I need your best UnParenting Advice

[74Heaven]

My difficult 19yo daughter is coming home in a month from a unsuccessful (but very fun lol) year at college. She has grown up a lot this past year.

 

She found her way of doing things (being on facebook all night, getting engaged online to a high school acquaintance for 3 months (hadn't seen him since 2009 in person - never a close friend), spending all her money frivolously, procrastinating, skipping assignments, etc.) didn't work out to a successful freshman year. Her grades were unacceptable and she lost all her school scholarship money and broke her agreements with us grade-wise. Now, she is planning to move home, work all summer and go to CC (she will pay for it if she does go) in the fall.

 

So, personally (LOL), her overall maturity (seeing her ways fail) is an improvement since last summer when we were blamed for her problems. She is not so mad at us anymore, sees the wisdom in a lot of our good advice and we have been able to step out of the line-of-fire so to speak.

 

My daughter is dishonest to us in most of the agreements we made with her - so we really don't trust her. She knows this. She understands (when she is thinking straight) why we don't trust her. She owes money to her bank for overdrafts (we paid because we were on the acct. she owes us that money as well.) She owes money to her school because she didn't use her w/study money to pay a small amt. of tuition still owing after our pmts.

 

She says she wants to live here. And we *want* her here, but - assuming she can follow the rules - how can we "un" parent her. We are not going to say, "pretend we are a hotel; come and go as you please". That's just not fair to the other 6 of us who live here. Running a big family means lots of chores, lots of helping out and lots of stress because the activity/money/time ratio is stretched 7 ways!

 

Thoughts on how to be more hands-off, but still protect our rights and our space and our family? Anyone BTDT? (It is like parenting a rebellious 16yo who just happens to be 19yo?)

 

Let me reiterate - things are better! She is maturing! There is progress. It is just the two-steps-forward; one-step-back type?

 

Thoughts?

Lisaj, mom to 5

[fischerl]

I hope you get some great advice from some who have BTDT. Although I haven't found myself in your situation, I do have a 20-year-old DD in college who will be moving home for the summer, so I am interested in seeing replies!

 

The only thing that comes to mind, and I will be doing this, is to talk with your DD about what you both feel is fair and reasonable, and then *write it down* and post it. That way no one has to try to remember things that haven't become habits.

 

My DD will continue to do her own laundry, she will join her siblings in a washing dishes/empty dishwasher rotation (they switch each week), and I know she will do a lot of the cooking because she enjoys that. Hopefully she'll also find a summer job!

 

Although she is an adult, I'm thinking we'll ask her to agree on a curfew—partly as a courtesy to us and partly for her own safety (what appropriate activities are available after 1:00 a.m. anyway?:tongue_smilie: )

 

Best of luck!

[FaithManor]

That is a tough one. First off, let me say that I have not had this problem with my soon to be twenty child, so I am not speaking from experience.

 

I guess, my inclination would be to draw up a rental contract. These would be the terms under which you are willing to allow her to live at home and would include a payback plan for the money she owes you and the college. This would spell out your expectations - ie. take care of your own dishes, laundry, keep the room reasonably neat, take out the garbage each Thursday, clean the bathroom on Saturday, put gas in the car if you are allowed to use it, and so that our sleep schedules are not completely disrupted, be in by midnight....or whatever...just a clear set of terms, expectations, and consequences. You could also say something to the effect that since it will still be your money that provides for her well being (the roof over her head, the electricity, heat, etc.), you reserve the right to evict the tenant for persistent behavior which negatively impacts the other tenants (family members). That way she knows you reserve the right to NOT continue the arrangement.

 

Then I'd have her sign it after having ample time to think about it and consider her options.

 

But, that may be too harsh. I'm just not certain because I've never gone through it. I do remember my dad saying to my brother when he was 17, "You can adhere to your mother and I's house rules or you can leave. No one is stopping you; it's your choice." He decided to obey the rules, which were not oppressive by the way.

 

Faith

[Nan in Mass]

