Wow, thank you for all this help! I may start by asking my cousin about how she got her children's ASD diagnoses. She lives just north of me and since she knows this area, she may have some good info for me. She tried to talk to me about it once, but at the time, I was so evaluated-out that I told her we'd already checked into it. Plus, I had a lot on my plate. Pretty sure I had PPD with my last baby that lasted a really long time. I couldn't even help myself. I wasn't looking to take on another fight. Thankfully, I'm on the mend. My husband and I have been working on our health pretty hard lately, so I'm feeling stronger not only physically, but emotionally these days. I think your nudges have been a good thing for me. Thanks so much. Now, off to try to convince the hubby and ask my cousin some questions...

Yes, my son is the same as yours, he doesn't understand very basic words. It has to be something that catches his attention or he doesn't absorb it. I don't know if there's a term for it, but there's so much he doesn't understand, yet some things he's got incredible knowledge about. When he was about 5/6 we did a kindergarten unit, spending a few weeks on the solar system. He absorbed nothing. However, the following year, he discovered Star Wars. He absolutely loved it and it got him interested in space. He pulled our Apologia astronomy book off the shelf all on his own and practically memorized it. I still recall one of his speech teachers' double take when she asked him what his favorite planet was and which he'd like to travel to if he could. He gave his answer and then this poor kid who has such a hard time stringing words together listened to his teacher tell him which planet she wanted to travel to. He stopped and corrected her, telling her that she couldn't do that because the particular planet she had chosen was a gas planet so she wouldn't have anywhere to land. She just did not know how to respond to that. LOL! There are lots of times when my son does need visual examples of his math problems. Things like a three step word problem can trip him up, but if I can draw him a picture, he'll get it very quickly. His last evaluation was a couple of years ago. We used to take him in for therapy at our local university for their graduate student program and they would evaluate him every semester. The last evaluation said he has expressive/receptive/cognitive language delays of 2 years expressive and 3 years receptive. I think that gap has gotten bigger lately. More recently, he did get speech therapy through last year's charter school. They took forever to get us an IEP meeting and then the woman who ran the school delayed paying the private speech therapy company, so he only got a few months of therapy. Thankfully, the therapist was very good and my son warmed up to her right away. I asked about evaluations and she told me I'd have to ask for the school to evaluate him. Another down side to that though was that we had to do the speech therapy over Skype, which, normally, I wouldn't have minded, but I think my son needs more actual face-to-face work. He doesn't make eye contact when talking to people and he needs to work on that. We were never sent paperwork to re-enroll in the charter for this year. Other families were. I think it's because the school didn't like having to pay for therapy for us, but that's just too bad. It's the law. It's what they're required to do. Either way, the school is no longer going to function in this area. Right now we have no charter here but there's one trying start up. Thanks for the encouragement to fight for my son's educational rights. If the new charter does start up and if we do enroll, I'll do just that. If the charter doesn't happen for us for whatever reason, I'll take him back to the university for therapy. We'd actually stopped taking him there for a while because money had gotten really tight and we just couldn't afford even the discounted therapy. I had applied for our local Shriner's (they offer free speech therapy) about a year ago, but I still haven't heard back from them. I've never heard of a disability scholarship, so I'm going to say no, my state doesn't offer them. I'm sure someone would have told me about them. When we first moved back to this state, I was part of a special learner's group and I know they would have said something. Unless it's something that's more recent. I'll look into that. I'm not completely anti-med, but I used to be.lol. The older I get, the more I understand that meds have their place too. I would still prefer to avoid them if I can. My 18 year old has never been diagnosed but she has to have ADHD. In fact, she just went galloping past me.lol. It's what she does to work out her need to move. She drinks caffeinated teas and she and I both think that helps her. I don't know if my son would go for that or not. He's crazy picky about what he eats/drinks and his gluten-intolerance does not help the situation. I did get the kids some Thinking Putty. I'll have to have him use that more often. I forgot about midline exercises. I'd read about them and tried them briefly with my now 18 year old, but I don't think I've ever tried them with my other children. I'd never considered that my son has ADHD. I guess it's because his attention problems are something I've only noticed recently during school and because overall, he does things a lot differently than his sister and daddy do. He for sure has the language issues. I think he also has ASD. He was evaluated for it as we were in the process of moving back here from out of state. He'd gone to a special-ed preschool up there and they were convinced he had ASD. Unfortunately, we had to move here and being a poorer area, people didn't want to help much. We took him to a regional center for evaluation and he hit all but one marker (not sure if that's the right term) for ASD. The only reason he didn't hit that marker was because he would play with his sisters (I don't think they considered that it tended to be parallel play) an because he would sometimes make eye contact. Apparently neither they nor I noticed that he doesn't really make much eye contact while talking to people. I never realized that until a year or two later when one of the speech grad students pointed it out. So, if the charter doesn't work out, do you have any suggestions about where to go for evals? It'd have to be general suggestions of course since you don't likely know my area. I'm sort of torn about the charter thing. On the one hand, if we do it, I can demand evaluations and therapies. On the other hand, I hate all the testing and paperwork, plus, we're Christians and I like to use Christian curriculum whenever it works for us. We're not supposed to use any sectarian materials when using a charter whether we pay for it ourselves or not. And we have to keep up with Common Core, which I don't really mind some of it, but other parts are just silly.

