Need help interpreting vision therapy results?

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

:banghead: Booo...just wrote this whole post and it didn't go through!!

 

Anyways...

 

just got the results from ds10's vision therapy screening and I don't feel like I got much interpretation from the DR. :confused: I am hoping that some of you well-educated and experienced parents can help me see the big picture here!!

 

His first appt. got him in glasses for being far-sighted and his binocular vision was off. I think eye teaming/convergance issues.

 

Second, was the visual processing and perception test. He scored above average, 90th percentile, in processing. However, scored below average in perception. Weakest were L-R and Hand Eye Coordination at 1-2%.

 

She recommended vision therapy and that we seek a full eval. from a physchologist to coordinate therapy (I agree with the latter for sure and have already been looking into that). She said a neurophysc would be overkill for our needs. I also asked her if these results seem to be consistent with what you see in dyslexics and she said no. However, she proceeded to say it was b/c dyslexia comes with low (or lower) IQ and she suspects ds to have an above average IQ.

 

This confused me b/c I am under the impression that the opposite is true of dyslexia (average to above average IQ)...and that visual processing would not be an issue. It's language processing with dyslexia. Therefore, his results seem to imply that the defecit is taking place outside of the visual processing center and information is getting jumbled somewhere else (ummm...language processing center? or maybe executive function? or both? IDK). I am not saying vision therapy isn't what we need...but I just don't feel like I got an interpretation targeting his defecits or atleast targeting a specific area that may be causing his defecits (even though I asked). IDK...maybe most don't ask but...I need to know the details, lol :D!

 

Also, I kind of don't feel like we made any gains...the exam results just reinforced what I had already assesed by working 1-1 with him.

 

If anyone can help make a little sense out this, PLEASE do! I defentily have to catch the big picture (or atleast have some ideas that I am on the right path) before I feel comfortable working the pieces of it.

 

In advance, thanks so much for any input!

[PeterPan]

This is going to sound really brash, but I'd question what your doctor even knows about VT, dyslexia, etc. To say dyslexics have lower IQ is about the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Ok, I've heard stupider, but let's just say it's patently false, patently. It means she doesn't have enough experience with dyslexics and treating visual procssing problems to know what she's talking about. A dev. optometrist can't even diagnose dyslexia, and they CERTAINLY shouldn't be telling you it means the dc has a lower IQ. Stealth dyslexia=high IQ + dyslexia. Not at all unheard of; google it.

 

So this doc didn't give you a written letter of findings? No photocopy of the test scores? No written estimate of what the VT would cover and how long it would take???

 

I'd look for another doctor. You should know exactly what you're treating and why. You want somebody who has experience with your problems and isn't spouting stupidity. I don't see how you can even tell if you need VT at this point. I left our VT evaluation with NO confusion about exactly what was going on and what we were trying to fix. If they didn't demonstrate that to you, then something is wrong. The people who have come on the boards with such general/generic results and a recommendation to do VT anyway seem at the end to feel like they got taken for a ride. He should have been able to demonstrate clearly, exactly what the problems are. Mine did, and the docs for others here did too.

 

$80 this doc is friends with that psychologist, and that's why you got that referral. A neuropsych is a psychologist who knows more, that's all. You should definitely pay money for the less qualified psychologist when you have problems. You wouldn't want to go to someone with more experience and knowledge.

 

BTW, what do *you* think is going on? I must have missed it in other threads where you explained.

 

I didn't realize what a game all these referrals are when I first started. You call one place, and you figure they're referring you to the BEST in town. No, they're referring you to their chum, someone they went to college with, someone they know. Get synical. Ask lots of questions.

Edited February 25, 2011 by OhElizabeth

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

This is going to sound really brash, but I'd question what your doctor even knows about VT, dyslexia, etc. To say dyslexics have lower IQ is about the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Ok, I've heard stupider, but let's just say it's patently false, patently. It means she doesn't have enough experience with dyslexics and treating visual procssing problems to know what she's talking about. A dev. optometrist can't even diagnose dyslexia, and they CERTAINLY shouldn't be telling you it means the dc has a lower IQ. Stealth dyslexia=high IQ + dyslexia. Not at all unheard of; google it.

 

***:iagree: I know that!! Which is why I questioned her knowledge/interpretation of things. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt that she was certainly not making a dyslexic diagnosis. I had just asked her if she finds these results to be consistent with other dyslexic patients and would his results support a dyslexic diagnosis based on her experience in treating patiens who needed VT. Her response though was not educated which defenitely made me scratch my head and come here to the board...

 

So this doc didn't give you a written letter of findings? No photocopy of the test scores? No written estimate of what the VT would cover and how long it would take???

 

**She is mailing me the written report Monday. She told me over the phone that he would probably need 2-3 sessions (12 visits=1 session) but she re-evaluates after every session. She did not go over specifics but said that a program would be put together to work on his particular areas where he needs improvement. More specifically, he achieved a 90th percentile for the overall battery of visual processing tests...and perception broken down: L-R discrimination was 2%, developmental eye movement scanning was 25th percentile...she said his clarity was there but he was slow, and Hand Eye Coordination was 1%...she said details overlooked and would reflect in a lack of organization on written work and motor skills of handwriting and spacing affected, lacks ability to visualize and image and accurately transcribe it.

