Dealing with Bad Attitudes

[AmyinMD]

I'm really having a hard time getting my 10 year old to do her schoolwork lately. It seems like once my kids hit the middle school age that their attitude about schoolwork changes. It has gotten to the point where I feel like I spend all day hounding her and she usually still has stuff left at the end of the day. She's off in FL with my inlaws this week and it is so nice this week. I've been able to work with my younger kids who seem to enjoy doing their school work. This happened with my oldest as well. Once she hit 11 it got so hard to get her to do her work.

 

She badly wants to go to school. She tells everyone she is going next year no matter what. I'd love to send her off and have someone else deal with her all day but I do not like our local middle school at all. My oldest went for 7th grade this year and it has been rough. She does not want to go back next year. My oldest has always been very well behaved and does not get into trouble at school. I could see my 10 yo getting in with the wrong group and getting into lots of trouble. That makes me really hesitant to put her in school. I have put the girls into the lottery for the only charter school in our county but it is unlikely they will get in and we really don't have any other school options unless we want to pay for private school.

 

If I have the girls home next year though something has to change. I'm sick of hounding them about school work. My oldest has never been as defiant about school work as my 10 yo but she mopes around and just doesn't do it. Last year I felt like all I did was hound her to do her work which is a big part of the reason she's at school this year. Now we just hound her to do her homework. I feel like it's happening again with my younger dd. I know I need some better consequences if they don't do work because right now they know they can get away with it. Neither is good at working independently. I know I have messed up there. With both of them I wind up sitting with them pretty much the entire time which I feel shouldn't be necessary at their ages. I did have dd doing TT independently but I discovered she was copying answers and skipping explanations and really wasn't understanding the lessons.

 

The worst part of the day is history. I love history and I really like the MFW history we are doing this year. It is mostly me reading to dd but every day I have to hear how much she can't stand history. I don't really think it is the curriculum. I think she'd hate any of them. She also despises math but I obviously can't skip that either. I did switch her out of TT which she hated to Saxon which she complains about less but I don't think she'd like any math program. She hates grammar as well but she's doing GWG 5 which she can usually get through in around 20 minutes and I don't think anything else would be better. I think dd would do Geography, Latin, and Art and spend the rest of the day drawing if given a choice. I think part of it is she's decided she's going to school and doesn't want to do any of the work I assign her. She has said she'd have no trouble getting "real" schoolwork done.

[FriedClams]

My first thought is - what's her currency? Does she like time with friends? sports? internet? video games? sleeping in? staying up late?

 

Whatever it is, I'd let her know, sweet and calmly, that her attitude isn't working and should it continue - then X is gone. Dawdle in school - no friends this weekend (or whatever it is). If it's really bad I'd make a list of all the fun things she can lose for her attitude. Every time it happens - go cross one off the list. No discussion. Just mark it off. And stick with it.

 

I would be kind and firm.

 

And I would let he know how much you love her and how you and your DH will decide where she goes to school - not her.

 

You are the mom!! You can do it!!

[5LittleMonkeys]

My first thought is - what's her currency? Does she like time with friends? sports? internet? video games? sleeping in? staying up late?

 

Whatever it is, I'd let her know, sweet and calmly, that her attitude isn't working and should it continue - then X is gone. Dawdle in school - no friends this weekend (or whatever it is). If it's really bad I'd make a list of all the fun things she can lose for her attitude. Every time it happens - go cross one off the list. No discussion. Just mark it off. And stick with it.

 

I would be kind and firm.

 

And I would let he know how much you love her and how you and your DH will decide where she goes to school - not her.

 

You are the mom!! You can do it!!

 

This is really excellent advice and really hard to adhere to if you aren't in the practice of doing so all the time. However, if you can discipline yourself to adhere to this method it is effective.

 

My oldest, just today, lost the privilege of doing her schoolwork in her room, for a week. It was taking her a very long time to finish a 20 minute assignment so I went up to see if she needed help and found her on the computer. Now, granted she was looking information for a personal project (not school related) so it isn't as if she were playing a game or something but the rule is NO computer when you are doing schoolwork. She knew the rule because it is on the list that is posted on our pantry door. It's number 3. So I simply said, "number 3" and turned around and went back downstairs. No argument, no yelling...she came downstairs and sat at the table. She knew that if she argued or whined she would have been violating numbers 1 and 2.

 

I found that in order to keep myself accountable I had to make a list of infractions and consequences. I listed the top 10 problems we were having and established a consequence for each. Everyone signed the bottom of the paper. I try to make the consequences appropriate for each dc so I have 4 columns of those. Each dc has thier currency, as SWM put it.