Oh good! Then since my son already likes Singapore, we could just stick with that. That's good to know. I think from now on I will order the home instructor guides. We have had some financial struggles. My poor husband has been through six jobs in the past two years. Thankfully, he's working at a more stable place that's been around for a while and he's earning a bit more than he used to. We're slowly purchasing things that we'd been putting off for a long time. A tutor just wasn't going to happen, but at least it's something we can start to think about now. I'd actually been hoping to use some of our educational funds last year to pay for tutoring. We had signed up with a home charter school last year for the first time ever, but it turned out to be a disaster. I suspect the woman who ran the school may have been embezzling. She wasn't paying her teachers, vendors or many of her purchase orders, then she convinced a larger charter school south of us to pay off some of her debts, saying she was going to incorporate her "school" into theirs. After stringing them along for a while and getting a lot of our orders paid off, she "changed her mind" and the hand-off never happened. Plus, she never ended up hiring any tutors anyway. I plan on filing a complaint with the state board of education but apparently, there's some super secret process and I can't figure out how to do it. We're currently waiting on another charter school to move into this area, hopefully this year. I believe they actually have tutors, so if they do, that's the first thing I'm going to ask about. I've also seen a sign in someone's front yard not to far from here for tutoring services and they take special needs kids, so if all else fails, I may inquire there.

No, I haven't had any of us evaluated for math issues. I don't even know where to go to do that. Plus, my husband is normally a super sweet guy but whenever I think one of the kids has issues with something, he thinks I'm reaching quite a bit. I also think he thinks I'm just trying to be mean to that particular child. I don't understand why. I think that's really silly of him since DH has ADHD and mild dyslexia. He got upset with me when I was figuring out our son's language delays, anger & anxiety and he also got upset when I thought our oldest daughter had vision issues. I was right both times. At least he apologizes after we've gotten it figured out, but it's so frustrating to have to deal with that on top of finding out our children have yet another struggle to deal with. It does make me feel better to know my children aren't the only ones who are not working on "grade level" whatever that means. Thanks for that. :) Stupid and incapable. That's how I felt/feel when it comes to math. I felt it back when I was working outside the home since I usually had jobs that had to do with cash handling. I feel it now that I don't know how to help my children with math. My oldest daughter is always saying she feels stupid. The funny thing is that in high school, I didn't feel stupid in my math classes. I was usually at the top of that particular math class, but I started out in Pre-algebra in 9th grade. In Geometry, we had to work in groups a lot of the time and I was the one everyone else in my group borrowed the homework/seat work to copy from. I did feel it when overhearing some of the other kids at school talk about doing Calculus. I knew I'd never get there because I'd started so far behind and I'd never been good at math anyway. I made up for it in other areas, so it wasn't too bad. I guess the good thing for me was that none of my friends were taking Calculus either. :/ So where does someone learn the concepts? Would Singapore cover that?

Aww, you're so sweet. I love big families too. :) The 9 actually include my "angel babies" in heaven. Sorry, I know my signature is a little confusing. I think I added all my little angels after losing my son Peter and I just can't make myself remove them from my signature. :) I actually only have five children on earth. Like you! :D Its funny that you said "big families". I used to live in an area where 9 children was big, but I knew people who had 8, 9, even a family with 10. Where I live now, my family is looked upon as huge, and my oldest has moved out, so usually, I only have 4 with me. It's interesting to see the difference.

