Plaid Dad & other Latin gurus: About those macrons....

[Rhondabee]

We've just finished LCII, and I have Henle in hand for next year. I haven't yet found an explanation re: macrons - what do they indicate? Do we need to start writing them?

 

(Suddenly Latin became very complicated :confused:)

 

Also, if I get the Lingua Latina for "reading", any idea how fast/how often that should go? I looked at the sample @ amazon and think LCII will have prepared us pretty well, and it would add some spice, tho' I don't feel confident enough to use it as our main text.

 

Thanks!

Rhonda

[Plaid Dad]

Macrons indicate long vowels. They are (imo) a useful tool for learners to help with the rules of accentuation and to distinguish certain verb and noun forms (first declension nominative singular from ablative, for example). You will find some editions of classical Roman writers that do not include them, and most post-classical Latin doesn't have them either. If you are using a program that includes them, you can consider them part of the spelling of a word.

 

You would probably need more than LCII to get much out of Lingua Latina beyond the first few chapters; I would recommend it as a reading supplement after a year or so of Henle. Prof. Oerberg presents grammar in a very different order and there is much, much more vocabulary in Lingua Latina than in either LC or Henle. The vocabulary is presented in context, so it's usually fairly easy to get the meaning even if the word is unfamiliar; if not, you can refer to Lingua Latina: A College Companion for a complete listing.

 

HTH!

[Rhondabee]

Macrons indicate long vowels. They are (imo) a useful tool for learners to help with the rules of accentuation and to distinguish certain verb and noun forms (first declension nominative singular from ablative, for example). You will find some editions of classical Roman writers that do not include them, and most post-classical Latin doesn't have them either. If you are using a program that includes them, you can consider them part of the spelling of a word.

 

HTH!

 

So, then, is LC wrong in teaching that all the vowels always make the same sound? (Ah, Ay, Ee, Oh, Oo)

 

And, is there supposed to be a difference in the pronunciation of the 1st decl. nom. sing. and the ablative? Or is it only a written difference?

 

Thanks again!

Rhonda

[Mamagistra]

*bump*

[latinteach]

So, then, is LC wrong in teaching that all the vowels always make the same sound? (Ah, Ay, Ee, Oh, Oo)

 

And, is there supposed to be a difference in the pronunciation of the 1st decl. nom. sing. and the ablative? Or is it only a written difference?

 

Thanks again!

Rhonda

 

The long and short vowels have different sounds.

 

There's definitely a difference, it's NOT just written.

 

A great place to learn how to pronounce Latin is at the Wheelock Latin site. They have a set of (free) audio files that will help you learn proper Latin pronunciation, professionally done by a Classicist and overseen by the editor of the Wheelock's Latin series, so it's definitely authoritative.

 

http://wheelockslatin.com/chapters/introduction/introduction.html

 

Specifically, you can get the answer to your question by checking out their tutorial on vowel pronunciation:

http://wheelockslatin.com/chapters/introduction/introduction_vowels.html

 

Do your best with the Latina Lingua. Remember that it's not the quantity of reading you do, but the quality. The point is to develop your fluency.

 

Hope this helps!

[Plaid Dad]

The explanations in LC are simplified, even for the ecclesiastical pronunciation they teach. Since Memoria Press's focus in on teaching grammar, they don't put a lot of stress on pronunciation beyond the basics, really. It's enough to get you started, but it's not meant to be the last word on the subject. :)

 

The Wheelock page latinteach linked to is great for classical pronunciation. You might also look here for more details on ecclesiastical. It draws on the norms for Gregorian chant that are in use today.

[LisaNY]

 

Do your best with the Latina Lingua. Remember that it's not the quantity of reading you do, but the quality. The point is to develop your fluency.

 

 

 

I will have to respectfully disagree somewhat with this. I have found it tantamount to my comprehension of the new material in LL to do repeated reading of each capitula in Familia Romana. I find that my understanding of the material increases tremendously when I simply re-read the stories over and over. By doing it this way, I feel that it trains my mind to read "Latin as Latin" without having to constantly translate the Latin into English in my head.

 

Perhaps you did not mean it the way that I understood it, in which case, you can clarify it for me. :001_smile:

[Rhondabee]

Aw, man!!!! (I would insert a rant here - but with no coffee in the house, and knowing I'd just need to delete it anyway, I will leave said rant to your imagination - LOL!)

 

Yes, thank you, that info is *very* helpful.

 

Think I'll bury my head in the sand for a week while I recover from this year before I truly dig in to next year's stuff ~

Rhonda

[latinteach]

I will have to respectfully disagree somewhat with this. I have found it tantamount to my comprehension of the new material in LL to do repeated reading of each capitula in Familia Romana. I find that my understanding of the material increases tremendously when I simply re-read the stories over and over. By doing it this way, I feel that it trains my mind to read "Latin as Latin" without having to constantly translate the Latin into English in my head.

 

Perhaps you did not mean it the way that I understood it, in which case, you can clarify it for me. :001_smile:

 

I probably wasn't very clear. It's better to really understand what you are reading -- and re-reading is exactly what you should be doing -- than it is to "cover" more material in the book only superficially. You might think you're working through the material more slowly, but what you're really doing is working on it more in depth, really getting to know it, and internalizing what you're learning. You are spending "quality time" with the reading, rather than just superficially glossing over the readings in an effort to "get further" in the book. So, we actually agree. :001_smile:

[Plaid Dad]

Perhaps you did not mean it the way that I understood it, in which case, you can clarify it for me. :001_smile:

 

I took latinteach's comment to mean that it matters less how quickly you move through chapters in Lingua Latina than how much you're getting out of the material you do read. I don't think that precludes multiples readings of the same text - which is pretty much required for Oerberg's method, in my experience. But maybe I'm misunderstanding the comment!

 

ETA: Sorry! We were typing at the same time. :)

[LisaNY]

I probably wasn't very clear. It's better to really understand what you are reading -- and re-reading is exactly what you should be doing -- than it is to "cover" more material in the book only superficially. You might think you're working through the material more slowly, but what you're really doing is working on it more in depth, really getting to know it, and internalizing what you're learning. You are spending "quality time" with the reading, rather than just superficially glossing over the readings in an effort to "get further" in the book. So, we actually agree. :001_smile:

 

Yes, then we *do* agree! Thank you for clarifying. :001_smile: