Avila
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Posts posted by Avila
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I am Protestant, but I do not believe going to church is about our feelings, "experiencing God" with our feelings, or about how good the sermons are or whether the pastor is reaching our hearts most of the time, or any such things.
I think that this emphasis on our feelings and our own needs and wants in the church is a huge problem in some modern American Protestant churches.
I agree! Feelings change. Sometimes they are not real. God is always there. I don't always FEEL Him there, but that does not change the reality of His presence. It is so easy to get wrapped up in feelings and not see truth. I don't think that is a Catholic or non-Catholic issue. It is a human issue.
And it is a universal problem.
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Is the bolded above correct, or is the post below correct? Or have I forgotten what a mortal sin is?
Which is it? Sincere question.
CCC 2181
2181 The Sunday Eucharist is the foundation and confirmation of all Christian practice. For this reason the faithful are obliged to participate in the Eucharist on days of obligation, unless excused for a serious reason (for example, illness, the care of infants) or dispensed by their own pastor.119 Those who deliberately fail in this obligation commit a grave sin.
This is the rule for Catholics. This is not the rule for someone who is not Catholics. Catholics have chosen to be Catholic. When a Catholic is confirmed, he or she makes promises and assumes obligations. This is one of them.
However, what Parrothead said is also true. We cannot know the state of the soul of an individual Catholic -- or anyone, for that matter. There are three conditions for a sin to be a mortal (or grave) sin: grave matter, full knowledge and full consent. If someone is lacking in the knowledge or is not, for whatever reason, able to give full consent, the sin MAY not be mortal for that person at that time. Some Catholics don't know their faith. The obligation is still there, but their moral culpability for it may be lessened.
The Church does NOT teach that non-Catholics will all go to hell. In the end, we are all at the mercy of Christ when we stand before him at the end of our lives. God have mercy on us.
As far as the rest of the predictable mess this thread has become -- a Catholic said she is thinking about leaving the Church but that she feels like this is wrong probably doesn't want to convert. My answers were as one Catholic to another Catholic, who I will pray for and honestly wish for God's blessing on.
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Thanks everyone. While my post may have seemed more lighthearted than it really is, I do want to stress that I don't expect church to entertain me. I am not looking at a singing, dancing TV style Protestant church( not that this is wrong either, just nt my style). The church I'm looking at is simple and straight forward, but the preacher touches on things that interest me and the community is strong.
I was hesitant to speak to the reasons that my current Church is leaving me cold but I will briefly. There are few families and while my kds attend CCD, it is once a month and the kids do not interact with each much.I sit in and most of the kids do not want to be there (these are teens in Confirmation). After Mass, everyone dashes off. There is no mingling, no neighborliness, nothing. It as been many years and we know almst no one at our church, despite volunteering, attending fish frys during Lent, etc. And most important, Mass just doesn't speak to me right now. Trust me when I say that this is a ME problem, I know that I get out of it what I put into it. I'm Catholic enough to not criticize a priest, let me just say that between his homily and my heart, we aren't connecting. I have prayed, I have watched DVDs, have read books and searched my soul as to why Mass hasn't fulfilled my needs. I have debated whether it was the devil, whether I was in dry spell, being tested. This is deeper than it appears but for right now, I feel a change might help me figure out what is going on with me.
Go to Adoration. Read St. John of the Cross and about the Dark Night of the Soul. Look for saints who inspire you. The Church is deep enough to meet your needs here.
You may need to separate the Church from your parish. I have had that happen. Sometimes a parish is not a good fit. Sometimes that kind of change is in order. Sometimes trying another parish or an oratory or the Cathedral or a TLM or any number of options we have as Catholics can bring about spiritual renewal for us.
Find a new devotion that really speaks to you.
And then realize that you are making this more difficult than it needs to be. Mass is not about you. It is about worship. It is all there for us. All the angels and saints. All of Heaven and Earth. I get that you are not seeing that right now. Sometimes we get more out of Mass than others. Push through. Do it anyway. Look for other things to fulfill you, if you need to, but at some point you are probably going to realize that seeking that fulfillment can be fleeting. Feelings are temporary. They wax and wane. No matter where you go, there you are. You take you with you.
I am not belittling what you are going through. Believe me. Most of us have been there. I am just saying that there are other answers within the Church for you.
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The title says it all. I am Catholic and lately I haven't been getting much from Mass. I have been Catholic my entire life and I doubt I would ever convert. That said, there are things that have bothered me about my local church. I have some good friends who go to a non dem. Protestant church that has a wonderful youth group, lots of families and a very intense and motivational preacher. My current church lacks all of the above. I guess I'd like to see how it is to go this church and experience something different.
Is this terrible? Is this okay? I am feeling like I'm betraying my current religion? Thoughts?
You are Catholic, so I am going to answer as one Catholic to another. I am going to be blunt with you.
You are Catholic. The Catholic Church teaches that it is a mortal sin to miss Mass. Protestant services are not Mass. If you choose to attend another Church and not go to Mass, you will be in a state of mortal sin, according the Church you belong to and the rules you have chosen to follow. Mortal sin is terrible.
Is it terrible to be curious about other churches? Of course not. Is it terrible to wonder about having better music, a better youth program, a more enthusiastic pastor? No.