I think it's as you say. He's learning the concepts, however slowly at times, but not retaining his math facts, like at all. That's what made me think that eventually, he will end up having big problems. He's not learning his math facts, just like my older daughters and me. I see it with my 8 year old DD too. She uses an abacus to do all her math problems. She can't do them without it. I also like the idea that my son is hanging in there with Singapore since he struggles so much with everything else. He is "behind" though. At 12 years of age, he should be in 7th grade (he turns 13 in November), but he's just finished Singapore 3A. I was hoping to have him catch up this summer, but I get busy and forget to make sure he did his math every day and he takes advantage of that by pretending he didn't remember either.lol. I actually wasn't clear on what working memory was when you asked about it, but after looking it up, it really does look like he has a problem with that, especially when it comes to language recall. He has very halting speech because he can't remember which word he's looking for next an if he's stressed out in any way, he can't really speak at all. My older girls tried a lot of different math programs because they had such a hard time getting through any of them. My oldest tried more because of the 4 1/2 year age difference. I think one of the first things we tried was Math-It, but since that wasn't a complete program, we looked for something else. Math-It never helped either of my girls retain any of their facts anyway, so that was a bust. (I tried it with my son a year or two ago and he didn't seem to understand what he was supposed to do.) So we purchased Mastering Mathematics , then MUS, I think we tried something else in there, but I can't remember what it was... A Beka maybe? Then we tried Saxon for one year for both girls. I was actually the problem with Saxon. It just felt like we were spending our entire school day trying to get math done and we had a new baby in the house at the time and I was just exhausted, so that just wasn't working. Then I think we went back to MUS since a friend had convinced me to give it another try. MUS had redone the teacher's manuals (I despised the first set, I couldn't follow them at all.) so that made me think maybe I could make it work a second time around. My oldest actually went with that for a while, by this time she was very very behind in math. It got to the point where she couldn't follow Steve Demme anymore and I sure didn't know what he was talking about so after a ton of arguing, I finally convinced her to try Teaching Textbooks. That may have actually worked except my oldest daughter for some reason kept uninstalling everything off the school computer and I was never able to grade their work. The last straw with TT was when my silly DH bought the old version of TT pre-algebra for my second DD and she hated having to write everything out (I think she has some dysgraphia), so she just quit doing it. At this point, my oldest turned 18 and got her GED. My second child then tried Life of Fred, but she insisted she needed to go back to doing fractions because she didn't understand them. She finally made it to algebra only last year, but we were trying out a home charter school for the first time ever (awful experience BTW) and I was feeling a lot of pressure to send in decent grades. That part I guess turned out to be a good thing because it made me realize that she just wasn't getting LOF either. So we switched to Kahn Academy, but she disliked it and I couldn't figure out how to print off her work to turn in to the school. Finally, our educational specialist, who is a sweet friend from church, gave me a huge book full of sheets from her adult high school program's math, where she's also a teacher, which turned out to be Keys To... My second daughter still hasn't even finished algebra but I let her "graduate" if she promised to finish algebra and geometry. I was considering sticking with Singapore and adding R&S, but I was afraid to burn us all out. As much as my son seems to tolerate math though, he might just like doing both programs. I have no idea how my 8 year old DD would handle doing 2 programs. She's still so full of wonder about the world right now but I can tell she's hitting the next level of maturity. She's started having panic attacks. Thankfully not when it comes to school, but still, I don't want to stress her out too much. MUS was also a contender because of my son's strong visual/kinesthetic learning style. He's also a whiz with LEGOs so I figured the blocks would be a big draw for him. In fact I actually bought the Alpha workbooks at the beginning of last year because that's when he just couldn't figure out borrowing/regrouping. We watched our old MUS DVDs and did a few lessons, but I lost the big block house poster, from so many years ago and it took me forever to make another. By that time, my DH had finally gotten our son to understand borrowing/regrouping, so I stopped with the MUS. Are you doing all three programs with your kiddos? Singapore, R&S and MUS? How long does that take you every day and do you take breaks in between? I felt like not knowing their math facts really held my older girls back because they're afraid of math. Honestly though, they got that from me. I'm afraid of math too. I still don't know a lot of my math facts and it can be really embarrassing sometimes. I finally learned the whole 10's addition thing after working with cash for years as an adult. It's insane. I was a front end clerk at a grocery store counting out $100,000 minimum drops every weekend night at closing for a couple of years before I fully grasped it an it took a few more years practice before I felt solid. I finally learned how to count back change after years of elderly people, some patiently, and some not so patiently showed me how over and over and over again. I didn't know my 10s facts at all until then. My older girls just freeze up when it comes to math. I can see it on their faces because that's what I used to do too. My oldest was dreading taking algebra in college this summer. Her fiance told me she'd be on the verge of a panic attack most nights because she wasn't understanding her homework. A few weeks in though, she finally started to understand a little, but she'd frequently forget how to do it again. She also panicked every time she had to work on a new concept. My second daughter freezes up and gets really cranky over algebra too. Thanks for the help. My DH hates talking curriculum with me so it's nice to talk to people who can tell me about their experiences and give some suggestions. :)

