Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Hi I am trying to figure out what math to do in the fall with my ds12. He will have completed Alg 1, 2 and Geometry with TabletClass and AoPS Counting and Probability. I wonder if it wouldnt benefit him to take Intro to Algebra B (which is like Algebra 2, right?) again at AoPS for rigor and challenge, and to cement certain concepts before moving on to Trigonometry (that is what comes next, right? :confused1: ) Or maybe he should try AoPS Intermediate Algebra?? Thoughts? ETA: I made an error. My son has NOT completed Alg 2 yet...or even started it. Ack. Mommy brain overload. He's done Alg 1 and Geometry with TC, but not Alg 2. So I think that he will place into Algebra B, but I will have him take the placement tests. Clearly, I need more sleep. Or more coffee. Or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Have you given him any of the post-tests? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiana Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 +1 for the post-test. You should take the post-tests for algebra 2 and geometry. http://www.artofproblemsolving.com/school/recommendations#state/32 I also think, for a kid this young, throwing in intro number theory would be fun and interesting. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 okay thanks. I will have him take the tests and I also emailed AoPS for recs. My suspicion is that Algebra B would be the right place for him. And yes, Number Theory will be happening at some point as well. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiana Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 I actually think that he should be in either Geometry (because of how much more challenging the AOPS course is) or Algebra 3, if he learned well with Tabletclass. AOPS Algebra A and B is the two halves of their introductory book, and Algebra 3 is their intermediate book, which is the algebra part of precalc plus a bunch of extra stuff. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dereksurfs Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Since we have used both TabletClass Algebra 1 and AoPS Intro to Algebra (1-13) I would say they are complimentary. AoPS is so unique in a number of ways. I've heard many students, especially those in the public schools, use it as a secondary course. This adds a new level of challenge with more thought to the some of the concepts as well as greater depth in certain areas. For a young student there is nothing wrong with taking two passes at Algebra. That being said, if he takes the pretests and appears ready for Algebra 3 there is nothing wrong with moving ahead either. One thing to keep in mind with Geometry is that AoPS Geometry is known to be one of their toughest courses with a lot of intensive proof work. That may or may not be the thing you want to him to dive into more next. I'm also not sure about the grading of such proofs since we didn't go that route for Geometry. ETA: Your DS has moved with what appears to be a blistering pace through TC. So this may be a good time to reinforce some important concepts before going to the next level up... Or maybe something just really clicked with him and he is in a crazy, math loving, growth spurt groove. :thumbup: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 Well, this is a child who prefers Algebra to Geometry, so if their Intro Geometry is that challenging, it might just be off-putting, especially at his age. My concern with Algebra is retention--he gets things quickly and consequently they sometimes seem to pass right through his mind quickly (or that could just be tween brain). I will have him take the pre-tests and see where he falls. He had no problems with TC Algebra, but again, I am concerned about retention so another pass wouldn't be a bad thing, especially if it was challenging. Oh, and as an aside, i got an email back from AoPS and they basically said the same thing as you guys. But they also mentioned "Oh, and rest assured, Counting and Probability will be getting much harder--we start the kids off easy so they can master the fundamentals." Er....good to know....LOL :crying: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 Since we have used both TabletClass Algebra 1 and AoPS Intro to Algebra (1-13) I would say they are complimentary. AoPS is so unique in a number of ways. I've heard many students, especially those in the public schools, use it as a secondary course. This adds a new level of challenge with more thought to the some of the concepts as well as greater depth in certain areas. For a young student there is nothing wrong with taking two passes at Algebra. That being said, if he takes the pretests and appears ready for Algebra 3 there is nothing wrong with moving ahead either. One thing to keep in mind with Geometry is that AoPS Geometry is known to be one of their toughest courses with a lot of intensive proof work. That may or may not be the thing you want to him to dive into more next. I'm also not sure about the grading of such proofs since we didn't go that route for Geometry. Did you find it beneficial for him to take Intro to Algebra A at AoPS, even though he had completed TC Algebra 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 ETA: Your DS has moved with what appears to be a blistering pace through TC. So this may be a good time to reinforce some important concepts before going to the next level up... Or maybe something just really clicked with him and he is a crazy, math loving, growth spurt groove. :thumbup: Well, he is not done with Geometry yet. He thought he could keep going concurrent with AoPS C&P but there's no way. I actually agree with you about reinforcing important concepts. Which is why I am leaning towards Algebra B at AoPS (which is basically Algebra 2). ETA: Okay, wait a second. I just confirmed online that my son has NOT done Algebra 2 at TC. He told me he had, but I think he was confused, thinking the second semester of Alg 1 was basically Alg 2. Ooooopsie my bad. Okay, so he definitely won't be ready for Intermediate ALgebra at AoPS. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HootyTooty Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 My son is working through C & P right now. And his big grins are slowly turning into furrowed brow. They weren't joking about it starting nice a smooth and getting harder in the end. My son is still having fun (???) though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 I would not base your decision on the pre-tests but the post-tests. Their pre-tests are notoriously easy. I would definitely give him both their A and B post-tests. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 My son is working through C & P right now. And his big grins are slowly turning into furrowed brow. They weren't joking about it starting nice a smooth and getting harder in the end. My son is still having fun (???) though. Glad to hear my son is not alone. He is like "WHERE DO I EVEN BEGIN???" LOL. He's still having fun, but I think learning that he is expected to do every. single. problem. in. the. book. will be a huge relief. Is he taking the online class that's currently running? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiana Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Well, he is not done with Geometry yet. He thought he could keep going concurrent with AoPS C&P but there's no way. I actually agree with you about reinforcing important concepts. Which is why I am leaning towards Algebra B at AoPS (which is basically Algebra 2). ETA: Okay, wait a second. I just confirmed online that my son has NOT done Algebra 2 at TC. He told me he had, but I think he was confused, thinking the second semester of Alg 1 was basically Alg 2. Ooooopsie my bad. Okay, so he definitely won't be ready for Intermediate ALgebra at AoPS. Haha yes. Give him the Algebra A post-test but Algebra B will probably be the appropriate placement. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 I would not base your decision on the pre-tests but the post-tests. Their pre-tests are notoriously easy. I would definitely give him both their A and B post-tests. Yes, you're right about the pre-tests. He took it for their Pre-A and found it easy, but the Pre-A book? Not so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dereksurfs Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Did you find it beneficial for him to take Intro to Algebra A at AoPS, even though he had completed TC Algebra 1? We approached the sequence a little differently. As you know from experience with TC there is overlap between TC Pre-A and Algebra. It's actually very similar in parts. So the order DS did things was TC Pre-A followed by AoPS Intro to Algebra which we then followed up with the later parts of TC Algebra 1 for review. I definitely found it beneficial given our sequence. The one weakness of AoPS, for us anyway, is the lack of practice problems including reviewing basic principles. It is more geared toward stretching one's brain in new ways with respects to problem solving. There are fewer problems with more contemplation and wresting over individual problems. Working on single problems for over an hour just takes extra time. Although interesting and challenging there is not a lot of reinforcement of previously learned material in such a model. Rather there is the assumption that once something is learned it is known. Yet obviously this is not always the case. So DS actually felt like he needed more practice in the fundamentals which I was happy to provide via TC. In your case, you are going in the opposite direction, with TC first. I think that may be the more common way some approach AoPS when taking a second pass through Algebra. It will definitely add rigor and cause him pause for greater thought in certain areas. With a solid foundation already laid, it will free him up to ponder some of the alternative approaches and concepts AoPS presents. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dereksurfs Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Well, he is not done with Geometry yet. He thought he could keep going concurrent with AoPS C&P but there's no way. I actually agree with you about reinforcing important concepts. Which is why I am leaning towards Algebra B at AoPS (which is basically Algebra 2). ETA: Okay, wait a second. I just confirmed online that my son has NOT done Algebra 2 at TC. He told me he had, but I think he was confused, thinking the second semester of Alg 1 was basically Alg 2. Ooooopsie my bad. Okay, so he definitely won't be ready for Intermediate ALgebra at AoPS. Ok, that makes a bit more sense. Not that he couldn't have raced through Algebra 2 so quickly. I was just kinda surprised by the pace. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted March 6, 2015 Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 Ok, that makes a bit more sense. Not that he couldn't have raced through Algebra 2 so quickly. I was just kinda surprised by the pace. Oh he couldnt have done it that fast LOL. Not and retained anything. I agree with you about a second pass through Algebra. I think I will put him in Algebra B--just looking at the topics it looks about right for him. Of course, with the pacing of their online classes, it seems just about anything would be a challenge LOL. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiana Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Oh he couldnt have done it that fast LOL. Not and retained anything. I agree with you about a second pass through Algebra. I think I will put him in Algebra B--just looking at the topics it looks about right for him. Of course, with the pacing of their online classes, it seems just about anything would be a challenge LOL. Yeah, this also explains (to my confused mind) why you thought the algebra b topics should fit. I was surprised you thought that after algebra 2! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dereksurfs Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Oh he couldnt have done it that fast LOL. Not and retained anything. I agree with you about a second pass through Algebra. I think I will put him in Algebra B--just looking at the topics it looks about right for him. Of course, with the pacing of their online classes, it seems just about anything would be a challenge LOL. Yes, AoPS is designed to be challenging, regardless of your background. It's even hard for adults with advanced degrees in STEM professions and many years of math under their belts. Yours truly was no exception to this realization. :tongue_smilie: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HootyTooty Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Our time zone make the classes at an odd time for us. So ds is working through the book concurrently with with the reminder half of Intro to Algebra. Right now we are rotating after each chapter, I have found it has made my son's math journey more enjoyable. I'm hoping next year when we move to Geometry we can do something similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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