Juniper
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Posts posted by Juniper
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If you were a convert I'd love to hear why you chose EO over, say, RC. I'd also like to hear more about the theological and metaphysical differences, if anyone can point me in a certain direction? DH and I are considering RC but I want to know as much as possible. :)
This is always a difficult thing for me to answer, in regards to comparing the two. No matter what, when we convert to one over the other we are using our best judgement to apply more or less value to individual differences between the two churches. Once you have a good grasp of their similarities it comes down to evaluating the differences.
In the broadest sense, for me, I chose EO because it struck the right balance for me between exquisite depth of wisdom and stunning simplicity. There were theological paths, within the RC, I just could not make myself follow as a matter of church Dogma (Immaculate Conception of Mary and its relation to Original Sin being one).
When it comes down to it Roman Catholicism was too complicated for me. I don't mean too intellectual, the Orthodox church has some great minds, but too "busy." Sorry, I am lacking in ability to convey my thoughts on this.
I will say this. It would be so much easier for me to convert to RC and I have been very tempted. There is a great RC church within walking distance of my house (which is saying a lot since I live rather remote) where we could make friends and have an immediate community. The nearest Orthodox church is 1hr away and very small.
Truth is I can't do it. Really it is no longer a matter of theology. I have seen Saints in all Christian paths. It is that the Divine Liturgy is medicine for my soul. The church year continues to bring me into layers of healing, peace, and love. For me there is no other way.
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It's possible that I'm misunderstanding what you're asking here, but I just wanted to say that an EO priest does do both what is required by local law, and what is required by the church. He does sign and submit paperwork as the officiant so that the wedding is legally recognized. This question was asked recently on an Orthodox podcast that I listen to. A caller, who was divorced, wanted to know if she got remarried whether she could just get the sacramental part of the marriage and skip the legalities. The priest answering the question said no, priests do have to follow local laws.
It was my understanding that the couple often goes and has the civil portion done on their own at a court house or in some cases when one member is not EO they have a second ceremony at a Protestant church (somewhat frowned upon from the EO side). In both cases, I think the EO priest would not be performing the civil portion. I am sure it is on a Priest by Priest basis, but I could be wrong. :)
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And if you choose to question, many will simply cast you into the lot of people that never really "got it" "believed it" "were saved" in the first place.
Not speaking about anyone in this thread, but I've seen that mindset more than once in real life. I appreciate that some have sat on the questioning fence and fell back into Christianity with their faith and a sense of peace. Those of us that fall off the fence in different directions still find validity in our beliefs, still held christian beliefs and practices before, those can't just be negated after our search.
I guess what I'm saying in my coffee still kickin' in moment, is that many of us have turned to God, prayed, sought, done and heard or not heard a different reply. I'm still on the fence trying to observe and enjoy all of what I see as God's creation. I just have a different perspective than I did, that doesn't mean I was never a christian in the first place.
...and it does not mean your present position is fixed. ;) Heck, I have climbed myself on and off it more times than I can count in the last 7 years! :D
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In the timeline, I don't see any reference to the Eastern Rite churches under the Roman Catholic church (e.g., Ukrainian Catholic). These fall under Roman Catholic in that they recognize the Pope as the head of the church, but there are some huge differences between RC and eastern rite churches - for example priests can be married.
I believe they fall under the umbrella of The Roman Catholic Church. A couple weeks ago I was engaged in a lengthy discussion about the differences between EO and Eastern Rite as far as theology goes. Many believe they are identical except for the Pope issue, in fact some will insist so. They can be very similar depending on location and Priest, but theologically they are different. It is more than the Pope that divides us. Mary's Immaculate conception, Original Sin, Purgatory and indulgences are actually bigger issues for me personally.
I do appreciate that the new Pope has strongly encourage the Eastern Rite churches to be EASTERN. To be distinct from the Western church in practice, but I am not sure that he was intending that to extend to theology.
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Interesting. There's an Armenian Coptic and Eastern Orthodox church near us. I have wondered about the differences. One is certainly smaller, but I assumed that as due to congregation size.
What are EO masses like? (I do not know if they are services or masses to be honest) Do they differ, if you know, from a Roman Catholic mass?
And bonus question for those outside the US- I have a strange fascination with the "My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding" shows, but mostly for the ones from the UK. Oftentimes, when the Gypsies marry, it is at church, which I assume is RC (due to vestments or altars or alter boys, etc.) If a church were available, could the Gypsies/ Travellers hold their ceremonies for baptism, communions, confirmations, or weddings at an EO church or would they have to have been members first?
