Former Christian YECers, tell me about your journey...

[JumpyTheFrog]

If you're a Christian and used to believe in a literal 7 day young earth creation, and now believe in an old earth, I'd like to hear about your journey.

 

Please, let's try to keep this thread civil and not let it turn into a big debate.

 

 

Edited to add: I realize my thread title may be confusing. I'm asking about people who are still Christians, that started out believing in a YEC, but now believe in an OEC, or even theistic evolution.

Edited May 29, 2011 by HoppyTheToad
clarity

[LoveBaby]

I'm not sure where I fall in the YE, OE category. There are some things that make it seem pretty straight up YE, then there are things in the book of Daniel and others that make it seem OE. I do however firmly believe that God created the earth, that he did in fact create it in the order given in Genesis and that when the times comes and I have an opportunity to ask Him, He'll let me know how it all went down.

 

I just can't for the life of me figure out how this becomes such a dividing issue amongst Christian's...if we a) believe God created it and b) believe in God...then does the timing of it all really matter?!

 

As for teaching my children - we learn about both theories, talk and discuss that there are some things this side of God's kingdom that we just won't know the answer to, but that the lack of answer's doesn't mean God isn't real or doesn't have a plan.

[LisaKinVA]

I'm not sure where I fall in the YE, OE category. There are some things that make it seem pretty straight up YE, then there are things in the book of Daniel and others that make it seem OE. I do however firmly believe that God created the earth, that he did in fact create it in the order given in Genesis and that when the times comes and I have an opportunity to ask Him, He'll let me know how it all went down.

 

I just can't for the life of me figure out how this becomes such a dividing issue amongst Christian's...if we a) believe God created it and b) believe in God...then does the timing of it all really matter?!

 

As for teaching my children - we learn about both theories, talk and discuss that there are some things this side of God's kingdom that we just won't know the answer to, but that the lack of answer's doesn't mean God isn't real or doesn't have a plan.

 

:iagree:

I can't claim to be YE or OE... and honestly, I don't think it matters. The important thing for Christians to believe is that God Created. All the rest is our interpretation of what MAY have happened. We won't truly know or understand until we are in the presence of the Creator. Making this some sort of "bright line" test between Christians is (in my humble opinion), a tool of Satan to cause division within the church -- making the church as a whole less effective for God's purposes.

 

I grew up with a literal YE interpretation... I became a debater in college (back in the 80's), and discovered other ID theories that <gasp> I didn't even know had existed. As I read and learned more about them, I gravitated that way. However, there are lots of things I have learned over the last 20 years that are plausible (not just YE/OE), that aren't traditionally taught in churches. Interesting interpretations that aren't "excluded" by Scripture, but not "proven" by Scripture, either. I have also become much more wary of any "doctrine" that is taught based upon a verse here or there... especially when dealing with the epistles.

Edited May 28, 2011 by LisaK in VA

[Trish]

Here are some facts about God, He is:

 

1) Creator of all life

2) Creator of our universe

3) Omnipotent

4) Omnipresent

5) Omniscient

 

6) He gave ONE life form a free will

7) He will judge each of us personally for how we used our free will

8) He will judge all of mankind at the Final Judgment

 

These facts have been revealed to us. What has not been revealed to us is how these things are true. We have capacity to explore and understand our world, to some extent, but we do not have the capacity to explore and understand God, beyond what He is willing to reveal to us.

 

That's why scientists will continue to be confounded.

 

I think that's cool!

 

:D

[LNC]

I read a bunch of books and online after the kerfluffle. I never had an opinion on YE or OE, just that God created. Somehow though through homeschooling osmosis, I thought YE was likely the "right" way to believe, until a physican friend in our church asked me what I thought about starlightm :). After the kerfluffle, I read Origins, by the Haardsmas and an article by Tim Keller on Biologos that leaned to Theistic evolution. Origins made a convincing argument for that, except I can't get away in my heart/mind from the importance of the historicity of Adam and Eve. I read Systematic Theology by Wayne Grudem's chapter on creation, which had good points in favor of OE as well. All of that to say, I now lean old earth and believe Adam and Eve were real. Not sure how that gels but I'll read more by the pool this summer!! John Piper recommends Genesis Unbound by John Sailhammer. If I can ever I find an oop copy under $50 I would love to read that!

[Aelwydd]

I don't remember my parents or people in the evangelical churches I grew up in ever making YE such an issue as it is today, although they did hold to a literal understanding of Genesis. As a young adult, I began researching early Christian history, in order to answer questions I had regarding the discrepancies between evangelical Christianity, and what I read and studied in the Bible.

 

Then, I met my husband, who was a conservative Anglican. He had studied at a Reformed Episcopalian seminary, in addition to his own research, and he convinced me that it was the catholic branches of the Church (Eastern Orthodox, Eastern Catholic, Roman Catholic, Anglican, etc.) that remained truest to the faith as it had been delivered to the Apostles.

 

I am nothing, if not analytical by nature. I might have remained happily ensconced in traditional Anglicanism, or even gone Orthodox, had it not been for the fact that I couldn't overlook or ignore the consistent preference of men over women in the Church. I had read all the verses, over and over, since childhood, regarding how women were called to "submit" to their husbands, and even how women's salvation is to be found in childbearing.

