Another spelling question - spelling aloud?

[rebbyribs]

My 10yo daughter is not a good speller.  At this point she reads well (although that didn't happen until she was 8yo) and has a great vocabulary, but she just doesn't seem to remember how words are spelled even when she's seen them hundreds of times.  We've worked through 5 levels of AAS.  The first two levels seem to really have stuck with her and improved her spelling, but it didn't seem like she was learning the words from the later levels as solidly even after lots of review.  She makes a fair number of just careless mistakes, which she can fix on her own when I point them out.  And then she also has lots of trouble with words where there different valid options for making the sounds.  I see a lot of misspellings like "horce", "beleaf", and "mutch".

A couple months ago, I tried switching her into Spelling You See (Americana level) because I thought we should continue doing spelling but not move up a grade level.  I also thought that visually marking the specific vowel team patterns might help her concentrate on which ones are in which words.  So far, I'm not seeing much progress, although we can keep with it for a while longer...

In the meantime, I talked with her CT from the charter school about her spelling, and she gave me a list of spelling approaches to try before getting a formal evaluation.  We've tried most of them, but one was spelling aloud, which I'll admit had never occurred to me.  For me, spelling aloud is usually more difficult than writing down a word because I have to visualize the word in my head and then say the letters aloud.  I find it like trying to do two-digit multiplication mentally as compared to on paper.  That said, things like the "Be Aggressive, B-E Aggressive, B-E A-G-G-R-E-S-S-I-V-E" cheer do make it easier to remember the spellings for a few words.  So, maybe that's something to try, and clearly my daughter isn't learning spelling visually like I did. Is there any curriculum or guidelines for spelling aloud?  I guess I'm also thinking of the spelling bee from Little Town on the Prairie, but I'm not sure how they were breaking down the words or keeping track of where they were.

My other thought was that she seems to do well using spell check on papers, even though her typing is very slow.  (She has been through Dance Mat Typing, but that didn't help much.) I was thinking of having her try Touch Type Read and Spell to try and work on the typing and spelling simultaneously.  I don't know - any other ideas? What would you do / what have you done?

[MerryAtHope]

Those visual errors do take lots of drill and varied practice. I found that it helped more to not just practice it day after day, but to use the word analysis skills taught in Levels 3 & up of AAS.

 

So, for horse, show the word card and ask her what's tricky about that word (the /s/ sound could be spelled with a C or with an S). So have her mentally note that it's an S. Then ask, "Why does this word need a silent e?" (otherwise it would look like a plural word--hor-hors). Thinking about the E keeping horse from looking like a plural word can help her re-categorize this word in her mind with -se words instead of with -ce words.

 

I often had my kids read a word daily for several days, each day noting anything tricky about a word, and then trying to spell the word again. This usually accomplished more than just practicing it lots of times. â€œWord Analysis†is added starting in Level 3 to get children to think more about why words are spelled the way they are–to think about which techniques they need to use.  Does this word follow certain rules?  Is there more than one spelling choice that could work? Do I have to learn this one visually and use methods like scratch-paper spelling?  Do syllable rules or suffix rules apply?  and so on. But my kids needed a lot of help and encouragement to employ these strategies and think actively. If they are more passively trying to learn words, they tend to get lost in all the visual phonograms. 

 

The word banks can help with visual reinforcement too--read them with purpose (ie, don't just have her read them but ask a question such as, "how is the /ee/ sound spelled in these words?" for lists like the IE words. This can help kids to think more actively about the words they are reading and to associate them together.) Sometimes I used a word that my student remembered easily. For example, if she finds "chief" easy, try the phrase, "chief belief" (as in a most important belief.) 

 

For the word much, ask what rule it doesn't follow (we usually use tch after a short vowel.) Again have her read it and note this daily for several days, then try practicing it again.

 

Auditory practice may help with some words (having her spell out loud). I found for my kids that they often said the wrong letter or lost their place in longer words though, so I kind of had to pick and choose when that was a helpful strategy for practicing a word. I found thinking through the word was more helpful. Kinesthetic practice can sometimes help too. Make sure to put any missed words back in daily review until they are truly mastered.

 

It's good that she can fix a lot of mistakes when you point them out. With spelling, there are layers of mastery that are progressively more difficult:

 

-Spelling in the context of the list with tiles is easiest–words all follow the same pattern

 

-Spelling the list in writing can challenge some students who have to work hard at handwriting.

 

-Spelling from word cards (shuffled to mix the patterns) is slightly harder, but students still only have to focus on spelling

 

-Spelling in dictation is another step harder–many words using differing patterns are used, and the student has to hold the sentence in memory, and also think about capitalization and punctuation.

