More CC Questions

[mom31257]

Is the main focus of Foundations in CC to make memorization more fun as well as provide socialization and learning under other teachers? One may be starting near me, and I'm trying to find out more to see if I want to go to the meeting. Ds will actually be in 5th grade and is already doing IEW and is enjoying R&S English, so I'm not sure I would be interested in Essentials. Also, how often does the cycle change?

[Paula in MS]

There are three cycles for classical conversations. We are memorizing cycle one this year and moving on to cycle two next year. I am not sure I would say the purpose of CC is to make memorizing fun because a lot of the work is done at home, but it does provide a measure of accountability for the families. A morning at CC begins with a general assembly of families then moves into 2 1/2 hours of class time. This class time is divided into 5 blocks of time: science experiments, fine arts, presentations, introduction to memory work, and review time.

 

The memory work is presented in various formats: songs, hand motions, visual aids, etc., but the student will need further practice at home to really know the material.

 

I know it is difficult to make a decision when you can't see an actual class in progress. You may want to see if you can attend an open house outside your area if you can. I will be glad to answer any other questions you may have.

 

Paula

[tm_burriss]

I like being able to watch the tutors present information and then being able to implement it on my own. I also like that even if I never manage to get art science into the curriculum completely they do a little of it at Cc every week. I second attending an Open House if at all possible. The presentations are also great. Even my youngest is now completely comfortable speaking in front of people.

[mom31257]

I guess I misunderstood what this is all about. I thought this was a supplement and extra curricular, not directing your curricula at home. So if you do science experiments at CC, are they connected to a curriculum you use at home? If so, what company does it come from? For grammar you would study verbs and prepositions all year if you are in Cycle 1, pronouns, adverbs, and conjunctions all of Cycle 2, etc.? What do you use to teach grammar the rest of the week?

[Sophia]

Amy, people use CC differently. I use it as a supplement and spend about 20 minutes a day doing memory work at home on non CC days. I still do all the other subjects separately and do not try to line up history, grammar, etc.

Otoh, some people do expand on the memory work at home and study it in more detail. Just depends on what you want to do.

[Staceyshoe]

You've already gotten some great responses about CC and how it can work for families. It is a *very* structured program--which works beautifully for some families and just doesn't work well at all for others. Attending an open house will give you a feel for how the program works.

 

At first, I wanted everything to line up--our curriculum that we do at and CC all beautifully coordinated. It didn't work out that way, but I've found that CC works *better* for us when everything isn't 100% coordinated. If ds has encountered a term or person in CC memory work, when we get there in our own studies, he is so excited and can't wait to learn more about it. If we cover it before he encounters it at CC, then CC is serving to reinforce what he's learned.

 

CC Foundations has been a good fit for ds. It's nice that he is in the classroom with the same group of kids for an entire morning and then gets lunch and recess with them. Real friendships have formed that way, and we often get together outside of CC. He's also gained real skill in speaking publicly and has spoken in front of groups of up to 100 people (not at CC) without any nervousness at all. I *know* that would not be the case if he did not have the practice of weekly presentations. Next year, we won't be doing CC, and I'm trying to figure out how to meet these needs without it.

[mom31257]

Thanks for all the other information. I've directed co-ops in our area the last 4 years. I wanted some classroom, social interaction time for my kids. When I couldn't find what I wanted I started my own programs. For 3 years I directed a co-op that was totally enrichment, special classes that met for 8 weeks each semester. They were all taught by the moms who were attending so we had no real costs involved, only supplies and a donation to the church we used. It worked well, but I did find that I wished it was more of the work we did at home and less enrichment. I also wanted it to feel a little more like it went all year long. We did have over 20 families with 60+ kids in attendance.

 

In talking to other moms I knew, several wanted to try IEW. I had gone through the TWSS program on my own and was trying AFF with my son. We decided to get together and go through SWI-A this year. We meet every other week. I teach the IEW class. A mom takes the K-2nd graders and is teaching a reading/writing class during IEW. The rest of the moms are taking turns doing a life skills class for the rest of the time we are there. I teach Biology labs for some high schoolers during that. Again, we don't pay to come other than supplies and a donation to the church. This is a smaller program with only a few attending.

 

I found someone else to take over my other co-op and left to start this one. I'm enjoying it, although the only thing for my high schooler is the Biology labs. The rest of them come just for that class, and there wasn't someone willing to teach a high school class during that first 1.5 hours. I don't know if the other high schooler's would even have time to come, though.