 

I'd look for another doctor. You should know exactly what you're treating and why. You want somebody who has experience with your problems and isn't spouting stupidity. I don't see how you can even tell if you need VT at this point. I left our VT evaluation with NO confusion about exactly what was going on and what we were trying to fix. If they didn't demonstrate that to you, then something is wrong. The people who have come on the boards with such general/generic results and a recommendation to do VT anyway seem at the end to feel like they got taken for a ride. He should have been able to demonstrate clearly, exactly what the problems are. Mine did, and the docs for others here did too.

 

**There is not another doctor listed on the website within a 100 mile radius. I MAY have found one, through word of mouth, another local doctor but I still have to check into that one. I could always send our results there for a second opinion. I agree...I am not going to pull the trigger on therapy until I understand the bigger picture better. And she recommended that too.

 

$80 this doc is friends with that psychologist, and that's why you got that referral. A neuropsych is a psychologist who knows more, that's all. You should definitely pay money for the less qualified psychologist when you have problems. You wouldn't want to go to someone with more experience and knowledge.

 

**Unfortunately, I have not had enough experience with all of this to understand all the benefits of the different specialist out there. I have tried to get some input on that here on the board but still felt a little wishy washy on things. I agree that she probably does have a relationship with this doctor...they do tend to have referral networks in place simply based on relationship. Now the neurophsyc. was who I was originally looking into anyways just so that I could get a more objective analysis, as well as, additional cognitive understanding. If you can share any benefits you see fit between how to choose between the two, please share.

BTW, what do *you* think is going on? I must have missed it in other threads where you explained.

 

**Well, I haven't really posted about our "whole" story. Mainly b/c it is cumbersome...as most anyone with SN's children know. And I am dealing with not only just his special needs but 2 others of my 4 seem to have something going on :confused: so it becomes time consuming and a money pit trying to get it all figured out and their needs met.

 

As for DS10, he has been recognized with at risk in Kinder for reading failure and services started...and never stopped. Except that he has never been tested to see exactly why he struggles. One of the reasons is b/c he was moved to a private school in 2nd grade (and they had yet to test for LD in public). In the private school, he was in a VERY small teacher to student ratio and they modified things for him and taught him thru Barton. He did very well there. This year, now fourth grade, we moved out of state and I am homeschooling him, the private school wouldn't work with him and I don't want to put him through the public SN"s experience (that was a disastor in the earlier grades).

 

Since homeschooling him, I started to notice multiple defecits that painted a picture...all connected in some way...and started to seek knowledge and understanding of why all these things exist in what appears to be a very smart student. His last school mentioned dyslexia being a possability so that is the road, by default, I initially pursued seeking info.

 

He also has symptoms of adhd-combination type (more controlled on diet and supplementation), has high sensory needs, dysgraphia, terrible spelling, slow reading fluency, good comprehension, poor word attack skills, lacks attention to details, L-R confusion, word ommissions or additions when reading, has to use a tracker, difficultly following written sequence of directions, terrible organization of work...This is all SO taxing....on everyone! Thankfully we've seen some behavior improvements with diet...for one, his impulsive, in your face behavior has improved...he was becoming OCD about kissing his 2yo sister and hanging on me! Poor girl! And poor boy...TOO much love in the wrong way turns people OFF!!!! UHHH!!!

 

I think it's adhd, dyslexia, and dysgraphia. Honestly, that is my gut but I am not sure though :confused:. Also, diet is ongoing...he has allergies and has developed food sensativities that have been manifesting in stomach upset...that has improved but is not healed. I am a believer that this all plays a in big role in the big picture and plan to get lab work done simultaneously with the physc.

 

And since 3 of my 4 children show signs of it I am carefully working through this since most all this is OOP expenses. I really don't want to waste a ton of money on the wrong specialist and I suppose that is my biggest fear. I will spend a ton of money, that we don't really have, to find he has an "unspecified reading disability"...DUH??? I can diagnose that! I want someone to tell me WHY? What makes him different? Mainly so that he can operate in his strength zone and we can effectively work with his differences.

 

BLAH!!! :rant: LOL!

 

I'll leave ds#2 and dd#3 out of this one, lol! Then they're next...

 

I didn't realize what a game all these referrals are when I first started. You call one place, and you figure they're referring you to the BEST in town. No, they're referring you to their chum, someone they went to college with, someone they know. Get synical. Ask lots of questions.

 

Thanks for listening!!!

 

PS-long and I didn't proof read so sorry if there are errors or major run-on's!!! :tongue_smilie:

[Dobela]

This is going to sound really brash, but I'd question what your doctor even knows about VT, dyslexia, etc. To say dyslexics have lower IQ is about the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Ok, I've heard stupider, but let's just say it's patently false, patently. It means she doesn't have enough experience with dyslexics and treating visual procssing problems to know what she's talking about. A dev. optometrist can't even diagnose dyslexia, and they CERTAINLY shouldn't be telling you it means the dc has a lower IQ. Stealth dyslexia=high IQ + dyslexia. Not at all unheard of; google it.

 

So this doc didn't give you a written letter of findings? No photocopy of the test scores? No written estimate of what the VT would cover and how long it would take???

