Online Games for Higher Math?

[Paige]

We used to use and enjoy supplements like Dreambox and Prodigy for math. My DD is in Algebra and asked if there was anything similar that she could do now. I haven’t found anything- is there something out there?

Alcumus and Khan Academy are not fun at all. Dragonbox is too abstract for what we want. The ideal program would be adaptive with a little instructional help if the student gets stuck and fun with things like quests, prizes, etc. 

[daijobu]

Alcumus at AoPS?

[Paige]

2 hours ago, square_25 said:

Why is Dragonbox too abstract?

You can't tell Dragonbox what to focus on. I want her to practice working with multiplying polynomials with exponents today, for example, and in Dragonbox you just get the next Dragon, whatever that happens to be. Also, they don't always use notation with actual numbers and symbols so while it may be intuitive, it's not something she'd necessarily understand how to transfer to what we're talking about in her lessons and it doesn't help you much if you don't know what to do by showing why.

Alcamus is a big fat no. It's just math problems with no gamification. 

[Paige]

I'm not sure if I looked at the new 12+ Dragonbox. Is it much different than the earlier version?

Edited December 16, 2019 by Paige

[Clickie]

Have a look at Mangahigh, it's Grade 2- HS.  They are reviewed on Commonsense Media, which is where I learned about them originally.  On the Mangahigh website, they'll give you access to some of their games without registering but it is in fact a full curriculum where the parent/teacher has a  dashboard to create specific assignments aligned, in our case, to common core math.  I would note that I feel their product is unfortunately named.  They do have a lot of fun games that represent algebraic concepts.  It is pay, unfortunately, but you can get a free one week trial as a homeschooler, and if you like it, get it cheaper through Homeschool Buyer's Coop.  I don't represent either company, I just lurk on this board but I thought I'd chime in here because I recently had to find a fun middle school/ high school option for my son because Prodigy is so weak in the upper middle school grades  ;)

For background, my son is homeschooled, age-wise Grade 4 but just finishing up Grade 6 math (he's already started Grade 7 topics concurrently), and is approximately Grade 8 / Grade 9 for geometry.  We've topped out on Prodigy because it gets way too weak in content once you get into Grade 7/Grade 8.  We've switched to Mangahigh recently, he loves the games.  He happens to be "grounded" from his computer in the last few days, but he keeps asking to go back on to play Mangahigh.  Anyways, hope it helps.

[Plagefille]

I agree that Alcumus and Khan are not fun like Prodigy. My older kids have really missed using Prodigy as a fun review, but I haven't found anything yet for high school math.

[Paige]

I looked at Manga High but one of the reviews, maybe Commonsense, said that high school math students should spend most of their time in a separate area of Manga High that seemed to be more like Khan Academy or Alcumus and not the same fun game world. I didn't look into it more after reading that but I'll check it out and see. She may benefit from a preAlgebra practice too so maybe I'll just sign her back up for Prodigy or Manga High but it would be nice if there was a program that could also stretch what we were doing here. I really loved Dreambox for that. She used to move faster online than what her curriculum at home did so when we got to new material she was already familiar with the topics. 

I just brought her home again after several years in PS and I feel her basic calculation skills have declined. She said they used calculators in class every day for calculations beginning in 4th grade (when she began PS) and it shows. 

Edited December 18, 2019 by Paige

[Paige]

3 hours ago, square_25 said:

 

Oh, yuck! That's really unfortunate. Then maybe just playing an arithmetic game of some sort wouldn't hurt :-). 

Yeah, she knows how to do it all by hand, but the speed she used to have isn't there and her mental math skills are rusty and no longer automatic. 

 

 

[Gil]

Does it have to an online/computer based game? Is there anyone who could/would sit and play an Algebra themed board/card game with her?

[Clickie]

On 12/18/2019 at 6:58 AM, Paige said:

I looked at Manga High but one of the reviews, maybe Commonsense, said that high school math students should spend most of their time in a separate area of Manga High that seemed to be more like Khan Academy or Alcumus and not the same fun game world. I didn't look into it more after reading that but I'll check it out and see. She may benefit from a preAlgebra practice too so maybe I'll just sign her back up for Prodigy or Manga High but it would be nice if there was a program that could also stretch what we were doing here. I really loved Dreambox for that. She used to move faster online than what her curriculum at home did so when we got to new material she was already familiar with the topics. 

