Any Cancadians here who have used the Royal Conservatory of Music music theory

[Gwen in VA]

I am teaching a music theory class, and I absolutely love the Canadian texts and workbooks!

 

My kids will finish work preparing them for the level 2 theory exam this spring. We're not going to drive to Canada, and the exams don't seem to be offered outside Canada, so they won't actually take the exam, but I am curious --

 

The program is pretty rigorous. It goes up to level 8. Are the upper levels usually done at the college level?

 

What level test loosely corresponds to what grade level? (I know it depends on the kid, but......do high schoolers often graduate having completed level 5, or would that be unusually high?)

 

What level theory would a "normal" kid who is interested in music but only practicing 2 hours a day or so (so not planning on becoming a professional performer) work through by the end of high school?

 

Any thoughts are appreciated -- I have poked around on the web a bit but haven't been able to figure out if the upper levels are still considered routine high school materials or if they are really geared toward pre-professional students in college.

[Moira in MA]

Gwen

 

The Royal Conservatory of Music has a program in the US. It is called the 'national music certificate program'. Used to be the Royal American Conservatory of Music but they changed that -- I wonder why? <grin>

 

My dd's have taken the exam -- eldest has grade 8, younger is taking grade 5 this December. Students usually are expected to have grade 8 to be accepted to college programs. Later practical levels have required theory exams in order to complete the practical grade.

 

You didn't mention instrument so I'll just link to the main sitehttp://www.nationalmusiccertificate.org/index.html#

 

HTH

~Moira

[Gwen in VA]

Thank you so much, Moira!

 

Students usually are expected to have grade 8 to be accepted to college programs. Later practical levels have required theory exams in order to complete the practical grade.

 

I guess I'm a bit confused -- what do you mean by expected to have grade 8 to be accepted to college programs?

 

My daughter plays the piano, but her teacher has never mentioned this program and I've never heard of it. Of course, the closest examination center is three hours away, so that may be part of the problem!

 

I bumped into the RCM while looking for music theory programs, and I love the book we're working through. At this point, I am only interested in the theory portion. Having her take the theory exam to verify what we're doing at home would be nice.

 

What age is your older child who is doing grade 8? And what age is your younger child who is doing grade 5?

 

My dd is 13 and we will be done with the three levels of music theory rudiments (pre-harmony) by June. We're hoping to do one or two of the harmony levels next year. I have no idea what level of piano she would be at. She will be competing in Music Festival this year at level "very difficult 1" or "very difficult 2" -- her teacher hasn't decided yet -- but I don't know how that would compare with anything else.

[Moira in MA]

Gwen

 

Not sure I really know that much more than you but when I was first looking at the exams I checked out the Canadian site and found out how the provinces handle the examinations: http://www.rcmexaminations.org/acadinfo/accreditation.htm.

 

For instance, Grade 8 Practical with Grade 2 Rudiments is given a Grade 12 music credit in Ontario, in Nova Scotia you need the Grade 3 History in addition.

 

My elder dd took grades 7 & 8 practical w/grade 2 rudiments when she was a sophomore (she had intended to try to complete the grade 10 practicals by the end of high school but has since backed off -- it was sucking all the joy out of her music practice.

 

My younger dd is taking Grade 5 practical and basic rudiments next month, she is a sophomore.

 

The Grade 3 Harmony exam is supposed to be a bear, it represents a huge step up from the basic, intermediate and advanced rudiments. The girls' teacher recommends taking Introductory Harmony before attempting Grade 3 Harmony (Basic)

 

HTH

~Moira

Edited November 14, 2009 by Moira in MA

[Gwen in VA]

Thank you, Moira!

[Storm Bay]

To get into a university music program, you need at least a grade 6 piano level for studying a different instrument, and I guess grade 8 or higher to study piano. That would be the performance exam, which covers pieces, studies, tehnique, sight reading & ear tests. I can no longer remember which theory exams go with which grades, but I know when I took them, I just did the last Rudiments of theory exam rather than do them all. You have to have that in order to do Harmony, Counterpoint, etc. There's also history. You can take exams in the States, as someone else mentioned.

 

The last intermediate exam is Grade 9. Grade 10 & ARCT are the senior/advanced exams with RCMT. As for the Rudiments of Theory, I don't know if the book I still have is still in print or not. I bought the one that covered all 3 levels.

[Gwen in VA]

Thanks!

 

Karin, I assume that when you say you need at least a grade 8 or higher to get into a university music program, you are talking about a university music program in Canada? (I can't imagine any set of schools in the US being so organized as to all require the same thing!) Do correct me if you actually mean music schools in the US!