 

I'd look for another doctor. You should know exactly what you're treating and why. You want somebody who has experience with your problems and isn't spouting stupidity. I don't see how you can even tell if you need VT at this point. I left our VT evaluation with NO confusion about exactly what was going on and what we were trying to fix. If they didn't demonstrate that to you, then something is wrong. The people who have come on the boards with such general/generic results and a recommendation to do VT anyway seem at the end to feel like they got taken for a ride. He should have been able to demonstrate clearly, exactly what the problems are. Mine did, and the docs for others here did too.

I found out later that our VT was fairly new to the business. I knew she was new to our town as well. However, she gave me test scores in a very thorough written report, she explained to me what was wrong with my son's eyes, she gave me terms and definitions, she explained how he was seeing and how that effected other things. She then was able to give me a plan of action of what she would be doing, why she was picking particular activities, what those activities were expected to do, and so on. When she changed his goals and objectives, I always knew why. She had a time line of how long she hoped it would take.

 

...

I didn't realize what a game all these referrals are when I first started. You call one place, and you figure they're referring you to the BEST in town. No, they're referring you to their chum, someone they went to college with, someone they know. Get synical. Ask lots of questions.

My reply in color :)

[Dobela]

***:iagree: I know that!! Which is why I questioned her knowledge/interpretation of things. I'll give her the benefit of the doubt that she was certainly not making a dyslexic diagnosis. I had just asked her if she finds these results to be consistent with other dyslexic patients and would his results support a dyslexic diagnosis based on her experience in treating patiens who needed VT. Her response though was not educated which defenitely made me scratch my head and come here to the board...

 

When we first went to our VT she almost immediately said to me that ds did not have dyslexia. This is after more than one professional told me that he did have it. She later agreed that she was not in the businees of diagnosing but that the screening assessments she used were considered to be very accurate for predicting dyslexia. However, she never made statements aligning IQ with likelyhood of having dyslexia. That to me shows this VT either has poor communication skills, is unexperienced with a large community of dyslexic students and therefor has a narrow view of dyslexia accordingly, or is just uneducated and didn't realize how educated you were. I hate it when someone gives me a bad answer instead of just saying, "I don't know." :glare:

More specifically, he achieved a 90th percentile for the overall battery of visual processing tests...and perception broken down: L-R discrimination was 2%, developmental eye movement scanning was 25th percentile...she said his clarity was there but he was slow, and Hand Eye Coordination was 1%...she said details overlooked and would reflect in a lack of organization on written work and motor skills of handwriting and spacing affected, lacks ability to visualize and image and accurately transcribe it.

I can't remember which thread right now but this sounds like the Primative Reflexes we were discussing somewhere else. My son's scores in those areas were the same or lower. When we successfully remediated these, well and with VT in general, my son's resemblance to someone with ADHD diminished greatly. I thought we were looking at ADHD but he was so wiggly and unfocused because literally he couldn't use his eyes to complete the necessary tasks.

 

I'd look for another doctor. You should know exactly what you're treating and why. You want somebody who has experience with your problems and isn't spouting stupidity. I don't see how you can even tell if you need VT at this point. I left our VT evaluation with NO confusion about exactly what was going on and what we were trying to fix. If they didn't demonstrate that to you, then something is wrong. The people who have come on the boards with such general/generic results and a recommendation to do VT anyway seem at the end to feel like they got taken for a ride. He should have been able to demonstrate clearly, exactly what the problems are. Mine did, and the docs for others here did too.

 

**There is not another doctor listed on the website within a 100 mile radius. I MAY have found one, through word of mouth, another local doctor but I still have to check into that one. I could always send our results there for a second opinion. I agree...I am not going to pull the trigger on therapy until I understand the bigger picture better. And she recommended that too.

 

This doctor may be just fine. Just follow your gut. She may sound like an idiot discussing dyslexia, but actually be very good at correcting vision. I would be very involved and focused with her at first though. I would also watch my child for improvements. They should come slow at first (and exhaustingly so) but there should be improvements.

$80 this doc is friends with that psychologist, and that's why you got that referral. A neuropsych is a psychologist who knows more, that's all. You should definitely pay money for the less qualified psychologist when you have problems. You wouldn't want to go to someone with more experience and knowledge.

 

**Unfortunately, I have not had enough experience with all of this to understand all the benefits of the different specialist out there. I have tried to get some input on that here on the board but still felt a little wishy washy on things. I agree that she probably does have a relationship with this doctor...they do tend to have referral networks in place simply based on relationship. Now the neurophsyc. was who I was originally looking into anyways just so that I could get a more objective analysis, as well as, additional cognitive understanding. If you can share any benefits you see fit between how to choose between the two, please share.

 

BTW, what do *you* think is going on? I must have missed it in other threads where you explained.

 

**Well, I haven't really posted about our "whole" story. Mainly b/c it is cumbersome...as most anyone with SN's children know. And I am dealing with not only just his special needs but 2 others of my 4 seem to have something going on :confused: so it becomes time consuming and a money pit trying to get it all figured out and their needs met.

 

As for DS10, he has been recognized with at risk in Kinder for reading failure and services started...and never stopped. Except that he has never been tested to see exactly why he struggles. One of the reasons is b/c he was moved to a private school in 2nd grade (and they had yet to test for LD in public). In the private school, he was in a VERY small teacher to student ratio and they modified things for him and taught him thru Barton. He did very well there. This year, now fourth grade, we moved out of state and I am homeschooling him, the private school wouldn't work with him and I don't want to put him through the public SN"s experience (that was a disastor in the earlier grades).