*Not an expert* :)
I only followed the show a little bit a couple years ago, but I am pretty certain that the gypsy's in the episodes I saw are Catholic, hence the use of those churches.
My Priest is Romanian and I am aware of quite a large gypsy population there. Again, if they are Orthodox they would be welcome to participate in the sacraments of a church (Baptism, Marriage, communion being some of those). Orthodoxy does not have a wedding ceremony that is comparable to the more familiar and traditional ceremony of the West. We have a Crowning (yes, complete with crowns for bride and groom). There are prayers for the new family/kingdom that is being established with the marriage, but we do not have vows. The EO also does not perform the civil portion of the wedding.
Clear as mud? ;)
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I don't know. It is pretty safe for Farris to speak out now. I think he knew what kind of man DP was. Otherwise why was he making such an effort to distance himself? Why didn't he speak out sooner? Has he issued any statements against patriarchy before now? He has a lot of respect among many conservative religious homeschoolers. If he actually has any moral courage why wasn't he talking about his problems with patriarchy before now?
As I was reading the article posted originally I saw Farris picture and realized he was the lawyer I spoke to shortly after my assault. It was at a homeschool conference and he seemed very taken aback that a lone woman came up to discuss legal issues with him (not related to the assault, related to homeschooling) he even alluded to looking forward to speaking with my husband further. It was weird and made me feel very sad.
Honestly, I am mixed up about HSLDA's take on this. It sounds good. All the right words, but I just dont know. Anyone know if he has daughters? Have they been encouraged to go to college?
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The "threatening" message from Beall seems a bit less than complicit, and not very threatening (though certainly upsetting). I'm very willing to believe it was sent by a wife who believed (at the time) that these were false allegations, or mere innuendo.
Who among us would instantly believe innuendo like that against our own spouse? I, as a first reaction, would be more likely to consider the rumours false, and I would hope the "girl" would help deny them and/or stop contributing to trouble of a scale she might not understand. If the email was sent from that perspective, it not only makes more sense, but is a significantly less nefarious thing for Beall to have done.
You might be surprised. I know in my case the threatening phone calls and ravings were very scary.
I do not know Beall personally, but I know quite a few escapees from the movement and they are very serious when they say she is, "Mean as a snake." I will give her that it is a bad coping mechanism, but I am sure Lourdes was under extreme duress.
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I really hope she wins her case. More precedent in this area would be very helpful. I know I often came up against incredulity from certain mindsets when I explained that there are certain situations (Pastors, Counselors, Doctors, Military especially when combined with damnation, community rejection, and possible fiscal consequences) when an adult cannot consent.
Those were often the hardest conversations. She is doing a brave thing and I genuinely hope and pray she has a very strong support system. It sounds like she does.
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Thanks ladies. PJ, that is what I am trying to do....my homework and then we will discuss things. :)
I don't know what I would do if we had major food allergies too!
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Recently my dr has asked me to restrict carbs for awhile to see if they are a contributing factor to some of my ailments.
How do I approach this within Orthodoxy. I am struggling with how to proceed, whom to listen to and finding a way to stay healthy.
Thoughts? -
Thanks for sharing this. I remember being 8 and begging my Mom to let us have a religion. I had this desperation and fear about dying, purpose and structure. I look forward to reading the book.
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Rosemary in CO used to be a regular poster here. She has a fiber arts blog called Rosemary Knits, which has a bunch of handspinning info as well. The last post in her blog, which was quite a while ago, had an interesting rolag technique that may be up your alley.
Very interesting!
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An 'E' would trigger a parent-teacher conference here, initiated by the teacher. You do need to clarify with the teacher what exactly is expected. Then come up come with an action plan you and the teacher can agree upon.
I wish it had. :(
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We got a bit more info from their teacher yesterday. Just for background both twins have qualified for Title 1 reading every time they have attended ps. In their previous school I did push for learning disability assessment, because of my concerns regarding dyslexia but nothing was found....other than the fact that they both have ADHD, which we already knew.
I have also done some remedial programs geared towards dyslexics here at home. I cannot remember their exact reading level from the last parent teacher conference (this school uses a different method the one I was more familiar with), but they were both on the low end of the scale for their grade. Presently, one of the twins has once again qualified for Title 1, but the other one (the one that actually struggles a bit more) did not qualify. I guess they tested him on a good day.