Hello, I have a 12 year old son and an 8 year old daughter who I am currently schooling. I've decided we're going to switch to Rod & Staff math because I've heard a lot of good things about it over the years but ignored it because I always thought it looked boring, plus I have a negative emotional association with R&S since it was what my sister and I used the one year we were sort of tutored at home as teens. However, I've read so many good things about R&S math lately that I think I can get over that. I've graduated my two oldest girls, having used so many different math programs and none of them have worked for us. We tried Mastering Mathematics, MUS (twice), Saxon, TT, Life of Fred, Kahn Academy, and probably more I'm forgetting. My oldest is currently in college working on a communications major. She's doing extremely well, made the dean's list last year ect. Except, she had to take remedial math classes and she's struggling a bit with algebra this summer. She says she finally got a teacher who is good at explaining everything and she thinks a big part of that is because the teacher has instant fact recall while the other teachers did not. I sure never did. My 18 year old has graduated, but I've asked her to keep working on her Keys to Algebra workbooks and then go back to Life of Fred for Geometry. Anyway, so far, everything we've tried hasn't worked. Currently, my 12 year old is using Singapore 3A. He's basically done but I haven't purchase 3B yet. I do have 4A & 4B with the home teacher guides. My son has language delays of three years, but I think the gap has gotten bigger since his last evaluation. He has always loved numbers and counting. Math is the only subject he has much patience for and he will usually do on his own. With every other school subject, if it takes too long or bores him in some way, he'll zone out and not take in anything I'm teaching. Even if we have conversations on certain topics, he's forgotten what was discussed by that afternoon. He's different with math. He does take forever to get his work done and usually he understands it, but if it's a more complicated word problem, he needs help. It also took him forever to understand regrouping and borrowing. Likewise, it took lots of explaining before he got the idea of division. He doesn't retain his math facts, which is exactly what my older girls dealt with and that's holding him back just like it has them, and me if I'm honest. I see my 8 year old typical (I think) daughter having the same issues. She's only used a thick workbook for math (The Complete Book of Math) which was supposed to cover 1st and 2nd grade but is getting ready to go into third grade this year so I need to find something that will work for her. Can anyone offer help in how to place my children with Rod & Staff math? I saw one website that had assessment tests, but I'm 99% sure my husband won't want to spend $20 per test. I looked at the table of contents for the 1st and 2nd grade R&S sets and it looks like there are some topics toward the end that my 8 year old hasn't tackled yet, but the first part looks way too easy. Should I take her all the way back to 1st? I have no idea where to put my son. Like I said, he just finished Singapore Primary Mathematics 3A U.S. edition, and like I said, he really hasn't learned even most of his addition facts. I don't want to frustrate him and I don't want to make the same mistakes I made with his older sisters. I'd really love some help.

Testing, testing 123

Wow, that's great! I've got to go but how about starting with this http://www.hslda.org/docs/study/ray2009/2009_Ray_StudyFINAL.pdf Maybe mention proper socialization, Ivy League schools accepting homeschoolers... Good luck! :)

Thank you, I will look at all the programs mentioned. I think I'd briefly heard of CLE and Math in Focus but I'd never heard of Ronit Bird. I just checked out the RB site and I'm pretty sure my girls and I all have dyscalculia. That would explain a lot. Hopefully one or more of these programs will help us get on track and I won't have to worry about the rest of my kiddos having problems with math. :)