 

Since homeschooling him, I started to notice multiple defecits that painted a picture...all connected in some way...and started to seek knowledge and understanding of why all these things exist in what appears to be a very smart student. His last school mentioned dyslexia being a possability so that is the road, by default, I initially pursued seeking info.

 

He also has symptoms of adhd-combination type (more controlled on diet and supplementation), has high sensory needs, dysgraphia, terrible spelling, slow reading fluency, good comprehension, poor word attack skills, lacks attention to details, L-R confusion, word ommissions or additions when reading, has to use a tracker, difficultly following written sequence of directions, terrible organization of work...This is all SO taxing....on everyone! Thankfully we've seen some behavior improvements with diet...for one, his impulsive, in your face behavior has improved...he was becoming OCD about kissing his 2yo sister and hanging on me! Poor girl! And poor boy...TOO much love in the wrong way turns people OFF!!!! UHHH!!!

 

I think it's adhd, dyslexia, and dysgraphia. Honestly, that is my gut but I am not sure though :confused:. Also, diet is ongoing...he has allergies and has developed food sensativities that have been manifesting in stomach upset...that has improved but is not healed. I am a believer that this all plays a in big role in the big picture and plan to get lab work done simultaneously with the physc.

 

The first bolded sounds so very much like my son. His words jumped on the page, he couldn't complete mth problems if horizontal and vertical were on the same page... handwriting, sensory issues... For us, and I know every experience is different, VT helped all of that. He couldn't have good handwriting because his eyes didn't track. If your eyes don't track or don't consistently know where the lines are on the paper, you can't write well. Your eyes are one of the biggest sensory inputs a body has. If your vision is not right, then it will effect other senses as well. I really believe that my son's body was on sensory alert all the time because the brain was so confused by theinformation it was receiving from the eyes. It couldn't handle sounds, and textures, and all the other information it was receiving because it was so busy trying to see correctly. Once my son was seeing better, the sensory issues greatly decreased. He still has some, but not nearly to the degree as before.

 

And since 3 of my 4 children show signs of it I am carefully working through this since most all this is OOP expenses. I really don't want to waste a ton of money on the wrong specialist and I suppose that is my biggest fear. I will spend a ton of money, that we don't really have, to find he has an "unspecified reading disability"...DUH??? I can diagnose that! I want someone to tell me WHY? What makes him different? Mainly so that he can operate in his strength zone and we can effectively work with his differences.

 

BLAH!!! :rant: LOL!

 

I'll leave ds#2 and dd#3 out of this one, lol! Then they're next...

 

 

:grouphug: I think you are in the hardest stage. Really. I can't tell you how many people I asked for advice and referrals and help from. I was fortunate to have one friend from a homeschool group that was about 6 months ahead of me in the search and I learned from her experiences.

[PeterPan]

I'm sorry, I guess I'm still not seeing you talk about the specific issues for which VT is known to be helpful: focusing, convergence, eye-team, suppression. Our place had little tools, and they worked through them, one at a time, showing what dd's eyes were doing for the task and what they SHOULD have been doing. That difference represented the problem. Our doctor then put her on a visagraph, a pair of infrared goggles connected to a computer, and they showed her eye movements when reading. They could quantify the skipping, jumping etc.

 

Did this doc do any tests using tools? Or was it all visual perception stuff on paper??? We had that too, but that wasn't the basis for the diagnosis. The actual demonstration of the problems was the basis for the diagnoses, and I left with NO confusion about what was going on. I had seen the problems (eyes jump, can't converge, can't refocus, etc.). I saw them make happen in her the headaches and symptoms she had been talking about. They did look at bilaterality, but that was a side thing and merely got a referral to OT.

 

I would consider a drive of 100 miles a small thing if it gets you to a better VT doc. I wouldn't hesitate to drive that far. I drive every week over 100 miles to take my ds to speech, so I'm doing it. For VT, I think you could get away with once a month or every other week with tons of homework. So although it's a trek, it doesn't have to be overburdensome. It's MUCH more important that you get a VT doc that you feel confident in. What you're describing is pretty vague. Is this something this doc does a lot? Did you talk with others using her? If you drive farther, will it open up the possibility of someone who does more VT and has more experience? There's even such a thing as certified vision therapists. That's when the doc doesn't do the VT but a therapist who has gone the extra mile to get certified. They're extremely rare, but that would be a tipping factor. If the farther doc is a Fellow with COVD, that would be a tipping factor.

 

Don't forget you can email these people. Email that farther doc and talk with them. Tell them you got a vague diagnosis and are looking for options. These days you can usually connect right to the doctor via email. That will tell you a lot.

[PeterPan]

We didn't have retained primitive reflexes, so I have no experience there. However if that was what the doctor was looking at, why didn't she tell you??? Certainly that's an issue to check for. You know what might help you is to wait for her letter, see what it says, then see if things are still so unclear. Maybe you missed a lot of the terms she was throwing around in the flurry of the moment? If things are unclear after you get her letter (and after you post here about it), then you could email her back or call and try to get her to clarify. Like Dobela said, she might still be someone you can work with.

