s/o High School Reading Expectations

[RootAnn]

Since I'm new to high school expectations and I didn't want to derail the US History / Govn't thread, I thought I'd ask here.

 

Lori was kind enough to draw up a suggested schedule for DragonFaerie in her thread. I'm quoting the section that got me thinking:

 

MWF = History = 100 min/day

Mon

- 60 min = America: Last Best Hope (read 1 chapter)

 

I understand that everyone has different reading speeds, but in general, what is the expectation of reading per day (or per subject) for high school? Bennett's book is pretty easy reading compared to say, a Physics text or even some AP History texts. However, I'm not sure if I would be able to get through one of Bennett's longer chapters in an hour unless I was just reading for an overview. Chapters range from 25 - 51 pages and I expect my kid to annotate, check maps, and take notes of important people & events (dates) for end of chapter summaries & further research. 

 

A book like Marrin's Robert E Lee, for example, at 192 pages. How long would you assign to read that (on top of a fairly normal set of assignments)? One week? Two weeks? 

 

How about something like Uncle Tom's Cabin? (266, 382, or 500+ pg depending on edition) For literature, would you give a week just to read it and then follow with several weeks of assignments or spread out the reading over 2-3 weeks with discussion & work along the way & a (literary analysis) paper due the 4th week? 

 

Or should it just be "read for x minutes" and pick up the next day where you left off with time (vs pages) being the guide? I saw somewhere that 20 pages per day was a good rule of thumb for non-science-texts. ??

I've sketched out a loose syllabus for both Lit & US History, but Lori D's post left me wondering if I'm underpacing for high school level work. Help!

[Abeille]

Following, as I've been thinking about this too. My DS is a rising 9th grader and a very slow reader. His comprehension and retention is very good, but it takes him a long time to read. Up until now, we still do a lot of his history readings as read-alouds or with audiobooks. He read Uncle Tom's Cabin independently this year, and I think it took him about three weeks.

[Lori D.]

I understand that everyone has different reading speeds, but in general, what is the expectation of reading per day (or per subject) for high school?… I've sketched out a loose syllabus for both Lit & US History, but Lori D's post left me wondering if I'm underpacing for high school level work. Help!

 

 

Totally didn't mean to derail you!  :ohmy:

 

Please don't take that rough idea of a schedule from the other thread as "gospel". ;) I have no personal familiarity with Bennett's books -- I was just looking at the table of contents, which worked out to 1 chapter per week, since the OP of that thread was indicating she wanted to schedule all 3 volumes of Bennet's series, plus other materials, in one year. I did not look to see what chapter lengths were for Bennett's books, or how heavy/light the type of reading was.

 

And you are absolutely right -- every student is going to have a very different reading speed; and different types of texts will have very different reading speeds. Other factors that vary reading speed: size of print and space between lines of type on the page, wide or narrow margins, size of pages, amount of illustrations/sidebars, etc.

 

RootAnn, you list some great ideas as to how to schedule the reading at your house. :) You could take a week this summer and experiment with page amounts and amount of time with different materials to get a feel for what's realistic to schedule for your family. You might also try shooting for completing a section (depending on how long the section is) in one sitting rather than worrying about amount of time or page count. That allows you to absorb a complete topic or "thought" at one time. To help you figure out how long classic Lit. might take to read, you could look at how many hours long an audio version is for a rough idea of how long to schedule that work.

 

One thing to keep in mind is that History, and English credits tend to take more time, due to the reading (and writing). They also tend to be "mushy" subjects -- you could keep adding more and more and more to study. ;) So keeping an eye on your time is very helpful for keeping those credits "tamed", and shoot for an average of 4-6 hours/week, which keeps you on track for a maximum hour count of 180 hours = 1 credit.

 

We worked for understanding and mastery, and with slow-to-average readers that meant we didn't do as many classic works of Lit. in a year as others accomplished. That's okay -- what we did do, we had time to absorb thoroughly -- quality over quantity. ;)  

 

If you find you are starting to fall behind your schedule:

- for classic Lit, substitute a few short stories in place of a full-length novel

- for History, skim a textbook chapter to catch up, just noting subheadings, captions, bolded words/phrases, sidebars, etc.