Hello there, I have 4 children I'm currently schooling- DD16, DS11, DD7 and DD2. I have another DD21, who has flown the nest. I have always felt that I was bad at math. In school I did okay, even thought I struggled a lot with memorization of math facts. In fact, I never really memorized them all. I could get through my math classes, but I really didn't like them. My oldest began homeschooling in 2nd grade and we curriculum hopped the entire time she was homeschooling. I guess we still are. My oldest never got a grasp on math facts and is currently doing remdial math in college. She sounds like she's a bit worried she'll have a difficult time getting through it. Thankfully, she's majoring in Journalism so she won't have to do a whole lot of math. Oldest DD has no learning problems that I know of. I mentioned that just to give a bit of history on our math failures. My second DD is having very similar problems. Can't memorize math facts and just doesn't seem to get math. She was using Teaching Textbooks but really started disliking pre-algebra because the version we had purchased (used) no longer allowed her to enter her answers on the computer. She didn't like having to write it all out. The act of writing has always been difficult for her. She has never been diagnosed with anything but I would definitly say she has ADHD, which had really become much less prevalent until a few years ago when I had to go back to work and the kids kinda did whatever they wanted while I was gone. They started watching a lot of TV and playing a lot of video games and unfortunately for my children, that really decreases their ability to learn and focus. Thankfully, I was able to quit and come back home when my youngest was born and I've gotten the younger kiddos out of the habit but the two older ones never stopped. DD also has what looks like stealth dyslexia. I don't know if this is part of it, but she's very disorganized. Kinda like me, honestly. So anyway, back to math- DD said she no longer liked TT and I talked her in to trying Life of Fred. She backed up to Fractions because she said she doesn't understand fractions at all. She finished the book but she said it was still pretty vague and she was barely passing the bridges (tests). DH finally ordered the next few books but I'm not sure LoF is working for DD either. While we were waiting for the new LoF books for the last couple of months, I've had her practicing her basic math facts every day with Math-It. She says math doesn't make any sense. My DS11 is using Singapore. He actually likes the idea of math but he has a lot of autistic-like issues. The biggest one right now being expressive/receptive language delays of 2-3 years, sometimes more. He has always loved counting and numbers but he's not getting the idea of regrouping in addition/subtraction. I've gone over and over it with him but it's just not working. I also have him do daily basic fact practice for 4 minutes each day but he only gets about 4-6 problems done in those 4 minutes. It is kinda hectic here with other siblings etc, but I can't send him to his room to do it because he'll just play with LEGOs instead. I want to find a math program that will work for all my children. I don't want them to struggle with math like I did/do. I'd appreciate suggestions.

Just thought I'd throw in my two cents- I didn't think my 2nd DD was ready to read at 6 but after lots and lots of pressure from my MIL, I caved. I had 100EL on hand and used it. It was a struggle, there were lots of tears from both of us, we even took a break but we got through it. Afterward I left her alone for a bit, didn't make her read much. Pretty soon, she was picking up books on her own and reading them! I started her on MFW K, did their phonics lessons as a refresher and now she's a fantastic reader. I hate to say this but she reads better than her 15 year old sister. What's really odd is DD#2 has lots and lots of signs of dyslexia. She reverses letters and has a difficult time with everything else but reading. I really think it was 100EL that saved her from not being able to read at all. Now my DS began teaching himself to sight read at 4 so I jumped right in with 100EL and he's doing great. We're taking it slow. He's on lesson 44 and is sounding out words everywhere he goes. Amazing what a $20.00 book can do. I hear Alpha Phonics and Phonics Pathways are both good programs too. Here's an interesting article about teaching phonics. http://www.donpotter.net/ed.htm I don't know if he's right or not, but I tend to lean that way after seeing what good, simple phonics instruction did for my daughter. I'm so grateful I stumbled on to 100EL. I bought it for nostalgic reasons. I was taught with the public school version of 100EL (SRA/Distar) so I thought it would be neat to have the book. I hope you get the kinks worked out in your daughter's program. :) Julie

This is a very interesting thread. I'm taking notes since I have a 15 month old. If your children are cooperative and interested, maybe they could pick and choose some activities from the Brightly Beaming toddler curriculum? http://www.letteroftheweek.com/nursery_age_1.html I'm just throwing this idea out there since I'm still not quite sure what to do with mine. If he likes books they could use the book list on this site and you could find some of these in board book form for him. My baby Princess adores books but she still rips pages so board books work best for her. Julie

I don't know, but you can read mine (in my siggy) if you like. It's mostly reviews right now since we got bombarded with review due dates in December for some silly reason but the ones toward the beginning and a couple in between are about my family's homeschool adventure. I wish you a speedy recovery! Julie

Oh, yes, I forgot to say that we used 100EL to teach DD how to read before using MFW K. We're doing the same with DS. I think 100 EL works way to well for my children and me to do it any other way. MFW K's reading instruction was a great review. I just wish I'd done the tactile letter activities with DD#2 instead of skipping them. I think she'd have picked up handwriting better if we had. I think it's good that you want to have your child do more phonics first. It'll help I think. :) I've never used the K program while using another MFW year so it's good to hear they help you integrate. That'll make life even easier. :) Julie

