Well-Ordered Language by CAP

[Guest]

Is anyone using this program with a child with learning differences?

https://classicalacademicpress.com/product/well-ordered-language-level-1a-program/

I just ordered Writing & Rhetoric for my 9-year-old (ASD/ ADHD) for 4th grade next year. I stumbled on this program while pinning on our curriculum boards and it made me smile. I already have language/ grammar resources for him (hands-on but not as explicit and well structured as I would like) but this is the level I want to work in with him on grammar, and had started looking at school type curricula as most homeschool grammar curricula would just not work for this boy. This just seems such a better fit for him and resembles the way I approach things while teaching him! I was making mental images of hands-on add-ons I can make to go with the lessons ☺️. 

Any experiences to share?

[Guest]

I am just reading the review in the Cathy Duffy website (dated Feb. 12th, 2018) and it mentions that it is new. I guess it just came out??? With the forum breaks I take I figured I had just missed mention of it. Anyway, I guess anyone interested can check it out ?. I added it to my soon to be 4th grader's curricula to-buy list for this coming school year.

[Heathermomster]

DD completed WOL 1A-2a.  The program moves very gently and teaches parts of speech and basic diagramming.  We are shifting to Hakim 5 this year.

 

[PeterPan]

The sentences in WOL look very charming. If you're wanting things that give you a bit more nuanced instruction, also look at

HELP® for Grammar  I like this for the careful analysis, no big leaps

50 Quick-Play Grammar Games  Games!

100%® Grammar  Not too much on a page

Spotlight on Grammar 6-Book Set Super gentle

I have the Spotlight grammar set but am holding off till we finish the stuff we're doing now. I have the Quick-Play Grammar Games and we enjoy them, yes. Some need to be placed twice for him and they're easy to milk in more ways. When we move over to grammar (on the docket after we finish this vocab work, like you), I'll get the HELP book as well. I'm really excited about that. I think it will help seal the deal for my ds. He's coming along understanding words as single units rather than phrases, but I think he's still going to need super explicit exploration of the nuances of each concept, which I can get with the SLP-generated materials. I don't know if that's what your ds needs, but that's just reality where mine is. I've tried enough other stuff with him to know I just get these flat looks. I have to have something that has definite success. Even the QPGG were hard for him when we tried them earlier, which is why we paused. They're great, but I just realized with him I was going to have to work through the vocab/language pieces and then go to grammar. My gut is saying that will be pretty soon and that we'll be able to do more narrative writing work too, which seems to be where your gut is at, which is interesting. 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Heathermomster said:

DD completed WOL 1A-2a.  The program moves very gently and teaches parts of speech and basic diagramming.  We are shifting to Hakim 5 this year.

 

Thank you, Heathermomster. Yes, the gentle approach was one of the things that appealed to me.

So you won't be continuing with it then? They are only as far as 3B at the moment. I'll have to wait and see how things progress. I also like the approach when it comes to explaining the concepts and how they use relatable stories. It resembles part of my approach when explaining abstract concepts to my son. 

May I ask what you mean by Hakim 5? I have seen Joy Hakim's US History series and have her science books on my to-buy list, but that is all I know.

[Guest]

PeterPan, I have had one or two of those books in my considering board for a while now, but I will most likely not be getting them. I only buy a limited number of SLP resources, only when it suits my purpose and goals for my son. 

We have been focusing on comprehension using curricula and I decided to add the Speech & Language Activities for Grades 1-3 because I wanted to see their approach and sequence. I finally have most of the storybooks. I'm just waiting for one more, but it's the 8th book so we can start now while we wait. 

My son's receptive language and reading comprehension have always been more advanced than his expressive language, but the expressive has been catching up. Social communication and pragmatics have also been a main focus.

I don't usually rely on therapy materials to show me what to do. I use them as tools and adapt them for my purposes and to suit my sons. My youngest has always been verbal. His issues with expressive language have had to do with syntax and have been directly related to procedural memory deficits. This is what was holding him back. So I let him work out his own compensations through the use of declarative memory (only jumping in as a facilitator) while specifically working on his procedural memory. He has come a long way and expresses his opinions very well, with the occasional minor help from me. We are a good team and he accepts my input and also asks for help when he doesn't understand something.

While adding in WOL (I have decided on the 3 day a week schedule), I will still continue with our other grammar resources the two remaining days per week, as they are covering other areas for us. We will see how it goes!

Narrative has not been an issue, really. He started narrating stories in the form of collages in Inspiration and Kidspiration when he was about 5, and progressed from there. That later morphed into changing an element of a story and giving it his own twist (like the writing activities in W&R), to now coming up with his own stories as well. He also asks his brother to participate in some of his animations, each contributing with their own areas of strength.

He is a nonlinear thinker and amazing problem solver. He has multiple interests and is able to see connections that my oldest was not able to see at his age. Those are skills I have had to build on with my oldest, although he has always been a great problem solver in his areas of interest. 

Hope all works out well for you and your boy as well ☺️

[Heathermomster]

Apologies...I meant Hake.  

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Heathermomster said:

Apologies...I meant Hake.  

