A cross-cultural thread

[VanessaS]

The name thing is interesting. Our YMCA instructor introduced herself to the children as "Ms Liz". It took me a while to realize that that was her first name, not her last.

 

We Bavarians have the habit of speaking about people as LastName, FirstName. So if I was talking about John Smith I would say, "Remember the Smith John?" My DH does this for laughs over here sometimes, "Hey, let's watch that movie with the Depp Johnny." :lol: (hint: depp means idiot in German)

[Storm Bay]

My DH does this for laughs over here sometimes, "Hey, let's watch that movie with the Depp Johnny." :lol: (hint: depp means idiot in German)

:lol::lol: Once you're done that movie, you can go and "Throw the horse over the fence some hay." That was the joke I used to hear, because in English you can't show cases with the articles. My dad's first language was German, and he didn't learn English until he went to school at 6 1/2, even though he was born in Canada. They spoke German at home, church and in most of the stores where he grew up.

[momof165]

We're German too. Same deal here. It's a big cultural difference that I'm still adjusting too. I think people in Germany see a much larger difference between general nudity and sex/pornography. Once I was at a beach here and I had my 6 month old DD in a diaper and an older lady commented that it was obscene. And my DH and I were surprised to see young boys and girls swimming in t-shirts at an indoor pool.

Last winter we went swimming a few times at the YMCA and I was struck by how shy everyone was in the female-only changing rooms. I got out of the shower naked to dry off and everyone's eyes nearly popped out of their heads. They came out of the showers fully dressed! How in the world did they do that without getting everything wet? Some even came out wearing socks and shoes. :001_huh:

 

As for general homeschooling: we've had issues about what script to teach our children. My DH and I write in the German hand but will that confuse my children since we're mostly using American materials? We're thinking about italic since it's in-between.

This is very confusing in math with 1s and 7s. Also, the books teach English measurements but we prefer metric. Yesterday we had an evaluator from EI here and she asked how much my DD weighed when she was born. "3680 grams." "Umm.... how many ounces is that?" :lol:

 

And then we have the problem with phonics. I speak English with the children but we sometimes read books in German and with my DH it's the other way around. When they ask how something is pronounced it always takes me a few minutes to figure it out.

 

Hi Venessa,

 

loved your response. Makes me feel much better seeing others having the same problems!:D Don't worry too much about the script. My dh is Ukranian, I am German - talk about different writing styles. My son is learning German script - we tried Italic, but he just didn't like it at all. I teach him to read American script - but he uses German script and actually LOVES it. His handwriting has improved so much - it's unbelievable. For writing the numbers 1 and 7 - my son uses (again) the European writing, but in tests, he switches to the American number writing. He is 9 right now, and we have no problem switching forth and back. However, it took until this year for him to do so. He is learning the metric system alongside the English measuring system. I have more problems adjusting to the English measuring system than my son.:lol:

 

Ds speaks German fluently, he can read German books (equivalent to 3rd Grade such as "Das Magische Baumhaus), and he writes on a 1st - 2nd Grade level. He is learning Latin (1st year) and has started with Italian. I went to College here in the States, but was never taught Phonics. I was taught the whole word/sight word system. So, Mom had to learn Phonics first before I could teach my son. :tongue_smilie: Dh just shakes his head. For him, Russian and Ukranian makes sense, English does not!:001_huh: So, I am the only one doing the teaching and it can get very confusing at times. I am just glad that ds has figured it ALL out!!!!

 

BTW - I am from Bavaria as well. Where are you from? I am from Schweinfurt (Unterfranken - so, technically, we are not "Bayern" - but "Franken")

 

Sonja

_____________________________________

Homeschooling just one - ds 9

Edited April 8, 2009 by momof165

[VanessaS]

Aaaaah!!!!!!!!!!!!! -- Franke! Die Barbaren kommen!

 

Sorry, just had to take a jibe at you. I'm from the Oberpfalz and my husband is from Niederbayern. So, we're REAL Bavarians. *snicker* But you guys have better wine and Bratwurst, so it's all good. LOL! We actually spent a lot of time in Nuernberg and Wuerzburg because we have family there and we lived close to there (Amberg).

 

Actually, I'm just a transplant. I was born in Stuttgart and raised in Heidelberg. But I claim Bavaria since my kids and husband are from there, and I can fake the dialect. I'm just "passing", you see. When my DH first met me he'd tease me because I Schwaebelt a bit. Everytime I'd exclaim on Sunday night, "Morge muss i scho wieda schafe gehe!" He'd just laugh himself silly. "Honey, Mann sagt: Morgen muss i wieder Auben. Schafe, schafe, schafe. Hausle baue!" But I speak properly now. LOL! Actually, I speak Niederbayerisch now and my Oberfpfaelzer mother can't understand a word I speak. Of course, if you ask her, she speaks "proper German". Umm... yeah Mom.