Our main area of change is math. After discussing it here with some of you lovely people, we decided to dig in with MUS for my oldest. I read aloud some of your responses to my questions and DD began to realize it's okay to spend lots of time catching up. We did an entire lesson of MUS yesterday and she felt she got the concept. It was a simple lesson so I was okay with her finishing it all in one day too. She did say she feels the need to do all the worksheets because they help her retain the material. I'm okay with that too because she can obviously get it done. We also switched to doing the MUS online drill rather than Quarter Mile Math and she likes that too. It really looks like we can catch her up to grade level with no problems as long as I'm watching her closely. Now for DD #2... Honestly I'm still not sure what we're doing with her other than switching from Singapore to something else as soon as were done with the current workbooks we have. I'd switch right now to Rod & Staff but DH hates it that I've changed curriculum so many times. He hates my buying new curriculum in general so the thought of me not finishing it is unbearable to him. :tongue_smilie: After discussing my girls' math problems here I talked it over with DD#2 and it turns out she really doesn't like Singapore. She says Math Mammoth explains concepts better for her. Either way we're going to do both Singapore and Math Mammoth every day instead of alternating every other day. We're also dropping Math Windows for now and using some triangle flash cards for her to say her facts orally. I'm hoping it'll help that the answers are right there and she doesn't have to count or guess. I'm also waiting on an addition fact trick book called Two Plus Two Is Not Five so we'll see if that helps her. She did very well with our review of Times Tales and she almost seems to know her multiplication facts better than her older sister after using it so we ordered the Two Plus Two book since the Times Tales people recommend it for learning addition facts. DS will continue preschool until we move... And that brings us to the other big change for us this year: We're going to have to move in with my mom.:crying: I love living here in NV. I don't want to move back to CA but I don't think we have any choice. We're just not making it here. The good thing is the fact that we have that option at all. We're thinking about sending our oldest to a CS there. It's a charter school so we'll only have to pay for her books and I'll be relieved of having to deal with my hormonal teenager while trying to school my special needs learners and the baby. I hate to do that but I think it'll be best for us all. Her cousins have gone to that school for years so from what we understand it's a good school. I may have to tutor her after school to help her with math but I'm very willing to do that. If that's the case, I'm going to dig in and have fun with DD#2. She and I work very well together so finishing out the year with her will be lots of fun. We're working on MFW ECC. We're also testing out the Prairie Primer so we can write a review on it. DS and I will probably pick up B4FIAR since it's very similar to what he does in his special ed preschool CUBS program so I'm glad I already have that book. We'll continue with 100EL since he's learning to read so well. Julie

I've never tried WP but I'm currently using MFW ECC and I used the MFW K program with DD#2. We love it. I'm sure this is a preference thing though. I don't know about you but I just wish someone could tell me what exactly is going to work for my children.;) I so wish we'd known about MFW when we began homeschooling. Like others have said, MFW is just pick up and go no monstrous SL instructor's guide to worry about. I know I could've put the pages I needed into a small binder, but the MFW TM is much easier. You can buy the basic or deluxe package so you have all the books that are absolutely necessary, then you find the book basket books at your library or you can purchase them elsewhere. I love that the bible/missionary theme is integrated into the curriculum or at least ties in somehow elsewhere. When I originally began using MFW, I got frustrated because I couldn't find the exact books listed but it doesn't really matter, just find a similar book at the library and you're set. I tried SL very briefly last year but it didn't work for us. Don't get me wrong, SL is a lovely program and honestly their slogan "The way you wish you'd been homeschooled..." is right on but my girls are different. They need hands on stuff while I OTOH, could have spent the whole day reading books as a kid... which is very difficult to do now that I have small children to attend to. Another thing I didn't like about SL is some of their read-alouds are very advanced and some contain content I don't want my children exposed to just yet. I just read one of the books from the SL K program to my 10 year old and she loved it. My 5 year old however could not have followed it at all. Yes, he has speech delays, but I still don't know if he could follow the book if he didn't. When we were trying to use SL, we were spending the entire day on the couch reading. It was very difficult. My kiddos can't handle that. One of the reader books from SL contained lots of cursing and I honestly don't want my children reading something like that, especially on their own. MFW warns you if there's something questionable in one of their books. I really appreciate that because it means I have the choice to omit that part or I can choose to read and discuss it instead of having no warning and being caught off guard. Oh, and yes, you choose your own math, LA, spelling and cursive handwriting for MFW. MFW does make suggestions for these and you can purchase from them if you like or purchase whatever you want elsewhere. MFW now suggests Singapore for math. I belive they used to suggest Saxon. We are currently using Singapore for one child and MUS for the other. Singapore is not working for us so we are going to switch to either Math Mammoth or Rod & Staff next year. I personally did not like their suggested cursive instruction so I used Christian Liberty Press, then Peterson handwriting. I used Emma Serl language lessons for my oldest but didn't like using it without a teacher's manual. I don't know if I'd like it now that someone has published a TM but I've fallen in love with Queen Homeschool's language lessons which has a similar feel but was written in modern times. I think we'll stick with Queen Homeschool rather than MFW's suggested language arts. One thing to keep in mind with MFW is that they suggest you use a separate year for K and first grade. That means you're still teaching more than one curriculum if you have children in that age range. Personally that won't bother me because I only have 4 children and I've taught the K year before and we loved it. ETA: You could split up the group and teach the K or first grade curriculum to your littles and teach the older ones from the MFW 5 year cycle. But I don't think you'd ever be teaching more than two levels at a time. I actually stumbled upon a blog where the whole family, 5 or 6 children, was using MFW K and I think the kiddos were as old as 10. Honestly due to some hard knocks in life and my DD#2 not being ready for school at 5, we used MFW K from the time she was 7 till she turned 10 last summer. She finally started to get slightly bored with it at the end but became much more enthusiastic when we started including her brother. She liked teaching him. :) I do get the idea that the K year is better than the first grade year but I haven't used the first grade year myself, so I can't say that for sure. It is very helpful to participate on the MFW BB. There are some very experienced users there who can answer your questions. One in particular is named Crystal and she's been a terrific help. I wish I'd begun participating there sooner. It's not very busy so it's not a big chore. Whew! Sorry that was so long. :) Julie

