stobaugh vs. notgrass American History

[downthelane]

Can anyone provide me with some insight into how these 2 materials compare? Just a little more background. I at first glance really liked the Stobaugh text - the unit a week - topic a day with a reflective essay at the end, but once I purchased the the text and began to read through it I found it filled with a fair amount of personal essays by the author at the beginning and end of the text. At first, I thought we could simply skip them, but then I became concerned that maybe the "history" itself has a great deal of the author's opinion. I realize every author writes from his/her perspective, but there was just a bit too much - religion and personal bias - from Stobaugh. My student does.not.want a preachy text.

 

We've been using living books up until this point and wanted to go a streamlined one year route for American History for his Junior year. Any suggestions if Notgrass doesn't fit the bill?

[HollyDay]

Honestly, I am not a big fan of either text. Dd said they were "a bit too dry" for her liking.

 

My oldest actually used AOP LifePac American History. I supplimented with various works of literature and other resources. It worked quite well for her because it fit her learning style.

 

My youngest has a different learning style so we will be looking at other options for her when she approaches 11th grade. Some thoughts to consider.......

 

BJU has a US History course. I've not used their high school text so I can't comment on it personally and I beleive they have come out with a newer edition since I last looked at a student text. I did use their American Republic as a resource. It was a good resource, but since it was not my primary spine, I can't really comment on the bias that may or not be present.

 

Several families locally used All American History for high school US History. They supplimented with extra writing and lit, but they spoke well of the program.

 

I just saw Power Basics US History at our local homeschool bookstore. I've not looked at it, just noted that it was in the high school section.

 

One local family used Joy Hakims US History for high school last year. I used it as a suppliment to SOTW vol 4 for 6th and 7th grade fyi

 

HTH

[downthelane]

My oldest actually used AOP LifePac American History. I supplimented with various works of literature and other resources. It worked quite well for her because it fit her learning style.

 

Could you say more about her learning style? What would you say are the pros/cons of LifePac?

 

My youngest has a different learning style so we will be looking at other options for her when she approaches 11th grade. Some thoughts to consider.......

 

BJU has a US History course. I've not used their high school text so I can't comment on it personally and I beleive they have come out with a newer edition since I last looked at a student text. I did use their American Republic as a resource. It was a good resource, but since it was not my primary spine, I can't really comment on the bias that may or not be present.

 

Several families locally used All American History for high school US History. They supplimented with extra writing and lit, but they spoke well of the program.

 

I'm not familar with this text, but it looks like a Middle School product. Thoughts? Ideally I would like something already high school level. However, I'll look at it closer.

 

I just saw Power Basics US History at our local homeschool bookstore. I've not looked at it, just noted that it was in the high school section.

 

I'll have to check it out.

 

One local family used Joy Hakims US History for high school last year. I used it as a suppliment to SOTW vol 4 for 6th and 7th grade fyi

 

I looked at Hakim. The tone just seems young for my son.

 

HTH

 

 

Thank you for all your thoughts. I appreciate them.

[Musicmom]

My dd has enjoyed the book, History of the American People, by Paul Johnson. It's not a curriculum, but a book telling the entire history of the US from the earliest beginnings through the 20th century--in greater (and more interesting) detail than you'd find in any text. DD found it very engaging. (It was recommended by SWB in TWTM--in our older edition anyway!)

 

The book is about 1000 pages long--but spread over a 36 week school year that amounts to covering roughly 30 pages a week. Quite do-able. You could use it as a spine, and add in documentaries, other living books or primary sources (such as the Constitution) to flesh it out. For grading, you could assign a few papers. If you do American Lit alongside it for English, that would enhance it as well.

 

(I'm not familiar with Notgrass, but we shied away from Stobaugh for the same reasons you mention--too much personal opinion.)

 

ETA: Just wanted to add, based on your comment above about the tone of the Hakim series being a bit young (we used Hakim in middle school), that History of the American People is definitely high school/adult level.