I have lived with over-18 children, I myself lived with my parents when I was in my 20's, and my parents did the same with their parents. (LOL In case you haven't caught on by now, we tend to avoid change in my family.) It works well in my family, I think maybe because it was all worked out a few generations ago. It is assumed that a young person over 18 is an independent adult, but one who still needs lots of help and advice. Final decisions belong to the young person. We talk beforehand about how it is going to work. The assumption is that the young person will contribute to the household, but not as much as if the young person were renting a house with friends. In other words, the parents still pay the bulk of the bills and do the bulk of the chores. Usually, to make things simple, a chore is assigned to the young person. For example, I did the laundry when I lived at home. Our sons often have had a maintenance project, like painting the house or putting in a new furnace or stacking the winter's wood. All adults have to either be working or going to school. If they are working full time and not going to school, then they have to pay house money or contribute some other way to the household's expenses. For example, my mother bought the groceries once a month. Parents often find ways to help out the young person if they are struggling, but it tends to be something finite and concrete, like paying their car insurance. Cars belong to specific people and are lent freely, but the owner gets first dibs and the borrower replaces the gas used. Everybody possible is put on Dad's medical insurance. Anybody else is heavily pressured to pay for their own - we all know that aunts, uncles, and second cousins would mortgage their houses to pay for anyone's major hospital bills in the event of an accident, so that encourages the oh-so-invincible-and-not-so-responsible young people to actually pay for insurance. The same applies to telephone plans and any other way to reduce expenses by combining into a family and getting a family rate. There are house rules that apply to all adults, set by the owners of the house. This usually involves letting people know where you are, what your plans are, and whether you will be there for meals. It is ok to say I don't know if you don't know. There are no curfews but you are expected to come in very quietly if you are out late. The last one in turns out the entry way light. That way, if someone wakes in the night they can tell if everyone is home. Parents try to help young people make safe plans. This is tricky. You have to meddle minimumally with the object of the plan and just change a few of the details so that it will be doable and safe. I don't think my middle one will mind my giving you a recent example involving him. His best friend is in the airforce and is working at a base about 2 hours away. when my son was home from college, the two of them decided to get together and go skiing. The friend got out of work at 3 and their original plan was for my son to go pick him up and drive past the base another few hours, go night skiing, and then head back at 10. My son was going to get back at 3 in the morning and then have to drive the 5 hours back to school the next day. 20 year olds can do things like this, but it wasn't the safest of plans and it was going to be pretty uncomfortable. We got out the map and helped him to make a plan that involved just as much visiting but much less middle of the night driving. We helped make the plan to build a smoker and smoke the Thanksgiving turkey more doable, too. We as parents help them figure out how to pay their taxes, renew their licenses, pay their bills, and other adult chores. We help them keep track of these sorts of things. We celebrate holidays together and try to have a family dinner together once a week. We talk a lot. It is fun hearing about each other's doings. This requires lots of tongue biting on the parents' part or the young people won't share. You pray a lot, as the parent. You say when something is dangerous but don't go on about it and the young people know it is their decision in the end.

 

HTH

-Nan

 

Edited to add - For us, as parents, this is a time of tense waiting. You have to have faith that the child will eventually grow in a completely reliable, responsible adult, but that point doesn't seem to be come about 24, at least in my family. Meanwhile, there is a very uncomfortable time, uncomfortable for both the hopefully waiting parents and the keeps-making-mistakes child. You have to keep forgiving and help them to pick up the pieces and keep trying. You have to not say too much and try to help them save face so they will keep listening to your advice and keep wanting to be like you some day. You have to hope none of the mistakes will have long-lasting or fatal consequences. You have to have faith that your beloved child will grow up and figure it out and you have to be what you want them eventually to be. You have to celebrate their successes but not act like you expected them to fail. It is very hard. As they get farther away from 14 and closer to 24, it gets harder in some ways, because the mistakes they make have more far-reaching consequences, but it also gets easier because they are successful more often. I found that it helped me to think of them as someone who was trying to grow their adult self. It isn't a project that gets done all at once. You can't expect them to be magically done at 18. They can't grow unless they have the opportunity to try things and rise to the occasion, and that means that they are going to fail sometimes, too. They have to do most of the work themselves and it is hard work. Telling stories about the times you yourself made mistakes can comfort everyone. From the child's point of view, it is a time of trying and trying and trying again and not getting too discouraged, depressed, or giving up. From the parents' point of view, it is a balancing act of saving face, not fussing, and offering advice, comfort, and support.

Edited April 5, 2011 by Nan in Mass

[Halftime Hope]

who mentioned a written contract. The purpose of the contract is to help both parties set up and agree to firm expectations and commitments, so that trust can be rebuilt. Again, it is a tool for *both* of you. Put your expectations for behavior and attitude into a contract, as well as using it to spell out both general principles for living within your home and specific commitments.

 

One other thing, I would spell out in the contract that the young person returning home will also be expected to, within reason, "pull with the team" for everyone's well-being when there are pop-ups. She cannot be a "silo" who can't be called upon to help, as it is very unjust to younger siblings to have an older one who's given preferential treatment.

 

As an example, we had planned a family spring break fencing project. At the last minute, my eldest informed us that his co-worker had fallen through someone's ceiling, so he would have to work instead of being able to help us dig out and re-cement fence posts. (It's was a big, thankless job, so his lack of availability hit us hard.) My eldest will be staining the fence when the wood is dry enough, so he will share the work.

 

hth

[Just Another Jen]

I'm in the trenches with you so I can tell you what we are doing but now how it will work out in the end. ;)

Substitute a 20 yo son for your daughter and its close to the same story.

So, we have house rules written and signed by all of us on the fridge. Things like curfew are spelled out. Chores are assigned as his contribution to the family. Since we are in the middle of a whole house remodel that part is easy. If rules/promises are broken he loses freedom. We are having him title the car he uses in his name and he'll have to get his own insurance. We'll continue to help pay for school but we will reimburse him based on his final grades. He is on our cell plan for now. Obviously, at 20 if he doesn't like it he can move out. We're trying to guide him into adult responsibilities and behaviors. I'll have to let you know how it's going in a few months.

[emubird]

It can be difficult for a college student with a job to do as many chores as others in the house. If she does get her act together in terms of studying and working, you may want to cut her some slack with the chores.

[Nan in Mass]

I agree.

: )

[Belinda]

Wow. Thanks for the posts and good advice. I've got a daughter moving back in and am going clarify our expectations regarding letting us know where she is going, when she'll be back and if she'll be eating with us. I do thinnk this is a matter of common courtesy, though not so apparently 'common' to dd.

 

Belinda