 

About the mouthing. That's sensory. Has he had an OT evaluation yet? He certainly has more than enough symptoms to warrant it. Personally, I don't see why she thought a neuropsych would be overkill. You'd like clear answers about working memory, ADD, executive function issues, whether this is impacting his learning, whether he needs certain modifications, etc. I don't see where it's overkill. I'm not saying the psych she recommended couldn't do it, but a neuropsych wouldn't be overkill. Our OT wanted us to get a neuropsych eval, and we have a similar mix. Oh, and the psychs I've called aren't lower $$ than the neuropsych. :(

 

Have you ever looked into OT? Just listening, it almost sounds like the OT symptoms (SPD, ADD/ADHD, sensory-seeking, etc.) are giving you more problems than the VT symptoms. I'd treat the biggest fire first. We started with VT, because dd was having outlandish headaches from her eyes. However we got to a point where we couldn't go any farther in the VT because the OT stuff was holding us back. There's a point where you can't make good progress on your processing, etc. if you've got all those sensory symptoms in the background, kwim?

 

I know, I hate the doc search thing too. Just for your trivia, you might call the VT doc and see what OT she recommends. Then you could start seeing how people cross reference. You might find a really good OT who knows of a different VT doc she likes better, etc.

[siloam]

Halley,

 

Dyslexics usually do have a high IQ. I personally just tested genius. It was one of those one less right questions and it would have been normal, and it was in a group setting for health class, so I am not sure how accurate the whole thing was. But I didn't cheat, so even allowing for a generous margin of error it wouldn't be low.

 

I would honestly find your neurophysc (if the other lead doesn't work out) and then take your cue from them. It might be that if you had a neurophysc who knew their stuff was coordinating with her, she might learn a thing or two. :D She might be an expert in her own area, and might have gotten her wires mixed about dyslexia because it is not really her area of expertize.

 

Heather

[LizzyBee]

She recommended vision therapy and that we seek a full eval. from a physchologist to coordinate therapy (I agree with the latter for sure and have already been looking into that). She said a neurophysc would be overkill for our needs. I also asked her if these results seem to be consistent with what you see in dyslexics and she said no. However, she proceeded to say it was b/c dyslexia comes with low (or lower) IQ and she suspects ds to have an above average IQ.

 

This confused me b/c I am under the impression that the opposite is true of dyslexia (average to above average IQ)...and that visual processing would not be an issue. It's language processing with dyslexia. Therefore, his results seem to imply that the defecit is taking place outside of the visual processing center and information is getting jumbled somewhere else (ummm...language processing center? or maybe executive function? or both? IDK). I am not saying vision therapy isn't what we need...but I just don't feel like I got an interpretation targeting his defecits or atleast targeting a specific area that may be causing his defecits (even though I asked). IDK...maybe most don't ask but...I need to know the details, lol :D!

 

 

 

By definition, a dyslexic person has normal or above IQ. Like OhElizabeth, I would be concerned about a doctor who makes statements that are clearly not true about something that is not her area of expertise.

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

I'm sorry, I guess I'm still not seeing you talk about the specific issues for which VT is known to be helpful: focusing, convergence, eye-team, suppression. Our place had little tools, and they worked through them, one at a time, showing what dd's eyes were doing for the task and what they SHOULD have been doing. That difference represented the problem. Our doctor then put her on a visagraph, a pair of infrared goggles connected to a computer, and they showed her eye movements when reading. They could quantify the skipping, jumping etc.

 

**Sorry, I think I mentioned in the first post...briefly!!!...that his first appt. showed that he was far-sighted and she said that his eyes were NOT working together as a team...both far and near. She seemed to diagnose this through light tracking. He was never put into goggles. She prescribed him glasses. On the phone appt. discussing the results the first appt. was not mentioned. I think you are right that I will have to wait for the written report to see if it is a more detailed analysis.

 

Did this doc do any tests using tools? Or was it all visual perception stuff on paper??? She did both...I guess...the tools were minimal. We had that too, but that wasn't the basis for the diagnosis. The actual demonstration of the problems was the basis for the diagnoses, and I left with NO confusion about what was going on. I had seen the problems (eyes jump, can't converge, can't refocus, etc.). I saw them make happen in her the headaches and symptoms she had been talking about. They did look at bilaterality, but that was a side thing and merely got a referral to OT.

 

I would consider a drive of 100 miles a small thing if it gets you to a better VT doc. I wouldn't hesitate to drive that far. I drive every week over 100 miles to take my ds to speech, so I'm doing it. For VT, I think you could get away with once a month or every other week with tons of homework. So although it's a trek, it doesn't have to be overburdensome. It's MUCH more important that you get a VT doc that you feel confident in. Agree. I found two others that are about an 1 1/2 hours away...she is an hour away so not too much farther. It's just hard on the family....in addition, dd is in speech and ds#2 is commuted to school...limits my time!! What you're describing is pretty vague. Is this something this doc does a lot? She appears to have a busy practice. Did you talk with others using her? We just moved here this last summer. I don't know anyone else in the area who has the same needs...so no. If you drive farther, will it open up the possibility of someone who does more VT and has more experience? I don't know...I suppose I will have to develop a list of questions and call to interview. There's even such a thing as certified vision therapists. That's when the doc doesn't do the VT but a therapist who has gone the extra mile to get certified. They're extremely rare, but that would be a tipping factor. If the farther doc is a Fellow with COVD, that would be a tipping factor. She is a Fellow with COVD and so are the DR's that are a little farther...one of those office's in which have a certified therapist. So that may be a double good sign!

