I ran out of likes last week on another post and I was devastated. This time, I'm saving my likes for someone special.

Men like that usually do but then blame the women there for why they were undressing them with their eyes the entire time in front of their wife. I just get that impression off his writing. He writes like someone who has a wandering eye and is constantly finding himself attracted and 'tempted' and then tells his wife that it is the women's fault and he is incapable of looking away.

In the UK. I can see how it sounds strange but more conservative Muslims (including my own family) generally segregate genders and avoid mixing with the opposite gender outside what is necessary (like work or school). So, for her, she would not go to a mixed gender gym and instead only went to a women's one (especially since she was a hijabi and could take off her stuff there) and she felt he should do the same not only so he wouldn't have to worry about his responsibility to lower his gaze but because she didn't feel it was appropriate for him to be working out in gym clothes around women when he's supposed to keep himself covered up too :p. Personally, my husband goes to a regular gym but he times it for times when it is deserted.

It actually made me think of a friend who was so upset at the idea of her husband going to a mixed-gender gym that she vowed she was going to go with him every time and just stand there. When she got there, she realized all the men were busy and concentrated on their workouts, not even looking at the women, and the women were also sweaty, exhausted, hair coming out of their ponytails...etc and certainly not flirting or trying to attract men there. After that, she told him she was fine with it and let him go on his own.

For sure, especially when practiced as written. Of course, we too have plenty of men who shoot off their mouth while forgetting their own eyes are supposed to be glued to the floor or who criticize a woman for not wearing proper hijab while they're shaving their beards and walking around in shorts or skin-tight jeans dragging underneath their feat and mopping the floor lol. I actually found it funny while reading the comments because someone admonished her that it is pathetic to be like Islam, putting all the responsibility on the men, and then made a comment about a burka. I did have to chuckle at that given the conversation here. ^This. And if it was too subtle in the article, she comments on it in the comments section: Commenter: And let’s not forget the “thank you†for not being a distraction to the married men, who want to be focused on how to grow in The Lord to better lead their family, but too often must guard their eyes at the very place we come to exalt God; and for not distracted the Godly single men who are often led astray by a pretty face with a vain heart. Good article! {Shahrazad inserts gagging noises as she thinks about older, married men needing teenage girls to dress modestly so they can focus on their Lord instead of ogling them} Phylicia Delta: Kristin, very true! My friend Courtney (she commented above) recently wrote a great post about that topic. Commenter: Sadly, I was once a young girl that cared more about the attention I got in church and out of church with how I dressed- cleavage, tight clothes, accompanied with tattoos, body-peircings, and all. I know the mindset very well when I see so much immodesty in church. Thankful God used a God-fearing man to see more in me and set me straight, lol. I’ve been a preacher’s/pastor’s wife for 11 years now. I take every opportunity to reach teenage girl’s hearts, bring out the truth in their intents, and teach them the sad consequences of this attitude with my own testimony. Modesty is definitely a heart issue! Thanks again. Phylicia Delta: Kristin, sounds like you have a great platform to speak to their hearts! Modesty is a heart issue. Immodesty is usually out of insecurity, pride, or desperate need for affirmation, as I am sure you know. As we address the hearts of these girls and show them God’s love, eventually they grasp that God values their beauty and will give up the temporary attention of men for the lasting value of God’s approval and the love of one man who doesn’t need extra skin shown to attract his attention. Thanks for all you do!

When I was maybe 10, I remember getting ready to go to a church thing with my aunt and cousins while I visited them for the summer. I remember my cousin and I were trying to put on a little light pink lipstick and sneak by because we were feeling rebellious. My aunt saw us and flipped, she was so upset that we had wanted to wear it there, and she said that when a woman wears lipstick 'it makes men look at your lips and makes them think of sex' and asked us if that is what we wanted. Hearing that as a 10 year old, it was so jarring and I was so deeply disturbed by the idea, I seriously couldn't bring myself to wear lipstick for years lol.

I don't see it as offensive to those who have a standard of modesty. Jinnah does, she was posting actively here. I do, as I said, I literally wear full on abaya, headscarf, and face veil. But just having personal standards of modesty for your own dress (in my case, because I believe God said so, not because I think men need to be saved from themselves) is not really what is being discussed here.

