I wouldn't mind it, but we always read in my big bed. Maybe I should have some fiddly stuff nearby and available.

Oh, I'm so glad it's not just us, Eagle! We're only on page 27, and we're all bored to death. They made it through The Boxcar Children happily, and then they played Boxcar Children for weeks afterwards, which shocked me. I thought it would be way too old-fashioned for them.

First, I should add that the 8-year old is much better at listening. I don't think she is loving Padfington yet, but she is generally much more eager to listen in. I think maybe the 6-year old just isn't ready yet. She is technically not six until July. Maybe I'm rushing her on this. I think it really might depend on the book for her for awhile. I have looked at FIAR so many times. But I just can't wrap my head around it. I don't think it's a good fit for ME.

I've had my heart set on a lit-based curriculum for my 6 and 8-year old daughters next year. But I'm noticing more and more that neither of them are great at listening to chapter books, and forget audio books altogether. I think I'm a pretty darn great narrator (I do voices!), and I really enjoy reading aloud to them. I keep thinking my enthusiasm will be contagious, yet we keep slogging along, with the 6-year old often claiming to be bored. Is it my book choices? We just started A Bear Called Paddington, and I can tell they are struggling. We don't have this issue with picture books at all. Will a lit-based curriculum exacerbate their boredom or help them improve their listening/audial-learning skills?

I've never considered CLE until reading through a couple of these math threads this week. Am I reading it correctly that I have to pay for a placement test AND a teacher's guide to go with that test, though?

