On page 125 in the WRTR (4th edition), it states that a first grader should be able to get to Section O by April. Is the child copying the words or is the teacher dictating the words to the child? "By October 1 first -graders should begin writing the words in Sections A-H. Teach them at least thirty words a week so that by November 1 they reach Section I, when they will begin to read aloud from their first book." It then continues to say that the first grader should be able to reach Section O by April. I'm curious, but to me the words in Section O seem like they are at a third or fourth grade level. I know the following year you go back a few Sections to review, but then you truck through the Sections again, likely reaching the end of all the words. Is it expected that one is done teaching their child to spell using the Extended Ayres List by the end of second or third grade, given the parent started in Kindergarten or earlier (especially teaching the phonograms and handwriting)? I would like to know this because I would like to switch to R&S Spelling in 4th grade (or fifth), depending on when the children are done. Lastly, where can I get the Morrison McCall Spelling Scale? Thanks!

I am so excited about these responses! It is such a huge relief. I just want to make sure, but the book basket recommendations are related to the history topic at hand, right? You mentioned that there is also another book list they recommend that includes the classics? So the teacher manual provides two separate lists, right? Thanks and so exciting!

That is so awesome to hear! I'm not kidding. I could actually use MFW every year through H.S. I just hope it's rigorous enough to prepare them for college. I have another question. MFW uses a book basket to encourage reading more books than their recommended ones. Do they offer a book list of great classics? We love to read aloud and I would love for the kids to listen or read books that are not part of the MFW packages. I noticed there are many classics missing in the upper grades and I hope MFW offers a list of additional good read the kids or I can do. I certainly hope MFW is the answer and I don't have to spend so much time researching if we should or should not have a spine curriculum in our education. Ugh, so much work!

I am looking at SO many options for next school year. We are currently using (and liking) R&S English and WWE. We also do a lot of read alouds. I'm not the biggest fan of MOH this year and BFSU Science is fine (learning a lot, but need to prep ahead of time). Math is very good. We are using Singapore, with LoF on Fridays. Lastly, we also use Spalding for spelling and that's working out pretty well. They are learning a lot. From what I see in the MFW catalog, it looks like a great spine curriculum. Ideally, if this program is really great, I would like to use it throughout my children's high school years. The thing is, I like R&S English, WWE, and Spalding. I'm really not willing to part from these programs, but how could I work it into MFW? I will be calling the company too. I have a series of questions for them. I'm hoping I could substitute their recommendations for language arts, at least the writing, grammar, and spelling, with Spalding, R&S , and WWE. Do you think the addition of these programs will make the day way too long rather than using their recommended ones? WWE and R&S English don't take us too long - about 15-20 min each. Spalding takes longer, especially at the start of the week. Monday is the longest at about an hour, otherwise, it's about 20-30 minutes. I'm really hoping MFW is the answer for all the years of homeschooling, which would help them to prepare for college. So much less to think about if we just stick with MFW, and supplement when needed.

Can you point me to that timeline???

I am struggling with History and Geography. I will write a separate post on Geography though. I think there are too many options out there for history curricula and I can't narrow it down easily. Currently, we are using MOH. I like it - seems to serve its purpose. I prefer MOH Vol 1 over SOTW Vol 1. We also are working on a timeline written on a large board, which I think is beneficial - time consuming, but beneficial. Anyway, for next school year I'm looking at different options. 1) Veritas Press self-paced (online) with flashcards - my husband thinks this is too expensive and overall may take too much time out of the day. I read some reviews and seemed like many people liked VP self-paced history. 2) SOTW vol 2 (audio) with flashcards and timeline from History through the Ages 3) MOH vol 2 (audio) with flashcards and timeline from History through the Ages I like using a timeline, but like I mentioned above, it's time consuming. I know nothing is absolutely necessary, but would it be that detrimental to their learning history? Has anyone started using a timeline and later chucked it?

I had a quick question - sorry, but slightly off topic - but I watched a couple of your videos on your website...how do you create your ten frames? Sharpie on a white board or black electrical tape? Also, do you laminate your dots to velcro on the little papers with the ten frame? Thanks! I will definitely be using those videos to solidify some of these math facts for my kids.