 

I agree also with telling your dd that she needs to stop being disrespectful to you and your dh by telling everyone that she is going to ps. I would tell her in no uncertain terms that the work you provide her is indeed REAL school and she is expected to do it and do it properly or she will be repeating whatever grade she is in right now. My dd11 is going to be repeating 6th grade next year, not so much due to bad attitude as it is to give her another year to work on growing in maturity before we start a heavier middle school workload. My point being is that you need to establish control here. From your post it sounds as if maybe she has manipulated control into her court. Not to be harsh, but you need to put her back into her place...but in a loving and nurturing way. Explain to her how she is setting herself up for failure and tell her what will happen if she continues on this path of defiance. (Gets farther and farther behind in her studies, the work becomes overwhelming because she hasn't mastered the skills she needs, gets a worse attitude about school, does poorly in highschool...you see where I'm going with this.) Most of all she needs to know that her actions have consequences; short term and long term.

 

As for having to sit with them to get their work done...if you haven't trained them to work independently then you are going to have to bite the bullet and sit with them. I still sit with dd11 for most of her work and I do writing and Latin with my oldest still. Even wtih the subjects she can do on her own I still meet with her before and after to make sure she understands the lesson and then again to check her work. It is hard to fit everyone in but it is a necessity.

 

Once you can get the attitudes under control and she is doing her work then you could discuss with her other options for those subjects she doesn't like doing. For example, you said she liked art, so would a unit study based history work better for her? Something with a lot of activities or lapbooks? For math, have you tried enticing her to get her weekly work done by awarding a day of just math games or maybe a day with no math at all? As for grammar, are you sure she just hates it or does she not like it because she doesn't understand it? I would tell her that you will explore ways of making school more enjoyable for her AFTER she starts behaving and has provided a track record for having a good attitude. (edited to add: I just wanted to say that you may find that once you squelch this bad attitude of hers she may find that she doesn't hate these subjects as much as she thought she did. When you have that darkness hanging over you all the time everything seems to look bad to you.)

 

I know its all hard...I've been there. My oldest spent weeks in her room with nothing to do when we first started homescooling because she decided that being homeschooled meant she could do whatever she wanted. I wasn't sure how to deal with that at first but then I remembered that I was the adult, I was the parent, and I had control. She was very mad at me for a while but she got over it and now we get along beautifully...except for when she violates rules 1 through 10.;)

 

:grouphug: to you and I hope you can find some resolution.

Edited February 2, 2011 by 5LittleMonkeys

[Down_the_Rabbit_Hole]

In the past I have made a contract for my kids. In the contract it states when I am available for school, when work is due and the penalties if late(usually monetarily, something like .50), work will be done before all none school activities can happen, what constitutes work completed and attitude, also when the school day starts and ends. It also states that if they want to do school differently, they are responsible for monetarily reimbursing the family funds for the curriculum we bought and then they are responsible for continuing their education by themselves (which includes registering themselves, getting their supplies and getting there, as well as anything else that might come up).

At the beginning of the school year we go over the contract and I explain the whys behind it. they didn't necessarily like the contract but it helped me through the years I needed it. If they argued about work I just showed them the contract and my argument was made. It was about middle school age when I needed these contracts and the contract signing only happened a few years, after that they were no longer necessary.

[AmyinMD]

My first thought is - what's her currency? Does she like time with friends? sports? internet? video games? sleeping in? staying up late?

 

 

Her I-Pod and sleeping in are her currency. If she has to get up before 9 am she complains all day. She is aware the school bus comes at 7:15 so I don't see her liking to get up for that. I am not a morning person either and we have never done much schoolwork before 10 am but I may start getting her up early if she has a bad attitude. My youngest is gone from 12:45-4:00 for preschool and that is the best time for me to help kids with schoolwork. I'd like her to do some things she can be a bit more independent with in the mornings and then we could finish up while ds is at preschool. My plan has been to keep her I-Pod each day until schoolwork is done. I do like the idea of adding in another consequence if her attitude is bad.

 

So much of my focus lately has been on my 3 year old and I know dd has used that to her advantage. We just transferred ds from EI to Special Ed which was a big ordeal. He's also been losing verbal skills so we've been dealing with a bunch of doctor's visits for that. Plus I've been so worried I'm having a hard time staying on top of everything like I should.

[Capt_Uhura]

I found that in order to keep myself accountable I had to make a list of infractions and consequences. I listed the top 10 problems we were having and established a consequence for each. Everyone signed the bottom of the paper. I try to make the consequences appropriate for each dc so I have 4 columns of those. Each dc has thier currency, as SWM put it.