I would say this is not a phonics issue, but more a comprehension and vocabulary issue. The boys also have a weird quirk that I am having a rough time helping them work through. They are what I would consider very "justice" oriented. What I mean is that if they do not hear, comprehend or are in some direct fashion are made completely aware of their teachers expectations regarding every. specific. assignment., they simply won't do or will barely make an effort to do the assignment. Then when they get a bad grade they are genuinely baffled and frustrated, because they insist "she didn't SAY to do that." This in turn feeds their insecurities and they are scared to try and complete future assignments.
Their teacher is saying that the grade is due to assignments not being turned in or being turned in poorly. They have also had the opportunity to redo assignments and have not done that. When asked why they did not redo the assignment they were both completely clueless and didn't understand that because she said it was something they "could do, but did not have to" that they should take the time to do it. They are not lazy in anyway, but they don't understand why if it was something they should have done she didn't just say so. It is difficult to describe this without making them sound lazy or entitled, but that isn't their issue. They don't infer well and they almost feel tricked when these things happen.
I did take one of them to the Ped today to discuss a better option for adhd meds and he gave me some good ideas, but mainly he just had a gentle but firm talk with my son about the fact that reading is not optional.
They do have basically straight A's in everything else accept one has a C in Writing.
You know, as I think about it, the inference thing is really a big deal. I am thinking this is one of the things affecting their vocabulary and comprehension. They struggle with inferring meaning or even identifying roots. They struggle with understanding written instructions on worksheets. They can read the instructions, but they do not how to take what they read, look at the paper they are working on and turn what they read into action. Make sense? -
My husband found one of ours twins progress reports in the "to be burned" paper box for our woodstove this morning. It wasn't pretty. This in turn caused us to ask the other twin where his report is. Supposedly, it is lost somewhere. Suffice it to say, both twins have an "E" (F). Their grade is also slipping in Writing "C-".
They already sit for an 1hr in the evening for free reading, are not allowed access to the x-box until the weekend and are regularly taken to the library where they do actually check out age appropriate books.
Right on my son's progress report his teacher wrote that he would need to do extra credit and needed to ask her for help when he doesn't understand something. But, when I told him he needed to ask for help and extra credit he said she would not give it. I asked if he had read what she wrote and he said he had. I kinda lost it at that point and brought to his attention that she wrote right on it to ask her about both. ;(
They have already been held back once. So, what would you recommend I use with them in the evenings to help bring up their comprehension and fluency? They are 5th graders. -
I am working on some Malabrigo Nube right now. It feels a bit felted, and doesn't want to draft easily, but it is turning out to be a beautiful yarn!
I second the Ravelry recommendation. Check out the "What a Kool Way to Dye" group. (All about drink mix dyes.)
I love Malabrigo Nube! I use it a lot in my wet felt flowers. i wish I could figure out how to create those colorways. They are stunning!
Right now I have dyed up some alpaca and angora in greens and pinks and am going to try spinning from a cloud. I need to make a newborn hat for a relative and am just in the mood for something Spring and Light! :)
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I know this is a crafty group and was wondering if there were any other handspinners on here? I am looking for an online resource for different techniques and recipes for dyeing and blending different fibers together.
Right now I have the itch to spin up something super soft and fairy like, but am struggling with the specific approach I want to take.
What are you working on?
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I actually find it very interesting that the school has stepped up and volunteer to waive her tuition for this semester and a student body group has offered to raise her tuition for the semester. I think there is quite a bit more going on here. The only ruling the judge gave was in regards to this being an emergency situation. At this point it is not. The girl is safe, her tuition is covered. It will be interesting to see what the actually ruling will be in April.
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The other children in the home seem to support the parents rather than the sister. That speaks volumes to me (and it is more than one additional child).
This holds absolutely no weight for me. If those children are minors they are dependent on these parents. It is also possible that this child has been demonized or made into the family scapegoat and they are parroting what they have been raised to believe about her.
Again, I really have no idea what the truth is. I do know that what we are privy to is very much the "tip of the iceberg" and there are most likely a lot more layers to this situation.
This girl could very well be an entitled brat. It is also possible in my mind that there is alternate explanations. Last week I was actually discussing my own childhood with my therapist. How I hated having to run away, but I didn't know how to keep myself safe from my mother (she wasn't physically abusive with me, but she was mentally and emotionally). I could go no where to escape her rages. Eventually, I ran from the home, many times. My parents told everyone almost verbatim what these parents have. How they missed me, were saddened, how they had been paying for my therapy (not mentioning that would stop every time a therapist said something they didn't like), how I just didn't want to follow the rules and various other things. There wasn't anything I could do that would not reinforce the public image they had painted of me. It is one of the worst feelings of powerlessness. The therapist looked at me and said, "What were you going to do? Go down the street and pay for a room at the Holiday Inn?"
