handling 13yo cont.

[choirfarm]

I started a thread in the K8, but it probably should have gone here anyway. I'm still struggling. This was this morning: Have you finished your math review (Chalkdust pre-algebra)? Kid- Oh..no I didn't. Me- Ok, you must finish it today and then give it to me to grade and then correct your mistakes today so you can take the test tomorrow. Kid- very irritated, Ok, ok..you've made your point. Me- Don't forget to unload your section of the dishwasher (other 2 have done theirs.). Kid- eating breakfast and irritated,ok. He has started school and he didn't do it. I go in and smile and say, dishwasher?? Kid- big sigh, glare and off to do it.

 

I did try to give him a kiss this morning, he told me he was way too big to kiss. IT is like everything I say to him is irritating. He tells me a lot that he knows. HE doesn't need any preaching. BUT HE DOESN't DO THINGS. So consequences??? He has 100 minutes of his 120 left for computer this weekend. He has his only activity, youth, tonight. What should he get time off for. I am tired of being dismissed.

 

Christine

[Joanne]

It sounds like a very common problem. Frustrating, but common.

 

I'd decrease the space between the command and follow up. I'd increase supervision. To use my own phrasing, I'd get off my butt more often.

 

I believe I'd (and I have in my home) "chosen my spots" in terms of the irritable attitude. Disrespect gets addressed. Irritatable (and irritating) grumbling usually gets no attention.

[Guest Dulcimeramy]

My oldest son turned 13, and began acting restless, unmotivated, argumentative, and unhappy. The atmosphere didn't feel very nice around here, and I despaired of being able to continue homeschooling him. I thought we were on the verge of having a real problem.

 

It was just puberty.

 

One day when he was acting up, I just turned and looked at him. Really, really looked in his eyes. Guess who I saw? My son. My mind flashed back to years and years of being so close with him and being able to understand what was bothering him. I'm probably not explaining this well...I think I just quit seeing him as a "teenager" who was irritating me and I began seeing him as my own little boy needing help through a major transition. He needed to connect with me (and Daddy, which is a different thread) and we were pushing each other away.

 

Even though I thought he should be working more independently, I began sitting with him while he did his studies. Even though he had been very successfully figuring out some of his lessons on his own (and preferred to, when he was 12), I began actively teaching every subject. Lots of togetherness, lots of hands-on, lots and lots and lots of talking.

 

We had some frank discussions about his social interactions. We experimented with more freedom online until we found a level that works for both of us. We joined a group, dropped a group, changed some things, began church-shopping to find more likeminded friends...until I realized that his social outlets were not just boxes that I could check off on my Good Parenting Sheet under "Socialization." They need to enrich his life or they don't count.

 

Now he doesn't do outside activities unless he personally finds great value and positivity in them. Youth group didn't make the cut, and neither did Facebook. Singing groups and volunteer work did.

 

Six months later, I have my son back. Things are going very well, he feels he is being permitted to change and grow, I feel I can trust him again, and we're both optimistic about continuing to homeschool.

 

I thought that age 13 was a time for him to grow and grow, but now I see that I needed to grow, too. I needed to learn to communicate with him at a different level because he is not a little child any more. I also needed to learn how to handle discipline issues without using methods that are more appropriate for much younger children, or that set a bad example. (Knee-jerk punishments and revoking of privileges, for example. I think that is really bad for kids, because it is disrespectful of their plans and just shows that you don't really have a clue what else to do.)

 

We aren't done raising this child and it won't all be a piece of cake, I know. I just feel that we hit a fork in the road there at the Age 13 Mile Marker and I thank the Lord that we seem to have chosen the right path.

 

Do whatever you can to stop the adversarial vibe between you. That builds such a wall when you need to be connecting.

 

The following color-coded illustration may not apply to your situation at all, but it is how I came to see what I had been doing. I had been entirely blind to the fact that all the ways he was driving he crazy were being echoed back to him by my own behavior. Maybe you'll see yourself in this, too:

 

He speaks disrespectfully to you, slacks on his chores, and ignores his homework.

