Omnibus OR World Views of Western World?

[mominbc]

Can anyone give me insight as to the pros and cons of each. Would World Views of the western world have as strong an english program?

Thanks

[Michelle in MO]

I can tell you about Omnibus. Omnibus has an extensive reading list, perhaps a bit too much for what my kids and I are able to handle. However, overall we've come to really enjoy the program, and I've learned to pick and choose among the readings. There are Primary Readings, which are more essential, and Secondary Readings, which help to balance out the literature credit and are usually lighter. You would give your dc three credits if you did all of Omnibus: one in history, one in literature, and one in theology. Since we didn't do all of the readings, I divided up our hours/credits into either literature or history. This year went much better than last year.

 

The actual Omnibus book starts out with a section on each book entitled "General Information" which includes information on the author, context, summary of the book, setting, and other key issues. Then essentially it moves on from there to different sessions discussing each day's reading. There are recitation sessions sprinkled throughout which review the readings over several days. There are also writing sessions (which we tweaked) and evaluations (which we did quite a few of, although not all). The Omnibus readings are coupled with readings from Spielvogel's Western Civilization (we substituted World History: A Human Odyssey by the same author---and we always read full chapters, not just portions of chapters).

 

The only changes I would like to see in Omnibus would be more explanations of and discussions involving literary analysis, and also I would like to see Omnibus's writing sessions tweaked a bit. Otherwise, it's a very good program, and I would say it would be more than equal to almost any English program at a high school---and an honors one at that. My oldest is already a strong reader, but I'm convinced it was the difficult ancient readings we did last year that enabled her, to some degree, to do well on the PSAT in the fall.

 

HTH!

[ChemMommy]

I've got a rising 9th grader and I'm trying to firm up plans for high school. From day-to-day, I bounce between Omnibus, Notgrass, Stoubaugh, Spielvogel, Guerber, etc! I actually broke out in a rash from the stress!

 

The information on the veritas press site on Omnibus is very limited. I emailed them and got no information, so I appreciate your post.

 

Could you comment a bit more about the problems you've seen in the writing assignments? Also, it is laid out as a lesson plan or is it laid out more as a general order of study?

 

Thanks!

 

Pam

[Cedarmom]

I have not seen World Views, so I unable to compare it to Omnibus. However, I do use Omnibus and can give my thoughts on Omnibus.

 

 

1. Book selection- The books are varied in type, interesting , and challenging.

 

2. Discussion questions- I love these- my son would rather read than discuss. But, the questions are insightful and sometimes lead to deeper discussions. The teachers cd's answers are helpful.

 

3. Writing assignments- I enjoy these. They too are varied. They have some progymnasta, with directions on how to write. For Dante, we wrote Poetry. We have also done story writing this year. Many of the assignment do not give very detailed how-to, so you may need to supplement with another writing assignment unless your child has done a lot of previous writing.

 

4. Test-these are short answers and essay. At first my son struggled with these, the questions were more indepth and analytical then he had encountered. Now I don't call it a test, I call it an essay. We go over the questions together, discuss the answer, and then he writes it. They have examples in the teacher's cd, which is nice.

 

5. Literary analysis-it has a little but not as much as I think it should. I supplement with TWEM and Teaching The Classics.

 

6. We don't cover all the books they reccomend. Some people do. We like to take it slower. We use The Teaching Company to enrich some of our readings, and have enjoyed that.

[Michelle in MO]

I've got a rising 9th grader and I'm trying to firm up plans for high school. From day-to-day, I bounce between Omnibus, Notgrass, Stoubaugh, Spielvogel, Guerber, etc! I actually broke out in a rash from the stress!

 

The information on the veritas press site on Omnibus is very limited. I emailed them and got no information, so I appreciate your post.

 

Could you comment a bit more about the problems you've seen in the writing assignments? Also, it is laid out as a lesson plan or is it laid out more as a general order of study?

 

Thanks!

 

Pam

 

We tended to use the Summa (discussion/possible writing) questions as writing assignments rather than the progymnasmata exercises.