- for English or History: completely drop a book, supplement, project, paper, etc. to catch back up

 

Again, so did NOT mean to panic you! :) All the best as you move into high school scheduling! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[Penguin]

This is my main concern about high school. DS is also a slow reader with excellent comprehension.

 

And it would be one thing to ask him to just read - quite another to ask for notes, outlines or annotations.

 

I am still not sure if my plans are overly ambitious.

[1Togo]

For non-textbook reading, I don't use page amounts for two reasons:  1) It hasn't work well with the varying abilities of our children, and 2) I want dc to focus on comprehension/content rather than getting through a set number of pages.   Instead, I use time for reading assignments; i.e. read for 30 minutes or 45 minutes or .... The reading time slot often includes a short writing assignment and/or annotation, so it isn't difficult to determine if the reading is productive.  We have used questions from "Teaching the Classics" for reading journals, and more recently, Adler's Great Ideas.  It's really simple - read for X number of minutes, write in journal, which usually takes about 30 minutes.  Keep moving steadily.  Let the books and learning lead the way rather than completing a list.

 

I use textbooks for teaching skills, and I usually schedule about 1 hour per day for this work in early high school.  For example, outlining the chapters of the health textbook and going over the outline with Mom might take 1 week for a chapter.  Anatomy chapters might take 2-3 weeks because dc takes Cornell notes for the chapter, studies the notes, completes other chapter exercises, and takes tests.  I also include lecture note taking with some courses as prep for note taking in college classes.  After a few weeks, I know how much dc can do well in 1 hour.  As the subjects become more difficult and our goals change, the time per subject may increase to 1.5 hours or 2 or 3.

 

I usually schedule 2 hours for composition, whether dc is working research essays for subject topics (government, health, history, etc.) or literature papers.  

 

So, the day consists of time slots with a mix of hard-and-fast assignments as well as do-what-you-can-do-well assignments.  Fwiw, math is 1 lesson per day, and we try to have morning time before math that includes reading aloud, Bible, etc.

 

In the wish-I-knew-then-what-I-know-now category, I often over-scheduled in the early years because I didn't understand that I couldn't shoehorn 2 hours of work into 1 hour, that I needed to allow for the difficult days/work, and that I needed to have a complete understanding of how many productive hours of work were appropriate for dc.  Using this year as an example, dc worked on both Algebra 2 and Geometry, so that was usually 2 hours of work.  Composition was another 1-2 hours.  Violin practice was 1.5 hours. Test prep was 1 to 2 hours.  Latin 3 was 2-3 hours.  Because of cover school requirements, we're finishing some subjects this summer.  However, dc and I feel this was an incredible year.  Significant progress with math, composition skills much stronger, violin audition material off and running, test scores in the money, and good grade on Latin. :hurray:  :hurray:

 

As Lori D. said quality over quantity.

 

 

 

 

[Penguin]

1togo, the specifics of your post are SO helpful! Which Adler book are you using?

[1Togo]

We are not using an Adler book, and btw, I don't use study skills books/courses.  I teach Cornell note taking, which we use for oral lectures and textbooks, and I teach outlining, although I don't place as much emphasis on outlining.  Dc study for tests by "teaching" an imaginary class with the Cornell notes.  I also think of ways to teach several skills with one task/assignment.  For example, we are working on timed essay writing using materials from Bravewriter.  Next week, after the timed essay is completed and evaluated, dc will use the essay plan; i.e. brief outline, written for the timed essay for an oral speech; i.e. 5 minutes at the most.

