Help...making homemade bread machine bread...question on (not) using yeast and gluten

[sheryl]

My recipe that I created calls for spelt and oat flour. And, of course, I add other ingredients too!

 

Now I buy oat groates and grind my oats into "oat flour". It's NOT a light "pastry" oat flour....in other words, I do not have commercial equipment that a company would for grinding flour. So.......my flour is not as "fine". It's a little more dense and heavy.

 

And, spelt, I buy Bob's organic.

 

Also, I have stone ground whole wheat.

 

I do NOT have any white or any other flour in my recipe.

 

In addition to the above "heavy" flours, I'd like to not use yeast. That's really my Q. Since my flours are heavy, what replacement to yeast can I use. It's hard to get it to raise naturally and now I want to not use yeast which would only help it....but, want to use something in it's place.

 

It seems like a double wammy that I'll end up with flat bread OR it will turn out so dense that maybe David could have used it against Goliath. :D

 

So, any suggestions on proportions for the 3 flours? And, what can I use in place of yeast and how much, etc?

 

And, what is gluten? I've been told I may want to stay away from it for my dd's sake. Is it in the flours above? In common every day fresh foods, or only processed? Or certain food groups?

 

I'm hoping to make this bread Sunday.

 

Thanks in advance.

Sheryl

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[Sara R]

That wouldn't be a gluten free loaf. Gluten is in wheat, spelt, and oats (and barley and rye). It's a natural part of the grain. Gluten isn't in rice, corn, potatoes.

 

I've had gluten free bread before. I baked what was supposed to be a fool-proof recipe. It turned out like baked playdough.

 

Without yeast? Are you thinking of leavening with sourdough starter, or baking powder, or what?

[Jennefer@SSA]

May I ask why you are wanting to stay away from yeast and gluten? Unless you are avoiding all wheat, oat, barley and rye products then your dd is getting gluten. Are you suspecting Celiac disease or does she have ASD? Either way you would have to take pretty drastic steps to remove all gluten from her diet. It's a lot harder than you would initially think. Ask me how I know?! :)

 

As for the gluten question...gluten is the protein in wheat (and many other grains) that makes bread chewy. In bread making you knead to develop the gluten which makes that beautiful loaf and why when you make cookies and cakes you don't want to over-mix. When you mix/knead you are developing the gluten. Chewy is good for bread but it makes cakes and cookies hard as hockey pucks!

 

If you need a good gluten free recipe I can pass one along. When we were on a gluten free diet I tried about 20 loaves before coming across a wonderful recipe that was a keeper. It was so yummy that dh even quit eating wheat bread and switched over to the gf loaf! It's not a bread machine recipe but you could play around with it to make the necessary adaptations.

 

I also have a fantastic whole wheat/oat/honey bread machine recipe I would be happy to pass along but it does use yeast, as well as ginger, gluten flour and a touch of vinegar to help it rise.

Edited November 8, 2009 by Jennefer@SSA

[Jennefer@SSA]

I thought I would go ahead and post the gf bread recipe.

 

It truly is the best I've ever had!

 

GF Bread Recipe

 

I made some substitutions like subbing quinoa for some of the millet and it worked great.

[Peela]

You need some sort of raising agent- and you can make bread with bicarb, or you can make sourdough which is a whole other experience (and sourdough has yeast in it, just naturally collected yeasts rather than bought in a pkt).

I have started making gluten free bread for my dh who has become gluten intolerant. For many people, spelt is ok, because they are specifically wheat intolerant rather than gluten intolerant. Its good to find out which it is because these terms are bandied about rather freely and interchangeably, wheras they are quite different issues. My dh seems to be able to handle some spelt etc. But if he has normal pasta, he has terrible discomfort. It can take some experimenting.

There are gluten free flours available here, so I am sure you can get them there too. Gluten is needed in bread to "hold it together" and make it sticky, so gluten free loaves need some sort of substitute to hold them together.

I make my own from scratch. THe grains you are using will make a heavy loaf, but you can also sift them to sift some of the heavier fibre out. But no, they are not gluten free.

Enjoy your breadmaking, and dont get too disheartened. I have made so much bread over the years that just didnt work well. Nowadays, I am getting better at it and I am glad I kept trying.

[sheryl]

Thanks to all.

 

J/P...I've been making break for years (married 29), but I become more and more health conscious. I just baked it. On the SN board I address issues with my 10 yo dd. I heard a comment that gluten can increase add/adhd issues. Since she was recently diagnosed with these, I'm thinking maybe I should try the gluten free diet. However, I've heard it's very strict and restrictive. P, you brought up a good point about finding out if it's gluten vs. wheat.

