[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

20 minutes ago, katilac said:

 

I do think you're being a bit blind to the fact that your husband has a valid concern. This is not a kid bucking the trends to dress in their own style, or choosing to follow interests that other consider nerdy. A rumor about this type of thing is more vicious and harmful than being laughed at for wearing a fedora or playing Dungeons and Dragons.  It's the kind of thing that will haunt them throughout high school. Seriously, accidentally saying at lunch that you share a bed with your brother is like throwing chum into the water with sharks circling. Sometimes you do have to be concerned over what other people think. The rumor-mongers will not be persuaded by nuances like separate bedding and a pile of pillows. It's the nature of the beast. 

I know you guys have made a decision based on other reasons, but I still felt like your dh could use a little defending 🙂

I appreciate you defending him...heck the poor guy needed it today! 🙂 

As with most domestic issues, there were a LOT of layers to my misplaced frustration with him. LOTS of backstory with this one. Fleshing it out with the Hive helped me see that more clearly and address the issue at hand. 

He had a very valid concern, but the way he approached it triggered some bad reactions. I totally own that. 

Thank you for your honesty, Katilac! 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

32 minutes ago, Bluegoat said:

My understanding is the girl is the 15 year old?  I'd feel differently if it were the other way round, TBH.  A boy at that age can still be very much in kid territory, whicle a girl generally won't be.  I think that changes the sense of it a lot, including likely for the kids. But a boy that age will also be about to really spring into puberty in short order, and then it may seem obviously awkward, even to them.

Yes, the girl is the 15 year old and the boy is the 12 year old.

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

18 minutes ago, Annie G said:

This sounds very different than how you initially described the setup. In the title you characterized it as sharing a bed, so of course we saw it that way, too.  The mountain of pillows between them seems weird to me- since they do have the option to sleep apart, what is the purpose of the mountain of pillows AND having the mattresses pushed together? Why not just put a mattress on opposite walls so they aren’t sharing a bed?  

good question-really it was just a matter of space and how it all worked out. They don't have a NEED to be next to each other, but they do have a "need" to have someone else in that dark scary room. 🙂 

Dh and I talked some more and we are on the same page. We both think it is time (well, past time) to get their bodies used to sleeping in their own rooms...alone. We have a game plan in place which includes utilizing the two dogs as pseudo-companions during the transition phase. 

And yes, I do acknowledge that I wasn't clear in my title nor original post. I did clarify further down though. Either way it's all good. 🙂

The mountain of pillows-totally normal in this family at times. When I was prego with all three of my kids I had a pillow on every single side of my body. I eventually weaned myself down to two pillows-ha. My dh, who recently had total knee replacement surgery, is now the one with a gazillion pillows all up and down his body for support. The kids...meh-just a transition from fort building to having a stash of pillows to snuggle with during the night if need be. 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

1 hour ago, Pen said:

 

Are the sheets and blankets divided separately between the beds or is there king size bedding  combining the sleep space? 

I didn't want to leave you hanging, Pen... 🙂

Two separate mattresses (I do get that this is the same as sharing a bed in some people's minds, which makes sense), two separate sheets, completely separate bedding, and a mountain of pillows between them to boot. 

 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

Sorry for the delay-I had an appointment....

-Just wanted to thank everyone for their bluntness-it is always appreciated on my end. Never apologize for speaking bluntly. We all filter information through our own personal experiences so it's always helpful, in my opinion, to hear everyone's take. And let's be honest, if I can't handle the Hive's heat, I have no business posting in the Hive Kitchen. 

I do understand where each poster is coming from, I honestly do. I think some of the comments are veering into alarmist territory, but again, each person's experience makes their opinion valid, and I take each of them seriously and to heart. 

All that said- there are several misconceptions that a closer reading of my posts and subsequent clarifying posts would clear up. 

I am going to separate them, not because I think there is anything nefarious going on, rather because I truly believe this is a case of what was once two kiddos getting better sleep when not sleeping in a room alone has now become, as a previous poster put, a "bad habit". 

🙂 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

24 minutes ago, mamakelly said:

Well it originally sounded like 2 opposite gender teen siblings sleeping in the same bed. Yes, I think that would raise some issues. It may be culturally appropriate in some places, but it’s definitely not common here. If anyone were to report it, I’d think they’d consider it cause for investigation.

 

23 minutes ago, hippiemamato3 said:

Yes. You'd be surprised how often incest/abuse happens in situations like this. 

Thank you both- this angle honestly wasn't on my radar (as far as CPS being alarmed over a situation such as this). Thank you for bringing it to my attention

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

Just now, happi duck said:

As mentioned upthread, I wonder about them both wanting to split at the same time.  Might be better for parents to say it's time rather than feeling "rejected" by a sibling who has been an anxiety comfort.

Yes! I think you verbalized something that has been at the back of my mind....good point happi duck! Thank you~

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

5 minutes ago, hippiemamato3 said:

I would separate them at those ages. 

I'm going to have another discussion with DH and come up with a game plan that will move towards this direction. 🙂 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

5 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

 

What’s his family culture? For my husband and mine, sharing of a bedroom for brothers and sisters is only done if there isn’t enough bedrooms to go around, as in sons to a room and daughters to a room. Even then, when there are only two bedrooms (master and kid bedrooms), the son might end up on a sofa bed in the living room while the daughter gets the kid bedroom at night due to daughters being higher up in priority for privacy. 

I shared a bedroom with an only brother who is nine years younger. People (non-relatives) kept asking when my parents were going to upgrade to a three bedroom home. My SAHM aunt had three sons, one daughter, a single sister and her dad to a room. Since her husband is paying the bulk of the expenses for her dad, no one said anything and just accepted that my aunt couldn’t afford a bigger home.

He lived alone with his dad and sister lived with his mom (parents divorced when they were young)

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

2 minutes ago, mamakelly said:

I wouldn’t be as concerned with them sleeping in the same room, as I would be about them in the same bed. And honestly, if CPS ever caught wind of that, it would probably raise some red flags. 

Really???? I'm not being snarky-I'm just surprised. 

These are 2 twin mattresses next to each other in a trundle bed. Would CPS honestly take issue with that? Genuine question.

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

3 minutes ago, KungFuPanda said:

This is true and my MIL grew up this way in Brooklyn. However, she was ABLE to sleep without her brother in the room. Sharing space isn’t in any way wrong, but that’s not the problem here.

Spot on, again. 

You're speaking my language. This is exactly what I would be telling a friend if she came to me with this...

I love this board for fleshing out issues!

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

Thank you Hive, for being gentle, yet real.

I appreciate it immensely!

Christmas break is starting-sounds like a good time to gradually change this up and allow their bodies to become accustomed to sleeping in their own rooms. As I reflect on the past few months, there are several signs that both are heading toward that direction but perhaps aren't quite sure how to break out of this co-dependent habit. 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

1 minute ago, KungFuPanda said:

I think your husband’s and other son’s instincts that this is not normal seem accurate. However, the co-sleeping dependency could be a symptom and not the actual problem. This isn’t about conforming to society. It’s about abnormal and untreated levels of anxiety. The 15-year-old could be in college in three years. You WANT her to be able to comfortably sleep alone by then. 

Good point. 

This is what I need to hear. Thank you. 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

1 minute ago, KungFuPanda said:

I’m not sure the transition is going to happen naturally with your kids. They’re a little past the age when most kids have opted for their own space. Sharing a room isn’t really weird, but needing to share a bed at this age is worth investigating and dealing with. 

The odds that it’ll “happen naturally” with both kids at the same time are slim, so either way this is an issue you’re going to have to deal with. Kids that age shouldn’t have too much anxiety to sleep in their own beds or even in their own rooms. I say this as a parent who believes little kids sleep better together. We had a brother/sister room “like on Dragon Tales” at my kids request until the older one wanted space. 

I think this problem might be a little bigger than who sleeps where at night. 

Yes, I absolutely agree (the problem being bigger than sleeping locations)  and it is being dealt with. 🙂 

We are definitely on the cusp of this needing to change due to individual needs coming into play or due to parental involvement. It's just hard to find where that line is, you know? I don't want to "enable" this behavior, but I also don't want to mess with something that is working and they are happy with, especially when anxiety is involved. I'm not against separating them at all (I mentioned earlier that I have been the driving force with past attempts). I guess it's just the way he implied it was "wrong" without giving any consideration to their anxiety. 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

24 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

I would be concerned about their anxiety levels if they feel they need to be that close to each other to feel 'safe' enough to go to sleep.   are there any other indications of anxiety?   was this drive more by one sibling than the other?

When one has a sleepover with a friend, or is away at camp or whatnot, ultimately the other "always" ends up in our room. on the floor,  by morning.At this point it is a mutual arrangement.

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

23 minutes ago, Storygirl said:

If they really need to sleep in the same room, can you replace the king sized bed with two twins or a bunk bed? Sleeping in the same room seems okay to me, but sleeping in the same bed is iffy at that age. Not because of what others will think, but just out of caution for their own development.

They are two separate twin mattresses, just placed next to each other in a trundle bed

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

17 minutes ago, maize said:

Not unhealthy, no.

And making them move to their own beds because a parent thinks it is not socially acceptable...well, you have to analyze then what lesson you are teaching about conforming to hypothetical peer pressure.

Would your kids be mortified if other kids found out and teased them?

Most likely this will resolve naturally in the near future.

This is my concern-what are we teaching the kids when we enforce changes based on what he "thinks" is socially unacceptable? 

Their older brother has harassed them both in the past and they just.don't.care. Their need to feel secure and safe at night trumps the grief their bother gives them.