 

Don't forget you can email these people. Email that farther doc and talk with them. Tell them you got a vague diagnosis and are looking for options. These days you can usually connect right to the doctor via email. That will tell you a lot. Great advise....I will wait until I have the paper work.

 

Thank you!

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

We didn't have retained primitive reflexes, so I have no experience there. However if that was what the doctor was looking at, why didn't she tell you??? The first I have heard of that is from Debola...however, I looked it up and yes, it does sound alot like him. I will be asking about that. Certainly that's an issue to check for. You know what might help you is to wait for her letter, see what it says, then see if things are still so unclear. Maybe you missed a lot of the terms she was throwing around in the flurry of the moment? No, I don't think so...I took really good notes as she was talking. I just think she was running through his performance. However, like mentioned maybe she'll detail the other things we are looking for in her write up. If things are unclear after you get her letter (and after you post here about it), then you could email her back or call and try to get her to clarify. Like Dobela said, she might still be someone you can work with.

 

About the mouthing. That's sensory. Has he had an OT evaluation yet? He is on a waiting list (it's been 2 months now!!!!)...this OT is specialized in SPD and has a great reputation (obviously)...after discussing our issues with the SLT (who works with dd) she recommended I get him evaluated. He certainly has more than enough symptoms to warrant it. Personally, I don't see why she thought a neuropsych would be overkill. You'd like clear answers about working memory, ADD, executive function issues, whether this is impacting his learning, whether he needs certain modifications, etc. I agree. I don't see where it's overkill. I'm not saying the psych she recommended couldn't do it, but a neuropsych wouldn't be overkill. Our OT wanted us to get a neuropsych eval, and we have a similar mix. Oh, and the psychs I've called aren't lower $$ than the neuropsych. :( That's good to know.

 

Have you ever looked into OT? Just listening, it almost sounds like the OT symptoms (SPD, ADD/ADHD, sensory-seeking, etc.) are giving you more problems than the VT symptoms. I'd treat the biggest fire first. We started with VT, because dd was having outlandish headaches from her eyes. However we got to a point where we couldn't go any farther in the VT because the OT stuff was holding us back. There's a point where you can't make good progress on your processing, etc. if you've got all those sensory symptoms in the background, kwim? I suppose that is why I started looking into the neurophsyc eval....I kind of felt like we were getting ourselves into a crab shoot. I don't want to keep guessing with all this...OR is that just the name of the game?!?!

 

I know, I hate the doc search thing too. Just for your trivia, you might call the VT doc and see what OT she recommends. Then you could start seeing how people cross reference. You might find a really good OT who knows of a different VT doc she likes better, etc.

 

Thanks again! :)

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

DEBOLA...Thank YOU so much for sharing your experience. It is very encouraging to me!!!!! Going through this all can feel so lonely at times....it's so good to hear from others that understand and can share that they have a child like mine :). Also, to hear that I have hit the pinnacle on our journey is reassuring...there is a light at the end of the tunnel!

 

Did you end of doing any other therapy with your son? How about his neuropsyc eval? What did it show? ...if you don't mind sharing.

 

Your input is so valued...thanks again!

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

Halley,

 

Dyslexics usually do have a high IQ. I personally just tested genius. It was one of those one less right questions and it would have been normal, and it was in a group setting for health class, so I am not sure how accurate the whole thing was. But I didn't cheat, so even allowing for a generous margin of error it wouldn't be low.

 

I would honestly find your neurophysc (if the other lead doesn't work out) and then take your cue from them. It might be that if you had a neurophysc who knew their stuff was coordinating with her, she might learn a thing or two. :D She might be an expert in her own area, and might have gotten her wires mixed about dyslexia because it is not really her area of expertize.

 

Heather

 

Thank you Heather...trust me, I know that dyslexia is not indicitive of low IQ. Besides having already known this...one clue would be the stock he comes from. As you can clearly relate with.

 

His dad is one of those rare genius breeds (well, in one skill zone...hmmm? lol)...he was in remedial reading his entire education and was a high school drop out...now ALL self taught works on the global level for one of the top 10 co-orporations in the world :lol:. Me...well...let's just say I am complicated...and I was when I was his age too which has certainly helped me to understand him (I think he is alot like me). However, my mom didn't have to do all this stuff. I just got F's (well, not all F's...but my grades were poor and I was a "day dreamer"). Then all of a sudden it all came together (around 7th grade) and magically I got straight A's....although, I always seemed to have to work hard as I was a terrible test taker and that has never really seemed to have diminished. Even when I sat for state boards. LOL! Wow...God has an amusing way to show off the genius in us doesn't He? That gives me hope though that one day he'll just snap out of the really challenging piece of academia like I did :D.

 

Now the adhd stuff...well...that is often one in the same but it does bring a totally different angle to this whole thing.

 

Now my other two are actually a little more of a mystery...but I am seeing a trend so I do think it is in the genes. I think I will have to do it in rounds but I get them each tested.

 

Thank YOU so much for your response! I am defenitely going to dive into neuropysch eval's. I think it will really help.

[wapiti]

Thank you Heather...trust me, I know that dyslexia is not indicitive of low IQ. Besides having already known this...one clue would be the stock he comes from. As you can clearly relate with.