[downthelane]

My dd has enjoyed the book, History of the American People, by Paul Johnson. It's not a curriculum, but a book telling the entire history of the US from the earliest beginnings through the 20th century--in greater (and more interesting) detail than you'd find in any text. DD found it very engaging. (It was recommended by SWB in TWTM--in our older edition anyway!)

 

The book is about 1000 pages long--but spread over a 36 week school year that amounts to covering roughly 30 pages a week. Quite do-able. You could use it as a spine, and add in documentaries, other living books or primary sources (such as the Constitution) to flesh it out. For grading, you could assign a few papers. If you do American Lit alongside it for English, that would enhance it as well.

 

(I'm not familiar with Notgrass, but we shied away from Stobaugh for the same reasons you mention--too much personal opinion.)

 

 

 

Interestingly, I was planning to use Janice Campbell's American Lit and I "think" she mentioned at one time Johnson as a possiblity to use alongside her material.

 

Could you elaborate more on "a few papers" - length, frequency, topics.

 

And thank you for the affirmation on Stobaugh. I'm apparently in a high-need zone for affirmation these days ; )

[HollyDay]

AOP's LifePacs are 10 worktexts that cover the subject. It is a basic read the text then fill in the blank. There are self tests periodically and a test every unit. The last LifePac is usually a review of the other 9. My oldest is a very "to the point, just the facts" type. She loves to read, but not necessarily for her primary learning. For example, she did not like BF Jr. high due to the literature based learning. She wanted something more timeline driven. She likes the flow of history and a clearly laid out direction. She does like to "dig into" a topic, but only after the timeline and study has been presented. For example, she chose to read more about ancient archtitecture and the egyptian pharoahs during her ancient history study. In US History, she read more about the constitution. When US (and World the year before) hit WWII, she wanted more so we pulled outside resources. LifePac gave the flexibility to be "just the facts" or to dive deeper by adding more. It was a good fit.

 

AAH does say on their website that it can be used for grades 5-high school when the activity manual is used. I've not used it personally at any grade level.

 

Another thought might be PAC. We used their World Cultural Geography this year and like it.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

There is a recent thread about AP US history that mentions Paul Johnson's book scheduled out. This is the thread:

 

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/471293-need-guidance-on-ap-us-history/

 

You'll want to look at #13. It gives this link:

 

http://fundafunda.com/prodpage

[downthelane]

AOP's LifePacs are 10 worktexts that cover the subject. It is a basic read the text then fill in the blank. There are self tests periodically and a test every unit. The last LifePac is usually a review of the other 9. My oldest is a very "to the point, just the facts" type. She loves to read, but not necessarily for her primary learning. For example, she did not like BF Jr. high due to the literature based learning. She wanted something more timeline driven. She likes the flow of history and a clearly laid out direction. She does like to "dig into" a topic, but only after the timeline and study has been presented. For example, she chose to read more about ancient archtitecture and the egyptian pharoahs during her ancient history study. In US History, she read more about the constitution. When US (and World the year before) hit WWII, she wanted more so we pulled outside resources. LifePac gave the flexibility to be "just the facts" or to dive deeper by adding more. It was a good fit.

 

AAH does say on their website that it can be used for grades 5-high school when the activity manual is used. I've not used it personally at any grade level.

 

Another thought might be PAC. We used their World Cultural Geography this year and like it.

 

 

Do either of these materials have a religious tone to them? We used PAC for Biology this year and my ds often felt that he was pushed into a corner to validate the religious/moral perspective in the lessons. (ETA - My mistake - we didn't use PAC for Biology. We used ACE School of Tomorrow). It all definitely is running together at present. I want to make this decisions and PLAY.)

[downthelane]

There is a recent thread about AP US history that mentions Paul Johnson's book scheduled out. This is the thread:

 

http://forums.welltr...-ap-us-history/

 

You'll want to look at #13. It gives this link:

 

http://fundafunda.com/prodpage

 

Thank you. I'll peruse this later. Looks interesting.

 

I wonder how much time is spent on history each week using this plan.

[Musicmom]

 

 

 

Interestingly, I was planning to use Janice Campbell's American Lit and I "think" she mentioned at one time Johnson as a possiblity to use alongside her material.