 

Now, realize my kids haven't come up through school using all of Veritas Press's materials, nor have they attended Veritas Academy. If they had, perhaps my reaction to the progymnasmata would be different. We have done some of the progymnasmata---first through the Classical Writing series (we did Aesop, Homer, and part of Diogenes) and then through Cindy Marsch's progymnasmata tutorials. Of those, we did one session at the beginning level (which I think was narrative/fable/proverb) and two sessions at the intermediate level (description/anecdote/confirmation--refutation). I think the one thing missing from Omnibus's progymnasmata exercises was the lack of writing exercises which lead into doing the progymnasmata. In other words, the CW series and also Cindy Marsch's tutorials were fairly extensive in teaching each level. I felt like Omnibus just kind of "jumped in"---yes, there were good explanations about each progymnasmata introduced, but no "lead in" exercises. Bear in mind once again that my kids did not attend Veritas Academy, so perhaps kids at that school spend extensive time doing preliminary progymnasmata exercises, so that by the time they hit 7th grade and start in Omnibus I, they're ready for anything and everything. My intent is not to criticize Omnibus, because overall I think it's a really good program. I just think the writing exercises should slowly build up to the progymnasmata, and I'd rather see the progymnasmata taught in order throughout the Omnibus series. In other words, I think that the progymnasmata exercises would have worked better for our family if they had been: 1) taught in order; and 2) taught slowly, perhaps several writing assignments focusing in on narratives, then fables, etc.

 

For example, the progymnasmata exercise for A Midsummer Night's Dream was Defense or Attack of a Law. In traditional progymnasmata study, that's one of the last studied. It just didn't seem to "fit"---at least for us. I'm sure there are others who did do the progymnasmata successfully. I just felt, at least for my girls, that using the Summa exercises as starting points for a written essay worked better. I also had Cindy Marsch do their evaluations on all written material, which worked very well for our family.

 

HTH!

[ChemMommy]

Thanks!

 

I've never heard of Classical writing or Marsh tutorials, so I'll have to go read up on them. We've been using IEW. Now I wonder if that's enough.

 

Can you tell that I've got a bad case of my-child-is-starting-high-school-itis?

 

I'm rethinking everything I've done in the last 9 years of hs education and seeing all kinds of gaps.

 

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

 

Pam

[Michelle in MO]

Thanks!

 

I've never heard of Classical writing or Marsh tutorials, so I'll have to go read up on them. We've been using IEW. Now I wonder if that's enough.

 

Can you tell that I've got a bad case of my-child-is-starting-high-school-itis?

 

I'm rethinking everything I've done in the last 9 years of hs education and seeing all kinds of gaps.

 

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

 

Pam

 

I remember reading in Debra Bell's The Ultimate Guide to Homeschooling about homeschooling through high school. She told the story of a friend who had to seriously search her heart and her inner resources to see if she could really do it, and she made that decision on a year-by-year basis.

 

As far as gaps in education, there are probably always going to be some gaps. Testing and other forms of evaluation, plus input from trusted friends and resources (i.e., these boards :D ) help us to locate those important gaps and try to fill them in.

 

The most important thing you can give your child will be the ability to learn and the desire to learn. If he or she learns how to learn, how to teach himself/herself, that will be the greatest gift you can give him/her!

 

Two stories in that regard: the oldest son of a friend of mine completed h.s. at our local public school and then went on to get his bachelor's and master's degrees. Believe it or not, he didn't know the names of the months of the year in order! Finally he decided he'd better learn them---so he did!

 

Second story: another gal I know, who went to one of our private schools in our small town, said that she didn't learn how to measure things from this school, but learned everything she knew about measuring from her mother.

 

So, there will always be some gaps---we just have to stay in tune with the variety of means at our disposal and give our kids honest assessments from time to time. Then, if they have the desire to learn and know how to research things and find things out, ultimately they can carry on from there.

 

BTW, IEW is a very good program---Cindy Marsch uses some elements of IEW in teaching her own kids. The ladies at Classical Writing also have high regard for IEW. If you want to stick with IEW, they have more advanced classes and DVD's geared towards highschoolers.

 

Best wishes to you on the next part of your journey!

[mominbc]

Thank you for the great information about Omnibus. :) I would love to hear someones view of Western Worlds.

[Rhondabee]

Here's an old thread from the K-8 board that might help a bit:

 

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17978&highlight=WVWW