 

His dad is one of those rare genius breeds (well, in one skill zone...hmmm? lol)...he was in remedial reading his entire education and was a high school drop out...now ALL self taught works on the global level for one of the top 10 co-orporations in the world :lol:. Me...well...let's just say I am complicated...and I was when I was his age too which has certainly helped me to understand him (I think he is alot like me). However, my mom didn't have to do all this stuff. I just got F's (well, not all F's...but my grades were poor and I was a "day dreamer"). Then all of a sudden it all came together (around 7th grade) and magically I got straight A's....although, I always seemed to have to work hard as I was a terrible test taker and that has never really seemed to have diminished. Even when I sat for state boards. LOL! Wow...God has an amusing way to show off the genius in us doesn't He? That gives me hope though that one day he'll just snap out of the really challenging piece of academia like I did :D.

 

Now the adhd stuff...well...that is often one in the same but it does bring a totally different angle to this whole thing.

 

Now my other two are actually a little more of a mystery...but I am seeing a trend so I do think it is in the genes. I think I will have to do it in rounds but I get them each tested.

 

Thank YOU so much for your response! I am defenitely going to dive into neuropysch eval's. I think it will really help.

 

If you end up going the psych/neuropsych route, I recommend finding one who specializes in both gifted and twice-exceptional (2E) kids. Test result analysis can get complicated, and the right expertise can really pay off.

[Dobela]

DEBOLA...Thank YOU so much for sharing your experience. It is very encouraging to me!!!!! Going through this all can feel so lonely at times....it's so good to hear from others that understand and can share that they have a child like mine :). Also, to hear that I have hit the pinnacle on our journey is reassuring...there is a light at the end of the tunnel!

 

Did you end of doing any other therapy with your son? How about his neuropsyc eval? What did it show? ...if you don't mind sharing.

 

Your input is so valued...thanks again!

Honestly, we have never made it all the way to a neuropsych eval. He did receive OT for 2 years prior to VT. THe OT was mostly hit and miss thanks to my not listening to my instinct about problems that were arising-mostly an absent OT and a poorly trained and mostly unsupervised assistant. Looking back I should have stopped OT and changed providers but did not because a friend worked there.

 

I did have a psych eval done - the IQ and achievement testing - by a local well respected psychologist that a friend recommended. It was just at the beginning of VT. At the end of the eval she gave me an IQ score and then said that she wasn't so sure it was accurate because his vision problems were so severe that she could tell they were hampering his processing, especially if the section heavily relied on timed visual skills. That was 2 years ago and we likely won't go back for more until next year or later, depending on insurance and finances. The psych suggested we return in 3 years and after VT. At the time ds had also just begun working with a specialized reading tutor so we just focused on VT and reading for 18 months or so to see what happened. For us that was successful, although if more signs of trouble rear up again we will definately pursue things further. Right now he is working about 2 grade levels behind peers but is moving quickly thru materials. He is also reading on grade level or higher although his comprehension is lower. We had pretty much stopped working on anything beyond math, VT, reading, and some grammar during the time that VT and specialized reading tutoring spanned. Plus, I spent 2 years too many thinking that he was in the 'better late than never' group or that some of it would self correct with maturity.

 

Part of the reason I stopped pursuing his is because our dd3 is also special needs. She was born at 26 weeks with multiple health issues and broad developmental delays. While we made it thru several hurdles, some of her issues began again interfering with quality of life about the same time he began VT and tutoring. She moved back to the front burner, so to speak, once I could see he was making progress. I have spent the last year getting her into services and addressing her needs. We anticipate going thru the same processes with her as ds though, and possibly will just go to the neuropsych first. It is easier for us to receive some referrals for her due to the birth history. Plus, she has been seen by related professions multiple times already.

 

Balancing the 2 has been difficult at times. For about 3 months their therapies overlapped and I was spending no less than 30 hours a week out of the house driving to therapy/tutoring, waiting for it to end, driving home again. I really have compassion for families who have more they are juggling.

Edited February 26, 2011 by Dobela
grammar, spelling

[PeterPan]

Halley, I know what you mean with the drives and stuff. Last semester we did OT, VT, and SLP. It was NUTS! If I could say, the younger they are, the less nuts it is. It was nuts for us because it left *me* so wiped out we could hardly do school. That was on top of the headaches dd was having from her eyes and the work of VT. We finished most of our VT by Christmas and dropped OT for this semester, so now we're down to just SLP once a week (2 1/2 hours each way) which is a huge relief. So I do know what it feels like, lol. That said, that VT doc who is a bit farther but has a certified therapist would definitely be worth calling. Email them, seriously. A lot of these docs have websites through the COVD website, and there are often direct email links for each eye doc in the practice AND the VT's. Avail yourself of this. They're not going to dish heavily, but they might tell you enough to confirm your suspicions that something is amiss.

 

The therapist that worked with my dd for VT was certified, and she was ASTOUNDING, absolutely astounding. A lot of this depends on the therapist being able to engage the mind of the child and the child then taking control of their eye processes. This therapist talked to my dc, not down, and was very respectful. Can't imagine doing therapy with someone who thinks you're automatically dumb if you're dyslexic. And yes, it sounds like at least your dh is dyslexic. Don't know about you, but your dh sure sounds it. Someone made a comment a while back about the rate of dyslexia at MIT...

