This is so good on so many levels. You sound like a great mom!! :) I hope you have a fabulous year together! Even when my kids can work more independently, I have found that they will share their journey with as much detail as time allows. IOW, they don't want to work independently; they crave collaboration. Peace, Janice

Good Morning, Seeking, Yes. I believe this is a definition issue. And I believe that misunderstanding of this definition derails a bunch of folks who have been hsing K-8 and are hoping for a 9th grader who can handle that transition-to-college-year level of oversight (I call it the periodic oversight model - Mom's not providing the oversight; someone else is). As I said, my dd was there by 12th grade; she sailed through this last year. This model would have been a disaster when she was in 9th grade. But I do not consider it independent learning. Her last year of honors dual-enrollment resulted in grades that will be with her for the rest of her life. She was ready for the responsibility. She was ready for the educational model: periodic oversight. I believe we agree: it is best for kids to spend their 12th grade year succeeding with the periodic oversight model. It helps them transition to college. Next year she will be away. She will not be living in our home, so I can not even see her sitting at the dining room table. She will have to work when no one is looking. (I didn't check her work, but I could see her and say, "How's it going? Are you on track? Good. Work hard; it's worth it.") When I re-read the OP, I see a mom who believed that the no-oversight model would work because the child was in 9th grade. No written work produced? Reading only? I see a mom who got sucked into some idea that homeschooled 9th graders sit at the dining room table and write essays just because you tell them to do it. You lay out the coursework, and they complete it. They might fall behind for a day of two, but they will work hard to catch up because they are homeschooled and they have been taught to love learning and value education. When Mom is busy, they get it. They work even harder, so she won't worry. The quality of their work goes up when Mom's stress level goes up. They get it. They love Mom, and they are team players. The less she checks, the harder they work. The less she checks, the more independent the children become. In my experience, Mom's ability to provide oversight has nothing to do with the child's ability to work without oversight. And that can damage relationships. High school is challenging on many levels. I have seen so many Moms rely on independent learning to help them manage the schedule. That's something that depends on the child, not the demands on the Mom's time. Let me say it this way. It's like needing a new roof. If I have a hole in my roof, it does no good to consult my checkbook to decide if I am going to buy a new roof. We need a roof, or we lose the house. The balance in the checkbook actually has no bearing on the demands of the system. Just because Mom is busy, (Overwhelmed to be honest. And the OP needs to know that this is quite common.) doesn't mean that a 9th grader is ready to learn independently. Even the periodic oversight model doesn't usually work with 9th graders. I spoke up here, because I want the OP to know that she fell into a common ditch. It's a matter of definition of terms. 9th graders need oversight. Either daily or weekly at a minimum; weekly is for children who have already been trained. She will have a better year this year if she abandons this idea of homeschooled high schoolers who sit in their room cranking out work that no one scrutinizes. I believe THAT is a marketing tool used by companies to sell curriculum. I haven't seen it work in real life; in my book, it's a myth. Peace, Janice in·de·pend·ent Adjective Free from outside control; not depending on another's authority myth a : a popular belief or tradition that has grown up around something or someone; especially : one embodying the ideals and institutions of a society or segment of society b : an unfounded or false notion

Good morning, I see plenty if oversight in this example. Yes, a motivated learner to be sure. But he is still receiving input. This example speaks to my point. He seems to want even more adult interaction. (Math begs for it- another reason why it makes me sad to hear homeschoolers talk about their children doing math independently. When he explained to you why a question was right on the test, he was demonstrating his need for collaboration. It sounds like you did an awesome job providing it. This kind of back and forth over the subject matter with an adult who is keeping the student engaged IS oversight in my mind.) I just graduated my dd who worked well at this level of oversight for her senior year. Primarily honors dual enrollment. But I see that as a heavy oversight year. I see AP tests as heavy oversight of learning. Instead of meeting Mom's expectations, someone else is watching. Granted the child is monitored less than once a week, but the monitoring is iron clad. I plan for my last child to be functioning at this level of oversight before heading to college as well. My experience has told me that colleges love the kids who can handle the periodic oversight model. It's the kids on either side of that line- the ones who need daily monitoring or are used to no/flexible monitoring who have a tough transition. I posted to offer hope to the OP. I have seen so many families disappointed to discover that their 9th graders can't handle no oversight. It can take families months or an entire year to recover from the academic harm. The harm to their relationship and the Mom's confidence? That's tough. I truly believe that it's a notion promoted by folks selling homeschool curriculum. I have not met anyone in real life for whom it has been successful. And I am sorry about the duplicate posts. I was typing on my phone with a terrible Internet connection. When I realized what had happened, I tried to delete the mess. I'm sorry. Peace, Janice