 

Anyway, for the Adler writing, we are doing the following:

 

1 - Read for the assigned amount of time.  Write one paragraph that identifies the Great idea and summarizes what the author has to say about it. (9th grade)

 

When the student gets very good at this, add the following:

 

2- Write #1 and write another paragraph that analyzes/compares what the author has to say about the Great Idea in today's reading selection with what he/she says about it in another place in the text or compare it with what another author says about the Great Idea.  (usually 10th grade)

 

When the student gets very good at this, add the following:

 

3- Write #1 and #2 and write another paragraph about what difference the Great Idea would make or not make in something you are thinking about doing or not doing. Why? (usually 11th grade)

 

4 - Do the above work 4 days per week, and write a 5-paragraph essay on Friday. (usually 11th grade)

 

We began using this Great Idea journal idea this year, and the work is going so well it goes into to my wish-I-knew-then category.  We will be moving to #2 this summer.  It can be used with all types of fiction and autobiographies but it is designed to be used with Adler's Great Books list.  Also, you do not need need to read complete books.  You can use a mix of complete books and selections; i.e. just start from the beginning and read to a stopping place you determine.

 

Of course, if you do all of the above, this is more than an hour of work, and it would be a significant part of the curriculum.

 

 

 

[Penguin]

I really don't want to derail Rootann's thread, but 1Togo I just need to pick your brain a tiny bit more about the Great Ideas Journal. Are your students working from Adler's 102 ideas or the Six Great Ideas? I love the idea :)

[Chrysalis Academy]

Listening too, and I love this, 1Togo!  Hope RootAnn is ok with us hanging on your every word!

[1Togo]

We are working with Adler's 102 Great Ideas, which I printed and put in the front of the journal.  I also like the Great Ideas journal better than anything else I have found throughout the years.  It covers so much.  The Great Idea journal with composition, math, science, Latin, and logic could be a classical curriculum for 9th, 10th, and 11th.  The headmaster who put this together says that he can really do something with his AP literature students after this work.  Next year is our last year of home schooling.  Can I have a do over?

 

Btw, the idea ties in with the op's initial post because the end result of the reading and journal writing is improved reading.  Also, we don't do this with every book.  Sometimes, the reading time is read-only as we move through whatever I have on the list for the year.  

 

Feel free to pm.  

[RootAnn]

Y'all know I don't mind.   :coolgleamA:

 

I'll have to come up with a happy medium between do-the-next-thing based on time & get-through-the-material. I have a fast & good reader, but a reluctant writer who doesn't want to have to use her brain.

 

[Edited to add:  She's enrolled in one of WTMA's writing classes in the fall, so I'm only scheduling Lit for her. Composition will take as long as it takes. There are only so many hours in the day, so I can't shoe-horn too much in. She's a voracious free-time reader, a math-lover, and she is continuing with her two languages in the fall while trying madly to make me add a third or a fourth into her schedule. She'd skip everything else (esp. writing and science) to make room for reading, math, and foreign language. So, I'm trying not to over schedule her, but I don't want to count history as a high school credit if it is more middle-school-level (half-speed) time-wise. Ya know?]

 

:bigear:

[Lori D.]

I'll have to come up with a happy medium between do-the-next-thing based on time & get-through-the-material. I have a fast & good reader, but a reluctant writer who doesn't want to have to use her brain.

 

That sounds great! Really, as Togo said above, *don't* try and go deep with every single book -- do some as read only, some as read-and-discuss aloud, some with a writing assignment, and some in-depth-pull-out-all-the-stops. :) And also as Togo said above, remember that it's a process; don't try and jump in full-throttle in 9th grade -- work your way up. :)

 

 

… She's enrolled in one of WTMA's writing classes in the fall, so I'm only scheduling Lit for her. Composition will take as long as it takes...

 

… I'm trying not to over schedule her, but I don't want to count history as a high school credit if it is more middle-school-level (half-speed) time-wise...

 

Just my unasked for 2 cents worth ;): I'd strongly recommend letting that class cover most of your writing needs, and ONLY read/discuss you literature for this next year -- no writing about it -- and keep the annotating/writing about History very light to start with, as together you figure out how much time the online class is going to require.

 

She'll get plenty of writing from the online class, and you can do literary analysis essays focused on your literature in future years of high school, and slowly/gently increase the annotating/writing about History as her stamina builds.

 

BEST of luck! Warmest regards, Lori D.