 

-Writing Station exercises (introduced in Level 3) focus on words the student has learned, but ask the student to come up with original content, which requires additional skills to be used. These serve as a bridge between dictation and spelling in the context of outside writing.

 

-Outside writing–this is the hardest level for the student. It requires them to think about all writing skills at once-grammar, punctuation, spelling, capitalization, usage rules, syntax, handwriting and neatness, paragraph rules–plus content, organization of their thoughts, getting answers correct or being creative, and so on.

 

So, if she misspells a word in outside writing, back up to some review at an easier level like the word cards. Also, instead of pointing out her mistakes, give her a separate editing time (no other LA assignment that day, so it doesn't feel like work is doubling up--just editing for that day). Praise for any mistakes she can identify (have her underline them even if she doesn't know how to fix them--you can help with that later). And of course praise for any she knows how to fix.

 

If she misses words she has already learned but doesn't identify them, try putting a light pencil X next to the line for each error, so she knows to look for one in that line. If she can identify mistakes on her own, she'll be one step closer to remembering the word the first time. We worked on this strategy first through dictations, then through the Writing Station when that was added, and then in outside writing as their skills grew. (Not all writing needs to be polished, and sometimes if the subject is science or history, I would choose to focus on content, knowing that spelling would eventually come along. Kids can get discouraged if you focus on everything at once–the goal of perfection seems unattainable.)

 

Anyway--sometimes it's not so much that you need to change programs as you need to help her with applying what she's learning so she actually practices it until it's solid. I found my kids sometimes resisted the word analysis or did a much more passive form (not thinking through the words very thoroughly) and that spending time helping them to do that more actively did more to solidify the spelling patterns.

 

This article on Helping Kids Achieve Automaticity in Spelling has some tips that I think you’ll find helpful. HTH some! They do get there!

[Ellie]

My 10yo daughter is not a good speller.  At this point she reads well (although that didn't happen until she was 8yo) and has a great vocabulary, but she just doesn't seem to remember how words are spelled even when she's seen them hundreds of times.  We've worked through 5 levels of AAS.  The first two levels seem to really have stuck with her and improved her spelling, but it didn't seem like she was learning the words from the later levels as solidly even after lots of review.  She makes a fair number of just careless mistakes, which she can fix on her own when I point them out.  And then she also has lots of trouble with words where there different valid options for making the sounds.  I see a lot of misspellings like "horce", "beleaf", and "mutch".

 

A couple months ago, I tried switching her into Spelling You See (Americana level) because I thought we should continue doing spelling but not move up a grade level.  I also thought that visually marking the specific vowel team patterns might help her concentrate on which ones are in which words.  So far, I'm not seeing much progress, although we can keep with it for a while longer...

 

In the meantime, I talked with her CT from the charter school about her spelling, and she gave me a list of spelling approaches to try before getting a formal evaluation.  We've tried most of them, but one was spelling aloud, which I'll admit had never occurred to me.  For me, spelling aloud is usually more difficult than writing down a word because I have to visualize the word in my head and then say the letters aloud.  I find it like trying to do two-digit multiplication mentally as compared to on paper.  That said, things like the "Be Aggressive, B-E Aggressive, B-E A-G-G-R-E-S-S-I-V-E" cheer do make it easier to remember the spellings for a few words.  So, maybe that's something to try, and clearly my daughter isn't learning spelling visually like I did. Is there any curriculum or guidelines for spelling aloud?  I guess I'm also thinking of the spelling bee from Little Town on the Prairie, but I'm not sure how they were breaking down the words or keeping track of where they were.

 

My other thought was that she seems to do well using spell check on papers, even though her typing is very slow.  (She has been through Dance Mat Typing, but that didn't help much.) I was thinking of having her try Touch Type Read and Spell to try and work on the typing and spelling simultaneously.  I don't know - any other ideas? What would you do / what have you done?

 

I don't know about spelling aloud, but I do know about Spalding. :-) And so that's my recommendation. :-)

 

[rebbyribs]

I don't know about spelling aloud, but I do know about Spalding. :-) And so that's my recommendation. :-)

 

 

Of course it is.  :-)  But now I'm curious - I had thought Spalding was a learning to read program.  How would you use it for a child who is reading well but having trouble with spelling specifically?

[stutterfish]

Fwiw, my mildly dyslexic child found it easier to spell out loud than in any other format. I'm the total opposite: I absolutely need to write a word to spell it. He's very much an aural learner. He also plays music by ear. It might seem counter-intuitive, but perhaps it's worth a try.

[Ellie]

Of course it is.  :-)  But now I'm curious - I had thought Spalding was a learning to read program.  How would you use it for a child who is reading well but having trouble with spelling specifically?

 

Spalding teaches children to read by teaching them to spell. So it works just as well teaching children to spell as it does teaching them to read. And you teach it the same way.