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I understand your thought process. And I wish you well. I have no evidence that the no oversight method works well. I hope you will. I truly do. This has been discussed many times over the years. Folks always come out of the woodwork to tell about how this is working well and they are planning to have a successful end of the project test score to confirm. Hopefully folks with that score will chime in and share details. That will help folks choose that path with confidence. Personally? I'm not interested. I have seen the oversight model work well. I have no interest in other methods. I realize I am in the minority in my disbelief. The no oversight method is popular. I am a proclaimed disbeliever. We can disagree. I'm not saying that your system wont work. I'm just proclaiming that I have no evidence. Peace, Janice

This oversight question is an issue. I don't know where this perception of homeschoolers as independent workers came from, but it has not aligned with my experience. People who hand their child a math book with an answer key in the fall and collect them in the spring and experience a successful outcome? I have never met one in real life. I read about them; I have never met one. (Sorry. I know you guys claim to be out there. I won't believe it till I see it.) None of my three kids worked completely independently on their own in any subject ever. There was always periodic oversight. Sheesh- even their college profs checked up on them more than once a semester. My kids need goals. They like feedback. It motivates. Even completely independent adult researchers attempt to be published. We all want someone to validate our hard work. Do you watch your son while he takes his math tests? Are the tests and answer keys locked up or does he have access to them? My friends who have been homeschooling successfully for years have locking file cabinets. Only mom has the key. The inexperienced homeschoolers haven't bought their cabinets yet. They are always surprised to discover that these things exist in the old timers homes. I have no clue why this is not more widely discussed. Makes no sense to me. Ever heard of Wolfram Alpha? Math moms beware!! Why do you think colleges place so much emphasis on test scores for homeschoolers? They get it. I only expect what I inspect. Period. No confusion here about that. My last ds is going into 11th grade. Some subjects are daily subjects; some are weekly. I can't think of any subject off the top of my head that will be checked less frequently than once per week. His dual enrollment classes meet twice a week with regular papers and in-class exams. Class participation counts. As he makes this transition to college, I will be spot checking to make sure he is developing good habits: he must prep for class and pass through ME before he goes to class. He will prep for class. I suspect your ds has been doing more than changing grades on a web page. I would suggest that you administer a proctered math test to find out where to insert him. If you were not checking his work in 8th grade, I would suspect that this trend runs deeper than you think. Then plan a fall schedule with daily class time (with you or another adult) followed by an independent homework assignment that is checked the next day. Put him in a place where you can see that he is working/reading. My kids have all taken a turn reading aloud standing in the middle of the dining room so I could continue to go about the house doings chores while still providing oversight. (Reading silently at the table is a privilege, not a right. I don't bat an eyelash about taking it away.) Sorry if this seems harsh. Homeschooled kids need an environment that breeds success- not an environment that expects success based on anecdotal info. Sorry, I don't believe that the no oversight model works. Ever. Don't care what people say; I don't believe it. I think that only works in an advertisement. Folks selling homeschool curriculum talk about independence in order to sell products. In reality I have never met someone who purchased weight loss. I have met folks who lost weight. They didn't buy it; they worked for it. And I'm sorry if this doesn't align with how you thought you would be spending your time with an older student. As they develop good study skills, they need an adult less and less. None of my kids have arrived at the point where they need no one ever. I realize that folks have suggested that your son is advanced. Based on what you have indicated, I suspect he is behind and drowning. He probably doesn't even know that this can be fixed. Stop looking back. Give him a chance to move forward. Give him what he needs: a teacher. Rescue him. I care. Really, I do. (Hugs!) I've seen this more times than I care to discuss. Most of us bust this completely independent leaner myth before high school. Oh well. Better late than never. If you're hsing five kids, you will benefit in the long run by embracing this ASAP. :-) Peace, Janice