 

You respond by chewing him out (speaking disrespectfully).

 

You yank a privilege or possession, the first that comes to mind or the one that will hurt him the most. (Slacking on your chores...your job as a parent is to get to the heart of an issue instead of just reacting. Parenting by reaction is a slacker way to parent.)

 

You despair of him in your own mind and to others who will listen, complaining that tomorrow will probably be more of the same. (Ignoring your homework. You aren't changing things, you aren't researching what methods have worked for teens or scanning your own memory for what makes this particular child tick. You aren't looking for any means, however small or drastic, to reconnect.)

 

What I've had to say here is my own experience with my son. Our relationship has always been very good until this roadblock, he is gifted in several areas and a mature thinker generally, and we don't have issues of peer dependency or substance abuse. So obviously my thoughts and experience won't be helpful in many situations. I'm just speaking for those who find themselves upside down unexpectedly with their "good child" and just need to pull back from the brink.

[cougarmom4]

Ah...it sounds familiar. We're struggling with ds12 and his attitude lately. It seems most of our issues are with ROUTINE things...and I've talked 'til I'm blue in the face how they just simply need to be done and there is no use arguing about it.

 

The thing that has helped me lately is writing down the things he needs to do--so I don't have to talk. :D I asked him if he'd prefer a checklist or something more like a card rotation/flip over type of thing. (This discussion happened in one of the rare calm moments!). He said he'd prefer the cards. So I created this little thing where he has two pockets (library book pocket cards)--one with cards of tasks to do; one with those completed. He has 12 cards--color-coded for morning, after-school, and evening. He's not homeschooling right now, but the cards include daily routines and responsibilities...basically reminders of what he needs to do but without my voice behind them. I have one specific card that says "Reminder" and then I listed out what he needed to remember for M-F...for example, on Tuesday--turn in Orchestra practice record; it gives the reminder, but *I* don't have to remember & nag him about it.

 

Basically, he has free time after-school when his cards are done (although only screen time on Fri/Sat for an hour each day). If he asks to do something, I simply have to say, are your cards done? Usually, he'll say no, and get mad at me, but I simply walk away. :001_smile: Ah...it's nice to get rid of a little contention and not get pulled into a battle of wills.

 

So...perhaps something similar would work for the homeschooling assignments. When we hs last year, we had a weekly checklist that ds would mark as we went through our day. But maybe some visual so he can physically mark off what he's done. Then dangle some kind of carrot in front of him...when you have all of this done by 11:00, you get to x, y, or z. When you complete these three by 3:00, then you get to j, k, l.

 

As for consequences, we typically either give additional chores, take away screen time, or take away friend time.

 

Not sure if this is what you were looking for, but I hope you get some new ideas to try! Hang in there...

[hornblower]

Oh Dulcimeramy :hurray:

That was such a wonderful post.

 

I was going to suggest

1) check lists - which you make together, preferably the night before, not just handing him a list of things to do. This will help also with learning about time management, goal setting etc but it takes you from being the constant nagging reminder (except at first you may need to remind him to look at the list).

 

2) sitting down with him for his lessons. There are stages where they need us an awful lot. Get really involved in teaching and hanging out & being there.

 

& 3) maybe shake up your morning routines. Would you both benefit from a walk? Or maybe a morning swim at a rec center? Or cooking lessons & making breakfast together?

 

 

 

But really my post is a "what she said" - Dulcimeramy explained it all so well!!

[cougarmom4]

One day when he was acting up, I just turned and looked at him. Really, really looked in his eyes. Guess who I saw? My son. My mind flashed back to years and years of being so close with him and being able to understand what was bothering him. I'm probably not explaining this well...I think I just quit seeing him as a "teenager" who was irritating me and I began seeing him as my own little boy needing help through a major transition. He needed to connect with me (and Daddy, which is a different thread) and we were pushing each other away.

