Steppenwolf
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Posts posted by Steppenwolf
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21 hours ago, Tanager said:
I’m trying to figure out how to go deeper with math, but we seem to just be going faster.
My first grader just whipped through the Singapore 3A and B workbook in 2 months - we skipped the textbook(which is very unlike me, but he already had his multiplication facts down and we just kept going). He did do the placement test to start there... For singapore 4A I bought the intensive practice book and am thinking to use other resources to help make the work more varied. This was an issue with 3 so to make it interesting I had put pages from different sections together. We started the 4A textbook, but he already knows place value and rounding... so again I’m thinking he could skip the textbook... he picks up fast and I’m hoping that by using other resources it will be okay and not go so fast. I see in old threads others have skipped the textbooks, but are we missing something by doing that? I feel like I need a brake pedal sometimes : )
Mathematical reasoning books look fun, but easy, does anyone have experience with them??? Are they at the same level as singapore or a year behind? He loves art, so I think these books would appeal to him.
Also: We started Zaccaro and that's a win. Beast is iffy, though he likes the puzzle books. He dislikes Life of Fred. Also we keep computertime at a minimum for his eyes. Any suggestions are welcome.
His sis is ahead a few leaps in math, but she never picked up on patterns and numbers like he does, so the deep thing is new to me. She is 2e and saxon was great for her with the spiral, she is rock solid on her math. My first grader did the Saxon placement tests (I was curious) and he landed at 7/6!? So we went back to singapore and did the 4A placement test and that's definitely where he is there.
No surprise re. Saxon.
We did Singapore before Beast Academy.
We also tried Zaccaro, and Life of Fred - our kids did not like much either of these.
Try Beast Academy online ($15 / month), your child may like it much more than the Beast Academy books. (Ours did.)
The online version has more of everything, interactive, all grades 1-5 are available at the same time, and it has lots of puzzles not related to the main lessons.
(Note: there is a control in BA online to allow access to everything at once, which is disabled by default.)
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8 hours ago, ScoutTN said:
I would be very wary of doing too many online classes, especially your first year homeschooling. It will take some time to adjust to a new paradigm. Home education is not school at home.
What are your primary reasons for homeschooling and will your student(s) be returning to public school?
History is very easy to keep at home and do something interest-led. You can read ahead a bit and learn with your kids. Read and discuss, add some writing and you’re set. What has your student expressed an interest in learning? We can help you craft a course if you provide some basic info.
You’ve addressed the five core areas. Are you planning any electives?
You might consider posting on the other education sub forums to get more views and replies.The regular school is supposed to provide two important things: education and socialization.
The socialization is fine, but the education is not sufficient for these particular kids.
The default plan is to go to a regular high school where they'll be able to get APs.
On the other hand, if they stay in the current school, they won't be ready for APs.
Another reason (which might be the most important one) is that under-challenge is harmful.
We are planning to do: math, science, english, history, spanish.
Plus music instruments and sports.
The regular scheduled classes provide an outside structure, which works much better with these kids than when mom and dad are teaching.
We are definitely making sure that they are not over-loaded.
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On 4/23/2023 at 1:39 PM, Lawyer&Mom said:
Dd9 is fairly globally gifted. 99th percentile on MAP reading, 98th percentile on MAP math. But despite her math ability she doesn’t show nearly as much interest in it. She’s too busy reading to be a mathy kid. She’s had passing interest in Beast Academy or Life of Fred, but math doesn’t hold her focus. None of this is a problem! Except sometimes I think I ought to push her in math, given her ability. (Enrolling her in AOPS math in-person is an option!) Please talk me down from this imaginary cliff. Tell me that her passion for reading/fantasy/history/language is important and that I should support her passions. And tell me that your mathy kids were already showing mathy interest at age 9. Thanks!
Yes, you should support her passions.
On the other hand, if you do decide to nudge here in the direction of math, here are my 2 cents.
1) Math is often an acquired taste.
