Dawdling, Boredom with Saxon 76. Need a Solution.

[Fourmother]

Help! My ds11 is bored to death with Saxon 76. It is an awful drudgery each day. He dawdles, and is beginning to say that he hates math. We tried switching to Singapore a couple years ago, but it didn't work for him at all. He just didn't "get" the bar diagrams. There wasn't enough instruction or review for him. We went back to Saxon along with the DIVE cds. It takes him 3 or more hours to do the DIVE lesson, practice set, half the problem set and corrections. I have him do odd #s one lesson and even #s the next. This eats up so much of the day, and is dashing all my hopes of implementing a 3 hour loop schedule. Right now I feel like pulling out my hair (and his, too.) :banghead:

 

Someone recommended setting a 1 hour limit for math no matter how much ds gets done. Then eventually he would get tired of being stuck on one lesson for a several days or more, and learn to speed up on his own. I'm hesitant to try this for fear that ds would get absolutely nothing done. Right now I'm setting the 1 hour limit for school time and requiring the work to be finished during his free time. But like I said, it still takes hours and hours.

 

I think the problem is a combination of short attention span, boredom, lack of an effective, engaging text. Any advise?

[G5052]

Some might say to try Teaching Textbooks, but I've heard of kids turning it into marathon math sessions as well. It depends on whether you have the resources to try something else or if you want to deal primarily with the character issues.

 

If he's taking 3 hours, it's because he wants to take 3 hours. My 11 y.o. dislikes math and likes to drag it out, but he knows that there are consequences for that (smile). To make sure he keeps working, I sit with him when he does math and correct him when he slides down the chair or loses focus. His math time is when I do my devotional reading, pay bills, and read the newspaper. Sometimes I do let him divide the lesson into two parts with his morning break in between, but he knows that he has to complete one lesson a day almost all of the time. We use CLE Math which is similar to Saxon, and it's far from thrilling, but he's learned a lot and I'm not changing curriculum.

[Hoggirl]

We used Saxon from 3 through most of 7/6. We got through about 2/3 of Saxon 7/6 and changed to Chalkdust Pre-Algebra which is a DVD-based program. My ds is a strong math student and generally likes math, but he really grew weary of the Saxon system. I am so glad we made the change. He just really needed something "different." His lessons were starting to stretch out a bit, too, though we never did DIVE. We do limit math to one our a day, but CD isn't set up to do one lesson per day as Saxon is, so this has worked fine for us. He completed the Pre-Algebra in one year and the Algebra in one year with no problems. You son just might need a different program. CD is a mastery program and that took some getting used to, but my ds (and I) love the instruction by Professor Mosely.

 

You didn't say anything about wanting to change necessarily, but for us, we had had enough of Saxon.

 

HTH

[Camy-7 boybarians 1 lady]

So far, my 3 boys have gone through the occasional "deer in the headlights" phenomena while working on academics. Perhaps your child is plagued w/ this as well.

 

What I have done is to do half of my son's math lesson w/ him orally(the newly introduced concepts), and then he does the remaining review and practice type problems on his own.

 

I do not allow him to leave the table until this work is finished.

 

To self-motivate, you could put the responsibility on him to get the work done w/o stating time limits . Later in the day, when he wants to indulge in a privilege, say no, and remind him that he is to finish his schoolwork if he desires to partake in pleasurable activities. Example, our children have computer time each day. When my 11 yob stated it was his turn on the computer, I inquired if he had finished his schoolwork. When he stated he had not, the computer privilege was disallowed.

 

This works even better when they have a more pleasing opportunity to participate in. My sons are very self-motivated because of our consistency in this area. (Sometimes it is more painful for us to watch, however).

 

I would also encourage you to make him more accountable w/ other duties or responsibilities both inside and outside the home. Is he finishing what he starts? Does he take care of his personal belongings and property? This can be part of the bigger picture, kwim?

 

Blessings,

Camy

[Fourmother]

As I see it there are 2 problems. First DS used to like math. We've used Saxon almost from the very beginning, but I now see issues with Saxon which I believe are getting in the way. I don't like the way Saxon teaches short cuts without really explaining the principles behind the thing. It leads to a lot of frustration and maybe a sense of futility on ds's part. This was why we tried Singapore a couple years ago. Unfortunately, the bar diagrams had him in tears. He was more frustrated with Singapore than with Saxon, so we switched back. The DIVE cds have helped a little. Still, each year math is becoming more tedious and frustrating.