We used Hake in 6th with my oldest. I wish we had continued with it! It's why I say, we will see how it goes with WOL with the youngest. Are you getting the writing as well? That did not work for us at all. 

[Heathermomster]

4 minutes ago, Moved On said:

We used Hake in 6th with my oldest. I wish we had continued with it! It's why I say, we will see how it goes with WOL with the youngest. Are you getting the writing as well? That did not work for us at all. 

I picked Hake because I wanted to start combining punctuation and grammar rules.  I haven’t decided yet what we’re gonna do about  writing.  I own about five writing programs.   It is likely that I’ll stick with SWB materials and teach the five paragraph essay.

 I’m introducing the WTM history notebook this year. The notebook involves outlining and writing in a variety of ways.  Talk to me in six months.

[Guest]

38 minutes ago, Moved On said:

We used Hake in 6th with my oldest. I wish we had continued with it!

I meant, I wish we had continued with the Hake series. We did finish book 6.

I am moving him to Warriner's. Holt Elements of Language was discontinued. For writing I am bringing him back to W&R; another program I should have stuck with with him. I haven't decided where I will place him yet. I ordered quite a few of the levels since I want to use it with my youngest as well. 

[Guest]

History with my oldest is another story! For now I am working out the books. Some of the books I am looking at are not books used in school or homeschool. Fleshing it out still...

[Heathermomster]

Wait, we are using Hakim’s US History series as the main spine for history (1820- WW2).  How funny is that.  

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Heathermomster said:

Wait, we are using Hakim’s US History series as the main spine for history (1820- WW2).  How funny is that.  

It crossed my mind that this was why you typed Hakim in your original post ☺️ , but then again, I don't visit the curriculum boards much anymore so I figured, perhaps there was a program I didn't know about. I didn't know about WOL either until I stumbled on it in the Rainbow website.

I'm buying SWB's The History of the... World, I own an older McDougal Littell World History text, and I'm adding Holt World History and Sociology. Some of these will be used during the 4 year cycle as resources. Then I have a list of other books I am looking at, that are more time-period specific. I am building on oldest son's research skills and historical analysis. We will be bringing Dad into it also. He's a big history buff, especially with US history. I have also purchased A Patriots History of the United States but I need to read it before we get there. Anyway, sorry for the random thoughts. Too many things running through my mind at the moment.

Youngest is a history fan. I am using Story of the World with him next year, and adding in many other book and hands-on resources. He has been pulling Ancient Times off the shelf for quite some time now and trying to read it. He has a passion for Egyptian history but has also been showing interest in US history. Joy Hakim's books may be a good fit for him when we get to that time period. 

Sorry for the rambling ?

[Guest]

Heathermomster, you have me thinking now. I'm considering dropping the Warriner's idea and just getting my oldest Hake 8. He did very well with it when we used it for 6th. It's very well structured and was very suitable for his learning style. Youngest would not be ready for Hake 4, but I can try to introduce FLL 3 (which I have from my oldest), and maybe move him over to Hake in 5th but start from Hake 4. I'll have to see! Oldest is more independent with math (finishing Algebra 1). If I work with him primarily on history and science, I may be able to spend more time with the youngest. I need to up language complexity with the little one (for the purpose of text comprehension and verbal/ written expression) and he needs a lot of focus on grammar for that. Thinking out loud ?

[Guest]

I'll still get him WOL 1A and 1B for next year though. This way we can work on that and perhaps bring in FLL halfway through the year.

[Heathermomster]

When DS was 8th grade, we used a Spielvogel text.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0538423293/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I don’t know a thing about Hake.  I picked it up because it seemed more structured and DD needs more grammar/punctuation practice.  I purchased a Warriner text for DH.  Unfortunately, the previous owner wrote in it using ink, and I don’t have a workbook or TM to use with it.

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Heathermomster said:

When DS was 8th grade, we used a Spielvogel text.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0538423293/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I don’t know a thing about Hake.  I picked it up because it seemed more structured and DD needs more grammar/punctuation practice.  I purchased a Warriner text for DH.  Unfortunately, the previous owner wrote in it using ink, and I don’t have a workbook or TM to use with it.

 

Thanks for the World history recommendation! I'll check it out. Trying to find a preview on it.

This is what we have been using, now discontinued:

https://www.rainbowresource.com/searchspring/?q=Holt+Elements+

This is what I have been looking at:

https://www.rainbowresource.com/searchspring/?q=Warriner's+#/?_=1&resultsPerPage=60&page=1

It doesn't look like they intend to discontinue this one, but with the cost of the Elements of Language packages I was irked when they discontinued it. It is another program that was a good fit for him. I'll probably ask for his input and see how he feels. He liked Saxon (got done fast) but he likes the extras with Holt. I'm not ordering till late October, so I have lots of time to decide. Grammar came more naturally to him. It might be better to focus on application (writing). This is where he needs work, in written expression! In which case, Saxon would be the better choice. It gets done without the extras.