2) Was dd9 doing Beast Academy on her own? It would help if you actively work with her. Kids of all math levels get stuck once in while or regularly on particular aops topics / chapters / problems. (I've seen this, and there have been plenty of mentions about this on these forums.) This hurts motivation.
3) A scheduled aops class may not be the best option right now. The pace may be too fast, and, again, some aops chapters are known to be harder than others for a particular child at a particular point in time.
A self-paced course, like Beast Academy, may work better, at least at the beginning.
4) Try different Beast Academy levels? Could be too boring, or too hard? You have access to all levels at once.
5) BTW, use BA online (subscription), at least for the above reason. And there is more fun in the online edition.
There are also lots of puzzles there, completely unrelated to the main material.
6) It is ok to skip stuff in Beast Academy, and to pick and choose. A lot.
7) Try Singapore math? A solid program, but much less problem-solving?
Hope this helps!
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On 4/22/2023 at 10:04 PM, 8filltheheart said:
I can't help with general science or physical science since my kids don't take those courses, nor an on online class, but I can share courses with videos that my kids have used. My rising 8th grader will be taking Friendly Biology next yr. (I did not want her sucked down into the weeds of a typical high school biology class. This one is a good fit for an 8th grader who isn't really interested in biology.)
DO's physics class should be accessible for an advanced 7th/8th grader. I have had a couple of kids take that class and it has been a fairly easy, straightforward class. If they are solid in alg, it shouldn't be challenging. Just mentioning in case it is one that would actually work for you.
Thank you for this info!
Yes, we are now leaning to a straight-up Physical Science or Physics classes for the next year.
We are considering adding Integrated Science too, but we could probably teach that on our own, and we''ll decide later.
(Basically, we'll see how it is going, and I am pretty sure we'll be making adjustments during the year.)
The Friendly Biology could work for one of the kids, and for the other later.
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On 4/22/2023 at 7:48 PM, Malam said:
I've heard good things about this course: https://www.clrconline.com/introduction-to-literature-and-composition/
https://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/707023-clrc-comp-lit-cross-posted-from-k-8/
For (self-paced, not live) multi-subject science, you can check out conceptual academy: https://learnscience.academy/integrated-science-explorations/
Thank you for these references!
We particularly like the English class.
Re. the Integrated Science class, we may not sign up, but I am getting the Hewitt's "Integrated Science" textbook that they are using. (I already have the Hewitt's "Conceptual Physics" and was not aware of the other book.)
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We’ve finally bitten the bullet and are switching to homeschooling this fall (from a public school), definitely for grades 7 and 8 (and of course we will see how it goes later).
We are looking for *online* classes (preferably live, but could be self-paced, if there is sufficient teacher’s feedback), or maybe individual instruction remotely.
We would very much appreciate advice here.
The kids are advanced in Math, as well as in reading. Writing is problematic, as far as we can tell.
Actually, we are very worried about *English*, as we ourselves cannot help much with it.
In Math, we’ll continue with AOPS, which is very familiar and can be used for years to come.
In Science, we’d like to find some general Science class covering many subjects.
As to individual Science subjects:
Physics: at some point in the future we will use Derek Owen’s classes (Physical Science + Physics), but not ready for that yet.
Biology: no idea yet, we’d like to include it this year, but it can wait a little.
We are pretty clueless about online English, History, Spanish classes. (The following is from searches on these forums:)
Spanish (the previous experience is 1 year of Spanish): https://www.spanish.academy/
English:
https://debrabell.com/ (AIM Academy Online)
Any other leads re. English? Can anybody compare the two above? Advice on particular teachers / courses? (Analysis / writing in particular.)
History: we are considering the same providers as for English: AIM and WTM academies (above).
Thank you!
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After BA5, if she is still doing as strongly, we’ll move directly into AOPS Intro to Algebra.
Are you aware that AOPS also has 'Prealgebra' textbook?
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Based on your description, Derek Owens math may be your best bet.
You've previously used 2 very different programs. Saxon is very weak, while AOPS is one of the most rigorous and hardest programs. (Jacobs is in the direction of AOPS, but not as 'meaty' or thorough.)