 

I like to make sure my kids are getting what they need outside of the home, and some other opportunities have shut down. Upward Basketball was cancelled at the church ds played before. The Christian school where dd sang in chorus lost their chorus teacher this year and found no replacement.

 

I will probably try to attend the meeting that is going to be next month.

[Paula in MS]

I guess I misunderstood what this is all about. I thought this was a supplement and extra curricular, not directing your curricula at home. So if you do science experiments at CC, are they connected to a curriculum you use at home? If so, what company does it come from? For grammar you would study verbs and prepositions all year if you are in Cycle 1, pronouns, adverbs, and conjunctions all of Cycle 2, etc.? What do you use to teach grammar the rest of the week?

 

When I said you do a lot of the work at home, I was trying to say that you will have to go over the memory work at home to have it memorized by the next week. They will not leave the class knowing the memory work perfectly.

 

I do not let CC influence my curriculum at home in the least, but some parents build their entire curriculum around the memory work topics. This is totally up to you. I also choose not to do essentials, but I think I am probably the only person at our campus who is not. I am using IEW at home along with abeka grammar.

 

I use apologia science at home along with Story of the World for history. We also use the Usborne encyclopedia for note taking. At CC this year, my daughter will see about 24 experiments performed from the Janice van Cleave experiment books. I remember hearing SWB say that it was important for elementary aged kids to see these demonstrations performed because it tells them how things work before they get to "real science.". There is not a lot of teaching during these experiments. We talk about the scientific method and watch to see what happens. This is very beneficial to us. It is sometimes difficult to get a lot of experiments.

 

I do not worry about lining up any of this curriculum with CC. As we go along in our studies, I will tie the memory work in and point out that she already knows something about a particular topic.

 

[cheryl h]

Thanks for all the other information. I've directed co-ops in our area the last 4 years. I wanted some classroom, social interaction time for my kids. When I couldn't find what I wanted I started my own programs. For 3 years I directed a co-op that was totally enrichment, special classes that met for 8 weeks each semester. They were all taught by the moms who were attending so we had no real costs involved, only supplies and a donation to the church we used. It worked well, but I did find that I wished it was more of the work we did at home and less enrichment. I also wanted it to feel a little more like it went all year long. We did have over 20 families with 60+ kids in attendance.

 

In talking to other moms I knew, several wanted to try IEW. I had gone through the TWSS program on my own and was trying AFF with my son. We decided to get together and go through SWI-A this year. We meet every other week. I teach the IEW class. A mom takes the K-2nd graders and is teaching a reading/writing class during IEW. The rest of the moms are taking turns doing a life skills class for the rest of the time we are there. I teach Biology labs for some high schoolers during that. Again, we don't pay to come other than supplies and a donation to the church. This is a smaller program with only a few attending.

 

I found someone else to take over my other co-op and left to start this one. I'm enjoying it, although the only thing for my high schooler is the Biology labs. The rest of them come just for that class, and there wasn't someone willing to teach a high school class during that first 1.5 hours. I don't know if the other high schooler's would even have time to come, though.

 

I like to make sure my kids are getting what they need outside of the home, and some other opportunities have shut down. Upward Basketball was cancelled at the church ds played before. The Christian school where dd sang in chorus lost their chorus teacher this year and found no replacement.

 

I will probably try to attend the meeting that is going to be next month.

 

 

Amy, we have similar aged kids, so I will tell you what our experience has been so far. This is our first year of CC. I have one kid in challenge b, one in challenge a, and two in essentials. My two essentials students have both used Rod and Staff previously, and EEL is plenty challenging. The fact that your dc have previously worked with IEW would be a bonus, as essentials moves at a very fast pace and is still challenging for those who were in it previous years. We have been very happy with what the challenge program has to offer, and have only felt like we needed to supplement only a little beyond their CC curriculum. We haven't yet participated in foundations because it was already full, but are registered for next year.

 

I do encourage you to not wait for an open house to visit a community. It will be very busy. Just contact the director and she will likely be more than willing to have you come anytime and then you can get all your questions answered without the distraction of other visitors. With your years of co-op leading experience you may consider tutoring, which helps immensely with tuition costs.

