Spelling - SWR vs AAS?

[mindygz]

I have to confess that I kept hoping spelling would just click for my kids like it did for me. It hasn't for dd9, and I am thinking maybe I need to "repent" and do some sort of organized, phonogram-based system. I have done spelling lists with dd9, but I am not sure that they have done much. So...ideally I would like something that I could do with dd9 and ds6, even better if we could do the lessons at the same time! Is that realistic or even possible? Can you tell me differences between SWR and AAS? Weaknesses/strengths?

[Amy Jo]

I have a 9yo and a 7 yo using SWR. (Never used AAS.) Ability wise - I could combine them. My 7 yo has a better visual memory, spelling & reading come easier to him. I choose NOT to combine them because my 9yo is doing 40 words a week. Not a chance my 7yo could write that much - he would hate it if I tried to make him. And I don't want to slow my 9 yo down.

 

9 and 6 is a big difference, probably hard to combine, but it could work out. I decided to use spelling city (free website) to handle quizzes, so it takes me a little less time.

 

You could try some of Elizabeth's (the phonics page) free phonics videos while you decide.

[SnMomof7]

AAS is easier to start with no previous knowledge :). It is just plan old open and go, scripted to boot, so if you aren't sure how to teach spelling with intensive phonics, AAS makes it easy. I've looked at SWR...but it scared me a bit :O! I don't know if I'd combine them though, you could certainly start them both in the same level, but I'd let them each progress at their own speed.

[Tracy]

I am a SWR user. I understand that AAS is much more teacher-friendly. What SWR lacks in ease of use, it makes up for in flexibility. You get everything you need to teach through high school in one package. (When I priced it, it was about half the cost of everything you would need for AAS, assuming you were starting with Level 1.) Because you have all of the levels, you can move your dc up or down wherever he needs to be without concern for the cost. The Wise Guide, which goes with the SWR manual, does a great job of telling you exactly what you need to be covering, but lets you figure out your own daily schedule for accomplishing it. This is a great program for anyone who ends up tweaking every program they use.

 

Another selling point for me is that SWR is also a reading program. The child I bought it for was already reading, but I have a 3yo that will be reading soon, and I am so glad that I already have a program. (And he already knows all the single letter phonograms just by listening to his sister do her flashcards.)

 

The weakness of SWR? The SWR manual is really difficult to get through. I spent a month with it before doing anything with dd, and then it took me a year before I felt comfortable with the program. The author just tries to tell you everything all at once that she has ever learned about teaching reading and spelling. It sometimes has a sort of stream-of-consciousness feel about it. So there is so much to sift through in order to get to the nitty gritty of what you need to know to get started.

 

Also, it is extremely Protestant Christian. I couldn't tell from your post whether that would be a plus for you or not. I am Christian, but not Protestant, and I don't mind reading stuff in the teacher's manual that doesn't jive with my own worldview. But I had to give up on using the sentences provided for the dictation to the students, partly because there was too much that was different about our beliefs.

[EmeraldGirl]

Just a note before I answer your question: My view is the 3 Rs are so foundational that they are the most important subjects to teach in the elementary years. The time invested now will pay great dividends later. I have raised 3 children and am now raising 4 more. In each group of children, one child had LDs (dyslexia, APD, developmental delays, ADD). I wish I used SWR for my first group of kids or at least spent the time to focus on the basics. I also believe that it takes children different ages to mature into reading.

 

I am a strong believer in the total SWR philosophy, this being my second time around after hs'g another set of children. I have only heard about AAS. I think it moves more slowly and costs more money.

 

SWR requires a lot of parental involvement. It is not open and go like a workbook. There is a learning curve intially. Once I got my head around it, I was much more comfortable and realized that program is very forgiving and enjoyable since the approach is varied every week.

 

They have a very active Yahoo Group which is moderated by the author and other trainers.

 

This is our 4th year with SWR. I can honestly say my kids do not mind the work involved and we mix up the practice lessons as suggested daily. We spend about 60-90 minutes per day total doing this. I have 4 kids at 3 levels.

 

It is all or nothing with SWR. Doing the program as prescribed is key. I did move at a slower pace initially b/c my kids were ESL learners.

 

I do appreciate that we can cover spelling, reading and writing/grammer in one program until about 3rd grade. Then I move to Easy Grammar because that program is based on Spalding also. I only need to buy a learning log each year to write the lists and rules, and a blank notebook for practice exercises.