Derek Owens Algebra 1 is based on the Dolciani textbook, which is a good sign, as this is a reputable textbook. (But you are probably looking for Algebra 2.)
Besides AOPS and Derek Owens, other choices are Stanford EPGY and imacs. Stanford EPGY may be good (but we have not tried the higher level classes). imacs looks drier and with more repitition than AOPS. IIRC, both are expensive.
Hope this helps.
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... get away from adults who view academics as something for elites, and be exposed to sociable people who use academics ...
- beautifully stated!
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It looks like DC (grade 1) will be working on Math Mammoth, and we do not worry about the Math progression. On the other hand, we are completely lost WRT what to use for ELA.
I've looked at the Easy Grammar (thanks to a mention by EndOfOrdinary) and liked it, but it is way too advanced for now. So I'm looking for something much simpler, starting from the very beginning, and will appreciate suggestions.
DC can progress quickly, but is not self-driven to learn things like grammar.
DC reads easily, and can read technical texts if they have high practical value, like 'Minecraft Redstone' books, with good understanding, while preferring 'fun short books' when reading for fun.
We have an Amazon Kindle, so some Kindle apps may be of use, probably as an additional resource.
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Davidson Gifted forums have some posts on 'adult 2e'. E. g., "2e/ADHD adult resources" (use 'site:giftedissues.davidsongifted.org/BB adult 2e' to find more).
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A good idea - I'd like DC to do this later this year (frustration or not), when there is more time.
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Ditto everything quark and chocolate-chip chooky said above (based only on my experience; YMMV, of course).
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The program is not one which is fast, skipped through, or pick and choose. The way it is designed is to give a wholistic, proof based approach. You pull out a chunk in that process and your student is left clueless or not able to provide an adequate, substantial proof. The point is that the program is dense with no fluff.
Yes.
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I would not skip them. Instead, show her how to break the problem down into microbits. Explain problem solving strategies. Help her realize that the concept is not difficult, but the wording might be. This will help her much more in the long run and show her that it is not about learning the math, but more about solving the problem.
I would have her draw them. When it gives you a name for Person A make it a shape or letter. When it tells you that Person B is smaller, taller, richer, ahead in line, whatever, put a shape/letter where it would need to go in relation to Person A. When Person C comes on the scene assign a shape/letter and place them in relation to the other two. By writing it she does not have to hold the information in her head. It also helps to break the sentences down into short clauses stopping after each bit of information instead of reading all of it at once.
All above is very good advice.
Word problems require the translation from the natural language to the language of math as the first step, which adds an extra level of difficulty, at any age, but maybe more so for younger children.
Re: whether to skip the topic: I'd try to avoid 'getting stuck' if this causes high levels of frustration. It might be better to continue on with other topics and keep coming back to word problems, let it 'simmer'.
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Actually, my pp didn't come out the way I intended it to. I think that if it is meaningful to her area of interest then the struggle to discover and craft the math will be extremely beneficial to her, despite how frustrating it is. But it shouldn't become something so negative that she starts to hate math. And I also feel it would be very helpful for her to speak to as many scientists she meets as possible to ask them about their own journeys with math.
I meant that her struggle could come from lack of repetition and application, not only understanding. Providing the explanation while she has more practice doing and applying the problems might be very valuable. Then, giving her a challenge e.g. working on some problems without the explanation might increase her confidence with the discovery aspect of it (when you think that aspect is meaningful to her). Holding her hand as much as you see fit, setting her up for success then slowly releasing her to work things out herself so that she eventually has that strength under her belt (but it doesn't have to come now)?
This.
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I'm sure some students do fine with absolutely no other math assistance except the AoPS book and solutions manual....mine is not one of them. ;) I imagine most students work with a parent from time to time, supplement with other resources, or take the class and have feedback from the instructor or teaching assistant. I doubt there are many who honestly have no other math input at all other than AoPS book and solutions manual.