Congratulations!!! My DS is on lesson 45 and he's loving it. Can't wait till it's my turn to announce we're done. DS is already reading labels all on his own- we've never mentioned these name brands to him before so it's surprised us every time he reads a new one. It's so cute that he's asking for "Mott's" now instead of saying applesauce. :001_smile: Julie

Oooh! I'd never heard of Touch Math before. That might help her. Looks interesting. I'll have to spend more time on their site. I'm also looking into Life Of Fred for my oldest. I read a review that mentioned you can get through LOF a bit quicker than other programs and it looks very interesting. I'll take a peek at Chalk Dust too. Thanks! Julie

LOL! I didn't even notice that. I guess it's because that's something I'd do myself. :D

See, I'm kinda stuck then. DD likes Singapore a lot more than MUS, in fact, that's why we switched, but she also struggles in math. Her main problem is trying to remember the facts so when she goes to do the work, it takes her a long time to count. DD also likes Math Mammoth. I wonder if we made it a point to work on Singapore math first thing in the morning, do her math drill orally, then let her do Math Mammoth on her own after spelling, LA and handwriting she can start moving through Singapore faster. DH asked that we finish out her Singapore workbooks before we consider switching to Rod & Staff. I think that's a good idea. I'm thinking since I'm not that great with math, R&S might be a good choice for us, however I have to say that I kinda like Singapore. Oh and thanks for letting me know the Singapore extras are not necessary, that's going to save me some money. :D

Yes, thanks for these reminders. Generally, my teen does not like working with me because we tend to have lots of interruptions from the littles and the two of us don't work well together in general most of the time but I think I need to make it a point to sit down with her every day for math. I'm glad some of you have said to do drill with DD#2 orally. I don't know why I didn't think of that. She has a hard time writing so maybe that's part of the reason the drill doesn't seem to be doing much for her since she's having to concentrate so hard on the mechanics of writing. This is great, thanks, Julie

Thank you all so much for all the ideas and suggestions! Wow, if I'd realized what a knowledgeable group this was I would've joined long ago. :) You've all given me a whole lot to think about and lots of good options. Funny how many of you mentioned how strange it is that my oldest is not more concerned about how far behind she is. I'm completely baffled over that one too. I don't know how to make her see how much of a problem this is. She and I have always butted heads so I don't want to be too harsh, yet it seems she just doesn't understand what I've said to her about it so far. I have no idea how to get through to her effectively. I'd never even heard of Lial's Math before. I was really confused trying to find it at first, then once I realized it's a remedial college program it made so much sense. DH had me buy a used teacher's manual for $4 so we can look it over as one of our options. I do have to say that my DD is, ahem, strong-willed so she's going to fight me over switching to something other than MUS if that's the way we decide to go. I'd already been looking at TT because a friend recommended it last summer. I very much appreciate you all agreeing that we need to spend more time on math with her every day. It helps a lot to have reassurance that I'm, in fact, not the world's worst mother for insisting on more time spent working on it. I don't think my oldest has LDs. As far as I can tell, we just fell behind. She also tested way behind grade level in spelling. Last spring I had her complete an online assessment and it said she was spelling at a low 4th grade level. Someone suggested I try Apples spelling program and I can see she's improved a whole lot, so I don't think LDs are a problem for her unless she has one that affects her only in the area of math. She has an incredible memory. About 6 years ago she memorized Psalm 119 for her Sunday School teacher who took her up for a ride in his glider as a reward so this problem memorizing math facts really stumped me. I guess memorizing numbers is a bit different than memorizing words. Now my 10 year old may have LDs. She's an excellent reader but everything else takes her much more effort to learn and do than it did my oldest. I read a description somewhere of a "stealth dyslexic" and it sounded very much like her. Now that a few of you have suggested R&S math, I'm going to take a serious look at it. She likes R&S's Spelling By Sound and Structure quite a bit, so she just may like their math program too. Hopefully a basic math program would be easier for us both. I've also checked into Flashmaster and Horizons math. Again, thank you all so much for the ideas and suggestions. Poor DH has a migraine for Christmas but once he feels better I'll have to go over all this with him. Julie