It's funny because we speak Bavarian with the kids but all of the books and learning materials are in Hochdeutsch. So, I guess we're a tri-lingual family?

[Storm Bay]

Aaaaah!!!!!!!!!!!!! -- Franke! Die Barbaren kommen!

 

Sorry, just had to take a jibe at you. I'm from the Oberpfalz and my husband is from Niederbayern. So, we're REAL Bavarians. *snicker* But you guys have better wine and Bratwurst, so it's all good. LOL! We actually spent a lot of time in Nuernberg and Wuerzburg because we have family there and we lived close to there (Amberg).

 

Actually, I'm just a transplant. I was born in Stuttgart and raised in Heidelberg. But I claim Bavaria since my kids and husband are from there, and I can fake the dialect. I'm just "passing", you see. When my DH first met me he'd tease me because I Schwaebelt a bit. Everytime I'd exclaim on Sunday night, "Morge muss i scho wieda schafe gehe!" He'd just laugh himself silly. "Honey, Mann sagt: Morgen muss i wieder Auben. Schafe, schafe, schafe. Hausle baue!" But I speak properly now. LOL! Actually, I speak Niederbayerisch now and my Oberfpfaelzer mother can't understand a word I speak. Of course, if you ask her, she speaks "proper German". Umm... yeah Mom.

It's funny because we speak Bavarian with the kids but all of the books and learning materials are in Hochdeutsch. So, I guess we're a tri-lingual family?

:lol::lol::lol: When I lived in Germany as a little girl, I learned the local dialect. However, my father, who was doing his second year of surgery residency there, would enter the hospital wards and say, "Nur Hoch Deutsch." (do I have that right--only high German?) He couldn't understand any of the dialects. He actually grew up with an old fashioned form of German (his family had left that area in the late 18th century but kept it up) and then studied Hoch Deutsch in German School on Saturdays.

[Friederike in Persia]

Lots of Bavarians, I like you lot a lot! Though can I just say that Schwaebisch is just fine and what's wrong with "schaffa, schaffa, Haeusle baua?!" You might have guessed, I'm from Stuttgart :001_smile:.

My 3 kids have a Schwaebisch accent, too, which I figure helps them identify more, apart from the fact that I wouldn't want to talk Hochdeutsch all the time. We used to have a Nordfriese work with us out here, who thought some of my expressions (stuff like "babela") were Tajik and not German :001_smile:.

 

Try and not worry about phonics too much. I picked up more with each child and if we would have a number 4 I would probably get it all right that time round. But even my eldest, who I struggled with the most (getting the "u" right was a biggie for me) is doing just fine and hasn't picked up any of my mistakes. (Apart from aunt and ant, I can't get those two right for the life of me and all 3 kids seem to have picked that one up.)

 

I love the non-fear attitude in Germany, but I have to say that the longer I'm away the more I loose it myself and am surprised how much my nieces and nephews are allowed to do on their own (much more than going to the loo on their own :tongue_smilie:).

 

One more on the naked topic. My sister went to an international bible school over 20 years ago and she's still not over the fact, that all the American girls kept coming out of the shower cubicle fully dressed!? Maybe they're still talking about this crazy German who couldn't put her clothes on :001_huh:.

[VanessaS]

Ah, another Stuttgarter... Have you seen those great Baden-Wuerttemburg commercials where they show famous southerners talking about their achievements and then they end with "Wir koennen alles, ausser Hochdeutsch. (We can do everything, except speak high German.)" I crack up every time.

Here's my favorite: http://www.baden-wuerttemberg.de/de/Ueber_Matto_Barfuss/119889.html?referer=167969

 

We just watched "Beste Zeit" last night and we both got really homesick. But it's not that bad since we're going to be visiting Germany next month. Just in time for the Biergarten to open.

 

Sonja, you Franke are probably very weary of the Bavarian-ribbing, aren't you? Actually, it's funny because a lot of the most famous Bavarian stuff is actually Fraenkisch, but you guys get no respect or appreciation. I told my DH about you and he said, "Wir muessen Gott fuer alles danken, auch fuer einen Franken. (We have to thank God for everything; even for a Frank.)"

 

But seriously, it's really cool that there are so many Germans and German-speakers on these boards! I had no idea.

Are we totally OT now, or what? I think we've hijacked the thread....

Edited April 11, 2009 by VanessaS

[momof165]

Hi Vanessa,

 

you know how it goes between Franken and Bayern. We always loved our independence and really rather see us as Franken than Bayern! LOL. You know what they say about the "Weisswurstzone".......

