Heather in VA
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Posts posted by Heather in VA
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It does make being the foster parent, social worker, counselor, etc. very hard. We have had children here who were "coached" on what to say or NOT say. Very scripted as all 4 kids in 4 different homes had the SAME answers word for word. The biggest answer we got was "I don't remember".....even about totally safe things like what they did at school, what games they played at recess, etc. We certainly heard that when asking about various large scars, etc.
I just pray that the children have some very very good and very experienced foster parents. As someone mentioned above, it seems like until about 3 years ago they were a struggling but making it family.
Maybe that is another reason they are in different counties. They could have chosen experience of the foster family over closer proximity. There is probably a big concern on the part of CPS to cover their butts too. They have to be completely on edge dealing with such a paranoid family. The Naugler's are probably just chomping at the bit to hear something they want to sue over.
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In case it wasn't posted, this is Nicole's personal FB page: https://www.facebook.com/HomesteadMomma?fref=ts
And an interview with Pace Ellsworth (i haven't listened to it yet): http://www.everything-voluntary.com/2015/05/episode-056-naugler-support-effort-0h30m.html
I hadn't seen her personal page before. It's one 'fight the big bad Man' quote after another isn't it.
Edited to add... there is a post where Nicole says that Issac and Uriah are saying 'I don't consent. I don't answer questions' to the people they are with. I really feel for those trying to reach those kids.
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Well I don't want this thread to turn into a vaccine debate, but I will add that they call themselves "naturopaths" (question 5 in the link) and don't even know what that means. That's an actual degree. NDs go through 4 years of school. She graduated from high school and he has an AA.
Not only that but in many states it requires a license. This is akin to someone attending a few births and pronouncing themselves a midwife.
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I hope CPS will update their shots, as part of their medical. Clearly, there's a tetanus concern on that property.
Maybe those who foster can answer this. I would hope so too but I wonder if it's legal. They have lost custody but not their parental rights so I think they might have to have permission from the Naugler's to vaccinate.
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And we are supposed to read something like that and still feel that she's providing them an excellent education???
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You mean Stuart?
I think that was his name. I don't know what kind of things he said but people who also posted very supportive 'you are doing a great thing here' type posts also posted that this guy (Stuart I think) was offering kind suggestions. So I concluded that he probably wasn't posting the more nasty type posts but still got banned. It is her FB page. She can do what she wants. It's not that different from the Duggars editing their FB page which they've done too.
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Any constructive criticism is seen as attacking them.
This is the crux of why I wonder if they will ever get their kids back. They have taken their anti-government, 'I have rights' thing to the extreme of viewing any advice, any criticism, any suggestion as an attack on their fundamental rights and freedoms no matter who is making the suggestion. Even simple suggestions from a regular person (i.e. not a government representative) is viewed as an attempt to make them change their ideals. With that kind of pervasive defensive attitude, they may not be able to hear enough constructive advice to make the changes they need to make to get their kids back.
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I read some posts on Blessed Little Homestead facebook page yesterday.
Obviously they are understandably deleting rude mean-spirited unsupportive comments which were left in last ten days or so.
However, what has me curious is that only supportive comments appear prior to the now nationwide notoriety.
I wonder why none of the fellow homesteaders gently pointed out certain basics like properly segregating farm animal living quarters from humans and other glaring mistakes that broke inexperienced homesteaders make/made. Mrs. Naugler herself states that BLH is a support and teaching site. Maybe they already banished non-supportive members prior to the May 2015 brouhaha.
I read some stuff on the 'anti-blessed homestead' page about this. They cut and pasted some posts from the Blessed Little Homestead FB page because things have been getting removed. There was one poster in particular that even the supporters thought was being kind in offering help and advice but he was banned. They seem to welcome cheerleading posts but not much else.
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I'm curious what it costs to set up and maintain a place like that. We have dog grooming places here. Heck we have dog day care LOL. but we also have self contained trucks that come to you and have all the necessary supplies inside to take care of the pooch. It probably costs more upfront but I would think it would be cheaper to maintain down the road with no rent plus the fact that you could probably charge more for the convenience of at-home service. Here's what one in our area looks like.
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As for the other alternate fb page, I agree that it's a bit mean-spirited. It's as if they are rooting for the family's demise. I am not. I truly hope they can get it together so the family can be saved. As it is right now, it seems to be a pipe dream.
I agree but I admit I'm not completely innocent of mean-spirited thoughts. I am tired of the families who make the news related to homeschooling or Christian values or home birthing being such horrible representations of these things and/or using them to justify bad behavior. Fortunately here for the most part people are seeing their calls of persecution are a crock of crap but it still irks me.
I want the absolute best for the children. They are innocent victims here. But part of me doesn't want good things for the parents. I'm working on it.
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From one of their FB supporters: "They get federal money for each adoption so they take as many kids as they can. The better they're raised, they more they want them. Which would you be more likely to adopt? The child who was well raised and healthy or the crack baby who is going to require lots of medical help and therapy?"
Now there's a perfect conspiracy theory. Your kids were taken by CPS? That PROVES you were doing an excellent job of parenting!
I'm speechless....
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I'm guessing not many people are going to show up. It seems like everyone who knows them in real life wants nothing to do with them.