I just brought her home again after several years in PS and I feel her basic calculation skills have declined. She said they used calculators in class every day for calculations beginning in 4th grade (when she began PS) and it shows. 

I hear what you're saying in terms of finding a fun, online world in which to learn math concepts.  I'd say Prodigy is probably best in class in terms of online world: adventures, lots of currencies to earn and spend, a little house to decorate, lots of clothes, pets and buddies, etc.  And except for the Tower, the student can complete it all with no membership (i.e. free).

Math-Whizz, which is an online math education, K-8, reviewed by Cathy Duffy, has some sort of online world according to her website review.  I signed up for a trial week (as with Manga High, no credit card is provided for the free trial), but my son wouldn't complete the assessment test.  He was offended by how repetitive and long the adaptive assessment was, so I gave up on it.  But according to the Cathy Duffy review it has something of an online world where you can spend points that you earn.  Seems to have some games that address pre-algebra and algebra but likely only to the middle school level, and it sounds like your child is in high school algebra.

In the vein of gamification of higher mathematics (but no online world), I would mention that later in the spring, my plan is to buy the game, Variant: Limits by the developer triseum, which claims to teach the beginnings of Calculus I (finite limits, continuity and infinite limits) in a puzzler game format.  My son loves the concept of infinity so I think limits might appeal to him.  Seems to be one-time price, not subscription, price okay-ish.  I don't see it reviewed except by a few websites that review educational software for institutions.

In terms of Manga High, the Common Sense Media review that you read probably was communicating that students could just click over on the left nav to the Games menu instead of completing their assigned work.  So, yes, in a school computer lab, the students probably indulge themselves.  I don't really worry about it in a home setting, the games are all math educational towards the middle school and high school level -- negative numbers, middle school - early high school geometry, solving linear equations.  But I guess if you thought your child wouldn't voluntarily do their assignments it could be problematic.  

In my case, I want my son to learn Grade 6 statistics (basic mean, basic mode, measures of central tendency vs variance) because Prodigy doesn't have any decent simple problems in this area.   So I've assigned my son to do Manga High's curriculum problem flows. The problem flows are similar to how Khan Academy or Beast Academy has a series of problems that you answer in a sequence, and then you get a score at the end.  Beast Academy does a 3 star system, Khan Acdemy does their mastery points, Manga High has levels of badges.  In Khan Academy, as you know, the student watches videos and then when they go through the problem flows, they are quizzed on their understanding of the topic.  

In Manga High, from what I've seen and we're really just starting out, there's a "Teach Me" section that instructs the student in the math topic that they are learning about using multiple choice and explanations, and then the "Play" question flow gives simple and elucidating questions, progressing from easy to medium to hard to extreme which is where the student earns badges.  This is ideal for me because my son prefers to learn just by answering simple questions and earning badges. He doesn't like hard questions if he doesn't already understand the topic.  That being said, he will do the hard questions in Beast Academy, but he gets very frustrated because he's a "completionist" -- which he tells me that in gaming means you have to get 100% (all stars).  In contrast, Prodigy, as you know, doesn't provide any instruction, just questions/drilling, although clicking on the the little hint icon often tells you directly how to get the answer ("divide by 16 to convert ounces to pounds", "the area of a triangle is 1/2 b x h"). 

Alcumus I've only looked at briefly, it seemed very dry, which is out of the question for my son right now, he's not emotionally mature enough to do actual math-math.  So can't compare.

BTW, because you mentioned Dragonbox Algebra 12+ in this thread, my son and I went back and re-did the game (We compete on separate ipads).  We completed it first a few years ago now, and it definitely has way more content then it did a few years ago.  It's serious work with algebraic expressions (solving for x). But no quadratics, etc. Fun!

Sorry, long post.

[Clickie]

Sorry, misread your post wrt the Commonsense Media review, now I see that the review was referring to the students' having to do their assignments in a somewhat boring problem flow.  (For some reason I thought it was about assignment avoidance. My bad.)   All I can say, is that my son finds it more interesting than Khan Academy's problem flow, which my son detests and won't do.  (I like it, and wish he would do KA.)  He will do Manga High at the moment because he feels completionist about getting the badges and the questions go up in difficulty which the UI shows (Easy - Medium - Hard - Extreme.