I say that because I somehow got that impression somewhere along the way. I think sometimes people are hard on themselves, or their children, because using the books alone isn't working.
With any program, a good tutor/teacher will be very valuable. DC gets help from me occasionally, gets very useful feedback on the 'writing' problems in his AOPS class; the interactive online class sessions are also useful.
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I treat the end of chapter Review and Challenge problems as assessment.
(Dd's done AoPS prealgebra, algebra, geometry, intro to number theory, intro to counting and probability, intermediate algebra, and is in the midst of precalculus.)
Alcumus may provide both practice and assessment: the topic's bar is green = passed, blue = mastery.
ETA: one can also see the progress by topic in the 'report' tab.
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I thought I hated it in school. I still get that dry-as-toast feeling when I open something like Jurgensen and just look at it (having never used it).
However. I *love* AoPS. A whole new world. (Disclaimer, I am relatively visual-spatial.)
Dip into geometry on Alcumus from time to time. Sure, sometimes it might make your brain hurt, but in a good way. I do it for distraction from stress (akin to doing the crossword during class in law school, but way harder). Go ahead, log in, just for one problem; I dare you :)
Beginning serious study of geometry after having dealt with mostly just 'discrete math' may be / feel overwhelming.
I, too, love how AOPS deals with geometry. (And many other, well-known, geometry textbooks (with rare exceptions) just turn me off.)
In particular, AOPS covers 'angle-chasing' inside and out as the first topic (at the beginning of 'Intro to geometry' book) - to me it looks almost like a game. Try it as an experiment - you might actually like it.
(BTW, here is a good definition of 'discrete math': http://www.cse.buffalo.edu/~rapaport/191/S09/whatisdiscmath.html - no pictures, ugh! While geometry is all about 'pictures'. :) )
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I'd suggest AOPS prealgebra (1 or 2). AOPS is hard, and very different from other texts/classes. Softer introduction to AOPS is better.
I'd also strongly suggest trying AOPS prealgebra textbook first (before the class start), from ch. 1 - the full load: problems in the text, exercises, challenge problems.
"He also works a little bit in Alcumus, independently, (I have him work on something until it turns green)."
BTW, you could try requiring the bar to turn blue ('mastery' of the topic) - in my experience, it may make a difference for future topics (YMMV). (In any case, alcumus is a great tool.)
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regentrude, on 14 Dec 2014 - 1:54 PM, said:
If she is has taken prealgebra, you can do Conceptual Physics by Hewitt.
Another good choice is How Things Work by Louis Bloomfield.
Or wait a year and do an actual algebra based course.
Those would be my suggestions as well. There is a TC course that pairs with Conceptual Physics called Great Ideas of Classical Physics, and Bloomfield offers a How Things Work course on Coursera that goes with his course. In case you want to add lectures to the reading.
Those would be my suggestions as well. There is a TC course that pairs with Conceptual Physics called Great Ideas of Classical Physics, and Bloomfield offers a How Things Work course on Coursera that goes with his course. In case you want to add lectures to the reading.
I like How Things Work by Louis Bloomfield too. (And thank you for the coursera reference.) Also: 'Thinking Physics' by Epstein and 'The flying circus of physics' by Walker (these two are problem/solution books, not textbooks), 'Cartoon guide to physics' by Larry Gonick (and many of his other guides too).
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- The new way things work by David Macaulay
- Electronic curcuits for evil genius 2/e (you'll need to buy parts separately, but those are cheap)
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Tanya Khovanova about John H Conway being able to factor large numbers in his head: 'Remember Your Primes': http://blog.tanyakhovanova.com/2008/09/remember-your-primes/ .
(Note: I also vote 'no' on rote memorisation.)
Homeschool grades 7-8: online English, History, Spanish, Science classes?
in Accelerated Learner Board
Posted
@Dmmetler
Thank you for the info!
I've just registered for one summer class at onlineg3, and I am looking at their other classes.
(An older child took "History through movies" there, and liked it, but it was a long time ago.)