 

The message I received was that it was my uterus, not my mind, or my other gifts, that offered the most to the Church. And I traced that attitude right back to the Garden of Eden, and the judgment on Eve, whose fate was to be reduced to a needy subordinate, and to suffer in reproducing children.

 

That led me to question why I even accepted this story as the premise for everything in terms of how men and women related to each other in church. Meanwhile, I became pregnant with my ds and after I had him, found myself relegated to sitting in the nursery or otherwise caring for ds, while any of my needs and concerns were ignored or dismissed. I observed how the other male members of the church leadership glorified "motherhood," and yet showed nothing but facile interest in women's interests. Or worse, assumed that my interests revolved around little more than whether I should breastfeed my son, or bottle feed him, and those sort of issues.

 

When I suffered from Post-Partum depression, again I received little support or understanding from anybody in church, with the exception of my amazing dh, who recognized the signs, and was deeply concerned for me. I never received any real support or understanding from my priest, or other leaders in the church. Worse, I found that this same attitude was present in many of our other churches (we were quite active in the diocese and attended regional meetings, so I had friends and acquaintances throughout).

 

I matched these experiences to the same type of failings I had observed in evangelical churches growing up. At the same time, I began taking classes part-time, to finish my degree. I took several science classes, and these gave me a new appreciation for the emphasis on evidence, and the methodical way in which theories are tested. I realized that everything from light bulbs to airplanes to clean water to space travel was all predicated on SCIENCE. If science was so unreliable, then none of these things should be even remotely possible, never mind a part of our every day lives.

 

Whereas the Bible and the Church have been entirely inconsistent in form and function throughout history. They have taken different forms and relayed many different messages to different people. Their claims are not testable or provable in any way, and yet, they are used as the basis of understanding life for so many Christians.

 

I finally came to the realization that of course I didn't believe in a literal Genesis, or a 6,000 year old Earth. I couldn't do so, without undermining the same logic that fuels the REST OF SCIENCE. And the Bible and Church had already proven to be a source of harm and ignorance, in my personal experience.

 

So, now I look at the Bible as more of a metaphor in most cases. I consider that stories like the Genesis contain interesting information and observations about human nature; but that these must be weighed against the knowledge and understanding gained by humanity over the millenia. If at anytime the Bible offers up information that goes against observable, verifiable evidence, such as YE versus OE, then there's no contest.

 

And that's how I came to be OE, after first believing YE.

[simka2]

My journey was a pretty ugly and graphic one. :glare: I believed very literally. 4 years ago I was planning family vacations to the Creation Museum.

 

Flash back to my childhood. In many ways it was very good and priviledged. I was raised to question, to seek, to grow.

 

Those traits led me to Christianity...and those skills saved me when my faith was ripped to shreds. When the church turns it's back on you, when you are the victim of a "Shepherd," you question everything. I began to research if there were other Christians like me. People who wanted to be able to "think" and "reason" without the fear of being called "unbiblical" or a "Jezebel."

 

I questioned a ton, and I refused to have blinders. In the conservative church I was taught NOT to trust myself, I learned that I had to be trust myself, before I could build any other trust. I trusted that God was BIG. He would lead me, hold me and guide me as I searched. He wouldn't squash me like a bug for questioning. ;)

 

Eventually, I came across other like minded people. I found out that many of Jewish decent did not believe in a literal 7-day as well. I eventually figured that if they could allow for evolution and God to co-exist, I could to.

[JumpyTheFrog]

I began to research if there were other Christians like me. People who wanted to be able to "think" and "reason" without the fear of being called "unbiblical" or a "Jezebel."

 

 

At the time, were you treated poorly for questioning a YEC? Or were others upset for your questions about other topics?

 

I ask because my journey started about 1 1/2 years ago with questions about one area. This led to questions in area after area. The whole age-of-the-earth debate is just the latest one. Two years ago, I never would've thought I'd be questioning a YEC.

 

I know some here have expressed they don't really find the issue very important. But I'm a "math/science" kind of person and I want to know what approach to teach my kids when they are older. I'm personally not content with "we don't really know what happened." I want to decide what I think the evidence points to before we reach that topic in our school work.

[simka2]

At the time, were you treated poorly for questioning a YEC? Or were others upset for your questions about other topics?

 

.

 

Ultimately it was questioning itself. It is difficult to explain. I wasn't in what one would typically see as a conservative church. Think New Life, in Colorado Springs. I did not know that everything I said as a staff wife was being scrutinized, not by parishioners, but by the Sr. Pastor an his wife. I told the wife I read a certain book, she came over to have a long talk. I said something at a banquet and got called into the office the next day. There were acceptable things to question...how church was done in the past (ie get rid of the organ) and that deacons and elders shouldn't have control of a church. The Pastor was the Shepherd, so he got control.

 

Basically, if I questioned anything that was not in line with the Pastor's personally held beliefs, I would receive the labels.....and I did. Long story short, my life was ripped apart before I got the chance to question YE in earnest.

 

But, I finally feel peace. Not, in facts, but in that I am doing the best I can and God will have to close the distance.