Corraleno Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Strategicum.com This is a new program, which I just recently heard about through a gifted email list I'm on. I haven't used it yet, but I’ve been corresponding with Dr. Stoyen and have signed DS13 up for one of the classes (which starts next week). The classes generally meet for two 90-minute sessions each week, although there is also a class for younger kids that meets for two 1 hr sessions/wk. There is no textbook; Dr. Stoyen teaches the concepts and assigns the problems himself. This is an integrated math program, in the sense that it combines related concepts which are generally taught in separate “courses†in the US. For example, the Arithmetic, Algebra, and Elements of Analysis course covers concepts which, in the US, would be scattered across several years from Prealgebra to Calculus. The next course in the sequence is Counting and Probabilities, Sets and Cardinalities. He also offers coaching for various Olympiads/MathCounts/NACLO, etc. Here is a brief description of the philosophy/methodology, from the website: Instruction emphasizes understanding and derivation of concepts....Our curriculum commences with a logic primer and establishes basic axioms of mathematics. The curriculum then systematically derives the body of mathematical knowledge conventionally taught from elementary school through undergraduate (math-intensive major) college years. Beyond core theory, the curriculum includes computational linguistics, computability, algorithms and complexity, statistics and probability, actuarial, economic and financial modeling, and numerical analysis. [/Quote] Here is a blurb about the teacher, Alexander Stoyen: A former Math and Physics Olympian in the former Soviet Union in the 1960s and 1970s, Dr. Stoyen has worked extensively with bright and exceptional, home schooled and traditionally schooled kids...†[/Quote]He has a PhD from University of Toronto, was a tenured professor at University of Nebraska, and has done research for IBM, the US DOD, and currently works for a technology company. He is based in northern VA. You can read more about his philosophy and methodology on the website linked above. ETA: I asked specifically about working with kids who are 2e, as DS13 is gifted but “hates math,†which I imagine is not exactly the target audience for these sorts of classes. Dr. Stoyen told me that one of his own kids is 2e and he is very sympathetic and accommodating of 2e kids. Since I've found that an intensive/accelerated/whole-to-parts approach has been very effective for DS in every other subject, I have high hopes for these math classes! Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ester Maria Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Theoretically, would it be possible to get course material only (from what I understand they use their own?) for kids who do not care about certificates of completion nor anything, but might be interested in working through some of the offered courses in their own? Or would one have to be enrolled in an online class anyway to get that? (Not sure it is even relevant for us, just asking.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted January 4, 2012 Author Share Posted January 4, 2012 I'm afraid there isn't any written course material, just the lectures and the problems that he gives the kids to work through. That's also how the Lukeion grammar course worked — all of the information was contained in the classes, there was no separate text or workbook. What I loved about the Lukeion course (which I'm hoping is true of these math classes) is that by eliminating all the repetition and review and busywork, and just explaining the concepts really clearly and in context, the process is far more efficient and effective. After a one hour lecture on tense and aspect, with clear charts and tables, DS understood it perfectly. Even now (six months later, with no review) if I ask him to tell me the "future perfect progressive" of any verb, he can do it instantly. Ditto with any other grammatical concept. For some kids, getting them to "see" the whole system at once is more effective than years of drill and workbooks. Not to mention the fact that this one 4-wk class transformed a grammar-hating kid into one with a keen interest in linguistics! I'm hoping that these math classes are equally effective! Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted January 4, 2012 Author Share Posted January 4, 2012 Here is some additional info about the three courses that start this month: 1. Arithmetic, Algebra and Elements of Analysis is a deep and comprehensive presentation of key concepts the conventional curriculum presents in the Pre-Algebra-Algebra-Pre-Calculus stretch. Some Geometry will be used too, mainly to provide a traditional home for irrationals and transcendentals and to introduce limits, differentiation and integration in a classic, natural fashion. 2. Algebra and Geometry for Younger, Bright Kids is exactly what you think it is. I reject both the artificial separation of naturally intertwined instruction of symbolic (algebraic) and drawn (geometric) abstractions and the unfounded delay of abstraction usage. Younger, bright kids can and should be taught properly, with these abstractions and concepts presented in a natural and integrated manner. As some kids may prefer one paradigm of abstraction over another, their integrated use assists in preferential learning as well as counter-acting effects of learning disabilities. This is a unique course and I don't know any other such course available anywhere nationally for younger bright kids. 3. The Computability, Complexity and Algorithms course presents material normally found only in college courses. Kids interested in computer science, engineering, robotics or intelligent systems should definitely consider this course.