 

 

 

Sometimes the solutions are so simple. Must. ponder. further.

[ELaurie]

that requires my dc to earn all of their screen time. They don't have IPads. but if they did, time spent using an IPad to do non-school related activities would be included.

 

I found that I was giving too many reminders and failing to be consistent with consequences (or rewards for a job well done).

 

Someone on the forums recommended a website called Celebrate Calm and I listened to a couple of their radio broadcasts, and then ordered some of their Calm Parenting CDs when they were on sale during the holidays.

 

The CDs have been really helpful as a reminder to take a step back, and let my dc be responsible for their behavior and school work. If one of my goals is for them to be more independent, I need to provide opportunities for them to practice important related skills.

 

So, I set up a simple list of expectations; they need to be dressed with hair combed and teeth brushed by 9:00 in the morning; they need to be ready to start school by 9:30, they have the option to start school earlier if they wish, all school work needs to be completed by 4:00; they need to practice their instruments by 7:30, be ready for bed by 8:30, and in bed by 9:00.

 

They can earn 10 minutes screen time for each of the above; they lose 10 minutes screen time for arguing with me, fighting with each other, and misusing screen time (going over the agreed upon number of minutes for using their IPOD, DX, Wii, computer games, or watching TV.) They have fewer ways to earn screen time on teh weekends, so if they want to watch a movie or a sporting event, they need to plan ahead and allocate their screen time accordingly.

 

I rarely let them use more than 20 minutes screen time on weeknights, or more than two hours on a given day (perhaps a 90 minute movie plus a 20 minute computer game) on weekends.

 

What I like about it is that the rules are clear and concise; they're motivated to earn their "currency," I no longer nag and remind them (as much - I'm still working on this :)) they are responsible for taking initiative to earn screen time (or not) and consequences for infractions are clear and simple to implement.

 

So far, my youngest, who has the stronger personality of the two, seems relieved to know exactly what to expect from the new system, and he has settled down a lot.

 

I'm sorry for all of the stress you're experiencingight now, no doubt that makes things harder. I hope you will find the tools you need to help your dd.

 

:grouphug:

[DaisyMay]

She knew the rule because it is on the list that is posted on our pantry door. It's number 3. So I simply said, "number 3" and turned around and went back downstairs. No argument, no yelling...she came downstairs and sat at the table. She knew that if she argued or whined she would have been violating numbers 1 and 2.

 

.....except for when she violates rules 1 through 10.;)

 

:grouphug: to you and I hope you can find some resolution.

 

What are your rules? I really like the idea of posting them. My 13ds is really starting to give me attitude and I can't stand it!!

 

Thanks!

Gayle

[5LittleMonkeys]

What are your rules? I really like the idea of posting them. My 13ds is really starting to give me attitude and I can't stand it!!

 

Thanks!

Gayle

 

Everyone's rules should reflect the specific problems they are having and the consequences are specific to each child. Our list changes when new problems arise or when bad habits have been broken. Usually once a month I will look over it and see if any changes need to be made.

 

Here are our rules right now; the consequences listed are specific to my dd13

 

1. No arguing - loose all screen time for 24 hours

2. No whining - loose all screen time for 24 hours

3. No computer during school time - loose screen time for the rest of the day and have to do school at the dining room table for 5 days.

4. No talking disrespectfully (no smart mouth) - write out the the definition of respect and disrespect then write an apology of no less than 5 lines to the person you were disrespectful to. Carry out 3 acts of kindness for the offended person.

5. No bickering (between siblings) within earshot of mom. - Complete one of mom's daily chores.

6. No snacking except at designated snack times - Loose snacking privileges for 2 days.

7. Daily work has to be completed by 6pm - No screen time until work is completed\no outside activities or friends over.

8. No sloppy work turned in - Re-do the work in its entirety.

9. All daily chores must be completed by 8pm - No screen time until work is completed\no outside activities or friends over.

10. Do not try to get out of or modify a consequence - Consequence holds and loose screen time for 24 hours.

 

As you can see my oldest's currency is screen time. I keep track of the no screen time hours too. For example if she violates 1, 2 and 10 in one day she will loose screen time for 72 hours. In the beginning this was a bit of a pain for me to have to keep track of it but now she will rarely violate more than one in a day. Numbers 1,2,4,5 and 10 haven't ever been off the list. Those are ongoing issues with my dc. The list isn't foolproof either; it requires me to enforce it. There have been days, you know those days, when I forget I have a list and I violate quite a few of the rules too.:tongue_smilie:

[DaisyMay]

Thank you for posting those! Some definitely fit my situation, so I think I'll give it a try. I appreciate the inspiration :)

 

Gayle