I do see this resolving naturally in the near future. There was a recent argument (at 6 in the morning) when she wanted to come in and get dressed for school. Usually he is up before her but this particular morning he slept in. He didn't' want to get out of bed. She wanted her privacy. A shouting match ensued. Ultimately he left. When he came to complain to me, I explained to him (for the umpteenth time) that if he wants to sleep in and have peace and quiet in the mornings, he needs to sleep in his own bed, in his own room. 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

5 minutes ago, Annie G said:

I wouldn’t have a problem with them sleeping in the same room but I would prefer that they separate the two beds.  I see it as they currently need to sleep that close together like other people might need a night light, tv on, a certain lovey or blanket.  Bedtime rituals are calming but you want to encourage a level of independence.  And they might not outgrow the need at the same time, and then what? 

These are my thoughts exactly. They are "self-medicating" for their nighttime anxieties.

The ironic thing is is that I have been the driving force in the past in getting them to sleep in their own rooms. I've tried everything, but ultimately we end up with one or the other in the other's room on the floor. It was always "my" job to get them to be comfortable/independent enough to sleep in their own rooms. Now that we have a system that everyone is comfrotable with (and getting quality sleep with), he voices his opinion. 

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

Yes, anxiety is at play with both of them...whole 'nuther post on that topic.

I need to clarify-Dh is ok with them sleeping in the same room. At the very least he wants to separate their twin mattresses. So, instead of the mattresses being side by side, which he isn't ok with, he IS comfortable with them being separated. 

I agree in that there is a way to do this without introducing the creep/shame factor, but the way he proposed it is what got my feathers ruffled. It didn't matter to him what the kids were comfortable with. He indicated that it didn't matter what they thought. 

I guess it is bothering me because he "seems" more concerned over what other people think about this arrangement more than how it is benefiting them both. He typically doesn't share his opinion so forcefully so that is another reason why I'm wondering if I'm being blind to something....

[Perspective needed please re. older siblings sharing bed]

My dh and I just had a heated discussion and we came away holding 2 completely different views. This isn't a JAWM. I need to see if I'm totally off base here.

Our dd15 and ds12 both have their own rooms with their own beds, however they have both chosen to sleep together in the same room. Both are sleeping in a king sized bed, composed of two separate twin mattresses (neither have felt comfortable sleeping alone in their rooms since we moved to our new home several years ago. I've tried many different tactics in getting them to be comfortable in their rooms, all to no avail. One always ends up on the floor of the other's room). 

Dh announced this morning that he wants to separate them due to his concerns over what people at school would think should this ever "get out". I tried to explain that this is what they have both chosen to do, there is nothing wrong with it, and at some point they will want their own privacy and the transition to their individual rooms/beds will naturally occur (on their own timing). His thought is that they "should" be sleeping in their own beds, and we need to "make" that happen (because of what could happen if kids found out). My thought is I don't care what other kids think as long as dd and ds are comfortable with this sleeping arrangement (and that they are getting adequate sleep!). When their need for privacy becomes paramount, they will make that transition (which I can see will happen soon).  I feel like he is introducing the shame and creep-factor into this arrangement by making it into a big deal. 

Am I missing something? Is this actually an unhealthy situation that I am not seeing? 

[Marvelous Mrs. Maisel]

I was SO STOKED to start watching it last night! I had been waiting, like the rest of you, for this 2nd season with great anticipation and high expectations. 

 

I couldn't make it through the 1st episode. 

I'll try again...but I'm not impressed, at all, with what I've seen so far. 

[4 Types of Narcissism - Video]

Fascinating and spot on! 

Thank you for sharing~ ? 

[Combining CLE 7/8th grade]

I did it with my dd last year-we almost made it!

I scheduled 2 lessons a day, skipped the quizzes, but completed the tests. Each lesson has a review so on one of the 2 lessons she did daily I had her skip that portion. It was somewhat of a challenge for her, but very doable. 

 

I'm doing the same with my upcoming 7th grader this year. Math comes much easier for him so I'm anticipating (hoping) the "2 lesson a day" plan to work well.

[Horse Peeps- question about hoof crack]

Our pony incurred a horizontal hoof crack last night that is about 1.5 inches long. She isn't in any pain, no lameness, no blood, nothing. Just a crack....that "looks" really painful to me, but I digress....

I have a call into our farrier, but am wondering what we can expect as far as down time. My dd had planned on taking her to a show this weekend (halter and showmanship only- no riding) that she has worked for all spring and summer. However, we obviously don't want to further injure the pony. I'm assuming the show is now off the table, but wanted to confirm with those that have had experience with this before I let dd know. Registration is tomorrow~

Thoughts? 

? 

[If you saw this at a scout camp...]

43 minutes ago, madteaparty said:

I had to google it. So many places one’s kids don’t belong ?

Op, you’ve clearly been infiltrated by rainbow sock wearing teens. Better nip that in the bud real quick. No safe places anymore....

and you wonder why conversations shut down. 

read.the.ENTIRE.thread.