns about the relationship dynamic. Maybe it would give some kind of insight. I don't really know. I will try to google the book. My apologies if I am misreading there.

[Kat w]

No apologies needed Lecka :)

Thanks k you for reading and commenting.

 

I'm not sure I'm following what your saying g about what hk said.

 

Can you break it down. For me? Sorry and thanks

[Kat w]

Theres a number my daughter was given by her old boss. For her....she hasn't called it.

And do you know of a good book? I'm sure there is one . I don't know what tho. I'm tryin to do damage control with the lil one lol

 

And this is why we have recommended when she comes to me about things...I mention counseling.

My husband has tried to spend more time with him and share our own personal stories and how counseling helped. ( we never had this particular issue but bad others. Raising kids is hard! Lol)

Edited December 7, 2015 by Kat w

[Kat w]

PS. Momhwtm,

 

That wasn't the case here with my daughter I assure you.

If anything, the sil got mad we didn't do enough to *support * them.

 

My daughter is independent . she's always worked and paid her own way. He wasn't a...real big worker if ya catch my drift. His previous career ended abruptly after a stint where he came back with well, the usual issues you would expect there.

 

Then the cop job. Thsts new. He started about 9 mo ago . they've been married goin on 7 years. And that's almost 2 years of employment.

 

So....my daughter has been sole provider for years.

Lots goin on. Of course, I can't go I to it all and I realize and appreciate you and everyone trying to be helpful on a Sunday when you could be doing anything else.

 

This ,however, not the case here.

I do empathize with your plight. That was ME! ME as the emergin adult with my parents. I have worked hard over the years to not be my mother.

Now, my mom lol. Thsts what irrites my DD :/

[PeterPan]

Stressful, whew!

[Kat w]

Very...and worrisome.

[Lecka]

I mean my mom and aunt were mentioning to me they saw autism signs for a year before I asked for the referral or went back to EI screening.

 

I would roll my eyes and at first, say why they were wrong and just looking for trouble when none was there. Then, I was planning on it but had things going on so I didn't do things as fast as they liked.

 

So I did not mind one mention per month by phone, or once per visit. Fine. More than that and I would end the conversation or be irritated about it.

 

That is how I personally felt.

 

But I am maybe more independent. I live a 5 hour drive from my mom and aunt. My same-age cousin was diagnosed with Aspergers in his early 20s, and I felt they were just looking for trouble.

 

So -- for me -- my response is, make one small mention per month, no more, and then stay out of it.

 

But I don't think that is the answer for every possible mother-daughter relationship.

 

My oldest child was born overseas while we were stationed in Germany. Just me and my husband. I was 25 when my oldest son was born and had lived in another state from my parents for most of the time since I graduated high school.

 

My husband is also very independent as far as accepting help from my family. He can accept it now, but in the beginning of our marriage I turned down some help that he felt like was insulting to his income (aka was implying he didn't earn enough). So I told my parents we did not need some things that were offered. We paid our own airfare for visits when my parents would have paid, and some things like that.

 

So -- that is part of my dynamic with my mom.

 

We are very close and talk all the time. I love talking to her on the phone! I ask her advice about cooking all the time. I ask her advice about other various things. I ask her advice about my daughter because they have a similar personality in a lot of ways.

 

But when it comes to certain things, I am simply not interested in hearing her advice. I am the one who is going to do it.

 

But -- this does not mean that it is universal. But, I think it is very, very common.

 

But your dynamic sounds like it is not one where your daughter would be irritated and insulted. And if she is -- honestly I don't think she would hate you if you made a push one time and were told it wasn't welcome, and then waited 6 months to mention it again. Or if you insisted to continue a conversation after she said she didn't want to discuss it further.

 

She doesn't sound like she is ending the discussion.

 

It sounds like she quits talking and then you don't keep going. Maybe she is overwhelmed or doesn't know what to say. It is very different from saying "I don't want to talk about it."

 

I agree with pp, it is not mean to be unavailable. You can tell her no. She can find somebody else, or she can have a consequence to her choices.

 

She is choosing her big house of lots of work. She is choosing her many obligations of school/work. She could choose to have different priorities if you are unavailable for on-demand free childcare.