[G5052]

One consideration for you, keep in mind that you are expected to stay with your student during Foundations and/or Essentials. This might be a factor for you if your other student isn't in the program. My older one that isn't in the program helps in a class for the first hour, then he studies in a side room, and then he helps me late afternoon. One of the Foundations tutors also has teens not in the program, and she is constantly juggling to find productive things for them to do and places where they can study and keep on task.

[stm4him]

As someone who has now made CC central in our home, I will give another perspective in case it is helpful. Before deciding whether or not to join CC you should decide what it is you want to get out of it. Some moms are there primarily for the co-op/socialization experience of it. Some moms are there because it is motivating to their kids to be part of a classroom situation once a week. Some moms are there because they just like the idea of the memory work (but many don't necessarily understand or fully implement a classical model at home). Some moms are there because it gives them accountability to come each week. For us it has been all of these things. But what first appeared to be a bunch of useful facts to memorize (as part of implementing the grammar stage of the classical model) became a rich and thorough curriculum. But in order for us to fully see this we had to use it to its fullest, which I will explain more in a minute. Initially I tried to do CC while also doing Singapore Science at home and Tapestry of Grace. Many moms do other programs while they do CC as a supplement. For us it was frustrating that things didn't line up and made it less likely that my daughter would grasp it. I have heard many moms, after trying CC for a year, say that they didn't like learning facts out of context; but the problem was not that the content did not exist, but that they chose to ignore it or didn't realize it was there (which I find all the time).

 

Moms are often wondering what is the minimum they can buy (which is fine if there is a true need), but they miss out on so much when they don't fill it in with the context that is provided. I will say that some of this context has really taken on the beauty it has after CC made their own timeline which goes so well with the history sentences. Over and over in the cards as we read the backs we make connections with the history songs and the geography we have learned and they began to be woven together, bringing about greater understanding. What happens is that moms get so bogged down with trying to do it all (meaning their history program and science program plus CC) that they end up dropping CC thinking they can do it better at home or that their other programs are better somehow. But it rarely gets done at home and loses a lot of its benefit apart from the community (though I would do it at home if I couldn't afford to join the community or had some other life issue that made it impossible, etc.)

 

What happened to us was that when we tried to do a separate program (which was in fact lined up topically with CC), it was way too much and so we dropped it. I found that they still learned quite a bit of science. We couldn't afford the history curriculum I kept waiting to buy last year and so all I had were read alouds loosely aligned with our topic last year and they STILL learned a ton of history because of the memory work. Here I had spent years trying to do complex curriculums with hands on projects and all this planning to do and they learned just as much (and retained more) when I let go of that and just immersed them in memory work and great living books that were related to what we were learning. They got hands on science and art/music at CC but they also had plenty of time off in the year for me to pull out extra science and history hands on things if I wanted to or as we had time to. I found that instead of the hands on projects I was doing as written in the curriculum, my kids came up with their own hands on creative things to make and do related to what we were learning. What we ended up having time to do, then, was to keep a record of what we were doing in notebooks by simply narrating and copying what we were learning and drawing pictures and have rich discussions on all subjects, pulling in the Bible regularly in our discussions. The world around them came alive in ways it never had before CC and they were interested in people, places, and events that they would never have cared about before because they had memorized them. It is really like a magnet for drawing in interest in the world around them. Not to mention the excitement of going to CC to see their friends and the growth they have had by doing presentations, etc.

 

We haven't done Essentials yet but I know enough about it from being around it and pouring over the samples, etc. that it is very rigorous and efficient in getting in a ton of information in one-three years. The first year is usually pretty overwhelming and parents often feel that their kids didn't really get it, but they are amazed the second year how fast the light bulb turns on. If they have had previous grammar they may do better than others who haven't. I think by the end they are thoroughly prepared for learning other languages and fully understanding the English language on an advanced level. The mom gets to learn along side the student while the little ones are being watched and it is motivating to the students to work on their assignments when they know they will be coming to class the next week.