Independent Study Senior Research Project Research Project: TITLE I would consider speaking to the prof who is going to guide her or provide oversight; he or might be able to help with a title. If it's not you, that will carry more weight, of course. I'm guessing that publication probably won't happen until after college acceptance. Since she is shooting for top scholarships, make sure it stands out somewhere on her common app forms, and be ready to offer some show and tell during scholarship interviews. If you can gain access to profs/ researchers at the prospective schools to verify the quality of the project prior to scholarship cutoffs, that will help. Most admissions folks probably aren't in a position to confirm/deny the quality of the project. Unless you can waive publication as a done-deal in their face, they won't be able to classify the achievement without confirmation from a prof. Gwen offered up a good title for your daughter, something like "A is for Admissions." I would second the rec for you and your daughter. She is probably targeting top schools; the advice is targeted toward high-achieving students. Peace, Janice

Checking in again. IMO, the book doesn't so much answer the question, "Does college maintain class inequality?" Instead it is the best answer I have found to the "How?" question. I arrived at the "Yes, in general college does maintain class inequality" conclusion quite a while ago. This is a broad brush, to be sure. But I found that denying it is a terribly difficult position to defend. Unless ignoring the truth is just too terribly painful. If so, I understand why discussing the outliers is a more pleasant way to spend our time. Yes, there are outliers. As far as boot-strapping your way out of a social class, there is a big difference between majoring in mechanical engineering and some of the majors listed in the article. The book is not about the kids in the math department who live in the honors dorm- the ones who study hard and are thankful for every opportunity that comes their way. Wrong book. But we know those kids are already the outliers in the undergrad population of IU. The book is not about the partiers vs. the studious. The book is about the kids with money who party vs. kids without money who think they can have the same exciting life because college existence makes all things seem possible/ equal. It's a mirage. Equality is a mirage. Even our grocery carts reflect our resources vs. our abilities. Shop at Save a Lot and then shop at Whole Foods. A clever cook with a good eye for value can turn a Save a Lot bag into a gorgeous meal and the Whole Foods gal can serve up a pile o' mush. But in general, the gal cruising the pre-prepped aisle at Whole Foods has a better shot at elegant entertaining with time to spare to get her nails and her hair done than the gal who needs a quarter to use the shopping cart. Rummaging through her purse with the strap that keeps coming unhooked. Dang! Seriously? There MUST be one in here. My dh calls Whole Foods "Whole Paycheck." So the book accepts class inequality at college as a given. Because it is. A given. Everywhere. But it's sneaky in college because everyone lives in the same block cell, and - to the untrained eye - everyone seems to carry the same book bag. Everything seems equal until things go wrong. If the book bags are stolen, one student is stuck in the library waiting for the text book she needs to be returned to the reserve desk. The other student has a new bag with new books delivered via next day service. She didn't even order the new pens. They just appeared. After all, you NEED pens. Student B can't really relate to student A's anxiety either. In her mind, student A is materialistic. It is wrong to be so bent on things. Student A acts like everyone is a thief now; she worries about her stuff all the time. She should focus on more important things like people and relationships. Stuff can be replaced. And, after all, if student A placed more of a priority on her education, she would buy new books. After all, you can't do well in college if you don't have books. Doesn't she know that? In the end, one of the gals grows up and heads to Whole Foods when it's time to entertain. She may not know the first thing about cooking, but she knows how to put together a beautiful meal. You want people to feel special and welcomed when they come to your house, don't you? Life is grand!! Peace, Janice Enjoy your little people Enjoy your journey

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Hi G, Did the short interview capture the book? No. Interview made the conclusions seem arbitrary and unsupported. I posted after reading the responses to the article. I know a lot of the gals who responded here, and I suspect that while they seemed to take issue with the conclusions they drew from the article, I suspect they might strongly agree with the actual conclusions drawn in the book. This leads me to this evaluation: Good book. Poor article. Did their research seem genuine? Yes. Conclusions were well-supported. Did it change in any way what you would tell a college-bound student? Yes. I had my dd read several chapters. I plan to return to the ideas with her after she has had the chance to live on a college campus for a couple of months. I'm suspecting a few ,"Oh. I get it. That makes sense now." Peace, Janice