We are a Waldorf-inspired family throughout the early years, and this document pretty much summarizes my outlook. Some would call it unschooling, but it's also just being at home together. :-) (From the helpful files of Marsha Johnson' Yahoo group): A Week in the Home Kindergarten! (For the child who is 4 years old to not yet six by June of the calendar year) Daily Rhythm is the key to the home kindergarten experience for families, including daily focus activity and morning routines. The child is yet living in the spiritual world, in the heavens, dreamy, and perceiving the environment as only an integral part of their own ‘wholeness’, not individuated, not intellectuated, not abstracted. The young child still feels part and wholly in the surrounding world, in the home, in the yard, in the world, with mother and father and siblings…….and needs to be left in this dreamy time, protected, nurtured, left to wonder and held in the rhythm of the day and week and month and year. We have been led to believe that we must stimulate children in order to provoke their intellectual and physical development. This is wrong thinking, from the spiritual educator point of view. Young children naturally are developing inner and outer forces that will carry them forward to the times when they are able and prepared to take on other tasks of education, and the body sends us very clear clues as to when this stage or that stage is occurring. In the meantime, surround the young child with the warmth and security of knowing that the adults are present, caring, and have promised to keep the rhythm that the child craves. In this way, the most excellent groundwork will be laid for the future tasks of these precious human souls. In your home, create and hold to the idea that each week day will have some sort of focus. Remember the old nursery rhyme? Wash on Monday, Iron on Tuesday, and so on. This is ancient knowledge passed down to use via oral history, and sound advice for any home maker and family. The Waldorf Kindergarten tries to replicate the home environment, if you think about it, and so it is natural and easy to use these ideas in your home. One problem to address before beginning this work is to go about your home and evaluate your possessions and your furniture: is your home simple and refreshing to live in, or is it crowded with objects? Can you reduce the clutter and amount of ‘stuff’ in the main areas of the home, so that you and your child can find and access the simple tools that are needed for each day? Read my article on the Influence of the Environment on Young Children on this website for more ideas on how to simplify your home surroundings. The one key idea must be, a place for everything, and everything in its place! In this way, life is likely to be much smoother in the day to day workings in the home Kindergarten. The second key item is, is there beauty? Does the eye of the beholder perceive something that is lovely to see? Beauty is not to be confused with economic value: a simple wooden table, scarred from decades of holding dishes of warm food for families, with a single jar of flowers from the yard, is beautiful. Strive for this feeling in your home, and allow your child to observe your striving. With these two thoughts in mind, we can begin to enter into the daily rhythm of the young child at home. When you have arranged your bed times and bed time routine, so that this young child is receiving 11-12 hours of sleep each night, perhaps going to bed at 7 pm, each night, then the child will naturally awaken when the sun is rising and peeping over the horizon. Leave the blinds open or open them after the child falls asleep so that the sunny light will enter the room and bathe the child in its golden light……so here we have rising in the morning rather than sleeping in or suffering sleep deprivation. This is essential to the success of your homeschool experience: well rested children and parents. During your kindergarten mornings, turn off the phones, disconnect radios or cd players, allow the quiet of your home to comfort and support you. Sing songs for transitions, short ones you can make up easily and remember, pick a main song for each day so that your child knows what is coming today. A simple daily rhythm includes these elements: Rising! Self-cleaning, tidy bedroom, dressing Prepare Breakfast, set table Enjoy the first meal of the day together Washing Up Morning Chores: sweep the floors, feed and clean up after animals, dry dishes, clean table and chairs, recycle and compost any leftovers, and so on. Morning Focus: Rotate these activities, begin at 9 am. Baking/Cooking Day--Monday Washing and Ironing Day--Tuesday Sewing/handwork Day---Wednesday Garden Day---Thursday Painting Day---Friday The morning focus should be accompanied by singing of songs related to that activity: the muffin man is good for baking, and so on….keep baskets around with the items needed for those days, and take them out to symbolize the focus of the morning for the child. On Mondays, gather the items needed to bake rolls or a loaf of bread or crackers, you can vary the recipes but keep it to maybe 3 or 4 good ones. Make an extra loaf to take to a neighbor or share with friends in the afternoon. The baking aprons come off their hooks, the hands are washed, then we concentrate on our task: kneading, rolling, shaping, and this is not rushed but a pleasant activity in a quiet kitchen…. When the bread is resting and rising, clean the dishes and counters and floor. Tuesdays: Use old fashioned methods: on washing day, use a handboard and a tub of warm soapy water to hand wash clothing, rinse, and hang up with clothespin, iron pillow cases and handkerchiefs and let child spray on the water, and so on. Include the child naturally in the activities. Find a small wooden ironing board and play iron and child can help press the hankies or dishtowels. Fill a bucket with warm soapy water and small rags, and wash wash wash! Wash the front of the frig, wash the counters, the tables, the railings, and so on….clean and dust the piano, sing songs while you work, use a small apron for the child and a big one for you! Have fun bringing sparkles to your home. Wednesdays Handwork/Sewing Day: Create a sewing basket with pieces of wool felt, large thick wool yarn, and pin cushion with big eyed sharp needles and button thread (strong). Cut out shapes from the felt and child can sew a bean bag, an ornament, a sachet, or other simple object from the felt. Teach the child to fingerknit the yarn and then stitch the fingerknitting together to make doll house rugs, coasters, make pony reins, or braid the fingerknitting together to make long braids for ropes. While the child works on this, you can be knitting a sweater, a scarf, crocheting, sewing your own project, etc. Work together on these projects each week and be sure to finish the projects. As the festivals approach, use this time to make special projects or gifts for family members. Thursdays Garden day in winter can still be spent with the outdoor chores that need to be done, washing porch, clipping and trimming, cleaning tools, and so on. It can also include arranging the nature table in your home, creating new trellises, harvesting crops, planting, or other outdoor tasks. In snowy climates, this could include creating bird feeders, and clearing ice from the bird bath. This day is spent outdoors for this hour, and is very enjoyable for children, regardless of the weather! It is also a good morning to invite friends to come over and work together outside. Or go to their homes and help. Fridays: Painting Day is a day to enjoy playing with colors on damp water color paper: set up the painting supplies, jar of water, brush, 1-2 jars of paint (red, blue or yellow), paint rag, paper is soaked for 4-5 minutes and laid on the paint board. Child paints feelings and ideas from self, not objects or guided painting at the K age. Finding out what happens and learning to rinse the brush between colors is a skill! Parent can also pre-mix colors (i.e. green or purple or orange) to allow child to paint a different color or two. Often children enjoy painting several pictures so have paper ready (round corners of the paper before soaking, you can vary sizes and shapes if you like, can be square, rectangular, circular, larger or smaller). Afterwards, clean up, wash hands, and so on. DAILY SCHEDULE: 7 am rise and above tasks 9 – 10 am Focus Activity for the Day 10 – 11 am Snack, and Play time Try to go outside for 30 minutes 11 –11:30 am: Story/Circle Time 11:30-12 Seasonal Art Time 12pm Clean Up Time 12:15 Lunch Free Afternoons…..play, rest, friends, go outside….. STORY CIRCLE TIME: --do the same circle for the season: one Fall, one Winter, one Spring. The child should really know the songs and poems by the end of the season (12 weeks) and be able to practically say and sing it by him or herself. Keep the same order and the same words to the songs. Pick 5-10 songs and poems for the season and learn them by heart! Use nursery rhymes, your own songs from childhood, add new ones from Sing Through the Day or other resources. There are sample circles on this website. Add movements and motions to the songs and poems. A Journey Through Time in Verse and Rhyme will keep you busy for years. Use a circle theme in your movements, following the path of the planets! Go round and round, and sing/step/skip and move together. Part of this time can include a game or two: children in the K love to hide and seek an object, perhaps Little Tommy Gnome is hidden somewhere and we need to find him! Arrive at a seated place during the last song (ring around a rosy) and then enjoy 3-4 fingerplays. Work with your child to be sure the motions are correct………have fun with these, there are several books on line that have dozens and dozens of fingerplays. Add 1-2 floor exercise: roll like logs, creep like snails, enjoy some movement on the floor, keep it is In the imagination and continue to grow quieter as the time passes……….bringing it in and in……..cover child with silks and sing a song about little brown bulbs, going to sleep, while the snow, falls so deep……..keep these floor exercises mild, and imitative, of course, you do them, too. Story Time: With a song, transition into the story time………as you light a beeswax candle on your little table or stump or whatever, a pretty setting to signal story time……… Glow Candle Glow With the Light of Stars Above And crystals below Light the candle with your Love Glow Candle Glow…..or use another verse Settle down and tell a story. Tell the same story every day for 1 week. Over the week end read and memorize another story. Use the Grimm stories but also include seasonal tale or your own religious tales or other fairy stories that you find appealing. Don’t read the story, tell it. Keep it short for littler ones, add time as they grow. One week of each month, tell nature tales: create a family of animals that your child sees and knows from your home area: rabbits, squirrels, birds, etc. and tell stories about their activities during the season on hand….add personalities but don’t create silly stuff like Papa Robin flying a superjet! Keep it simple, within the realm of possibility, Papa Robin found a Sparkling String one day….it was the ribbon from a birthday balloon………and he wove into the nest to make it pretty for Mama Robin……and so on. Children aged 4 need to hear simple daily stories about what happens in the world, children aged 5 and 6 can listen to longer Fairy Stories and enjoy them. End the story by allowing child to snuff candle after you rest for a few moments, together, to digest the tale…………..please do not discuss the story or ask the child questions etc about the story, let it rest and digest and you will tell it again tomorrow and so on……….leave the child to take the story content into themselves, breathe with it, and you will see some new things in their playing and pretend times. SEASONAL ART/PROJECTS: I have left time there for working on the various seasonal art or craft projects that you may be including in your work at home. This can also be coloring or drawing time for children who enjoy doing that, or you can make Martinmas Lanterns, work in the woodshop, decorate the home for the holidays, or other seasonal projects or ongoing work, maybe you are building a little playhouse or sanding wooden animals…..Whatever the project, be sure you are working on it, too, at that same time. Your child will imitate you in this work and other work. This can be working with beeswax, once a week, too. Clean Up: Tidy from the morning any tools or playthings, and enjoy lunch with blessing verse…. For Trees so Tall And Sky so Blue For Friends and food We thank you!