Oh good thanks for the encouragement with MUS. I just don't know how to make her understand how important it is that she get it in gear and quickly if she's going to finish in time. I hate to say it but she's pretty stubborn. Thanks for the Rainbow resource tip, I didn't realize they carried Singapore I'll have to take a look. You know I was wondering about them being unable to retain math facts. Do you think it's possible they both have a disability in that area? Most of the time I just attribute their problems to having tried so many different math programs but at other times I wonder if it's something more. How would a person go about finding out if it's an actual learning disability? I'm glad you mentioned having them work more on math. My oldest especially seems to think I'm abusing them when I have them work on Saturdays. Actually, DD#2 doesn't seem to mind all that much, it's mostly my teen now that I think about it. Thanks for the encouragement there. Oh no, I didn't. I tend to forget at times that she should actually be in high school since the last couple of years seem to have gotten away from me. I'll do that and see if they have any more suggestions for me. You know I do have the RSM card game set. I'd completely forgotten about it! I'm going to have to break that out and get started. Thanks everyone I really appreciate all this help, sorry if I didn't mention you but so many of you nice ladies responded. :) Hope we can work it all out. Julie

Hi, I'm Julie. I keep bumping into these forums while searching for curriculum help online and it seems there is a large variety of curriculum used here so I thought I'd finally register and ask a question or two. My girls are severely behind in math. They simply can't retain their math facts. I bounced around from one curriculum to another over the years, trying to find what works for them and finally settled on MUS a few years ago. I figured we could catch up if we worked really hard. A few years ago tragedy struck our family and I was simply unable to focus on school at all. We'd do a lesson here or there but that was it. I finally snapped out of it about 6 months ago and was freaking out because I realized my oldest especially is hopelessly behind in math in particular but both girls are very behind. I have both girls doing drill with Quarter Mile Math every day. My oldest loves MUS and refuses to think about switching math programs again. The problem is she just turned 15 and is only half way through Gamma! I keep telling her to do more than one lesson a day and she says 'okay', but soon I get distracted and she's back to doing as little as she possibly can. I think the only solution is to keep going and make her use Times Tales to memorize the facts she can't seem to get. She fusses about it but I'm done messing around. If anyone has any suggestions on how to move her along more quickly I'd love to hear them. My 2nd DD is 10 and slowly working through Singapore Primary Math (U.S.) 1A. She didn't like MUS. I've been having her alternate every other day doing a lesson in Singapore and using Math Windows addition drill but she still has problems memorizing her addition facts and it takes her forever to write out the answers. In a timed fact drill of 3 minutes she'll only get about 1/3 to 1/4 of an addition fact page done. I can see her counting every time I work with her. How long should it take her to start learning her addition facts? I ordered a workbook called Two Plus Two Is Not Five but I haven't seen it yet. I don't know if that will help her or not but I'm hoping. How helpful are the Singapore extras that Sonlight offers? Has anyone here tried them? I asked for cash for Christmas instead of gifts so I can buy whatever curriculum I can afford. I should have enough to buy the Sonlight extras since I already have the Singapore text/work books. Do you think the'll do any good? If not, any suggestions? Oh! I almost forgot, I'm doing a review for Math Mammoth and we received the grade 3 Light Blue series for DD#1 and the Subtraction 1 and Add & Subtract 2A Blue Series books for DD#2. Are these a good compliment to Singapore and/or MUS? I want to get this all figured out. I need to have a better direction to take my next 2 children who are 5 yrs and 14 months. I don't want them to struggle like their older sisters. Sorry I hope that all made sense and TIA for any help you can give. Julie