 

My point is that it is fine to join even if it is just a supplement. Many moms start out that way. Know why you are there and understand fully what it CAN be, even if you are not ready or willing to use it to that extent. It took me a long time to trust the system and let go of other curricula as I saw how unnecessary it was on top of what they were getting. Attend a free summer practicum (3 days free for mom, kids are in academic camps for about 30-40 dollars for the three days) which will teach more about the model and give you a chance to talk to moms who use CC to varying amounts in their homes. Check out CC blogs like Half a Hundred Acre Wood, Homeschool Story, Mt. Hope Chronicles, The Adventures of Bear, CCing it One Day at a Time, Not Consumed, and Teaching Boys.net. These ladies use CC pretty extensively and do really creative things with it that they share with other moms. Pray over how CC would be a good fit for your family (or not) and if you decide to do it just be aware that there are a ton of resources out there to explore and don't be surprised if it benefits your family more than you thought it would......

[laura291]

This is our first year with CC. My kids are 12 (6th grade) and 10 (4th grade). They are doing Foundations and Essentials. At first, I expected it to be very supplemental. We are in Cycle 1 this year, which is Ancient History and it goes by FAST! There is no way I felt we could keep up if we went in depth on anything. Also, the Classical model of education has us in the Grammar years, which is memorization and building that foundation. In Challenge A and B they'll move into the Dialectic stage and start learning the studies more in depth, so I'm not worried that they don't learn things in depth yet.

 

So, as I said, we planned on using it purely as a supplement to our current studies. However, that was challenging so now I've developed a more hybrid approach that works well for us. We toned down our home curriculum, and we spend a couple hours per week watching you tube videos or checking out books that cover the topics they learned at CC that week. It feels a little chaotic at times, but the kids really like the mix up! And when we come across something they've memorized at CC in their regular curriculum, they get excited and start singing the songs!

 

I think you should consider Essentials too. The fact you are already doing IEW means you'll have a slight advantage. Essentials is pretty intense for us, but my kids are learning so much!! I think it's prepping them well for High School.

 

The curriculum we use at home is Saxon Math, Apologia Science, Sonlight History. The rest we get from what we learn at CC.

 

Good luck with your decision!

[stm4him]

I just wanted to add that last year we did Apologia Science and that was what we dropped so we just picked it up over the summer and finished it then. We had plans for extra history but they fell off the wagon because of a move to another state (which included selling our house, etc.) and I got pregnant which meant I had less energy. This summer I have plans to do SOTW and some Veritas Press for history but because we have a baby due in March and a son with cancer which is causing us to prioritize health (physical/spiritual/emotional) over school I don't know that we'll get to all my plans for that either. However, I'm really not concerned that they aren't getting enough history. I am not sure about science but I'm leaning towards Real Science 4 Kids since the chapters are short, along with more homeschoolcurriculum-co's earth science download (matches CC memory work) and The World of Biology and Planet Earth (both by Tiner) as read alouds (history of science). We may or may not do all the labs and stuff that go with RS4K. I also like CKE Earth & Space. But I'm not stressed about it because they are getting plenty right now and we have plenty more living books they can pour over this summer on the topics we learned about.

 

By the way, the depth I talk about comes from the backs of the timeline cards and science cards and the history highlights......I sometimes wish there was a bit more science info, but we just add in science encyclopedias, living books, and videos and we've got plenty!

[mom31257]

One consideration for you, keep in mind that you are expected to stay with your student during Foundations and/or Essentials. This might be a factor for you if your other student isn't in the program. My older one that isn't in the program helps in a class for the first hour, then he studies in a side room, and then he helps me late afternoon. One of the Foundations tutors also has teens not in the program, and she is constantly juggling to find productive things for them to do and places where they can study and keep on task.

 

Don't you pay tuition, and aren't the teachers paid? We were part of another program that is no longer in our area that required tuition, but you were able to drop your students off and leave. The only parents who stayed to help were given free tuition in exchange.

 

 

 

Thank you all for the helpful the information. I really feel that this program is not for me. I only look for outside classes for socialization, having my kids experience other teachers, and experience a classroom setting. If I'm going to have to be there anyway, I don't think I should put out that kind of money when I've shown myself that I can create the same thing for about $60-70 a year.

[G5052]

 

Don't you pay tuition, and aren't the teachers paid? We were part of another program that is no longer in our area that required tuition, but you were able to drop your students off and leave. The only parents who stayed to help were given free tuition in exchange.

 

 

 

Yes, you pay tuition, the teachers are paid, and you are expected to stay for Foundations/Essentials. That's a biggie for some families, which is why I mentioned it.

 

This also is one reason that I've tutored for the last seven years. I figured that if I had to stay, I might as well be paid to teach (which isn't that hard if you enjoy teaching).