d.g. Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I've realized that the arts and "extras" are being neglected, and I'm trying to remedy the situation. The problem is, I'm about as musical as a rock. Ok, maybe not. Rocks can be used to make a rhythm. :D I have the opportunity to pick up several Suzuki Recorder School Soprano Recorder books (vols. 1-3) at a really cheap price. As in, less than $10 for all three. Add in some money for a pair of recorders, and that's still under $30 for at least basic instrument exposure for my son. I'm seriously considering it, but I have a big question. My only musical experience was recorder in 3rd-4th grade, and after-school choir from 3rd-5th grade. I never learned how to read music. I'd pretty much be starting from scratch. Is it possible I could manage to teach DS with these Suzuki Recorder School books, even with my lack of musical experience? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerPoppy Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I think it would be possible to give them some music education if you were learning it yourself slightly ahead of them, really trying to absorb each lesson, and using YouTube to get a sense of the rhythm and tone. But, I am a music teacher (piano, theory, and some experience leading choir) and I would highly recommend finding a flexible teacher who would be willing to teach group lessons to you and your children. Even if you don't want regular lessons, some teachers are willing to do a lesson here and there, maybe once a month or so. That would ensure you have guidance from someone who understands breathing, fingering, theory, rhythm, and all the rest of it. It would make sure you don't fall into bad habits or miss a big concept. And then, in between, you could teach mini lessons on your own with more confidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d.g. Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 Sadly, lessons aren't really possible. I have the funds for buying the Suzuki books only because I sold a few of my own books and some sewing supplies that were cluttering up my storage bins. The recorders themselves would be bought on Amazon with Swagbucks. I'm pretty sure I can't pay a teacher with Swagbucks, though that would be pretty cool! Thanks for the opinion, though, and especially the idea to watch YouTube videos. I hadn't thought of that. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I would NOT suggest using the Suzuki volumes if you're not a very fluent recorder player yourself. There are much friendlier recorder methods out there for the non-woodwind player. But if you want to actually teach recorder as an instrument, as opposed to as a teaching tool and a bridge to other instruments, Suzuki is perhaps the only program on the market designed for children that will get you there. The literature and depth is comparable to the adult-designed resources I use to teach Orff teachers recorder, but with a sequencing appropriate for children. Suzuki recorder is very different from other recorder methods, because it starts with the lowest notes to build up breath control and intonation. Which shocked me when I first saw the books until I did the training and discovered that you're supposed to tape the holes and work on the sound and breathing first, and gradually remove the tape as the child's control increases. It isn't until about halfway through book 1 (right about at Twinkle I) that they are covering all the holes on their own. Like all Suzuki methods, there are specific skills in each song that need to be mastered before adding more songs, and it's additive. Which, given the reliance on "One Bird", can make you feel like you're in a cuckoo clock factory. Suzuki recorder has a very different sequence than Suzuki violin or piano, because of the difference in a wind instrument vs a string or keyboard one, and it takes a LONG time to get to melodies that are familiar outside a Kodaly classroom. I LOVE the Suzuki recorder CDs-they're possibly the best teaching CDs for recorder as far as sound I've found. I'd also suggest listening to a lot of good recordings of sung folk melodies, because this is the desired inflections for Suzuki recorder, and medieval/renaissance consort playing. Much of the repertoire is from Zoltan Kodaly's vocal teaching pieces. There is no theory or music reading taught in the Suzuki volumes, which is also different from the typical recorder book, which is mostly designed to teach music reading with a little recorder used to make it interesting to the child. You will need to transition to reading and supplement as you move on, just as you would with Suzuki violin or piano. I like "The Big Book of Music Games" and "Music Mind Games" for this. My favorite recorder for Suzuki is the Peripole Angel-it's very, very hard to overblow and therefore supports the breath control in the lower range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d.g. Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 I would NOT suggest using the Suzuki volumes if you're not a very fluent recorder player yourself. There are much friendlier recorder methods out there for the non-woodwind player. But if you want to actually teach recorder as an instrument, as opposed to as a teaching tool and a bridge to other instruments, Suzuki is perhaps the only program on the market designed for children that will get you there. The literature and depth is comparable to the adult-designed resources I use to teach Orff teachers recorder, but with a sequencing appropriate for children. Suzuki recorder is very different from other recorder methods, because it starts with the lowest notes to build up breath control and intonation. Which shocked me when I first saw the books until I did the training and discovered that you're supposed to tape the holes and work on the sound and breathing first, and gradually remove the tape as the child's control increases. It isn't until about halfway through book 1 (right about at Twinkle I) that they are covering all the holes on their own. Like all Suzuki methods, there are specific skills in each song that need to be mastered before adding more songs, and it's additive. Which, given the reliance on "One Bird", can make you feel like you're in a cuckoo clock factory. Suzuki recorder has a very different sequence than Suzuki violin or piano, because of the difference in a wind instrument vs a string or keyboard one, and it takes a LONG time to get to melodies that are familiar outside a Kodaly classroom. I LOVE the Suzuki recorder CDs-they're possibly the best teaching CDs for recorder as far as sound I've found. I'd also suggest listening to a lot of good recordings of sung folk melodies, because this is the desired inflections for Suzuki recorder, and medieval/renaissance consort playing. Much of the repertoire is from Zoltan Kodaly's vocal teaching pieces. There is no theory or music reading taught in the Suzuki volumes, which is also different from the typical recorder book, which is mostly designed to teach music reading with a little recorder used to make it interesting to the child. You will need to transition to reading and supplement as you move on, just as you would with Suzuki violin or piano. I like "The Big Book of Music Games" and "Music Mind Games" for this. My favorite recorder for Suzuki is the Peripole Angel-it's very, very hard to overblow and therefore supports the breath control in the lower range. Definitely not fluent myself, but I've always regretted that I never learned to play a "real" instrument. I don't want my son to feel the same way when he's my age. If I were to buy these now and work on learning for the next year as part of my self-education (I'm already doing history, latin, & drawing), do you think that might be a good enough head-start for me to start teaching DS? Thanks for the book recommendations. I added them to my Amazon wishlist. Maybe if I'm lucky I'll be able to find them used somewhere. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The biggest thing you need is to understand how each piece fits into learning to play. That's fairly easy to figure out IF you're a woodwind player, or if you've had the training classes, but harder if you're not.I do think that it would be a good self-education opportunity. Remember that the goal is a beautiful, singing tone with a variety of articulations as appropriate, not moving through pieces quickly. If you listen to the CDs, you'll get a much better idea than I can give in words. Unlike piano or violin, there isn't much on teaching Suzuki recorder out there, which makes it harder for parents to approximate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d.g. Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 Ok. I guess I'll be looking for the CDs, too. Thanks so much!:001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shifra Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 My only musical experience was recorder in 3rd-4th grade, and after-school choir from 3rd-5th grade. I never learned how to read music. I'd pretty much be starting from scratch. Is it possible I could manage to teach DS with these Suzuki Recorder School books, even with my lack of musical experience? No. You will not be able to teach your child recorder from the Suzuki Recorder School books if you cannot read music and are not getting lessons from someone who can read music (and play recorder). The music is not that basic. If you want to teach your child recorder and you cannot read music, why don't you try Oak Meadow's recorder syllabus, which is meant for a parent who know absolutely nothing about either reading music or playing recorder. You will be ahead because you do have experience playing the recorder. You will probably find that all your recorder lessons will come back to you as you teach your children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama2Many4 Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 We're going to be using the Penny Gardner books on Amazon. Maybe take a look at those? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori D. Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 A wonderful, gentle, and totally self-teaching book for the recorder that we successfully used with 2 non-musical DSs: Penny Gardner's "Nine-Note Recorder". Here is the newer edition. The original edition is available on Amazon used books for $2.50 plus shipping. Enjoy! Warmest regards, Lori D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abrightmom Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 A wonderful, gentle, and totally self-teaching book for the recorder that we successfully used with 2 non-musical DSs: Penny Gardner's "Nine-Note Recorder". Here is the newer edition. The original edition is available on Amazon used books for $2.50 plus shipping. Enjoy! Warmest regards, Lori D. Lori, What recorders did you use with this book? This looks fantastic....:001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori D. Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 (edited) Nothing fancy (again: non-musical kids here, so *they* didn't care -- LOL!) -- we just bought this one for the first student (which gave us another book resource with a handy fingering chart), and then this one for me to use alongside, but later on for the second DS. These were from Rainbow Resource. Do a search at http://www.rainbowresource.com for "recorder", and you'll find even cheaper recorders sold solo. Or, you might check locally if you can get one for $2-3 from a homeschooler selling one; or local Craig's list, Good Will store, yard sale, etc. Maybe even being given away from a local public school? The more expensive ones really DO have a better tone, though, and if you plan on duets, you want to get the same recorder so the instruments are not slightly off-key from one another! :eek: Enjoy! I had fun learning along with the boys and doing duets from the Penny Gardner book with them, especially the Christmas carols. :) Warmest regards Edited August 21, 2011 by Lori D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d.g. Posted August 22, 2011 Author Share Posted August 22, 2011 A wonderful, gentle, and totally self-teaching book for the recorder that we successfully used with 2 non-musical DSs: Penny Gardner's "Nine-Note Recorder". Here is the newer edition. The original edition is available on Amazon used books for $2.50 plus shipping. Enjoy! Warmest regards, Lori D. I've added this to my wishlist. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay3fer Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I bought the newer edition of the Penny Gardner book for myself, but haven't loved it. (Full disclosure: despite being nearly tone-deaf, I did have some piano, viola and even recorder training as a kid... ) I found the Gardner book just a little weird. It's chock-full of multi-ethnic melodies, for one thing, which sounded great in theory, except that when I'm trying to play, I have no clue what they're supposed to sound like. Has anybody tried this one (Hal Leonard's Teach Yourself the Easy Way)? I haven't, but it has decent reviews... Once you know a (very) little bit, I do recommend this Usborne book of VERY easy recorder tunes. Even I sound decent playing them... ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay3fer Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 p.s. We all use the super-cheap Rainbow Resources recorders - they're even colour-coded (so I don't get one of the kids' by accident). But I did end up spending $16 or so on a "real" yamaha recorder for myself, and it really does sound better - though not $14 worth of better for the kids. :-))) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori D. Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I bought the newer edition of the Penny Gardner book... I found the Gardner book just a little weird. It's chock-full of multi-ethnic melodies... I have no clue what they're supposed to sound like. Hmmm... The original edition of the book had lots of standard preschool/kindy types of melodies and very traditional, recognizable songs, so it was fun because we recognized most everything, so we did not have the same reaction. Your experience with the newer edition reminds me of why I so often DON'T like "new and improved" products... :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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