 

Teaching spelling and reading can be challenging. I hope you find something that works for your children.

 

HTH,

Lisa in DE

[PeterPan]

Mindy, have you done any dictation? That would probably be an easier place to start, given your aversion to spelling programs. That's a pretty big jump from nothing to SWR, lol. No, I wouldn't fiddle with AAS with an older, non-struggling child. SWR is a more powerful tool and will bring her up to speed faster. I really like the magnetic letter tiles for AAS.

 

Do you know about WRTR? Parent of SWR, WRTR will have all the basics and might be at your library. It would be enough to get you started and to let you see if that approach actually clicks as much as you think it will. Then what you're getting, when you upgrade to AAS, are lesson plans and manips. Or with SWR you're adding all the enrichment activities and amazing dictation sentences.

 

I'm using SWR with an adult ESL student right now, and you'd think she'd cringe at all those christian sentences. (about 1/3-1/2 are) But you know, I finally got over it, realizing these are part of our popular culture, things from our history and heritage. And she hasn't said anything, lol.

 

So anyways, in your shoes, I'd start with dictation and learning the phonograms you can find for free in WRTR from the library. Then see where you're at.

[mindygz]

Thanks for the thoughtful replies and the information about the in depth nature of SWR. I will take a look at WRTR. I guess what I feel like might be most beneficial is a study of the phonograms in some context, maybe not SUPER in depth, but a nice exploration. I don't remember ever learning phonograms, but I have always been a "natural" speller -- DH (a horrendous speller) likes to joke that I can spell words I don't know and have never heard/seen, and it's nearly true. I think in words and the words are spelled correctly. My daughter is very artistic and right brained, so I know she doesn't think in words like I do, and I want her to have all the tools to make spelling as painless as possible as she progresses.

 

We do dictation with WWE (in level 3 right now) and she isn't a terrible speller. This year we have been working through the most commonly used words in English (from the Reading Teacher's Big Book of Lists) for our spelling words and she is doing pretty well.

 

So, I guess what I want is a study of the phonograms that would be of use to her (and my ds6 who is an intermediate beginning reader). Is there something like that, perhaps separate from an entire spelling curriculum/program?

[PeterPan]

WRTR is only like $17 on amazon, so it's affordable enough to buy just to learn the method of using the phonograms and rules, even if you don't want the word lists, kwim? And what you do is do regular dictation (Spelling Wisdom, from literature, from the Spelling Dictation Resource book, whatever you want) and *apply* the phonograms and rules to words she doesn't know. That's why I suggested dictation to you.

 

Just so you know, sometimes these things you're describing have names. "horrendous speller" = dyslexic. Right-brained can be dyslexic or ADD/ADHD. Freed's book "Right-Brained Children in a Left-Brained World" might be very interesting to you. He has some good tips on spelling. He contends that right-brained people are often VSL and gives spelling tips to work with that. I think it's good to have a mix of methods (some dictation, some analysis with phonograms for understand, some visualization like Freed suggests, etc.).

 

Yes, if you read WRTR, you'll quickly see how to carry it over to your ds6. Personally, I like teaching reading this way. I used SWR (spinoff of WRTR) to teach my dd to read. But if you don't want to do the method as a whole, it's very easy to pick out just the components you do like. And at $17, you don't mind doing that, lol. I use the WRTR phonogram cards btw, because they're very good quality and almost identical to the SWR phonograms. You might find WRTR gives you everything you want. SWR brings a lot more to the table with enrichments and whatnot and is of course $100 more. :)

 

Ok, I see you're doing the WWE dictation. That dictation is not very orderly for spelling purposes, kwim? The words there are more random, and it's main goal seems to be building working memory. Depending on how long that's taking her, you might add in additional dictation that is more systematic to work on her spelling. Or decrease the WWE dictation to a couple days a week to make room for spelling dictation work the other days. With a 9 yo who's average, doing it three days a week would be adequate. With a younger dc or one who is struggling, I would work more frequently.

 

BTW, are you bringing art into your days? My dd likes to sculpt (also right-brained, also with a horrendous speller dh, hehe), so when she was that age she would listen to me read history with polymer clay in her hands. She made ziggurats, shadufs, whatever we were reading about. And of course she did a lot of dress-up, etc. Happy memories. :)

[MyLittleBears]

Just wanted to add. I have been reading The Logic of English by Denise Eide.($20 on amazon) Can I just say "wow". It cleared up the clouds for me while using SWR and was everything I wanted the SWR manual to be. I had a tough time of it while trying to learn SWR and WRTR for that matter, (mainly due to time restraints) but she has such a way of getting right to the point and explaining everything so clearly. No teacher jargon or "classroom" talk. Just the basics of english based on this method. I am seriously considering switching over once her curriculum is released.