 

Could you elaborate more on "a few papers" - length, frequency, topics.

 

And thank you for the affirmation on Stobaugh. I'm apparently in a high-need zone for affirmation these days ; )

 

 

As far as "a few papers", this would really depend on what you feel need from your dc in order to assign a grade, or what you feel would be of educational benefit to your dc. For example, if your writing curriculum asks for a research paper, or you think your dc needs the experience of writing a research paper, you could use a history paper to cover this and count it for both. If he needs more experience with expository writing, you could have him write paragraphs every week or two, or a short paper (3-5 pages) every few weeks. Another idea would be to do one 4-7 page paper each quarter.

 

As far as topics go, you could pick big events in history to kind of separate and highlight those. Or let your dc pick the topics--you'll get a better paper if it's something your dc is really interested in.

 

On the other hand, if Campbell's literature assigns a fair number of essays or other writing assignments (especially involving background), then you may not want to add history papers on top of that. Another idea would be to just have your dc write a 2-page high-level summary for each "part" of the book (the book is divided into 8 parts about 100-150 pages long--there are no chapter divisions.) You can really gear it to what you have time and energy for.

 

Because we did a lot of Omnibus assignments, and quite a few literature essays, I never really assigned much in the way of papers for history. My dc also had a lot of academic pressure in other subjects (and good retention of what they read for history) so I was comfortable grading history more on a "completion" basis most of the time.

 

The only time I assigned a history paper was for ds's semester-long Ancient History course in 9th grade--there I assigned one paper, his choice of topic, and length about 4-5 pages, which was plenty for him at that stage of his writing development. It worked out well. He picked Archimedes and wrote quite a good paper.

 

Hope this gives you some ideas!

 

 

 

[downthelane]

 

 

Because we did a lot of Omnibus assignments, and quite a few literature essays, I never really assigned much in the way of papers for history. My dc also had a lot of academic pressure in other subjects (and good retention of what they read for history) so I was comfortable grading history more on a "completion" basis most of the time.

 

 

 

This is what we've been doing up to this point with one page summaries written on a weekly basis for history, since other summaries are being written other days.

 

All your thoughts are super and very helpful.

 

I think my son's Junior year will be quite rigorous in other areas, so I want to make sure that history doesn't throw us out of balance. And up to this point he's put a great deal of time into history.

[vettechmomof2]

My daughter is using AAH 1&2 and supplementing with the extras written up in the book.

 

It can def. be geared for High School level if enough lit is read, discussions/papers.research is done.She does reports, write ups about important people. Def. doable as a high school course. The tests/maps are geared towards middle school grades but if you add in some essay questions easy to use for high school.

 

She is 9th grade right now.

 

For end of high school she will be using Paul Johnson's book

[downthelane]

These are ALL such great ideas.

 

I have Johnson's book and I pulled it out this afternoon to read key areas. I enjoyed it a great deal. He is a very thoughtful author and I like the way he approaches religious history and social issues. There is a wonderful depth in this text. I had planned to use Johnson's book this year for early american history as part of a world history focus, but we set it aside and ended up just reading biographies of key people He has read up to about page 100 ( I think.) I do like the AP lesson plan posted using Johson. We could actually dive in a few weeks in, because I think ds has had good coverage of history up until the American revolution.

 

I also spent some time looking at the AO lifepacs which I also like. I see many features which my son would really enjoy (as in - streamlined) and which would allow him time to then go into depth in areas of interest. He likes to read biographies and geographical texts, so the life pac would allow time for this. Is there any mapwork in this program?

 

I haven't had a chance to look at the BJU text or the AAH materials.

 

Y'all are super. Keep those comments coming.

[downthelane]

Just an update - I've decided to go with Johnson and adding in the original documents material from Critical Thinking Press. This will go nicely alongside his American Lit studies and I'll use the movie ideas in the link shared earlier for the AP History. He'll do quite a bit of writing each week. I think it will be a great course. He's a thinker. Johnson will speak to him and I'll resist the urge to pile on more books. I've already ordered the rest of the materials. Another decision...done.

 

Thanks again everyone.