What constitutes "Honors"? (related to public school)

[Jenn in CA]

OK, we just joined a homeschool charter school (we get to hs, we get ps money for curriculum, we have to meet CA state standards). I can request that some of our classes be designated Honors by making them more "rigorous." After I submitted my Honors English plan, I heard back that I need to assign 8 5-page papers [one of those can be a research paper].

 

My plan was a weekly 1-2 page essay, a few (3-4?) 4+ page papers, and an 8-page research paper. That's still a year total of at least 56 pp.

 

To me, 8 5-pagers seems excessive. Any thoughts? Should I care about Honors status?

 

My oldest has already taken college composition and got an A. But those long papers are like pulling teeth. The counselor said, "If he had college comp in 10th you don't want to go backwards by only taking regular English afterwards." But, I'm thinking colleges will be more impressed by the college class than the honors classes anyway. My kids test well, they are bright and take lots of college classes. Would being in regular English hurt the transcript?

 

I'm feeling very torn between wanting that Honors label, but not wanting to do play their stupid game. However, switching to regular instead of honors would also take a lot of pressure off me.

 

On the other hand, maybe 8 5-page papers is the norm and I need to expect more out of my kids. I will say that *I'm* very afraid of what the grief *I* will get for assigning so many long papers.

 

Any resources for helping your kids write longer papers? They are good at organizing, and good at the 5-paragraph structure, but they haven't done much that was very long (other than the college class which nearly killed us both).

 

Help!!

Edited September 10, 2009 by Jenn in CA

[Jenn in CA]

Bump! Please... help!

[8filltheheart]

OK, we just joined a homeschool charter school (we get to hs, we get ps money for curriculum, we have to meet CA state standards). I can request that some of our classes be designated Honors by making them more "rigorous." After I submitted my Honors English plan, I heard back that I need to assign 8 5-page papers [one of those can be a research paper].

 

My plan was a weekly 1-2 page essay, a few (3-4?) 4+ page papers, and an 8-page research paper. That's still a year total of at least 56 pp.

 

To me, 8 5-pagers seems excessive. Any thoughts? Should I care about Honors status?

 

My oldest has already taken college composition and got an A. But those long papers are like pulling teeth. The counselor said, "If he had college comp in 10th you don't want to go backwards by only taking regular English afterwards." But, I'm thinking colleges will be more impressed by the college class than the honors classes anyway. My kids test well, they are bright and take lots of college classes. Would being in regular English hurt the transcript?

 

I'm feeling very torn between wanting that Honors label, but not wanting to do play their stupid game. However, switching to regular instead of honors would also take a lot of pressure off me.

 

On the other hand, maybe 8 5-page papers is the norm and I need to expect more out of my kids. I will say that *I'm* very afraid of what the grief *I* will get for assigning so many long papers.

 

Any resources for helping your kids write longer papers? They are good at organizing, and good at the 5-paragraph structure, but they haven't done much that was very long (other than the college class which nearly killed us both).

 

Help!!

 

My 10th grader is writing a 5-8 pg paper/week, so I don't think 8 is excessive.

[Julie in MN]

OK, we just joined a homeschool charter school (we get to hs, we get ps money for curriculum, we have to meet CA state standards). I can request that some of our classes be designated Honors by making them more "rigorous." After I submitted my Honors English plan, I heard back that I need to assign 8 5-page papers [one of those can be a research paper].

 

My plan was a weekly 1-2 page essay, a few (3-4?) 4+ page papers, and an 8-page research paper. That's still a year total of at least 56 pp.

 

To me, 8 5-pagers seems excessive. Any thoughts? Should I care about Honors status?

 

My oldest has already taken college composition and got an A. But those long papers are like pulling teeth. The counselor said, "If he had college comp in 10th you don't want to go backwards by only taking regular English afterwards." But, I'm thinking colleges will be more impressed by the college class than the honors classes anyway. My kids test well, they are bright and take lots of college classes. Would being in regular English hurt the transcript?

 

I'm feeling very torn between wanting that Honors label, but not wanting to do play their stupid game. However, switching to regular instead of honors would also take a lot of pressure off me.

 

On the other hand, maybe 8 5-page papers is the norm and I need to expect more out of my kids. I will say that *I'm* very afraid of what the grief *I* will get for assigning so many long papers.

 

Any resources for helping your kids write longer papers? They are good at organizing, and good at the 5-paragraph structure, but they haven't done much that was very long (other than the college class which nearly killed us both).

 

Help!!

 

You're asking about public school? My oldest was public schooled. He was in the "honors" classes all through elementary & middle school, but not in high school. In our local school, they no longer "placed" kids in honors according to ability, but instead basically had them "try out" or "apply" to be in honors classes. Things like teacher recommendations & willingness to do more work were what counted. When my son balked, I talked to the teachers & they admitted that there would be no extra books read or the like, but just more paperwork.

 

So yes, probably more papers written.

 

However, I wouldn't get too scared. The standards for high school writing as far as I can tell are not very intense. My son, as I said, wasn't in honors, but he got straight A's and such. He wrote on his college newspaper when he had time. His high school papers were more along the line of creative writing, or writing from an inventive perspective, etc. I rarely saw anything scholarly in terms of footnotes and such.

 

But if you want your kids to learn scholarly writing (which would be great), there are programs you could use where lots of writing is really expected. I'm thinking of Michael Clay Thompson materials or Stobaugh's writing stuff. Lots of writing there.

 

Just some thoughts,

Julie

[Susan C.]

My son didn't even write that many papers in his college English 101 and 102 classes. In fact, he said my English was much harder than college's.

 

I wouldn't have a problem with 8 papers for the year, just the 5 pgs. each. A lot of papers are 1-2 pages, we do all shorter papers except for a research paper.

[Jenn in CA]

momof7, WOW, that's amazing to me. Does your student require a lot of help or just "crank them out?" And are they always analytical-type papers, or creative, or a mix?

 

Like Susan C. said, for me it's the length, not the number.

 

But, your experience does make me feel better that it's doable.

 

Julie C., good point about the expectation not being too high.

 

I'm also still stuck on "Is the Honors label worth pursuing for college apps."

[8filltheheart]

momof7, WOW, that's amazing to me. Does your student require a lot of help or just "crank them out?" And are they always analytical-type papers, or creative, or a mix?

 

I'm also still stuck on "Is the Honors label worth pursuing for college apps."

 

No, my dd does not require a lot of help. She has been writing a paper per week since 3rd grade. (obviously much shorter way back then!!:D)

 

Her papers are always analytical-type papers. For example, some of the topics she has written about so far this yr are one comparing different forms of gov't (democracy, fascism, and communism), one on the differences between Protestant and Catholic views of sanctifying grace, and one on Aristotle and the study rhetoric.

 

She writes them, turns them in, we evaluate them together, and then she has to re-write them.

 

As far as the "honors label for college apps," I didn't label anything honors on my oldest's transcript and I do not plan on labeling anything honors on dd's. I don't believe that admissions officers are going to take a mom-labeled honors course as meaning much.

 

My objective isn't about a label as much as forming excellent writing skills, learning to write analytically (which is a skill she is still learning as a 10th grader), and forming independence so that when she does go to college it isn't about transition, it is simply about completing assignments.

 

(sorry if this isn't coherent. It is 230 am and I woke up with pregnancy-induced heartburn and cannot get back to sleep!)

[Jenn in CA]

You're doing a great job homeschooling! thanks for the insight.