Edited November 2, 2011 by MyLittleBears

[Aloha2U]

Just wanted to add. I have been reading The Logic of English by Denise Eide.($20 on amazon) Can I just say "wow". It cleared up the clouds for me while using SWR and was everything I wanted the SWR manual to be. I had a tough time of it while trying to learn SWR and WRTR for that matter, (mainly due to time restraints) but she has such a way of getting right to the point and explaining everything so clearly. No teacher jargon or "classroom" talk. Just the basics of english based on this method. I am seriously considering switching over once her curriculum is released.

 

Wasn't Denise Eide a former SWR Trainer?

[Tracy]

I guess what I feel like might be most beneficial is a study of the phonograms in some context, maybe not SUPER in depth, but a nice exploration.

 

So, I guess what I want is a study of the phonograms that would be of use to her (and my ds6 who is an intermediate beginning reader). Is there something like that, perhaps separate from an entire spelling curriculum/program?

 

You might want to try getting ABC's and All Their Tricks. It is a reference book that I have seen all kinds of raves about. And it is recommended as a supplement in the SWR program.

 

Just wanted to add. I have been reading The Logic of English by Denise Eide.($20 on amazon) Can I just say "wow". It cleared up the clouds for me while using SWR and was everything I wanted the SWR manual to be. I had a tough time of it while trying to learn SWR and WRTR for that matter, (mainly due to time restraints) but she has such a way of getting right to the point and explaining everything so clearly. No teacher jargon or "classroom" talk. Just the basics of english based on this method. I am seriously considering switching over once her curriculum is released.

 

Check out her

. She is so articulate, a word I would not use to describe the SWR manual. I am really infatuated with this upcoming curriculum. I have looked over the Logic of English web site, and it appears that the curriculum that is going through beta testing now (for older students) is about the same price as the core SWR package. But from what I can gather, the curriculum for younger students will be divided into different levels (making the total cost for the program much more expensive than SWR or WRTR). For me, this is a total deal breaker, because I have a dd that is accellerated, and I cannot easily predict what level she will be at from year to year. SWR gives me everything I need to teach any child at any level, and I just can't give that up, no matter how articulate Denise Eides is.

[MyLittleBears]

Wasn't Denise Eide a former SWR Trainer?

 

I actually don't know. Her blogs says she was a former ESL teacher prior to her homeschooling years. She says she sought training in Orton methods and she does mention Spalding and Gillingham in her book.

[MyLittleBears]

 

Check out her

. She is so articulate, a word I would not use to describe the SWR manual. I am really infatuated with this upcoming curriculum. I have looked over the Logic of English web site, and it appears that the curriculum that is going through beta testing now (for older students) is about the same price as the core SWR package. But from what I can gather, the curriculum for younger students will be divided into different levels (making the total cost for the program much more expensive than SWR or WRTR). For me, this is a total deal breaker, because I have a dd that is accellerated, and I cannot easily predict what level she will be at from year to year. SWR gives me everything I need to teach any child at any level, and I just can't give that up, no matter how articulate Denise Eides is.

 

 

I agree it is expensive, though her book is fairly inexpensive and gives you all the info you need. I'm finding it works well as a supplement to SWR. I have not read ABC's and all their tricks but perhaps it's similar.:001_smile:

Edited November 2, 2011 by MyLittleBears

[PeterPan]

Yes, I checked the SWR yahoo group archives, and she is fact was an endorsed SWR trainer. I also checked to see if they had discussed LoE on the yahoo group, and it doesn't appear they have, imagine that. ;)

 

Just looking quickly at it, her phonogram games book looks very creative and affordable ($15). The sandpaper letters look nice if you like the particular cursive she put on them.

[MyLittleBears]

Yes, I checked the SWR yahoo group archives, and she is fact was an endorsed SWR trainer. I also checked to see if they had discussed LoE on the yahoo group, and it doesn't appear they have, imagine that. ;)

 

Interesting......

 

Just looking quickly at it, her phonogram games book looks very creative and affordable ($15). The sandpaper letters look nice if you like the particular cursive she put on them.

 

I just got this book. It is full of useful games. Love it!