Live webinar on 4/21/21 with Kelly Mahler

[PeterPan]

https://www.kelly-mahler.com/live-online-courses/theory-of-own-mind/  this is new stuff on what she and Vermeulen are calling Theory of Own Mind. It's $59, includes handouts, and you'll have access for two weeks after the course. I'm signed up. Should be good! 

[kbutton]

On 4/20/2021 at 11:43 PM, PeterPan said:

https://www.kelly-mahler.com/live-online-courses/theory-of-own-mind/  this is new stuff on what she and Vermeulen are calling Theory of Own Mind. It's $59, includes handouts, and you'll have access for two weeks after the course. I'm signed up. Should be good! 

How was it?

[PeterPan]

4 hours ago, kbutton said:

How was it?

I haven't gotten to watch it yet. I was getting HBOT. It's available for two weeks so I was able to procrastinate. Is she offering a recorded version? It could be really good if she did, but I don't know. I assume part of it will be stuff that was sort of obvious to me and some will be lightbulb moments. She's a very clear thinker, so it should help me organize my approach and be very intentional.

The farther I go with interoception, the more I realize there is to learn and be aware of. Her materials are the *starting* point, but for people who are very high functioning (ASD1, higher IQs, whatever) or even maybe for people who are not, there's MORE. There's just more. Like we are saying to be aware of your ears, but your ears have the outside and the INNER ear, kwim? And you realize how hard that is to feel and notice? And then to be aware of both at once! Or how about your sinuses. That's a pretty useful thing to notice and be aware of, but in all these several years of body scanning I had never once scanned my SINUSES. Nobody said to. They're sorta your nose, but they're INSIDE. 

So emotions become more complex, body parts more nuanced. There's just so far we can keep pushing this and applying and getting to. And it all rolls back into self advocacy. If all you know is something is wrong with your breathing/nose, how do you self advocate? That's really different from saying my sinuses hurt on this side and I have an ear infection, kwim? Not that I did, but it all goes back to our self advocacy, whether it's body or emotions/mental health. 

My ds blew away the IEP this time with his excellent behavior and self regulation. That's with ZERO meds in his system, just a bunch of really targeted supplements and a boatload of interoception work. Not ABA, interoception. Coercion or self control, which would we rather have?

So no, I haven't watched it yet, but just from watching the bits she had put out in promo I know her thinking is going the right direction. She's making good connections. And she's going to continue to because her clients are going to continue to mature in their self awareness and their lightbulb moments will inform and drive intervention. The main thing I'm looking for in the talk is the component where she talks about *how* to work on this. I want to see whether it's a theory or whether she's been doing it with clients. And I want to see how solid and organized her ideas are. I have my own vague ideas (some evidence based, some extrapolated), but she's just a really organized thinker. They'll probably have drilled it down to something practical, sort of a stage 2 for people who are through the curriculum, and that's what I want to see, that nitty gritty.

I guess if she's shooting the breeze and there's no nitty gritty I'll let you know, lol.

Edited April 25, 2021 by PeterPan

[kbutton]

11 hours ago, PeterPan said:

I guess if she's shooting the breeze and there's no nitty gritty I'll let you know, lol.

That would be great.

I have thought her main curriculum ideas are useful for my family but maybe not targeted in exactly the right place. If she's covering what you're talking about, it could be really helpful. 

11 hours ago, PeterPan said:

So emotions become more complex, body parts more nuanced. There's just so far we can keep pushing this and applying and getting to. And it all rolls back into self advocacy. If all you know is something is wrong with your breathing/nose, how do you self advocate? That's really different from saying my sinuses hurt on this side and I have an ear infection, kwim? Not that I did, but it all goes back to our self advocacy, whether it's body or emotions/mental health. 

Or, you feel the differences but haven't picked up on the words or on why it matters--this sounds like good stuff.

11 hours ago, PeterPan said:

My ds blew away the IEP this time with his excellent behavior and self regulation. That's with ZERO meds in his system, just a bunch of really targeted supplements and a boatload of interoception work. Not ABA, interoception. Coercion or self control, which would we rather have?

That's very validating!!! It's so good to hear about kids getting what they need.

[PeterPan]

3 hours ago, kbutton said:

I have thought her main curriculum ideas are useful for my family but maybe not targeted in exactly the right place. If she's covering what you're talking about, it could be really helpful. 

It's easy to assume pieces are there that are not. Basically, they should be able to say what they're feeling and how they know. And they should be able to look at someone else and make a reasonable assessment of what they're feeling and how they know. And if the person is doing those two things reliably, they don't need the curriculum.

[kbutton]

50 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

It's easy to assume pieces are there that are not. Basically, they should be able to say what they're feeling and how they know. And they should be able to look at someone else and make a reasonable assessment of what they're feeling and how they know. And if the person is doing those two things reliably, they don't need the curriculum.

I would add an additional component--if you give off signals you don't know you're giving off, and you swear they don't match your internal state, you might need the curriculum, lol!

I know someone (not my ASD kiddo) that swears they are fine, but paces. Or says they are fine, but they look angry and have a big wrinkled up angry face, complete with Klingon forehead. Or the tone of voice is most definitely not fine. When the tone of voice finally gets better, they swear their internal state has been fine all along. Um, no. I'm like, "I'm going to do what you're doing, and you tell me if you think I look fine." 

[PeterPan]

On 4/25/2021 at 2:42 PM, kbutton said:

I know someone (not my ASD kiddo) that swears they are fine, but paces. Or says they are fine, but they look angry and have a big wrinkled up angry face, complete with Klingon forehead. Or the tone of voice is most definitely not fine. When the tone of voice finally gets better, they swear their internal state has been fine all along. Um, no. I'm like, "I'm going to do what you're doing, and you tell me if you think I look fine." 

I'm confused, is this your dc or someone else's dc? That's a complicated situation, because a whole bunch of things are going on there. Sure the interoception is weak, but other pieces are too. And really, even your example completely fails at the most basic test of saying how he feels and how he knows. Saying you're "fine" is not saying how you feel. That's just a learned blow off response when people are bugging you.

[kbutton]

10 hours ago, PeterPan said:

I'm confused, is this your dc or someone else's dc? That's a complicated situation, because a whole bunch of things are going on there. Sure the interoception is weak, but other pieces are too. And really, even your example completely fails at the most basic test of saying how he feels and how he knows. Saying you're "fine" is not saying how you feel. That's just a learned blow off response when people are bugging you.

Not my DC. It's an adult. 

The bolded is probably a coping mechanism from this person's family of origin. Self-awareness means more turmoil and inconvenience in that family. It's very frustrating to be emotionally astute in that environment; it just creates more friction, frustration, etc.