We are switching from Spell to Write and Read to Spalding. I am not switching cold turkey because cost is a factor, but we are almost there. We have been breaking up the schedule the way Spalding suggests in the book and so far things are much smoother. I also feel that because we are spending less time on complicated aspects in teaching spelling, the children's minds are more open to learning and remembering the words. They never could predict how they would learn the words that day - at least after the words were dictated. This didn't work for us.

Where can one purchase the Morrison-McCall Spelling Scale?

I really appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions. I find it a little difficult getting in touch with the company to help me out. Understandably, they are pushing the 6th edition book with the teacher's guide. They said the updated version includes teaching the meanings of the words. No thanks, if I can get it done reasonably well with the 4th edition. Lastly, do I study the third set of words on Wednesday? The book doesn't state it clearly.

I think I may stick with MOH and include world geography on the side (Trail Guide to World Geography). This can be done next school year when they are in 3rd and 4th grade. Maybe when in 4th and 5th grade, we can work on US geography, while continuing with MOH? Same company can be used. Just curious, but the student workbooks for the Trail Guide offer workbooks for all three grade levels (elementary, middle, and high school). Can you work on the elementary notebook and repeat this curriculum using the high school notebook later on? All these cycles are making me dizzy.

About the phonograms - when do you practice reading and writing the phonograms? Do you suggest before or after their spelling lesson? Presently, I am picking phonograms that are related to the words we're studying that week - anywhere between 12-20 phonograms. We work on them three times a week. About the rules - do you discuss the rules only if/when it applies to the word? I ask this because SWR has preliminary work, which is to be done before dictating the words.

I'm looking at pages 260-261 right now. Monday: Sounding out and writing thirty new words, then reread the first 10 words. Tuesday: "On Tuesday the children were given a twenty-word test, ten review words and the ten they had studied. On Tuesday, the children studied and sounded the second column of ten." My understanding of this is... study and review the second ten words and test those 10 ten along with the first ten words they had studied from the day before? Wednesday: Test the first and second ten words. There is no mention about the third set of ten words. Do you study and review the third set of ten words? Friday: Thursday is not mentioned. On Friday, you test all thirty words. I would like to include composition with the 30 words learned that week. Can this be done as soon as the spelling lesson is "over"? For example, using all thirty words on Friday and writing a short story after they had taken their test.

I do have the Mcall Crabbs books. I bought them with the SWR program. The 3rd graders do one or two of them per week. I have been using them since the start of the school year.

I just didn't like the flow of SWR. I read the entire book a couple of times casually and then again for teaching. After reading WRTR, I just feel the Spalding approach is more straightforward. I also like that the rule numbers are included with the dictated words, at least for the ones that have a rule. I'm still trying to figure it out, but knowing all I need is this book and the new phonograms, I'm set!

Ellie, you asked why I have the children write sentences. What other way do you "work on" the first 10 ten words after dictating 30 words? And so on for the remainder of the week when learning the other words. Also, when dictating the words, do you emphasize using the fingers to represent the phonograms? I wonder if there is a good youtube video of dictating using the Spalding method. There are plenty of LOE or SWR.

Thank you for responding. I wanted to quickly respond to Ellie's comments. On page 126, WRTR mentions that the younger students should write the words from Sections A-H on separate sheets of paper. These words are again dictated, but this time the child writes them in his/her notebook? Why twice? Reinforcement because the child is just starting to learn to write? Also, I have not dictated the first 7 notebook pages, yet. We had done this with SWR, although differently, and I'm trying to approach this delicately because I have one child who likely will fight me on this one...I really like how WRTR lays out the beginning notebook pages right from the start. My question is, do we fill in the columns as I dictate the words from the List?

I am slowly transitioning from SWR to Spalding. I have talked to the company a few times looking for some answers. I recently purchased and read through WRTR (4th edition). I'm still trying to fully understand the text - my goal is to read it at least two more times through. To be completely honest, I don't find their company to be "user-friendly" in terms of getting access to information about the program. In order for me to get my questions answered, I need to email my questions to the phone person/receptionist and she then asks one of the trainers the questions and takes down the answers. That receptionist then emails me back. What I really need is just to talk to someone on the phone that really knows the program. Anyway, I haven't purchased all of the items yet - still transitioning - and wanted to know your thoughts about my approach so far. On Monday, I dictate 20 words and the children write sentences on the first 10 words. On Tuesday, I quiz them on the first ten words (remediate any misspellings) and they write sentences on the second 10 words. On Wednesday, I quiz them on the second 10 words then on the first 10 words and remediate if necessary. On Thursday, I quiz all 20 randomly. Right now my 3rd graders are on list M and my 2nd grader is on list K. Do we continue to work on Spalding until they reach the end, list Z? If we work at a good pace, could we complete the book by the end of 4th grade? Does this mean that we are done with Spalding and only need to review? Also, I haven't moved from 20 words to 30 words a week - we are starting that this week (at least hoping to...). At 30 a week, we would reach list z in no time. We could potentially finish by mid 4th grade. What is Spalding's goal? If we followed Spalding and her recommendations, which grade should we complete all the list words in WRTR?