 

However, my dad is Badenzer (waschechter) - he is from Tiengen/Waldshut - and still up to this day, lots of people have problems to understand him. His German is very, very close to Swiss German and when I first met my dad's Mom I asked for a dictionary!!!!!:lol: Over the years, I have learned to speak and understand that type of German, so that I could at least communicate with my grandma and cousins!!!

 

By now, I am gone for too long to understand Swiss German, or even that dialect spoken in this region. My German has changed over the years to a more "Hochdeutsch" - but I have NO problems to understand Frankonians!!!

 

I am glad you can visit Germany and enjoy the "Biergartens." Hope you'll have a great time. Do you think you can take my with in your suitcase?:glare:

 

Sonja

_______________________________________

Homeschooling JUST ONE - ds 9

[VanessaS]

Allmaecht. The Weisswurst Equator! Very famous. Sort of like the Bavarian Mason-Dixon line.

 

I'm really looking forward to my trip. Especially now that my DH said I can take two days off to visit my friends and family in Heidelberg all by myself. Kid-free vacation. YAAAAAY!

[Nan in Mass]

Or are you in Australia or England? I've heard other mothers here on the board talk about how people change in the shower stalls, but where I live, people mostly change in the open, in front of their lockers. And toddlers swim in just a diaper all the time. I had mine swim in a teeshirt to keep the sun off and people often asked me why. Maybe this is one of those north/south or coast/inland splits? I remember a past thread where this was discussed where someone said that the younger people who grew up with cell-phone cameras were the ones who were the most likely to change in the shower because they didn't want their friends to pass their picture around from phone to phone.

-Nan

[Storm Bay]

Or are you in Australia or England? I've heard other mothers here on the board talk about how people change in the shower stalls, but where I live, people mostly change in the open, in front of their lockers. And toddlers swim in just a diaper all the time. I had mine swim in a teeshirt to keep the sun off and people often asked me why. Maybe this is one of those north/south or coast/inland splits? I remember a past thread where this was discussed where someone said that the younger people who grew up with cell-phone cameras were the ones who were the most likely to change in the shower because they didn't want their friends to pass their picture around from phone to phone.

-Nan

 

 

I agree. And some of it is personal. I've seen it both ways in the US.

[Friederike in Persia]

This getting dressed after showering seems to have some many attitudes attached to it that I keep telling my girls: "Lets look what the others do and try and not stand out!" :001_smile:

Though the last time when we were in Germany the collective cubicles were totally mixed, that was too much for my taste and we moved to individual ones. :auto:

[VanessaS]

Mixed cubicles would be too much for me. But if it's all gender-separated, I don't see what the big deal is. We've since discovered the Family Changing Room. Yay!

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

My last workplace had mixed bathrooms...

Very annoying during that time of the month.

[Ibbygirl]

Last winter we went swimming a few times at the YMCA and I was struck by how shy everyone was in the female-only changing rooms. I got out of the shower naked to dry off and everyone's eyes nearly popped out of their heads. They came out of the showers fully dressed! How in the world did they do that without getting everything wet? Some even came out wearing socks and shoes. :001_huh:

 

 

:lol::lol::lol::lol: Oh my gosh! I'm laughing so hard I have tears in my eyes. I can just imagine that scene! Too funny. I was raised to keep everything covered up. Skirts have to be to the knees or below, etc. I would probably have been one of those women having the heart attack if I had been there. hehehe

 

I'm a cultural mutt and I have so many weird things and customs that I don't even know where I fit in where. My family is Spanish and Cuban and I was born and raised in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida. Half of my family live in the latin quarter of Tampa (Ybor City) and half stayed in Cuba. I only have some distant relatives left in Spain. I grew up never eating dinner until sometime after 9pm. Sometimes we never ate until 10pm on weeknights. I grew up never worrying about time. In fact to this day I don't wear a watch. In our culture it is okay to be late. In fact if you are going to invite someone to dinner, it's understood that they probably won't be there until an hour after that time. We call this "Cuban time" hehe But in Ft. Lauderdale, the surrounding culture was mostly Anglo and they were definitely not cool with the being late all the time thing. I still struggle with this because I am notoriously late to appointments and I try really hard, but it just seems I cannot get anywhere on time. Also, we do alot of the kissing in my family. We are all very touchy feely and kissy and huggy and I have gotten more than a few strange looks from people when I am being openly affectionate with my kids in a public place. I've had people look at me with that shocked face and wide eyes and I think to myself, "what??" hehe Another thing is that we are really loud talkers in my family. I have a VERY large family and when we have family get togethers it is easy to have 50-60 people in the room all talking at once, but of course you don't want to talk to the person who is sitting next to you, you want to talk to the one who is across the table from you so you start shouting to them and they shout back. Everybody is shouting and talking and laughing loud. And then there is the language. We truly speak Spanglish. The conversations flow in and out of English and Spanish and with all of the laughing loud and talking loud I can just imagine what it must seem like to a more reserved quiet type person. :tongue_smilie:My mom said that her Anglo friends when she was a kid were afraid to come to her house after school because it sounded to them like everyone in the house was fighting. hehehe

 

I also always take my shoes off when I go into my house or anyone else's house. To me it is just disrespectful to the person to wear shoes into their clean home and track dirt in. I get weird looks for that one as well.