After reading a little more of her blog, I do feel kind of bad now. I read a couple of the newer posts (for those interested: 'Guarding Hearts, Kissing Frogs, and Other Dating Mistakes We're Making' as well as the article 'Does God Forgive Sexual Sin?') and it honestly made me really sad for her and of the impression I now have of her thought process. And because, unlike her, the more I read, the douchier he seems, I will go ahead and post a few more choice comments from Mr. M (after reading the above mentioned 2 posts in which she speaks about how unspeakably guilt-ridden she was and how she wept over kissing a man she was dating and had to cut out fiction, movies, changed the music she was listening to, and fasted in order to get rid of her desires): “Although I was raised in a Christian home, as soon as I was old enough to pursue relationships with girls, I broke loose. The result of this was that many girls were dishonored by me, and eventually I lost my virginity. When I first entered a relationship with my wife, Phylicia, I couldn’t tell her that I had remained abstinent for her. Losing my virginity before marriage made me realize the pain of extramarital sex, which did help me refrain from repeating this sin in my relationship with Phylicia. If I had a do-over, I would have refrained from it the first time and avoided that guilt altogether. I wish that I could have told my wife that she was my ‘First’. But the reason I was able to have a wonderful, guilt-free, wedding night with my wife is because I knew that it was our first time with one another. I know that I have been redeemed by God’s grace, which I sought daily during our dating relationship. It was, and still is, only by God’s grace that my wife and I are able to be free of our guilt and shame of the past. It is His redeeming grace that makes our love pure.†From the post here: phylicia delta . com /does-god-forgive-sexual-sin/ Also, Mr. M's response here: Phylicia: Last week I received an email from a young man asking, “How can I help my girlfriend uphold purity?†I passed the question along to my husband, Mr. M, and I think his advice is worth sharing. When we were dating, we often struggled to uphold the standards of behavior we knew were necessary in order for us to have a peaceful, God-honoring relationship. Today, my husband will talk about how men can help their girlfriends in this battle against lust. His answer: phylicia delta . com/ men-resist-temptation-dating/ (without spaces) What many people fail to realize is that when people are exposed to something a long time, they tend to become desensitized. There are many men here who could see several women walking around in tank tops and short shorts and not even notice, certainly not have big cartoon wolf eyes bulging out of their heads. It is not an uncommon sight by any means, especially in the warmer climates and people are used to it. When you look at a country like Egypt, as that was your example, some men there are also desensitized but in a slightly different way. Because so many women wear a headscarf and cover and because it is so common and theyŕe used to seeing a lot of women around them doing it, they don't see the hijab as something that right away forces them to be respectful or necessarily as a reminded to keep themselves in line. To those men, it is just something that women wear and thus, they'd be more likely to objectify a woman wearing it than for example a man here would. While I've had a handful of experiences, I can certainly say I've never been asked out while wearing a headscarf (though I do have one friend who was) and most men do not flirt with me or act interested. I imagine this is either because I am dealing with extraordinarily polite men with good senses of boundaries, I'm an 'uggo' lol, or because, since it is unusual, being a visibly Muslim woman who covers gives them the idea that I am off-limits romantically (which I am ;) ). Not sure if I'm making sense but hopefully you get what I'm trying to say. I wouldn't say people respect me because I'm wearing it but I would say that what strikes people as normal and how they react to it differs around the world. Last question, back to the blog and the 'type' thing. It seems he wasn't her ideal type she had in mind beforehand (not only physically but in terms of interests and commonalities) but she finds him very handsome and adores him now. His comments are more like 'I settled with regard to your looks because you're a good Christian even if I don't think you're physically attractive'. However, is there some unwritten rule that people of those types who are also Christian don't exist? I mean, you can't find a Christian person of the opposite gender who fits what you find physically attractive, is religious, and also shares a few interests?

Not to mention that little skin around the eyes that shows, the fairness there against the blackness of the veil...jezebel! Honestly, though, I always have a hard time excusing things on the age basis. I'm the same age as her (born in the same year) so it is difficult of me to give her a pass on that.

I don't understand how you can have K-Pop without IU, personally :p.

I think she had to close the yoga pants article's comments because she got a strong negative reaction directed at her husband. However, when you look at the comments he made that she chose to post: “Yoga pants make it difficult to work out when the girls are right there and the pants are so tight, it’s basically like the woman is naked. A friend of mine even said when a girl wears yoga pants… it shows all the form and features while covering up flaws, like imperfections of the skin or cellulite. They are designed to be appealing.†- Mr. M “The more you cover up the more [a Christian man] will want you. Men like mystery, and when you reveal that mystery walking down the street, there is no reason for them to pursue you. They’ve already gotten their reward.†– Mr. M As we walked into the estate store Mr. M glanced at my outfit. The pants I had found in my harried search were work out capris – otherwise known as yoga pants. “You know…†He said. “You are dressed a lot like those girls you always comment on at the gym.†We had talked about this before. Mr. M has requested, not commanded, that I refrain from wearing the pants to the gym, and really not in public at all. But I’d ignored the request, and here I was walking down the sidewalk in them. “I was kind of surprised you wore them.†He said sadly. I picked at the tag on a buffet table, glancing at myself in a mirror in the corner. It was just one request he had made – a request based on what he knew of his own male mind and the minds of the men around him. But I wanted MY way, so I ignored it. From her own words: I want to trust Mr. M around you. I want you to trust your husbands around me. Additionally, a young man in a men’s group Mr. M once attended upheld this view. He told the men it was tough for him to try to work out, where there are girls wearing yoga pants doing stretches right beside him. It was a struggle not to lust after them. He would have to make himself leave the vicinity to do his workout with the still-present threat of remembering their image and stumbling later on. Yet another friend told Mr. M that it pained and concerned him that his girlfriend would go to the gym in her yoga pants to work with her personal trainer, but he didn’t feel he could ask her to stop without being perceived as controlling. Also, in her own words: But there are consequences. The issue here is not that I wore yoga pants. The issue isn’t yoga pants at all, but the principle of the matter. The pants are skin tight. You can see every curve of my lower body. Not only is it attractive to Mr. M, but from several informal interviews, comments, and input from other men, it’s a recurring blind spot with Christian women everywhere. It’s about how hot I look, or how I want to dress, regardless of what anybody thinks. Now, reading that article AS a woman who covers her head and whole body and usually face as well, this gives me a viscerally negative reaction. And I just cannot fathom my own husband, who again literally spent the first chunk of his life in Saudi Arabia of all places, saying such things (or thinking them).

