Right Start, Math Mammoth, or something else?

[Jenmomof3]

It's time for a change. I have been using Singapore with both my ds and dd for the past 3 years. It has worked great with my natural math thinking ds, but has been very frustrating with my dd. I've tried going more slowly and supplementing with other workbooks for more practice, but she still is struggling with each new concept. I see her biggest problem when we try to go to the mental math. I just don't think she's there quite yet. I'm intrigued with Right Start as I think she is lacking the firm number foundation that that program gives and it would be very visual for her. However, I'll be adding my third child into the mix next year and I'm afraid of taking on anything that's going to take more of my time. I've also been looking at Math Mammoth since I understand it's similar to Singapore, which I've really liked. Does Math Mammoth jump to the conceptual as quickly as Singapore? Are there more practice problems?

 

Please help me decide between RS and MM. Or, is there something else I should research?

 

I've considered doing some form of RS (maybe games) through the summer and then starting something else in the fall. Any thoughts on this?

 

I'm so tired of trying to figure this one out and need some help. I really need to change my dd's math and help her start enjoying it again.

 

Thanks for your help,

Jennifer

[Aurelia]

If she needs manipulatives, I would go with Right Start. For basic math, I would look at CLE or Rod & Staff, which cover the bases thoroughly, and keep doing some Singapore enrichment and/or the Right Start games. RS is pretty teacher intensive, and the concepts they cover are advanced, but you could contact the RS folks and ask where to place your daughter. I found them very helpful when I was trying to figure out which level to buy at the beginning. They're prompt, too!

 

Math Mammoth is, as far as I can tell, similar to Singapore, and I believe there are a few more practice problems, but if Singapore isn't clicking, she might struggle with it. I can't say for sure, though. We used about a third of MM 1st grade and I personally didn't like it, though I have a hard time articluating why. Part of it was the areas were too small and it requires a lot of writing. Ariel whined nearly every time I pulled out the book.

 

Recently Ariel started struggling with MEP, so I pulled out the R&S workbooks I had on hand and have been letting her work through that, to cement her math facts. She's happy and we will go back to MEP in a month or so and see if it's easier. Maybe a similar plan would help your daughter.

[Corraleno]

I'll be adding my third child into the mix next year and I'm afraid of taking on anything that's going to take more of my time. I've also been looking at Math Mammoth since I understand it's similar to Singapore, which I've really liked. Does Math Mammoth jump to the conceptual as quickly as Singapore? Are there more practice problems?

 

Math Mammoth does not make the conceptual leaps that Singapore does ~ instead it breaks the concepts down into smaller steps and walks the child through each concept. Each lesson has an explanation at the top, usually with visual illustrations of the concept. Then there are partially-worked problems, often illustrated, then a set of problems for the student to work. It goes from concrete to abstract in each lesson.

 

I would say that Singapore and MM have a similar number of problems if a student does ALL of the problems in the Singapore text and workbook. If a student is only doing the workbook problems, then MM has a lot more practice. In the lower grades MM also includes more practice of math facts, number bonds, etc.

 

MM is very easy to use, especially with multiple kids, because you only need one program for everybody and it's open-&-go. Plus it's quite independent, so you just need to make sure the kids understand the explanation, and answer any questions that come up as they do the work.

 

Jackie

[Crimson Wife]

I used RS B & C with my oldest. We loved, loved, loved RS B but thought C was just okay. I previewed D & E and wasn't all that jazzed by what I saw. So I decided to switch to Singapore 3A. I also supplement with MM single-topic "blue" workbooks for the areas where I feel my DD could benefit from a more thorough step-by-step explanation.

 

I do love the RS games set and the abacus as a manipulative. We're continuing using both with Singapore.

[Jenmomof3]

Thanks for the replies and suggestions so far. I guess I'm leaning more toward MM. But as someone mentioned, my fear is that my dd is going to have the same problems as she did with Singapore. Then again, maybe the step-by-step is what will click with her.

 

With Right Start, every time I look at it I think, "Wow! This is sooo different than the way I learned." But, maybe she needs a completely different method. If it would really ground her number sense I would be willing to try to find the time to implement it. However, sounds like I need to look more closely at the upper levels - that might take it out of the race.

 

I'm feeling pressure to make a good choice up-front because I have a feeling that trial and error with different programs is only going to make her dislike math more. My wish is that she love playing with numbers the way I do, but at this point she is starting to really dislike math.

 

Any other thoughts?

[happyWImom]

You have to look at one of my last posts (I'm techno challenged, otherwise I would provide the link here, but I don't know how)! I was struggling what to do for math also.

 

My concern with starting over with either RS or MUS (my other consideration) was that because my ds has already learned the basics (although not fantastically) with Saxon, RS or MUS might really confuse her. Plus, I didn't know if we would have to start almost completely over, which would put us even more behind than we are already!

 

I decided to stop the Saxon, and we are doing MM right now, and I am planning on trying to incorporate (slowly) Singapore. I also am eyeing Miquon-just to see what it's like. I figure it can't hurt.:D

 

But MM is nice because they really do get a lot of practice, and you can download whatever you need, a little at a time.

 

Good luck!

[HappyGrace]

I tried all those programs with dd10 to try to get her to understand mental math and all it did was frustrate her (RS levels A-C, Singapore, etc.) Finally realized she needed a spiral math program (CLE). But then I wanted more mental math.

 

Enter MM (Light Blue)-it has been a Godsend! It explains the mental math incrementally so that she is FINALLY understanding it! We are both thrilled!

 

I backed her WAY up into Grade 2 and just printed out the pages she needed remediation on. Everything finally is clicking with her! She finished that now and I'm waiting to get the rest from the co-op buy at the end of March. Then over the summer I'll move her through only the pages she needs to remediate Grades 3 and 4.

 

Don't be afraid to back up in MM if you need to!

[applesing]

Jennifer, if you'd like to borrow my RS B manual to look at more closely, I will be finished with it in a few weeks. I won't need it again until July. Or you could borrow it during the weekend anytime. I have an extra abacus you could use, too. Maybe you could try a few lessons with dd8 to see how you two like it. Just let me know.

 

Lynne

[applesing]

Another thought I just had -- I read recently that some folks had used RS for 1 year, to cement the child's number sense. Then they switched to a less teacher intensive program after that. Perhaps you could use RS for a year and then transition her back into Singapore after that, since you basically like Singapore itself.

 

Lynne

[Jenmomof3]

Thanks for all the replies. It's nice to hear how well MM is working for some of you who have had the same math struggles I've had. Lynne, good to see you on the board. I may take you up on looking again at RS just to make sure I have really done all the research I can. At this point though, it looks like MM might be the way to go (supplemented with some fact practice and games). I had dd sit down and look at the samples with me and she seemed fine with it. It also helped me see that we are not completely off track as she was able to do most of the 2nd grade problems -- so she must be retaining what we've covered with Singapore. I think maybe just the step-by-step approach of MM will help us not have the frustration that seems to come with each new concept right now.

 

As a side question to those who use MM, what's the most economical way to have a hard copy. I only have an inkjet printer. Is it best to take it to a copy shop? Or, is it better/cheaper to just print the pages she needs as we go? Or, should I just buy the hard copy? What did you do?

 

Thanks again,

Jennifer

[siloam]

Jennifer,

 

I don't know anything about MM, but Right Start has worked very well for my girls. They also started out with Singapore and struggled with it alone, but don't have problems with doing Singapore behind grade level after RS.

 

Ok maybe saying any problem isn't correct. Some of those challenging and word problems still get to them (IP and CWP books), but they don't have problems with the logical leaps that Singapore makes in the Primary texts. T

 

Heather