 

I am really impressed by the educational materials! I am really happy with the RCM workbook we bought that covers all three levels of music theory, an all-in-one book by Mark Sarnecki. It is a terrific theory book! And I just ordered two of the ear-training curricula -- there are a bunch, and none of them have much info written up, so dd and I flipped a coin and chose two. We'll see.....

 

 

I guess I need to talk with some music professionals in our area and elsewhere to find out if this RCM testing thing is something we want to or need to get into.

 

Driving three hours each way to do a test seems a bit demented, so I need to be pretty sure that the RCM certificate program will really assist dd to reach her goals before I do all of that driving!

Edited November 15, 2009 by Gwen in VA

[Ruth in Canada]

The expected level for entrance to a university level music program varies by university and by program. "Performance" programs at good music schools can have very high standards--I was looking at one that said that the audition repertoire should be at the associates level. But I've also seen grade 8, 9 and 10 as the suggested level. In general, they are not asking that you already have the piece of paper from the RCM--they are just giving you an indication of what level of piece you are expected to perform at your audition. (You can look up the pieces in the syllabus book.) They also may give recommended theory levels. DD is planning to have grade 10 piano and grade 8 voice--both the performance and the theory/history--done by the end of high school. On her transcript, we will indicate that grades 9 and 10 (with the co requisite theory and history) are university-level courses because the local schools would give grade 12 credit for grade 8 RCM in piano. It is a lot of work--but it's also giving her exam taking and audition practice and a goal--both good things to have when homeschooling.

[Janet in Toronto]

I did the Grade 8 RCM Piano exam when I was in Grade 8 in public school. I then dropped piano and continued on with Harmony, Counterpoint, and Analysis (because I was interested....) and did those exams while I was in high school. I started piano when I was about 7 and only did Grade 6 and Grade 8 piano exams.

 

My roommate in university was a piano performance major and had her ARCT (Associate of the Royal Conservatory of Music). While Grade 8 Practical gets you a Grade 12 music credit, candidates for music programs at university normally are playing well above that level.

 

This page at the RCM website suggests pairings of performance and theory levels.

 

[interesting Aside: I have a friend who teaches at the Glenn Gould School at the Royal Conservatory (pre-professional program) and she said that the exam program was originally (way back) set up as a way to sort of regulate piano teaching. Examiners would travel across the country doing the tests and so parents could evaluate how well their child's teacher was working with them. It sort of standardized private music instruction.]

[Storm Bay]

The expected level for entrance to a university level music program varies by university and by program. "Performance" programs at good music schools can have very high standards--I was looking at one that said that the audition repertoire should be at the associates level. But I've also seen grade 8, 9 and 10 as the suggested level. In general, they are not asking that you already have the piece of paper from the RCM--they are just giving you an indication of what level of piece you are expected to perform at your audition. (You can look up the pieces in the syllabus book.) They also may give recommended theory levels. DD is planning to have grade 10 piano and grade 8 voice--both the performance and the theory/history--done by the end of high school. On her transcript, we will indicate that grades 9 and 10 (with the co requisite theory and history) are university-level courses because the local schools would give grade 12 credit for grade 8 RCM in piano. It is a lot of work--but it's also giving her exam taking and audition practice and a goal--both good things to have when homeschooling.

 

 

Yes, I should have been clear that different schools have different expectations, but that it's at least grade 8. Not the certificate, as Ruth said, but to be able to play at that level. While I quit for 11 years at almost 17 when I was in the States, I think I did my grade 8 exam in grade 9 school, but my teacher delayed taking any exams for a long time since she didn't want us to spend all our time learning pieces for exams until we were ready for about a grade 6 exam. However, many students start lessons later or take longer to get to various skill levels.

 

I do remember having at least one student who wanted to major in a different instrument who was trying to get their grade 6 exam in piano, or at least prepare at that level. It's been a long time, as I've been in the States since I got married.

 

As for the theory, that is a new book. Mine was a later edition of a book from the 1960s by a woman. I knew it went out of print, because I looked for another copy a few years ago, and I haven't seen the new one. I'll write it down, though, because I may either order it myself or have my mother pick one up sometime when she visits Vancouver, because I want my dc to do this in high school even if they don't play any instruments. So far, my girls aren't interested & ds is split between the (French) horn & the cello. However, the only band/orchestra experience nearby is band, so he'd have to play horn. But they all have enough music to take theory as part of a music elective (mandatory in our home school!) in high school.

Edited November 16, 2009 by Karin

[Guest rmarley]

Nicely shared the topic with detailed information and with good discussion ideas.