Haha, thank you! That is a big compliment. I obviously watch with subtitles and read a lot of DramaBeans so I just have spelling memorized from that.

Hey, in that poster's defense and in the words of both my former teacher and the principal of the Catholic school I attended in middle school, "you have to admit, most Muslims ARE terrorists." :001_rolleyes:

The yoga pants post is just...crazypants. After reading this, I need to step back far away from the site. I'll check back in 3-4 years maybe and see how she's faring and thinking then ;). http://phyliciadelta.com/that-day-i-wore-yoga-pants-5-myths-about-modesty/

Oops, I gave myself away! Yes, I'm very young. I got married as a teenager (16, almost 17) and had my first when I was 18 :).

This is true. Anything can be attractive to someone. Different strokes for different folks and all that. When I was a teenager, someone took some of my pictures that were on a social network and added them to a flickr collection for veil fetishists. There were guys who took a picture wearing full face covering and then added Muslim women and asked them for pictures of themselves (covered) because they got off on that. Very gross. But even on the nicer end of spectrum, a few men have stopped me and asked me about it and said they thought it was so attractive and loved the idea and wished their girlfriend/significant other would dress like I do so it really isn't as black and white as tank top and yoga pants = turns god-fearing men into howling dogs and modest clothes = respect and men won't find you attractive. Yes, definitely, you're right. And sadly, it is often the women who are harshest to other women in these areas.

I'd like to let her know that I literally wear a burqa and it still doesn't exempt you from disrespect. Seriously, some people really are perverts. Even when I went to school and didn't cover my face but wore a headscarf and an abaya (long, loose dress), I heard someone discussing my appearance (in the context of being 'attractive) as he and another guy walked behind me. Teaching men to respect women regardless of what they're wearing would be far more productive.

Make sure you keep writing out 'Islamic Terrorist' lest we forget.

I agree but I think there have been some tougher heroines these days. Shin Min-Ah (My Girlfriend is a Gumiho and Arang), Lee Min-Jung (Cunning Single Lady), Han Groo (Marriage Not Dating), Park Min-Young (City Hunter and Sungkyunwan Scandal), Kim Sun-Ah, Yang Jin-Sung (kind of in Bride of the Century), Eunji in Answer Me, and Choi Kang-hee (Protect the Boss), Moon Chae-Won (Innocent Man), Jung Ryeo-Won (History of a Salary Man), and definitely Lee Yeon-Hee in Miss Korea did good jobs at depicting pretty strong female characters.

http://phyliciadelta.com/five-countercultural-ways-women-can-guarantee-respect/

Made even more comical by the fact that she's an 8 and he's a 6 (at best). Delusional much? Maybe she isn't tall enough or thin enough.

Was she able to hear the sermon over her own self-righteousness and judgment? Sorry, that was mean. She could be a perfectly nice lady who just failed at expressing herself.

I agree with umsami that I don't think something will happen and sincerely hope it doesn't. I DO have kind of a rule that I stay inside and don't go out on that day though for my own safety (and that of my children), tensions tend to run really high (higher than normal) specifically on that date in my experience. I think if the Arab league DID put together an army to fight that group (sorry, won't use the term Islam in their name because they don't deserve that), they may find a good amount of interest, especially since many of the big scholars of Saudi have said it is permissible and you will be rewarded if you go to fight them and force them out.

I was a parenting expert before having kids too. It isn't till you have kids that you realize you don't know what the heck you're doing.

Uggos shouldn't come to church, duh. Really, she's been married for like 6 months?! Clearly, she's got marriage all figured out. I remember how much I knew about marriage 6 months in during the honeymoon stage.