Nope. In fact, my oldest turns 8 in August, and we won't start any formal lessons until then. She taught herself to read when she was 5.5, so it has been really easy for me to be relaxed about her progression. Now that we're starting with some focused learning later this summer, I'm not sure what my soon-to-be-6-year old will do. I anticipate she will listen in on most of our read-alouds, but anything beyond that is not expected of her. If she decides to try some handwriting or wants to participate in our science experiments, that would be great. But I won't require it of her. I would actually like to plan some things to do with her that will just be kindy activities. Baking/gardening/art days. Something along those lines that I can give her some extra attention with.

Shhhhhhhh!!!! I've made up my mind. I've made up my mind. I've made up my mind. I've made up my mind. I've made up my mind. Lalalalalalalalalalalalalalala!!!!

Thanks for all of the feedback. I'm leaning heavily towards BYL (as of this moment!), simply because I am more comfortable with the book selections. If we went with BKSK, we would probably use K, a level recommended for ages 5-7, and that would be for my 6 and 8-year olds. And I would still be substituting several of the books. I have a feeling either program would ultimately be fine for us, and because of that, I may very well question my decision for months to come! But for now, I feel like it's time to wrap up all these weeks of research and finally just. pick. something. I've also never used a lit-based program before, so that's another point in BYL's favor -- if this turns out to be entirely the wrong approach for our family, it's not quite the huge investment.