I have read the book; I recommend it. I just started typing a huge post. Twice. I've deleted. I recommend the book. It was worth reading. Peace, Janice

We use Paul's Cheat Sheets & Tables (Scroll down): http://tutorial.math.lamar.edu Peace, Janice Enjoy your little people Enjoy your journey

Lee Binz claims she did no literary analysis with her kids. http://www.thehomescholar.com/blog/i-hate-literary-analysis-part-1/ I wonder if she included that info in her course descriptions. (Sorry, not a fan) Transcript and Course Descriptions for us included academic info. Books read for fun were not listed. I didn't want to water-down the lists with titles widely listed as appropriate for elementary-aged kids. During the scholarship interview process both kids were asked about their favorite books. It's one of the topics kids should prep for discussion. Dd talked about Huck Finn, a title her college prof talked about in his recommendation letter. He claimed she wrote a graduate-level paper worthy of publication on the book. She also spoke about how she hated Wuthering Heights and why. She didn't discuss Twilight sp??, nor was it listed anywhere. (Sorry, no italics on this device) I was invited in later when the admission's officer offered dd her scholarship. She commented to me that, when considering homeschoolers, they always hoped to get a packet as well organized as the one I put together. "Up until now, we never actually received one this comprehensive. Very specific information. A clear picture of your daughter's exceptional education." I vote for a course by course book list included in the course description document. I think a 9-12 book list is a weird homeschool thing. (Sorry, that's what I think.) For scholarship and admission, our goal was normal as possible with a heavy dose of better than most within the format that they have chosen. Kids at the high school don't add their free reading to their academic documents. My goal was to let folks know that we understand their rails; we just travel farther than most on them. Peace, Janice