I cannot figure out which history and/or geography to use next school year (3rd and 4th graders). Ugh! I'm now leaning toward MFW ECC. I am currently using Mystery of History with the kids and we work on our "board" as a way to remember certain facts. They find it ok. I'm wanting to change history up and maybe start to incorporate more geography (world or us) for next year. Is it really that bad to not follow the four year history cycle by way of MOH or SOTW? I don't know a lot about MFW, but I'm guessing they have it designed so that we follow some type of cycle too. Does it confuse the children if we jump around each year? I'm hoping to cover the US states either the upcoming school year or the following. Whenever we do it, I want to incorporate US history too. The same idea would apply to world geography and learning world history simultaneously. Any good programs on either of these two? Help! Thoughts?

For those of you who use the BJU DL program, what did you use in the younger grades? FriedClams - Would you recommend using the BJU textbook for 4th and 5th grade (not the DL) or do you think that is still too structured? I just received the Weekly Studies for Science and think it's awesome. I will definitely include that for next year in 4th grade and maybe the BJU textbook for more detailed instruction. I think I will wait for the DL a year or two. Last question, is the DL a dvd or do you login with other students and its a live session?

bumping this thread for more feedback... thanks!

Does Science Shepherd offer anything for 5th grade and older? We currently use BFSU (Building Foundations of Scientific Understanding). I really love how the curriculum is designed - to be totally hands on, lots of living books, etc... - however, it takes a lot of mental attention on my part to "get it done" properly. I enjoy science and was very excited to teach it to my children, but I found myself getting busy with everything else that science (and history) got done when it got done. We are just starting the "B" thread in the book, which I find pretty pathetic given we started in September and have two third graders and a second grader, all who enjoy and get science. I realize I need support through the use of dvds (possibly) or a book that is more open and go. Maybe BJU is a better option for us and I could heavily supplement with living books. I'm at my library weekly picking up books. What about Mr. Q? I just think it looks rather slim in terms of content. What are your opinions about Mr. Q? I'm all over the place with science!

I'm struggling to pick a science curriculum for next year. I am definitely leaning toward a dvd-driven curriculum at this point. My oldest will be in 4th grade in the fall. I really like what I see with Science Shepherd - Introductory Science. It looks great, but there is almost no information out there about people using it and their opinions on it. I'm really hoping there are people on this site that have used it and are willing to share their thoughts about it. I even looked at Supercharge Science but crossed that off the list after finding negative reviews about it. Also, what are your thoughts about BJU science and their dvds?

Thanks so much for everyone's insight! We work on SM curriculum M-Th and on Fridays we use Life of Fred (and a little BA). I totally agree with the above response about making sure that the children are developmentally ready before moving on to new math concepts. I do supplement using Life of Fred because it gives them a different perspective on math and they get to learn how math can be applied in different ways. They also love it and we read about 3-4 chapters on Fridays. We were using BA on Fridays too, but we stopped the practice book - we now just read the guide together. They get "something" out of BA, but not the depth the practice book offers. They stopped being interested in doing the practice book on Fridays because they wanted that day to be a little more carefree with their learning. They prefer to work on math problems through the BA guide, and that's it.

Thanks, I will definitely move on. We use the Extra Practice and Intensive Practice books along with their regular Singapore Math workbook and textbook. So this begs the question, my kids will end up being about a half year ahead by the fall. If they continue this pace, then they will complete 1.5 years of math curriculum in one year. They will end being ahead by the mere fact that they are consistent about getting their work done, not necessarily because they really excel in math. They both like math and get the concepts just fine. The IP book does stump them more than any other math book they have though. This is so different than a regular brick and mortar school. I keep getting amazed with the benefits of homeschooling! You essentially take an average or slightly above average child and help them reach further.