 

Another thing for me, was that my husband is from the Dominican Republic. When we were first dating I thought that our cultures would be very similar, we eat almost the same type of food, both Caribbean etc. But I was surprised at how different Cubans are to Dominicans. In my family, children are included in everything. My great grandfather who emigrated from Havana to Tampa, used to always have us kids come in and sit down on the floor and he would tell us stories. He told us about Cuba and the stories of our family, wars, etc... If he had a piece of cake he would cut a piece off with his fork and feed it to you and children and adults just mingled together naturally and there was not talking down or sending us away to another room, we were treated like equals, just smaller equals. We were treated with respect and we always felt like we belonged with the adults because we were all family.

 

In my husband's culture, or at least in his family, kids work alot. They have alot of responsibility at a young age and have to do alot of work in the home, cooking and taking care of siblings and such. They treat the children so differently that I was surprised when I saw how his family was. They also barely touch the children. In my family everybody hugs and kisses all the time, or jokes around slapping a back or giving you a nudge with an elbow, there is alot of physical contact. In my husband's family they hardly touch at all. The feel is much more formal and I always feel like I don't know what to do with myself. hehe My sister-in-law will come to my house for dinner and turn on the t.v. and watch her shows. That took some getting used to for me. I always think if a person comes to your house to visit that you spend the evening together talking and visiting, I have to just tell myself that it is a sign of her feeling comfortable that she can make herself at home. :)

 

Language is another one that is funny. In my husband's country they use certain words in Spanish that mean one thing to them, but in our culuture it is a curse word, insult or sexually suggestive. That took some getting used too! hehehehe :tongue_smilie:

Edited April 21, 2009 by Ibbygirl

[VanessaS]

Oh my gosh! I'm laughing so hard I have tears in my eyes. I can just imagine that scene!

Actually, on Tuesday I was at the Y again and had to use the restroom in the pool changing rooms as the other one was being repaired. As I was walking through I noticed this butt-naked family (Mom and kids) changing and thought, "Well, there you go. Some people don't fit the stereotype after all!" Then I noticed that they were speaking German. :tongue_smilie:

 

Oh, my gosh! You guys sound like my family. My family is actually atypical for Germans because of our Slavic heritage. Lots of loud talking, hugging, kissing, etc. And lots of black American intermarriage so there's a big English-German-Czech mix at any gathering. Everyone is loud, pushing food, touchy-feely, red-faced from beer (Czech and Bavarian is a drunk combination, LOL!) or wired from too much coffee and cake, pinching children's cheeks, cuddling babies, standing up to shout across the room "Hey, Max! Are you listening? (Ay, Max! Horst me?)", telling young women to "Eat, eat! You need some meat on your bones." (no matter how fat they are), etc. And every statement gets repeated in different languages so that everybody understands it. Children running all over the place.

It's a circus. Drives passers-by absolutely crazy.

 

And we eat late, as well. Dinner is never before 8 pm and then everybody stays up talking until the wee hours. Definitely no adult leaves before midnight at a party. Often they last until 2 or 3 am. And they often serve a midnight snack and a 4 am breakfast at Bavarian weddings.

I haven't been able to shake off the late-dinner habit yet. It just feels so weird to eat dinner when the sun is still shining.

 

And when you arrive at a party it takes at least 15 minutes to finish hugging and kissing everybody already there. And each time someone else arrives everyone gets up and the process starts over. I can always see my DH steeling himself to get through the rite-of-passage. He always hangs back behind the children like: please don't notice me.

And I'm occasionally gripped by the need to cuddle and smooch my children (and DH) in public. People look at me like: what's gotten into her? :lol:

 

It's so funny to visit my DH's family because they are so physically reserved. They don't even touch their spouses and children. We went to visit them after not seeing them for weeks and his mother shook our hands. It was so weird to me. My mother has never shaken my hand.

 

Although, they're Bavarian so they can get loud and red-faced sometimes, too. And they talk/yell across the room or over each other all the time. It's that Italian-influence, I guess. ;)

 

I went to visit a friend of mine in Berlin and being around her family was like visiting another planet. Very calm, quiet, and reserved. It was nice for a while but soon I felt like I was going to explode. I'm very tactile, although my own relatives consider me introverted. LOL!

 

So, I guess there are big German inter-cultural differences, as well.

Edited April 24, 2009 by VanessaS