 

Is there not a substitute for gluten? But, you're saying it's already in the flours I have, right? OK, then I may stick with it for now. However, I have been interested for years in making the "Ezekiel" bread....using sprouted grains. Have either one of you tried it? Recipe?

 

Yeast....well, I'm wanting to know if there is a substitute as I don't know if my Jewish friends eat yeast and I'd like to make bread now with a yeast substitute for that reason.

 

???????

Sheryl

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[Jennefer@SSA]

Sheryl, not all flours have gluten. If you look at the link in my above post for the gf loaf you can see some of the flours that don't have gluten (quinoa and millet are some of my favs).

 

And speaking from experience the gfcf diet is very restrictive and very expensive. We did it for 8 months with absolutely no improvement for ds8. If I knew then what I know now I would have started with Feingold. This is still an expensive diet (depending on your family's current eating habits) but not nearly so as gfcf (in my experience anyway).

 

Warning...digression starts here....:D

 

You can also start with other things before jumping into any full diet. Eliminate the following - all artificial dyes, all sugar (including honey, molasses and such), all refined flours, white rice, all processed food, and all juice. You may find that by cutting out dairy you see improvement as well. Start with one thing at a time and keep a food/behavior journal so you can track what is and what isn't making a difference. Basically move towards a diet of meat, vegetables and limited amounts of carbs that are homemade and 100% whole grain, mostly water to drink and a small amount of low GI fruits. I have a friend that just by doing this has seen HUGE improvements in her son's behavior. That, unfortunately, was not the case for us but I recommend all parents start here. Actually it's the way we all should be eating anyway - more or less. :)

 

Also try fish oil that is high in its EPA to DHA ratio (like OmegaBrites for kids). And if that doesn't work try one that is high in DHA and lower in EPA.

 

Also regulate bedtimes and reduce visual stimulation through media to see if that is a trigger. In addition, be certain your dd is getting one full hour of physical activity each day and much/most of it should be aerobic.

 

There really are so many things to try. None of these has worked for us but I could tell you so many stories of families who have had great success with these sorts of changes.

 

Best of luck on your journey.

[sheryl]

Yes Jennefer, I would agree I think with everyone in your last post. Thanks for digressing..;) it's a thorough explanation and confirmation of what I feel we need to do.

 

I have to tell you though that even doing these basics will be challenging enough. I read in a health magazine that red and yellow dyes are the worst and if people consume them, then blue and brown are best....maybe blue gatorade and brown m and m's.

 

I don't give her much sugar at all. We do eat honey as it's natural. I buy the unrefined, unprocessed, unheated. Is this still bad honey?

 

She does not get enough exercise 50% of the time as I'm dealing with those behavioral issues and it's time consuming. :confused: School then becomes a looooong day and little or none is left over for free/play outside time.

 

I'll check your recipe links. Still not sure about a yeast sub. If it works just as well etc.

 

Thanks.

Sheryl

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[Jennefer@SSA]

Yes Jennefer, I would agree I think with everyone in your last post. Thanks for digressing..;) it's a thorough explanation and confirmation of what I feel we need to do.

 

I have to tell you though that even doing these basics will be challenging enough. I read in a health magazine that red and yellow dyes are the worst and if people consume them, then blue and brown are best....maybe blue gatorade and brown m and m's.

 

I don't give her much sugar at all. We do eat honey as it's natural. I buy the unrefined, unprocessed, unheated. Is this still bad honey?

 

She does not get enough exercise 50% of the time as I'm dealing with those behavioral issues and it's time consuming. :confused: School then becomes a looooong day and little or none is left over for free/play outside time.

 

I'll check your recipe links. Still not sure about a yeast sub. If it works just as well etc.

 

Thanks.

Sheryl

<><

 

As for honey, you will only know once you have completely cut it out for awhile and then add it back in one day. If she does okay then it can be an occasional treat. I have a friend who hardly even gives her child fruits b/c the natural sugar in the fruit is enough to send her dd sky high! She only gives it as a treat once school is done for the day and is sure to only stock high GI fruits in her home so that her dd has that slow release of sugar into her bloodstream.

 

Also, consider starting your day with one hour of exercise - or at least 30 minutes of a good aerobic workout. Have her run a mile or jump on the trampoline or use a good kids' workout video. It just might wear her out enough that her brain can slow down and your day will go more smoothly. You might even finish your day at the same time you were before. ;)

 

One other thing to consider is starting the day with a couple of eggs. The choline in egg yolk is enough to help some ADHD kids start their day off well. When I started learning about this, I had never even heard of choline. Now it's advertised as the new "magic" ingredient in all the baby formulas.

 

Best of luck!