 

I am not saying to never do it. But, yes, you can tell her no at various times. You can be tired. You can be in the mood for a book. You can want to spend time with you husband. It is fine.

 

Sometimes people choose to be busy so that they can avoid problems. Sometimes people overextend themselves and have to cut back.

 

This is stuff where I think you are good to help her a lot, but not so much that she is free to sign up for an extra class and live in a time-intensive home, and you just pick the slack up for that.

 

If she truly could not get by, I would not say that. It comes across like there is a lot of choice involved in their lifestyle, though, and on that I think you can say no!

 

If she gets a bad grade on a test, maybe she will study earlier next time in case her daughter is not ready to entertain herself at the last minute. That is not even autism, that is just parenting, to some extent. Sometimes kids interfere with our plans. Maybe she will decide to cut back somewhere. Maybe she will hire a babysitter. Maybe she will ask her husband to schedule in times that he is going to meet her needs so she can study.

 

There are choices there.

 

If that sounds reasonable, great.

 

If things sound more crisis-y than that to you, like you think it would be a bad situation if you told her "sorry, tonight isn't a good night for me" then to me that expresses a need for diagnosis/intervention.

 

Edit: I cross posted and I am a bit confused.

 

I would really stay out of their relationship, unless it is crossing lines. What does your husband think? Is he also concerned in this way?

 

If your daughter has a hard time with some things, I think she could also need more help than what adult children with jobs usually need and want. She could need more, and be open to accepting more.

 

This is again -- an area where my parents had better stay out of it. But it sounds like you and your daughter have a different kind of relationship. She sounds like she is open to your counsel.

 

I am assuming like you still see signs of Aspergers that could be making some things more difficult for her. I don't know on that.

 

If you are seeing it, I feel like ----- these gaps in conversation where you think she will make a leap of "putting things together" might not be her strength. Maybe speak more directly, even though that would usually come across as rude or patronizing. Maybe she would actually appreciate it. This is just a thought.

Edited December 7, 2015 by Lecka

[Lecka]

Separately, if your daughter continues with any other signs of Aspergers, I think it is worth considering that she is getting hints from other people, but isn't picking up on the hints. Maybe there are concerns expressed she doesn't pick up on.

 

I have the hardest time with deciphering what people mean with this stuff sometimes.

 

They may think I know what they are talking about and we are on the same page, but really I am not clear what they are talking about.

 

They might be using euphemisms and tricky things like that.

 

When it is an awkward conversation the euphemisms and veiled language do have a way of coming out. People don't want to be blunt, but that means they are indirect.

 

That is just a thought, too.

[Lecka]

Re-reading.... Is your daughter treated for ocd? Does she literally have ocd? I don't know. If she literally has ocd she needs to deal with that.

 

The book I mentioned is something like safety skills for aspergers women but liane holiday. I can't link and can't remember, but if that is not good enough I could look again.

 

It all sounds complicated .

 

Overall -- I think you can go two ways.

 

One, step way back, and let them figure things out. Step way back in various ways. Still help but maybe less or not on short notice, etc.

 

Or, step in and say what you are thinking. Tell her about parenting techniques. Point things out to her. Take the lead on some things a bit more.

 

It seems like you are doing a lot, but leaving a lot unsaid.

 

I feel like it would be better to either do things and say things, or else don't say things and also set more of a boundary.

 

You have got the worst of both I think.

 

I think when parents are helping a lot, they can talk more and express opinions. They ARE helping. You don't want them to hate you when they don't need help anymore, but I think that is a risk but maybe okay.

 

Or, you stay out of it more on all levels.

 

Your daughter and SIL can choose how they respond, too. Maybe they have a different relationship with you where they are not having your help for no-notice babysitting and help on home repair projects. Or, maybe they accept help plus advice. They have choice there, too.

 

I think you are doing too much to see them doing things that hou seem to disapprove of, if that makes sense.

 

I also think -- they were making it with the SIL having no job. Are they worse off now that he is employed? Do they have to work all these shifts and take all these classes.

 

I get it if the answer is yes.

 

If they have bought an expensive fixer-upper though, that is not a crisis I think you need to drop everything for.

 

Your daughter not feeling like dealing with a child is also not a crisis.

