Chris in PA Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 Help! My dd is finishing up 11th grade and her grammar skills are really lacking. We did Shurley grammar in 6th and 7th grade. Then Easy Grammar in 8th. 9th grade she did a little grammar with an outside composition class. Last year not much at all. Now we are almost at the end of 11th grade and this dc is guessing which words in the sentence are pronouns. And direct/indirect objects are a huge challenge. She also has difficulty with action verbs and linking verbs. Her punctuation skills are decent. I guess my question is where should we go from here? Right now we are working through Winston grammar. Not sure how successful we are at this point. The best years for her were the ones with Shurley grammar. Is there something similar to that for HS or should I just give in and say, "some people will never get grammar."? Thoughts......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather in AL Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 The only program you mention that I am familiar with is Easy Grammar. My kids used it for two years in middle school. It did a decent job, but was boring, so they quickly forgot much of what they learned. I now have a 9th grader and a 7th grader and they are both using Analytical Grammar (the high school version).... this is a great program! It can be used over three years or you can do it all in one. We are making it a 1 1/2 year course simply due to time constraints. After the kids have completed the program, I will have them use the weekly workbooks (I forget what they are called) to keep the grammar fresh in their minds. AG is set up a little bit like Easy Grammar in that the student has to label parts of a sentence, but it isn't boring (there isn't all the underlining, double underlining, circling, etc. that confused my kids) and the concepts are really well laid out and explained. There is diagramming, but if you have never diagrammed, don't let it scare you--- I never diagrammed a sentence before, and I'm pretty good at it now! My dc have really done well with AG. In fact, the grammar my 9th grader has learned has helped in his Latin class and vice versa. Maybe someone else will chime in with knowledge of the other programs you mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 I'll second Analytical Grammar. You may read my review here. I'm shocked that she finished Shurley 7 and struggles with IO/DO and AV/LV. There are so many different kinds of pronouns (subjective, objective, reflexive, probably more), that one is understandable. OTOH, how is her writing? If it doesn't affect her oral or written communication, I'm not sure I'd spend the time on it. Being able to identify a direct object in a sentence is not really necessary in life. Using direct objects in your speaking/writing can happen naturally without knowing how to identify them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in PA Posted March 17, 2010 Author Share Posted March 17, 2010 Sue: After using IEW this school year her writing is much better. We did not finish Shurley level 7. We actually did the 4th grade and 6th grade levels. I had actually considered a quick review/run through of Shurley level 7 next fall. I will take a look at Analytical Grammar. Heather: Easy Grammar the Ultimate Series is something I am looking into as well. Part of me thinks is her writing is ok so why worry about being able to indentify the parts of speech...... ughhhhh... so many choices and things to worry about...... Thanks ladies! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 We did not finish Shurley level 7. We actually did the 4th grade and 6th grade levels. If she still struggles with IO/DO and AV/LV after completing Shurley 6, then you need a different approach than Shurley 7, imo. We used Shurley 5 and ds did plenty of labeling of those parts of speech. Has your dd done any diagramming? It helps to make it very clear what the function of each word in a sentence is. We are working through Editor in Chief now. Today, we were looking at this huge, long sentence: My four years' experience as a pet-sitter, in which I was completely responsible for the care of a diverse population of animals, give me an excellent background for your current job opening. Ds was not able to tell that the subject and verb were not in agreement, partially because they were so far away from each other. I had him strip off the various phrases and figure out what would go on the baseline of the diagram. Then he was able to see that the subject was experience and the verb was give and he understood that give needed to be gives. Here's another example: I work well with animals; there is a special bond between they and I. Ds knew that they should be them. I asked him to diagram just the prepositional phrase (between they and I). Then, he knew that the pronouns should be objective pronouns because they were OBJECTS of the preposition. He knows I and they are a subject pronouns (I go to the store; THEY go to the store) and could figure out that he needed objective pronouns instead (Give it to ME; I gave the trophies to THEM). Analytical Grammar ROCKS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather in AL Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Sue: After using IEW this school year her writing is much better. We did not finish Shurley level 7. We actually did the 4th grade and 6th grade levels. I had actually considered a quick review/run through of Shurley level 7 next fall. I will take a look at Analytical Grammar. Heather: Easy Grammar the Ultimate Series is something I am looking into as well. Part of me thinks is her writing is ok so why worry about being able to indentify the parts of speech...... ughhhhh... so many choices and things to worry about...... Thanks ladies! I haven't heard of the Easy Grammar Ultimate Series, so I can't comment on that. I did buy my son the Daily Grams for 9th grade, but he only got about two weeks' worth of pages done before he was ready to pull his hair out from boredom. I was like your daughter.... I wrote and spoke well, but I didn't know the grammar terms, etc. It was just intuitive for me. I did get hit pretty hard on the ACT, though, when the time came. It was then that I realized if I had known the names or rules for things that I would have scored better. Other than standardized testing (or being an editor!), your dd probably won't have a need for the grammar. My ds is going to be taking the ACT in April (I know 9th grade is early, but the cc wants a math score to dual enroll), and he has said that Analytical Grammar really helped with the English portion of the prep tests & Question of the Day. He can rattle off rules and diagram on a whim, so he knows many of the correct answers. His English test prep scores are wonderful----higher than my final ACT score was! And he is my 'mathy' child, not my 'English/grammar/writing' lover! :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Easy Grammar. Yes, again. Well, actually, Easy Grammar Plus. Correct each page before she does the next...*you* do the corrections, not her. That way you'll know what she's struggling with. And she should be able to do 2 or 3 pages a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in PA Posted March 17, 2010 Author Share Posted March 17, 2010 Sue: You are selling me on analytical grammar. I have looked at the samples and it seems like it might work. I could add my 10th grade dd into the program as well. Do you think my 7th grade ds could also do this program just at a slower pace? Might be something that works for the entire family. Thanks for all your help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in PA Posted March 17, 2010 Author Share Posted March 17, 2010 Ellie: We tried Easy Grammar Plus in the 8th grade and it bored her to tears. Thanks for the suggestion. Maybe it is something to look at now that she is more mature. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunshine State Sue Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Sue: You are selling me on analytical grammar. I have looked at the samples and it seems like it might work. I could add my 10th grade dd into the program as well. Do you think my 7th grade ds could also do this program just at a slower pace? Might be something that works for the entire family. Thanks for all your help! Analytical Grammar is actually intended for 6th-7th-8th grade, so your 7th grader could do it as well as your 10th grader. The author developed it after teaching 8th grade grammar for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in PA Posted March 17, 2010 Author Share Posted March 17, 2010 Just ordered Analytical Grammar. ;) Can't wait for it to get here! Thanks for all the help. Love this board! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekarl2 Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Just ordered Analytical Grammar. ;) Can't wait for it to get here! Thanks for all the help. Love this board! I had to laugh as I read this post RIGHT when I was processing orders. I see yours, Chris, and it'll go out in tomorrow morning's mail. Let me know if you have any questions as you go along; I'm happy to help! Erin with AG (the girl in the video) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cajunkaren Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 I have been reading this thread and I just had to go see about Analytical Grammer and OMG I really like what I see. I have a daughter in 4th and she thinks ACE is very boring but I looked over the Analytical Grammar Jr. and well it looks really interesting. Has any of you had a 5th grader in this? It claims to be a 11 week program. I'm wondering if I would have to find something else for the rest of the year? Thanks for any information you have.. Karen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in PA Posted March 17, 2010 Author Share Posted March 17, 2010 Erin, I have to laugh as well. I met you at a homeschool convention in Fredrick MD. several years ago and I actually purchased it. Tried to implement it and for the life of me couldn't make it work. I really regret not working harder at it. My 11th grade dd has poor grammar skills that I am hoping to remediate. We will be starting the program as soon as we receive. Thanks for the offer of help. I may be taking you up on that one! ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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