Thank you for speaking to this issue, ocelotmom. I've always said you can never "unsee" something. And you can never "unhear" something either. I wouldn't label my daughter as overly sensitive, but even if she were, I believe it's my responsibility to protect that sensitivity as much as possible. With so much great literature out there, I don't understand the point of selecting books that are meant for older students. Just for the challenge? That's possible to do while also keeping children's social/emotional development in perspective. I know everyone has differing viewpoints on this, so thanks, again, for chiming in. (But really, how does it make sense to schedule a book like that alongside Winnie the Pooh?)

Have you looked at BYL Grade 6? "Continuing your journey through American History begun with Grade 5 using the series A History of Us by Joy Hakim, you will cover the Civil War through modern day. Choose a side in the tumultuous Civil War, learn what it was like to immigrate to America at the turn of the century, learn about the World Wars of the 20th century, and join the protests during the Civil Rights movement of the 1960s. You will continue your study of the 50 states, in order of their statehood." http://buildyourlibrary.com/purchase-grade-6-curriculum/

Sammish, BYL Year 3 looks AWESOME. Any program that includes "Mandy" is a winner in my book! After poring over the lists (for this year as well as the subsequent years we would use), I am wondering if I should just switch each year based on the lit for that year. Their history cycles are pretty similar, with the exception of method and materials used. For first grade, I am pretty okay with BKSK's selections, but I feel way, way more drawn to the selections for 2nd and 3rd from BYL. I think I'm just not confident with using BYL because we are coming at all of this as unschoolers, and I feel like I neeeeeeeeeed lots of direction. (And then I picture myself hating so much direction.) Gah!

I should add: I keep wondering whether I'm going to be able to trust BKSK's lit choices without pre-reading every single book. And, BYL actually has some of the same books in their program, but scheduled later. (Like "A Grain of Rice.")

Yep. That pretty much sums it up, Farrar. I also think an option would be to go with BYL and then just go completely rogue for history. Ugh. Can someone please decide for me??? :laugh:

Ah. Okay. Well, I may end up going your route then and trying to find used books because I really think we'd only use the RWH and maybe science from BKSK. I've got other plans for LA and math.

Thanks, Carla. Did you ever use BYL? Or, what book lists/curriculum have worked for you? It makes me feel better to hear that other people have had similar concerns to mine.

Wow, Michelle, I was under the impression that BKSK was selling the book packages at a great price, but I never added everything up myself. Maybe that's only if they were all new? I would feel much less apprehensive about using their RWH portion if I didn't have to spend close to $400 for that alone!

I have been stuck, stuck, stuck for months on whether we'd be better off with Build Your Library or BookShark. I prefer BookShark's detailed guide and approach to history, but their overall book list concerns me. Some of the selections seem way too mature(?) . . . heavy handed(?) . . . developmentally inappropriate(?) to me. My kids will turn 6 and 8 this summer, but if we go with BKSK, we would probably use their K package, simply because I think the materials look like they would still be interesting for the 8-year old, but not too advanced for the 6-year old. Anyway, as an example, here are the read-alouds for BKSK's K year: The Story of Dr. Dolittle The Arnold Lobel Book of Mother Goose The Llama Who Had No Pajama Richard Scarry's Please and Thank You Book My Father's Dragon Dolphin Adventure The Light at Tern Rock A Grain of Rice The Hundred Dresses Twenty and Ten The Boxcar Children James Herriot's Treasury for Children Dolphin Treasure Here's a Penny No Children, No Pets Little House in the Big Woods Beezus and Ramona Winnie the Pooh I've never read "Twenty and Ten," but after reading reviews of it, I have serious doubts about reading it to my kids. My oldest tried to read "The Hundred Dresses" a year or two ago, and she didn't understand it. She could read it just fine, but she didn't understand the concept of girls making fun of another girl because of the way she dressed. So I don't know that my 6-year old will understand it this year either. Those aren't the only two books that worry me, either. I much prefer the book choices in BYL, but as I mentioned, their history (using SOTW) isn't my cup of tea, and I would prefer more detail in the instructor's guide. Has anyone else experienced these concerns with these particular programs? And should I give one of these a go, or move on and look for a different lit-based program altogether?