 

 

 

Thank you for sharing this. I have also felt lately that with our struggles one of the things I need to do is simply LOVE this sweet boy of mine. I have to admit that it's challenging at times...as I get so caught up in the frustrations. So thank you for your sweet reminder.

[MIch elle]

It sounds like a very common problem. Frustrating, but common.

 

I'd decrease the space between the command and follow up. I'd increase supervision. To use my own phrasing, I'd get off my butt more often.

 

I believe I'd (and I have in my home) "chosen my spots" in terms of the irritable attitude. Disrespect gets addressed. Irritatable (and irritating) grumbling usually gets no attention.

 

 

:iagree:

 

Ask me how I know :tongue_smilie:

[Nan in Mass]

This is a wise, wise post. I hope everyone reads it. I managed to do this with my second and my third and as a result their teenhoods are/were (one 15, one 19) radically different from my poor oldest. In retrospect, I can see how many ways we failed him. No wonder he thought we didn't love him. It took about ten years to undo the damage. LISTEN TO THIS POST. Put your fingers in your ears, ignore conventional wisdom (that was our problem), shout lalala, and do what this post says instead. You'll still have a squally teenager, but they will just be squalls, not a permanant storm doing permanant damage and getting worse and worse until you have to move to a different planet.

-Nan

[choirfarm]

I think I understand what some of you are saying, spend more time not less. I'm just not sure how to do that. It isn't all of school. For example, he LOVES literature. He just finished REd Badge of Courage and decided he wanted to do Huck Finn like his older brother just finished. So I gave him the book with all of the questions. He finished all of them through chapter 14 yesterday and that was the first thing he worked on as well. my guess is he will finish the whole thing today. That would be typical. I can't keep up with his reading. Grammar is another story and he does need me to teach him. So I started he and his 2nd grade sister on Grammar Island and Music of the Hemisphere. I plan to follow that with Sentence Island and Building Language. He enjoys it. (He is doing a vocabulary workbook on his grade level.) He just made a 520 on the SAT that he took as part of Duke.

 

Math... I just don't know. I try to sit with him and explain it but he only gets furious with me and says he doesn't uderstand what I am saying. He loves Dana Mosely. I've gotten to where if he misses too many I have him go back and rewatch. That seems to do better than my teaching him as it always ends with him storming out.

 

TOG history is a breeze for him. I moved him up to the rhetoric level for the Civil War and he typically has all the work done in a couple of days.

 

Apologia Science, he is doing pretty well. IT just takes him forever. He is only on Module 11. He has been making A's on the tests when I give him the time.

 

But how do you teach him eVERYTHINg and the second grader who needs everything and then still help the 9th grader, who while independent still needs discussions on literature, history etc. There isn't enough hours in the day!!

 

I will talk to him about the social stuff. I ask him what he wants to be involved in and he says he doesn't care.

 

He might be going to the local ps for high school. They each get to make their decision about what they want to do. My oldest wants to stay home.

 

He has a planner that he is supposed to fill out. what I hear you saying is that I should fill it all out for him and have him check it off. I was trying to give him freedom with deadlines: 1/2 of Huck Finn done by the end of the week, Study guide for Apologia done by the end of the week, TOG week 25 work done by Thursday night so discussion can be done. But what ends up happening is he does all the stuff he enjoys and gets WAY ahead and drags the stuff he doesn't enjoy. So it isn't taking away freedom by giving him alist? I've got to go talke about Red badge with oldest, so I have to go.

 

Christine

[cougarmom4]

Maybe you give him a list of what needs to be completed by Friday...but he decides when he will do it; he is still being given freedom to organize his time/choose the order/etc, but still being held accountable for spending his time wisely. If you go this route, for the first few weeks, I'd still sit down with him and help him make the plan; then check in each day to see how his plan is going.