Hi Robin, You're not daft. The test questions need major revision. Peace, Janice

Good Morning Jean, Psychologists identify two main coping mechanisms when it comes to managing stress: problem-focused coping and emotion-focused coping. Problem-focused coping strategies aim to change the situation that is creating stress. Emotion-focused coping aims to regulate the experience of distress. I see three strategies of emotional coping already at work in the prior responses: seeking social support by talking to friends, self-control by trying to regulate one's own feeling or actions regarding the problem, and accepting responsibility by acknowledging one's role in the stressful situation. I would like to offer some info that might help you see the situation a little more clearly. Another emotion-focused strategy is reappraisal; it allows you to reevaluate so you can see the situation in a new light. First of all, I agree that folks who send their kids to school seem less stressed about college. I see it too. I think the calmness that we see in them is primarily due to a lack of information. Most parents really do think that their kid is attending a pretty good school. We all know that half of the schools have to be less than average; that's a statistical requirement. Few parents I have spoken to really know the actual stats about their schools. I have yet to meet a parent whose child is taking an AP class who knows the pass rate for her school. (I consider the pass rate a 4/5. I realize that the CB lists the pass rate at a 3; however, kids who are taking AP's are doing it to impress upper-tier schools. Those schools usually require a 4/5 in order to be impressed.) In our neighborhood, parents just sign their kids up for the course and the test; here folks are confident that the school will handle things. When their kid doesn't achieve a passing score, they just assume that the problem lies with their student. (After all, our generation was raised to believe that all academic failure was a personal failure. When I was in school, no one would consider blaming the teacher, the curriculum, or the test for a failure.) This problem is compounded by the fact that few parents understand the college admission process. They know that the really "smart" kids with the impressive extracurriculars get into the ivy league schools. Beyond that, most parents I speak to figure that the rest of the kids kind of filter down into the rest of the tiers. The assumption is that their school is probably not prepping most kids to get into the top ten, but they bet that plenty of kids from their districts end up at pretty impressive schools. No one tracks (or brags about) what happens next - after the kids leave the district. Who graduates? How long does it take them? How many of them have to switch to less challenging majors because they can't handle the one the high school says it prepped them for? How much debt does the student carry? How much debt did the parents pick up? Next time a parent proudly tells you that their child is going to school X in the fall, ask him what the school's four-year graduation rate is. (If you want to completely wreck his day.) I will bet you that he doesn't even know that such a number exists, or he will assume that most kids graduate in four years. Right? Otherwise it would have come up during all of those discussions and presentations? Right? After all, it's an expensive school with a good reputation. My point is this: most folks don't know the stats before they drop their kid off - that's why there is so little stress. They trust the system. The system might not have placed their kid on top, but certainly they are running somewhere towards the top. Their kids will be fine. Right? For many, many parents, the stress comes later. It's a private affair. ======================================================= The Common Core will be rolling out soon. Most states have signed up. I have linked to the test drafts for Language Arts and Mathematics below. Smarter Balanced is one of the two agencies developing tests aligned with the standards. These folks ARE the experts. The test drives the curriculum, and it will drive the classroom. Period. The test dictates where the money goes, so it is king. For the LA, slide on down to page 21. Note that one of the core standards for fourth grade writing is "Observe conventions of grammar and usage." Read the first sentence for the first source on page 23. Try not to scream. Remember that this is a long-awaited draft of sample test questions. The entire educational community has been waiting for this document so they can start prepping their kids to meet these benchmarks. This article about sharks is not being distributed as a proof-reading exercise. It is being offered to fourth graders as source material, something to read, study, and emulate. Continue reading the rest of the document developed by the "experts" in the educational community at your own risk. http://www.smarterba...-Appendices.pdf Then you can move to the math questions. My personal favorite? The water tank problem on p. 97. It is important to recall that the common core reduces mathematics to a handful of goals. One of them is attend to precision. Ms. Olsen's sidewalk on p. 106 is good for some head-shaking. The sports-bag question is an exercise in reading comprehension and sewing. The voice-bubble coming from Sally's mouth on p. 121 encourages kids to "add up the two numbers I get"; apparently "get" is a new math term. I asked my 10th grader to read some of these problems aloud. He paused and had to go back and re-read the problems in the exact locations I predicted. Remember as you read, these documents represent the work of the "educational experts"; these testing agencies are the folks who are driving the next ten years of education in America. This is their expert work. http://www.smarterba...cifications.pdf Common Core is new. The companies that have sprung up to develop these tests are new companies; their goal is profit. They know that like No Child Left Behind, there is a lot of $$ to be made from the Common Core legislation. And they know that there is no real way to raise the scores of economically disadvantaged children by testing them. Any test that is developed will just rank the kids. The kids from the good districts will come out on top; the adults in their lives can figure out how to push them in any direction that is chosen by the experts. The kids from the failing districts will just keep failing; they have poverty issues, not testing issues. The companies that are developing these tests and the curriculum to match it are looking for short-term profits. Period. They won't be held accountable when things don't go well. Neither will the political leaders be around to take the blame when this initiative fails too. No Child Left Behind claimed that it was going to achieve 100% proficiency in reading and mathematics. 100%! At the time, did you hear about parents challenging the political establishment by laughing hysterically at such a claim. That's like saying, "New York will be 100% crime free five years from now" or "We are going to eliminate obesity in American by 2018. There will not be ONE obese person in the United States in 2018. We will achieve 100% proficiency in weightlessness." Huh? The people who are writing these test questions are not the educational experts with the advanced degrees and a ton of experience working in the classroom. Those people already had good jobs. These are folks who signed up to cram square pegs into round holes. It's messy looking when they finish, but there it is. (Seriously? Where is the expert in English composition with experience teaching fourth graders who would allow that run-on sentence to pass through in a source-material document? No math expert would allow anyone to talk about the "height of the surface of the water" without a reference to something ELSE! Is the height of SURFACE being compared to the floor, the ceiling, the bottom of the tank, or the bottom of my chin? Note how the graphs are precisely labeled. Remember, that "Attend to Precision" is on the short-list of goals. I think the test generators are getting a C-. ) Now, how are you doing, Jean? Jean - seriously? Are the experts really doing a better job than you are? Would you hand that Shark Source to your fourth grader? Or would you politely step over it and move on? My advice? Ask yourself, "Am I more stressful when I am awake or when I am asleep?" In the end, I have learned that while it's more stressful to be awake, it's probably a better way to handle this problem. Peace, Janice Enjoy your little people Enjoy your journey

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