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

Halley, I know what you mean with the drives and stuff. Last semester we did OT, VT, and SLP. It was NUTS! If I could say, the younger they are, the less nuts it is. It was nuts for us because it left *me* so wiped out we could hardly do school. That was on top of the headaches dd was having from her eyes and the work of VT. We finished most of our VT by Christmas and dropped OT for this semester, so now we're down to just SLP once a week (2 1/2 hours each way) which is a huge relief. So I do know what it feels like, lol. That said, that VT doc who is a bit farther but has a certified therapist would definitely be worth calling. Email them, seriously. A lot of these docs have websites through the COVD website, and there are often direct email links for each eye doc in the practice AND the VT's. Avail yourself of this. They're not going to dish heavily, but they might tell you enough to confirm your suspicions that something is amiss.

 

I am sorry to ask of your time...but since you are way ahead of me in the VT dept...do you have any particular questions that you would recommend I ask? I will certainly email them. Also, having put more thought into the other office...his appt was the first week of Feb. We set up the follow-up phone consultation a week later. However, the office called and cancelled and rescheduled. The doc. mentioned that the therapist that does VT left the job a couple weeks ago and that she was doing the VT as they train a new therapist. Putting the timeline in place...it appears as if this doc. is in over her head due to lack of staffing. I don't think she even sat down and really interpreted the results...I think she just called and ran down the list with me and how the results plotted??? It is hard to speculate but it just seems to line up. I think overall we will be bettter served in the farther away office that has not only multiple doc's but **4**VT's! I wish they would have come up on my original search but for some odd reason they didn't? Oh well...at least I know now!!!

You all have really helped me sort through this so that I wasn't COMPLETELY dissappointed and frustrated 3 mo. and $1350 later!

 

The therapist that worked with my dd for VT was certified, and she was ASTOUNDING, absolutely astounding. A lot of this depends on the therapist being able to engage the mind of the child and the child then taking control of their eye processes. This therapist talked to my dc, not down, and was very respectful. Can't imagine doing therapy with someone who thinks you're automatically dumb if you're dyslexic. And yes, it sounds like at least your dh is dyslexic. Don't know about you, but your dh sure sounds it. Someone made a comment a while back about the rate of dyslexia at MIT...

 

I think both me and my dh are on the dyslexic and add/adhd spec. I KNOW I was dx mild adhd as a child and I DID have a visual component (which is why I started with the vision assessment). They are certainly family links on my side...all my siblings and my dad....However, there seems to be more awareness and resources nowadays!! :001_smile:

[PeterPan]

No, I wouldn't want a newly trained VT working on my dc, sorry. If the other place has 4 full-time VT's supervised by a doc who's a Fellow with COVD, that's a pretty good sign.

 

You're out $1350 to this one eye doc??? Or was that the cost of other evaluations too??? Oh, it probably included glasses, but even then it shouldn't have been that much. Our evaluation was $250 for 2 1/2 hours with the eye doc.

 

Questions? Well I'd just as succinctly as you can tell them your situation and ask some questions. Don't ask the things you expect a secretary to answer like cost. Be blunt. Ask them if they have any experience with dyslexia and 2E (gifted+dyslexic) students, whether any of the therapists are certified, whether the results of this other doctor would transfer over, etc. You don't have to tell them what you know. The real point is to fish them out and let them tell you what they do well. Through that the doc might refer you to a particular therapist to correspond with; ours did. And once we met, we realized it was a good fit. We stuck with that particular therapist the whole way through. (Our practice had numerous therapists, all supervised by your choice of the eye docs in the practice, and you could find one you clicked with and move at will.)

 

Well I hope you get some good information with this new place. At least it's good to have options. Yes, if the zip codes were off or the mile range to small, the results would have been different. But now you know. Keep us posted on what you find out! :)

[Mission-Driven-Mom]

No, I wouldn't want a newly trained VT working on my dc, sorry. If the other place has 4 full-time VT's supervised by a doc who's a Fellow with COVD, that's a pretty good sign.

 

You're out $1350 to this one eye doc??? Or was that the cost of other evaluations too??? Oh, it probably included glasses, but even then it shouldn't have been that much. Our evaluation was $250 for 2 1/2 hours with the eye doc. No, that was the cost of one session of therapy. Testing was $250...although that we also paid for his healthy eye appt. which ended up being $250 too :001_huh:. Glasses were covered by insurance (thankfully at $180). Now onto the expense of therapy...

 

Questions? Well I'd just as succinctly as you can tell them your situation and ask some questions. Don't ask the things you expect a secretary to answer like cost. Be blunt. Ask them if they have any experience with dyslexia and 2E (gifted+dyslexic) students, whether any of the therapists are certified, whether the results of this other doctor would transfer over, etc. You don't have to tell them what you know. The real point is to fish them out and let them tell you what they do well. Through that the doc might refer you to a particular therapist to correspond with; ours did. And once we met, we realized it was a good fit. We stuck with that particular therapist the whole way through. (Our practice had numerous therapists, all supervised by your choice of the eye docs in the practice, and you could find one you clicked with and move at will.) Thanks...great insight!

 

Well I hope you get some good information with this new place. At least it's good to have options. Yes, if the zip codes were off or the mile range to small, the results would have been different. But now you know. Keep us posted on what you find out! :)

Thanks again...I will...I am not going anywhere anytime soon...unless my children's brains all change overnight :D.