[Guest]

I did some digging around the CAP website and 3B WOL is not out yet, but will be coming out in the fall. Just clarifying since I said 3B was out in a previous post. The last level (books 4A and 4B) are coming out next year; 4A in spring and 4B in the fall. Here's the link:

https://classicalacademicpress.com/faqs/

I went over the author profiles, the general info on the program, Cathy Duffy's review, and the previews of the available levels, and I am even more convinced that this should be a good fit for my 9-year-old. I decided to get the Extra Practice discs (PDF downloads) as well, instead of introducing another program. Our other programs are all school based and can work well on the extra day or two. One doubles as a handwriting program, since handwriting is incorporated. I would like to add some elements from Serl's Primary Language Lessons. That is also gentle and something that would suit him. When my other son used it I had designed some notebook pages with space for drawing. I need to dig those up.

I also looked to see if it is compatible with W&R, and according to the above link it can work well with W&R, plus our ancient history studies.

I also spoke with my oldest and we both agreed it would be best to get him Saxon 8 and put more emphasis on his writing.

Now I just need to figure out the remaining history books ?

[Guest]

16 hours ago, Moved On said:

I also spoke with my oldest and we both agreed it would be best to get him Saxon 8 and put more emphasis on his writing.

I meant Saxon's Hake 8 ?

Heathermomster, I forgot to thank you for reminding me about Hake ☺️. I feel more comfortable about this decision.

Thank you, also, for introducing me to J. J. Spielvogel. I was quite impressed by his author profile and background (looked him up through several sources). His texts titled Western Civilization, look like they will fit in really well with what I am looking to accomplish. I am adding the first volume to my to-buy list. It is pricey though (especially through local sources), so I may have to take out something else. I might just take out the Holt World History and just get their Sociology. The other books on my list are not texts so they are not as pricey. Anyway, rambling now... Here's the link to volume 1.

https://www.amazon.com/Western-Civilization-Jackson-J-Spielvogel/dp/1285436482/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1531288983&sr=8-2

 

[Guest]

20 hours ago, Moved On said:

Thank you, also, for introducing me to J. J. Spielvogel. I was quite impressed by his author profile and background (looked him up through several sources). His texts titled Western Civilization, look like they will fit in really well with what I am looking to accomplish. I am adding the first volume to my to-buy list. It is pricey though (especially through local sources), so I may have to take out something else. I might just take out the Holt World History and just get their Sociology. The other books on my list are not texts so they are not as pricey. Anyway, rambling now... Here's the link to volume 1.

https://www.amazon.com/Western-Civilization-Jackson-J-Spielvogel/dp/1285436482/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1531288983&sr=8-2

 

All the books appear to have pretty much the same content and are either reworked in new editions (changing the format) or broken into separate volumes. I scored this one locally, lightly used from a high rated seller, for an excellent price, and it ships from Amazon. I'm happy ☺️

https://www.amazon.com/World-History-MindTap-Course-List/dp/1305091205/ref=olp_product_details?_encoding=UTF8&me=

[Heathermomster]

I really don’t understand why those used texts are so expensive.  I hope you didn’t pay too much.

[Guest]

It's a 2015 edition and the reseller is new it appears (shipping straight from Amazon), but with excellent reviews. He only had it for about $48 CAD (approx. $36 USD). All the others had it for $150 CAD and up. Yup, prices are even more crazy here! I figure I got a deal for a lightly used copy, but we will see when it gets here. I have been able to get better deals off of new resellers shipping through Amazon a couple of times before. 

Thank you for asking ☺️

[Guest]

It's supposed to be free from notes, highlighting, and underlining. That was a big selling point. It was why I grabbed it now. I found an older edition for slightly less but not as good a shape as this is (per reseller's comments).

[Guest]

On 7/9/2018 at 10:17 AM, Moved On said:

I have seen Joy Hakim's US History series and have her science books on my to-buy list, but that is all I know.

Put Joy Hakim's science history books in my 9-year-old's board of "Future Resources to Consider" and replaced them with Susan Wise Bauer's The Story of Western Science for my 14-year-old next year. It will be an additional resource to our 4-year history cycle. Sorted through the other history books and have a pretty good idea what I want to get, but also found 2 other sociology texts I like. I'll have to look everything over again when the time comes.

Our Writing and Rhetoric arrived along with some other fun, hands-on, and crafty resources I had ordered. We are going to be busy, which means I won't be around much, again ☺️

Have a wonderful summer, everyone!

[Guest]

PeterPan, this is the grammar program I use. The one I will continue with, alongside WOL:

https://www.rainbowresource.com/searchspring/?q=jolly+grammar

I did buy the workbooks for the first handbook and some of the hands-on materials (they are not available through Rainbow, I bought those from the UK.), but now I just buy the handbooks. It has all the sheets in each handbook, as reproducibles. We really like the program, which is why I am not giving it up. It only goes up to book 6 and I will be buying book 3 soon. 

Not saying you should buy it. Just showing you because I think you may have originally thought that I was talking about the Linguisystems book (the cut and paste grammar book). I don't really consider that as grammar. That's just something I bought for the summer. I am using it for social skills believe it or not! Kind of like social stories. 

 

[Guest]

The Spielvogel World History arrived today and I am very pleased ?! It's a 2016 printing and the entire book's pages are just like the one I uploaded. The back cover is just as intact as the front, and so is the spine. Love it!