 

If your daughter has sensory issues or rigidity that you think are related to Aspergers and that are currently not acknowledged -- well, I don't know how you bring that up. But if this is effecting her parenting I think maybe you just recommend some parenting techniques that might help her? I don't know.

[Kat w]

I jis lost my long post. Ugh

[Kat w]

Oh but yes. She has doagnow literal ocd.

She refuses meds. Always has for anything. I wish she would. She is an adult . I can't make her .

[Kat w]

And the job thing. They don't IMO need second jobs.

 

My daughter is saving money and frugal. She didn't want the house. He bought it anyway. She jjs wanted a no maintenance apt somewhere .

 

He bought a new car for first time in his life. Hence his second job.

 

Her s is to save money .

 

When he didn't work he wanted his parents to babysit just for fen purposes. They didn't much. And we loved visits but for babysitting. Well. Get a job and maybe ...til then. Ur in ur own boat buddy lol

 

But yes. I do see aspergers in both my daughter and her daughter .

 

I'm gonna suggest gifted route.

Hope it helps

[Kat w]

High functioning I should add. She was asked about it when she went to the facility my boys went to. She was a teen and ran across a few blips so we went back.

The first either of us had heard about it. She wasn't a fan of it lol

[Kat w]

The daycare has flat out suggested further investigation .

...to my daughter , not sure what if anything they've said to sil. He's never said

[Kat w]

And remember....they have documents from the military docs. They wanted to investigate further too.

 

No fruit.

[Kat w]

Lecka, my sweet daughter so does not get any subtle hint.

 

I'm sure thsts why the owner of the daycare talked to me about it. I told her talk to my daughter . thsts when they were more blunt.

 

She only gets bluntness.

I've so almost wanted her to do superflex w my boys! Lol

 

I doubt she'd get it then. Idk.

[Kat w]

I struggle with the line on that with her.

 

She doesn't always get it. My mom is intended over it. I tell her. Be quiet. She makes my DD mad.

 

So far that haant been my experience.

Maybe I should be more blunt. What others see as blunt, she usually sees as just talking.

 

Maybe you're right, maybe she's not making all the connections in her head.

Could very well be the case.

 

I'm going to feel it out in Tues. Go the question route..see if I really think I just need to come out and say it . tho, I have when she first asked me about it.

 

She said mom, I think she might be aspergers. I said I do too honey. How bout calling to schedule and eval.

She was so worried in her eyes. How that ever died in the water...I don't know.

 

I want to let her love her life and make her decision s. But. She comes to me with stuff to help reason out. Sometimes ....it's just work man! :)

I'm pushing 50, have 2 lil SN guys.

 

I am tired. I am more tired when she's here. The waking in the night for me. Sometimes grd does. Sometimes she doesn't. She is always waking up with her parents or other grandparents but again....I run em. Play tag...kick ball. ( that's really cute :))

Keep them engaged and structured. Grd thrives on that structure . and my house if full of things for the SN child.

Paints markers playdoh math manipulative ,blocks legos on and on. So....she's getting her sensory stuff to the hilt, learning things, plauys, runs alot, rides the horses w grandpa.

She sleeps good for me. Usually lol.

 

But when ya let em run all circles around the house with the open doors and they do that for 2 hours....they're gonna get tired lol

 

I'll never forget when I was first starting homeschooling I read a Mary pride book.

They had taken in foster kids.

Boys had a blast. Did the same thing. Ran around the house...played with things etc.

 

In 2 weeks when the social worker visited she asked...how are the boys doing on their meds? Mary said meds...noone told me about that. We don't have em. She said...oh.

And the boys were doing good.

 

Then she asked about spec ed classes. She said...i forget what and alot of you may know the story better than I...its been almost 20 yes since I read it.

Point being:

When you keep any child but esp those with more energy and...well. Fiestiness lol....keep them busy and engaged. It's a while another world.

 

My 11 yo takes meds. But he runs a bunch, has creative outlets. Lots of things around thst he likes to do. It helps a ton. It would be way worse without it.

 

My daughter just can't go there. She doesn't mind when I'm over and thwy do it cuz she knows me and all 3 kids are gonna have it all back together before we leave BUT....she foes retreat to her workout room and exercise. Lol