In later years, my Mom would progress to physically beating my little sister when she hit adolescence. I did not know about this until I she was an adult. Even now, in the last couple weeks when I have finally cut contact with my mother, my little sister is running to her side and I am once again the family scapegoat. So, it does not surprise me in the least that other children in the house are siding with the parents.
I think my only point in all of this isn't that this girl is a victim (I truly do not know) or that her parents are somehow monsters (they very well may not be), but that these things are often deeper, messier, and a lot more complicated than what is portrayed to the public.
I do hope that the older teens that have had to endure similar situations as mine eventually develop some sort of legal protections. I also hope she gets NOTHING if she is just being a brat.
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The "champion willing to advocate and fight for her" is demanding that she receive a $650 per week allowance (among other things,) and has apparently done enough to discourage her relationship with her parents that even the judge took the time to comment on it.
I'm sorry, but taking a kid in because she's living in a bad environment is one thing, but helping her sue her parents for a ridiculous amount of money is something else entirely different.
That's not a champion; that's an opportunist who is filling that girl's head with some serious delusions of entitlement.
Hmmmm... not sure if I completely agree. I do agree that the amount is high, but I think in legal proceedings it is often to shoot high and settle at more appropriate sum. Again, I would love to know more about the background this girl is coming from. There is obviously some deep wounds she carries.
Until I know more about why she is bulimic and other various unhealthy coping skills she seems to have developed, I refuse to pass judgement. I just don't feel like there is enough information out there about this. A part of me would like to see some precedent established for holding parents accountable to emotional and mental abuse (if that is occurring), unfortunately these things are very difficult to ascertain in typical child service evaluations.
Again, I have know idea if her parents are monsters, if she is or if the family helping her is. I just a bit surprised that t others find the situation so cut and dry.
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I will be very curious to see how this plays out int he long term. She could be a spoiled brat, influenced and bolstered by some strange family dynamics. OTOH, there could be a lot more going on behind the scenes. One of the things I do not understand is why people think she needs to come across as a mature adult? If her home life has been less than stellar (speculating here, but there are signs) how would she have gained that maturity?
One of the times I ran away from home the parents of my friend tried to stick up for me. They were offering me a place to stay and home that was not emotionally abusive behind closed doors. In true narcissistic fashion my Mother threatened the crap out of them (they were not lawyers, just a good family that saw her for what she was) and I had to go home.
Again, this may not be what is going on here, but if it is and this girl has found a champion willing to advocate and fight for her, I am very glad. I do hope that the truth comes out. I do not support entitlement, but I also do not expect her to have a perfect story in place. She is still an emotional vulnerable and immature teen. Her brain is not even fully developed. She is going to waffle, change her story (more like bring up details she doesn't want to or is afraid to).
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I have lived in both. I prefer Houston to DFW. If you are used to varied scenery you are going to want Houston. DFW was flat and brown, except for about 2 weeks in the spring. Houston has forests. beaches, bayous, rolling hills. After living in DFW I can't tell you how much I missed TREES! and the pines of east texas are beautiful.
If it were not for the heat I would gladly move back. One of my favorite areas is Tomball. -
I don't know how to quite from my phone. :(
I get what you are saying completely. In my own life I have no issues speaking directly with a teacher, but I thought the parent just walked into a room =not a volunteer, and I thought it was posted that the Matt 18 model was some sort of posted policy with HG. That is where I have to draw the line for my own family.
Again, not saying anything in the opposite extreme where people should just talk willy billy behind backs and jump ranks, but having a written policy of Matt 18 confrontation model is a major no no in my book. I was really surprised to learn HG has it and hope there is some misunderstanding. :(
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I have read the whole thread an really have nothing to add (bolt said everything I would have).
I will say the one take away I have received is that HG would never work for our family. Any organization that places customers (parents and children) in the position of having to confront a superior (official volunteer) when there is an offense is inherently unhealthy IMHO.
Would I be comfortable, yes, but I am always stunned when Matthew 18 is used in this way.
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I like this article about the Lenten period of fasting from a historical perspective. The footnotes are a great resource.
http://saintsilouan.org/calendar/lent/lent-history/
Yes, we fast Wed and Fri as well as three major fasts and a few other special days. Here is a good overview. http://orthodoxwiki.org/Fasting