 

The second problem definitely involves the larger issues of accountability, self discipline and organization. Dawdling can be an issue with other subjects, but not to the extent that it is with math. He also has trouble keeping up with his pencils, papers and books. I know that I need to be more consistent, too. It's hard for me to sit on top of him with 2 younger children to instruct. I'm sure you all know how it is. The rule is what you don't finish at math time is done for "homework" during his free time, so he has some motivation to speed it up. Perhaps he needs more.

 

He's about 25 lessons from finishing 76 so I'm trying to figure out what to do next. I'm not a parent who believes everything should be "fun, fun, fun." However, I don't like to see what could be an interesting subject turned into absolute torture. I'm trying to find a balance. I figure his job is to do the work with due diligence, and mine is to provide resources that work well for him. It seems like we're both failing. :sad:

[Suzannah]

We'll be starting Saxon 76 in September. DS has never been thrilled with math but this year in 65 it has been a drudgery with lots of staring into space and dropping pencils. Then when I correct the work I often find he's made a lot of careless mistakes which then take time to correct. Towards the end of the year we took a break and just drilled basic facts to make sure those were solid, then went back to the lessons with me sitting next to him for most if not all of it. I think it helped some. I think my plan for the coming year is to do "Life of Fred" a couple of times a week in addition to the regular Saxon lessons. I haven't worked out the scheduling, but my plan is to limit math lessons to something reasonable in two sessions. For the last two years I've tried to say anything not finished in a hour is homework, but frankly that disrupts the rest of our day and he was sloppy in his work too.

[Fourmother]

I think my plan for the coming year is to do "Life of Fred" a couple of times a week in addition to the regular Saxon lessons.

 

I have also been thinking of using Life of Fred. I wonder if it would serve as a good break between Saxon 76 and 87. Or, maybe I should look at something completely different like Chalk Dusk (mentioned by Hoggirl) or Math-U-See.

 

For the last two years I've tried to say anything not finished in a hour is homework, but frankly that disrupts the rest of our day and he was sloppy in his work too.

Yes, it is difficult. When one subject eats up this much of the day, it becomes harder to get everything else done. I am a stickler about this, but it is sometimes impossible when we must go run errands or have an appointment. Then I have him pick up where he left off the next day.

[TraceyS/FL]

I sold it from under her!!! :lol:

 

OK, it was 6/5 with DIVE - but she would NOT pick up the pace, so i sold it with her on lesson 90-something - and put her in Life of Fred Fractions (and have Decimals). She is liking it and picks it to do FIRST and it's not taken more than 20 minutes (i think that was because she did 2 lessons yesterday).

 

We then will be going to BJU Pre-Algebra wtih Homesat and seeing how that goes.

[CindyE]

My son is also 11 years old and very good in math. He went to a private school last year and did Abeka grade 5 and it was too easy. I am homeschooling him again next year. He wanted to do Saxon 76 because that is what his school does. They switch to Saxon in 6th grade. But after spending a few weeks on it, I couldn't handle it. I've done Rod and Staff and Chalkdust with my 2 older boys. Rod and Staff does a great job of presentation and review in a very traditional way but they only go up to 8th grade. And the 6th, 7th, and 8th grade books are very similar in their layouts. Each book covers the topics in more depth as you move up. I love Chalkdust except for the Basic Math book before Prealgebra. So my son is going to do the 7th grade Rod and Staff this year and then he is going to do Chalkdust starting with Prealgebra.

 

HTH

[Tamarind]

If your son has mastered the concepts in Saxon 7/6, he may be ready for Oak Meadow Math 8. Otherwise, try Oak Meadow Math 7. Order from oakmeadow.com. Oak Meadow recommended Saxon math at one time. Based on experiences such as yours, Oak Meadow developed its own math program. Oak Meadow Math follows a similar sequence as Saxon, but with less busy work. The lessons are shorter, concise but thorough. Unfortunately, Oak Meadow does not have a high school program. I'd recommend Foerster's Algebra and Jacobs' Geometry for high school.

[Fourmother]

No, I haven't considered R&S math, though we do use the English texts. I'll add it to my list of candidates. So Far I'm looking at Life of Fred, Chalk Dust, Teaching Textbooks, MUS and R&S.