I'm also curious to see if they actually pitch in and do some of the work themselves, or if they just kick back and command their minions.
I would hope at least Joe would be there. Nicole says on her pet grooming FB page that she is taking grooming appointments starting tomorrow so she might not be available. If they split the work, Nicole working at the pet grooming and Joe working on the homestead, they could start making some progress. Praying that is the case.
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The mutual friend that I have thinks they are good parents, who live in a "clean, organized" home. I really don't get it.
I don't get it either. I'm sure some negative things we are hearing aren't true. The internet is like that. But even if I'd never read anything but what Nicole herself posts and seen her own pictures I would be just as horrified. I see nothing clean or organized.
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How rural is Breckinridge, KY? Regulations likely are not so strict as they are for urban sites. -- [ ? ]
This seems probable. I would think if the regulations were too strict that structure would just be condemned.
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Their supporters are now calling the neighbor a "selfish old lady" who wouldn't even share water with thirsty children. This whole story is such a train wreck.
Their supporters comments are absolutely terrifying. So many comments about how wonderful it would be to live like that. Do people really think there is nothing wrong with that environment or are they interpreting the pictures differently than we are?
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There are samples of DIVE on their website.
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I read that stuff about the bit-coin and the Capistan stuff. I was really confused. That said, if the money is on the up and up and the loan was for the business, Word Nerd has a point that they might not be able to use it for housing even if they wanted to (which is a whole other question)
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I'm responding to this post because I'm too lazy to scroll up. But about the salon, it looks like they posted about the opening before today's hearing, so it was already planned, que no? And she has said that the salon is their primary income, so I can see why they would open. It would show an attempt at a stable income.
This makes sense but I don't know how I feel about it. Clearly money is extremely tight. They need an income but they also need money to make or find a habitable place for their kids. Dog grooming will bring in money but I wonder if they need the store and all the money it must take to set up and maintain it right now when that money could give them a place to live. Lots of dog groomers come to the client which eliminates that overhead.
It's possible or even likely that CPS and/or their attorney is encouraging them to get the business going. I'm not putting this particular issue on the parents. I'm just sad thinking of all that money to put together that very nice, clean place when their kids don't even rate 4 walls.
I also wonder what happens when she has the baby in a few months. It takes time to establish a business and she will have to close the shop for at least some time since I doubt she's hiring employees.
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Guilty here too
Edited to add.... I know we are praying for the kids and for the parents to get a clue but let's not forget to pray for the foster families. I can't imagine how hard it must be to take in kids who need so much.
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"Off - radar"... that's really sums up what they want. Off the grid is not what is going on. Off the radar of their responsibilities.
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I know this is really not important but that picture on her pet company FB page of the door with the name stenciled... is it just me or does it seem backward. That is clearly looking from inside out so wouldn't the name be on the outside of the door?
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I do think she looks like she's not taking care of herself but part of me wonders if it's an act. She looks overwhelmed with despair and grief but at the very same time she's posting on her FB page for her pet grooming how everything is coming along great and she plans to open today.
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That's a good point. 4 counties away in the west could be almost clear across the state but it's not like that in Kentucky.
I do know that a fair number of rural kids here end up in foster care in one of our three most populous counties because that's often where they have homes open right when needed.
LOL - that's funny. I was confused about why people thought it was so strange for them to be in 4 different counties. It never occurred to me that would be a huge distance. Here in the DC area we have 5 counties within 45 minutes depending on traffic
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And here's a weird post from their FB page today. Guess we were all wrong about what "off-the-grid" means.... :confused1:
Off grid doesn't mean we don't have electric, water etc.
It means we aren't connected to "the grid."
We live near Fort Knox. Seems they like the off grid idea as well. Of course they had the funds to build it all at once, we had a longer time frame.
We are building an off grid homestead. We didn't buy one. It's from scratch. Baby steps. We have plans for many of the things you all suggested. We just weren't on your time frame.
This is a very bizarre post. Just set aside the 2nd comment about baby steps, that was well addressed above by the poster who said you don't get a pass on feeding your kids now because you planted a garden that will have food someday.
Just the first part speaks volumes to me. For most people, being "off-the-grid' means to supply your own utilities and can mean growing most or at least a decent amount of your food. But to her she says being off "the grid' is different that that. To me that really shows that this is about anti-government, not homesteading. The "grid" is anything where the government can know who you are or what you are doing. This is why I think they are going to continue to see themselves as persecuted. Anything... absolutely anything someone asked of them is a threat. Any rule is hostile. Any expectation is persecution. If the assumption that the CPS wants a safe, clean living environment with safe food and water as their primary demand to get the kids back I think we would all agree that is not overstepping the bounds of government and they are requesting something reasonable. But I don't think these guys believe it's possible for anyone to ask anything reasonable of them. They believe they have to right to live without anyone, anything or any government telling them anything. What they are missing is that as parents the one right we do not have with our children is to deny them their fundamental rights. Children have the right not to be abused and the overrides the parents' rights to do whatever they want.
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NOOOOOO!
in The Chat Board
Posted
I think one of the saddest part of looking for updates is that I don't even know what to hope for. Do I hope for reconciliation knowing that even meeting some basic requirements from CPS isn't likely going to be a sign of a good future or do I hope the kids find great permanent placement with families even though it means they won't be with all their siblings or their parents.