[/Quote] Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ester Maria Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Thanks, Jackie. DD would possibly be interested in the one that starts in March (counting & probability - she was talking recently on how she was interested in topics such as probability and game theory), but I am not sure it is going to work out - she will probably be in GMT+1 in that time, which would make this course too late to effectively concentrate, though even if it were earlier, I am not sure what her general schedule is going to look like. I guess we will just stick with AoPS materials for now, though I have always wanted an integrated program. I cannot find any syllabi on his website, though - only general descriptions of courses? - so it is hard to estimate. Since they say most of their students are between 9 and 13 years old (DD is 13 going on 14 soon), and without syllabi or diagnostic tests, not sure. I guess I will just email the guy next month if DD will be interested in giving it a shot. She hates repetition and busywork too, but does not hate math. Yet. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBM Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Ester Maria, you might want to look into the Elements of Mathematics series of math books. I've only read about them (don't own them), but I believe Dana has them. You could contact her for more info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted January 6, 2012 Author Share Posted January 6, 2012 The classes meet 3 hrs/wk, though, so if you look at the cost per lecture hour ($17), it's not that out of line. Lukeion classes are about the same, and some of the PA Homeschooler classes are $21/lecture hour. Other classes often have registration fees and textbooks to buy, too. The other thing is that these are "integrated" math classes, which cover related topics that are usually (in the US) taught in separate years, so he covers far more math in a shorter period of time. The entire program will cover, in 3 years or so, what a typical US program would cover from Prealgebra to beyond Calculus (i.e. what would take 6-8 years in a typical US math progression). If you look at what the entire program would cost, it would be in the same neighborhood as AoPS or Landry Academy. E.g. if a student took all of the AoPS classes, it would come to about $3700 (including texts); 14 semesters at Landry Academy (Prealg through Calc & Stats) would be $4500 (plus the cost of the textbooks), and that wouldn't even cover some of the more esoteric topics. The reason I'm so interested in it is that I totally agree with his philosophy about teaching math, and I haven't seen any other program like that. Also, he really "gets" 2e kids (both as a parent and a teacher), and his approach seems tailor-made for kids who are gifted enough to handle advanced concepts, but have LDs that make it really difficult to extract those concepts from standard programs. This program seems to provide that interconnected/whole-to-parts focus that's missing from other math programs, coupled with the acceleration and lack of repetition that seems to work well with 2e kids. Anyway, DS has his first classes next week (Mon & Thurs), so I'll update when I've actually seen the teacher in action. Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBM Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Jackie, I will be really interested to hear how this works for your son. Please keep us posted! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) I've registered my son for the Algebra and Geometry for Younger Bright Kids class with Strategicum and was informed by Dr Stoyen that there's still space available in the class. I'm mentioning it in case someone here's looking for an online math class for an advanced child. The class starts this Monday. Dr Stoyen mentioned that this class is targeted at kids aged 9 onwards. Details here: http://strategicum.com/courses.html When I inquired about this class some time ago, this is what Dr Stoyen had to say. I thought his explanation was interesting and I'm quite intrigued by the approach he refers to although I do understand I'll only know how good it is after my son starts the class: I do have my own curriculum indeed. The main thing is to teach in an integrated fashion. Algebra and Geometry and Calculus (and Logic, and Computer Science, even Physics…) are largely or entirely merely different paradigms of the same key concepts. So we go in and out of different paradigms, linking them up while teaching these concepts...In our Geometry class we started from scratch. In Class 9 yesterday we began Trigonometry. We’ll be proving and deriving key results, such as the Law of Cosine, shortly. After our short course, the kids – who are mostly 9-12 years old – will have a better grasp on these paradigms than most high schoolers who took the (so-called) Algebra 2 or Pre-Calculus. Edited January 8, 2012 by quark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted January 20, 2012 Author Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) I wanted to update, since we've just finished the 2nd week of class (Arithmetic, Algebra, and Elements of Analysis). I am SO happy with this class! The format is very relaxed, more like a math club with lots of interaction & discussion, rather than a formal class with a lecture followed by a few questions. The classes take a "guided discovery" approach: e.g., an axiom or definition may be provided, followed by questions/problems for the kids to work out on the class whiteboard, followed by a conceptual explanation, followed by more questions and problems. It's a small class (6 kids) and the age range is 11-13. At 13, DS is the oldest, but he's also a 2e math-hater, whereas the younger kids are math-lovers who have had multiple classes with Dr Stoyen. The material is challenging, but the atmosphere is very non-intimidating — Dr Stoyen is like a big teddy bear, very warm and funny, and there's no penalty or embarrassment for wrong answers. (Usually a wrong answer will get a response like "OK, I can see what you were thinking, that was a very good try..." followed by a hint.) And I particularly like the constant reinforcement of the idea that algebra & geometry are just two different ways of looking at the same thing. There are 3 hrs of class per week, and (so far) there is no homework, so I've been pulling a few problems from Jacobs Alg I & Larson Alg II for him to work on the whiteboard between classes. This has turned out to be the perfect approach for DS — very interactive, discovery-based classes plus working fewer/harder problems on a whiteboard, vs. slogging through a textbook. He's totally getting the concepts, but the biggest breakthrough is that, for the first time in his life, he's enjoying math. After years of tears and arguments and hating math, he now says that math is really "fun & interesting." Instead of dawdling and procrastinating, and doing everything possible to get out of math, he's asking me to give him extra problems! We went out to dinner the other night, and he actually asked me to give him some equations to work while we waited for our food. :svengo: Needless to say, I plan to stick with these classes through the end of the sequence. :thumbup: Jackie Edited January 20, 2012 by Corraleno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest S Harris Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 In regard to the sequence of this curriculum, would Arithmetic, Algebra, and Elements of Analysis be the correct class to place a child that is 2/3 through pre-algebra? Is this the "first class"? Although I saw the classes that are offered for Spring and read the white paper about the curriculum, I don't think I saw the entire sequence of courses. Thank you for your comments above and any help you can provide. S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBM Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 That is wonderful, Jackie! I don't know why a more integrated approach isn't done here in the U.S. It seems to work so well in other countries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 In regard to the sequence of this curriculum, would Arithmetic, Algebra, and Elements of Analysis be the correct class to place a child that is 2/3 through pre-algebra? Is this the "first class"? Although I saw the classes that are offered for Spring and read the white paper about the curriculum, I don't think I saw the entire sequence of courses. Thank you for your comments above and any help you can provide. I don't know what classes were offered in the fall, but the other kids in DS's class have already taken from 2-4 classes with Dr Stoyen. He says that the classes don't really need to be taken in any particular sequence, though, as each course addresses a specific set of related topics, and covers those topics from about a prealgebra level up to precalculus/calculus (or beyond). So in that sense there is no "first class," you can jump in at any point. The Algebra & Elements of Analysis class will cover: *Relations and functions, odd, even, 1-1, onto, partial, total, composition, inverse *Numbers and variables, linear equations, polynomials, exponentials, logarithms *(Relative) primes, factors, (integer, rational, real and complex) roots *Key Theorems: Arithmetic, Algebra, Factor, Remainder, Intermediate Value *Sequences, series, convergence, divergence, limits *Tangents, areas and volumes, introduction to differentiation and integration For example, the first 3 classes have focused on relations & functions. Flipping through the Larson texts that I have, I can see that some of the concepts covered so far are introduced for the first time in Larson's Alg II and even Precalc. The basic philosophy is to present all of the material on a specific topic (or interrelated topics) in a single course, rather than present it a little at a time, year after year, from 6th-12th grades. The scope and sequence is entirely different, so the "levels" of the courses really don't correspond to Prealg, AlgI, etc. The next course that will be taught this Spring is Counting & Probability, and I think Dr. Stoyen said he was thinking of doing Geometry after that. He said that he's in the process of revising the way he groups the "units" and that there will probably be a total of 10-12 units in the complete sequence. Those will go well beyond what is normally taught in the Prealg-Calc sequence, though. I'm sure this approach would be a total nightmare for kids who prefer to have the material presented in smaller chunks, with repetition and review to "cement" the concepts, but other kids (like DS) tend to "lose the plot" if things are presented too slowly and broken into small pieces; they actually understand things much better if they get the theoretical "big picture" all at once. Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest S Harris Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Thank you so much! Your posts have been very helpful and timely, as I am trying to make a quick decision. My son is not struggling with math but is starting to say he dislikes it. This is our second year of homeschooling and math is really the last "sweet spot" we have yet to find. I am encouraged by this method and your comments about your experience. My son is very much a "whole to part" thinker and I think this might work! Since your son is taking the class we are considering, I have one last question. I contacted the instructor and he suggested that that we could watch the first three recorded sessions and join in for the fourth class. Based on your experience so far, would I be asking a lot from my son to do this, considering the paradigm shift and new technology, or would it be better to join a class from the beginnning in the summer or fall? I appreciate your thoughts on this. The online homeschooling community is amazing. Regards, S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Thanks for the update Jackie. The A3 class sounds great! The Alg and Geo class for Youngers was, sadly, cancelled due to low enrollment. Good to know we have the A3 to look forward to next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) Thank you so much! Your posts have been very helpful and timely, as I am trying to make a quick decision. My son is not struggling with math but is starting to say he dislikes it. This is our second year of homeschooling and math is really the last "sweet spot" we have yet to find. I am encouraged by this method and your comments about your experience. My son is very much a "whole to part" thinker and I think this might work! Since your son is taking the class we are considering, I have one last question. I contacted the instructor and he suggested that that we could watch the first three recorded sessions and join in for the fourth class. Based on your experience so far, would I be asking a lot from my son to do this, considering the paradigm shift and new technology, or would it be better to join a class from the beginnning in the summer or fall? I appreciate your thoughts on this. The online homeschooling community is amazing. Regards, S Have you asked Dr. Stoyen if the class will be offered again in the summer/fall? I'm not sure what his plans are in terms of which units he will teach when. If he'll let you watch the recorded classes to see if the course will work for you (before you enroll), I would give it a shot. You can skip the first class, it was mostly just introducing everyone and getting the WizIQ system working (we missed the first class and watched the video instead, and... we really didn't miss anything). If your son can understand and follow the 2nd & 3rd classes, then I'd jump right in. The next class is Monday afternoon, though, so you'd want to watch #2 & 3 before then. I think that when you're watching the recording, the class can seem a bit slow, because he waits for kids to figure things out, to type in answers or get the tools and draw on the board; it's definitely not a typical "video math lesson" (e.g. Thinkwell, MUS, Chalkdust, etc.). I remember thinking, through the first hour of class #2, geez this is slow, and yet by the end of the class they had covered an awful lot. And FWIW, DS didn't find the classes slow, because he was trying to take in and process the information. An adult who already knows this stuff might be thinking "get on with it already," but the child who is sitting there trying to understand the definition of an "odd function" [ f(-x)=-f(x) ] and figure out what the graph would look like needs time to think, kwim? Jackie Edited January 22, 2012 by Corraleno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 Thanks for the update Jackie. The A3 class sounds great! The Alg and Geo class for Youngers was, sadly, cancelled due to low enrollment. Good to know we have the A3 to look forward to next time. Oh, I'm so sorry to hear that! Ironically, he specifically added that class because it was suggested by parents — and then no one signed up? That stinks. :( Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Stoker Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 nm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emerald Stoker Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 (edited) nm Edited November 21, 2012 by Honoria Glossop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholas_mom Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I just found this while looking for Latin and VSL :) I am trying to appropiate math for my gifted son and this looks so good. Jackie can you update this class for you since your son took it last year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corraleno Posted February 15, 2013 Author Share Posted February 15, 2013 Sadly, Dr Stoyen no longer teaches online classes. :sad: I don't think he had enough kids sign up to be worth it for him — and most of the kids who did sign up were the kids he tutors in person anyway. You might be interested in eIMACS Elements of Mathematics online program; there have been a few discussions about it on this board if you search around. It's not a live class, and it doesn't cover the same topics, but I think it works well for VSLs and so far my son likes it. Jackie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholas_mom Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 Thanks! I will check it out :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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