But ask yourself why you are Catholic. I am Catholic because it is true. Nothing else competes with truth. I am Catholic because of the Eucharist. Nothing is ever going to compete with that.
Look for another parish. Or look for ways to make your own parish the kind of place you want to spend your time.
I do understand your frustration. Many Catholics, me included at times, live with this. But all churches have problems and when you switch churches, you switch your current set of problems for someone else's. Be very clear about what you are leaving and why before you do that. It usually is not the answer.
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I would leave Fr. Laux and/or Didache for high school.
What you use now depends partially on what you want to do for high school. If you want to use Fr. Laux later, the Kolbe book is very good prep for that. The older language and older names take some getting used to. Fr. Laux goes a lot smoother if you have exposed the child to that beforehand. My current 9th grader used the Kolbe book and is transitioning very smoothly into Fr. Laux for high school.
The Seton books are decent. They are fairly simple. My bright but dyslexic 7th grader is using them. The content is good, but they are simpler books than the Kolbe book. This child will not be doing Fr. Laux. She will be doing the Didache book or the CR Publications series.
If you want something now that does not involve the older language, I would look at the Seton books for simple or the CR Publications book for more complex (http://www.crpublications.com/scripture.html). Otherwise, I would look at the Kolbe book.
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The Dorothy Mills' Book of the Ancient World would work very well with MODG 6th grade history. It would incorporate Mesopotamia, the Hittites, etc. I would also probably throw in a history encyclopedia to get more world history versus just Western civilization. Then you could do Mills' books on Greece and Rome with MODG 7th and her books on Middle Ages and Renaissance with MODG 8th. This is assuming you like MODG, especially the CM influence.
MODG writing that year is done in content area subjects. You will practice writing in history and religion. That is alwaya a big caveat for MODG. If you are only using part of the syllabus, make sure you know where the writing is and use it OR choose a writing program to go along with it.
Kolbe has been, in k-8, more traditional textbook than classical. They are starting to revise that some. But following WTM history can provide a smoother transition to Kolbe high school than the current Kolbe history does, IMO. Kolbe is very good, for textbook. But it is very different from MODG in these years.
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I love these books. I used LTN2 the first year it came out with my advanced 7th grader. We both learned a lot, and I majored in history. I will not be using it for junior high again. There is just so much there that I really feel like my other two kids will get a lot more out of it delayed by a year or two.
My dd who used it has also used the Mills books, starting in 4th grade. This is also earlier than I will use them again, but they are terrific books.
You can use the LTN books in 7th and 8th, if you have a child who is an advanced reader with good vocabulary who is ready for mature ideas and ready to really get into the philosophy and the why (and ready to move beyond the what). But the books go a lot deeper than a lot of kids are ready for at 12.
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Just a side note. This is Peter Kreeft on The Problem of Evil and Suffering. He is thoughtful about it and not dismissive. If you have time, it is a great video.
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For me, prayer is centering. Not in a new age kind of way. I am no different than anyone else. When I pray and what I ask for does not happens, I can get sad or angry or frustrated. However, when I don't pray and the unspoken bad thing happens, I feel much worse. Why is that?
For me, it is because prayer is an unselfish act. Prayer takes me from being self-centered to God-centered. I can get too focused on myself. Prayer helps me step outside that and realize the world does not revolve around me.
Bad things happen. Suffering happens. It happens sometimes because we bring it into our lives with our own selfishness. But a lot of it is because we live in a selfish world, in general. We cause suffering to one another, intentionally or unintentionally by our actions and by seeking out our own good, without considering the greater impact. And then there is just the larger suffering that just happens (like earthquakes and natural disasters). Many, many completely innocent people suffer.
As a Christian, I am called to suffering. I am called to follow Christ. And where did he go? To the cross and the crucifixion. I have to follow him there, to that. I have to take up my own crosses. Prayer gives me the strength to do that.
God is not Santa. He gave us free will, and some of the suffering that happens is caused by own our free will and that of other people. But being a Christian in no way promises a life free from suffering. I would not want to serve a God who gave me my own way, at the expense of someone else. It does not work like that.
Continuing to love God and serve God in the midst of suffering is one of the hardest things Christians have to do. It is so easy to see unanswered prayers and tragedy as signs that God is not here or that he does not care. It is hard to understand a God who is omniscient and omnipotent and who loves us and still allows evil in the world.
It is hard to watch other people have answered prayers while our own go unanswered. But to me, thinking that way is still putting the focus on me and not God.
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I did Mills Middle Ages in one semester. I finished the year with the Renaissance book. It worked nicely.
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I am a Mills pusher. I found her at a library book sale when Emma was 2 and all the books were OOP.
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Churchill was interesting. I paired it with Rebecca Fraser for another perspective.
If you really want ancients, have you looked at Dorothy Mills?
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They do sales, but pretty much on specific items only, which tend to be the extras and not the curriculum books. Occasionally, they do free shipping when you order over a certain amount (which varies, but is usually $50). I don't remember a pattern to their sales, other than around holidays.
If you go to a Catholic conference, all their books are discounted (not a huge amount, but at least rounded down) and the shipping is free for anything you order that they don't have with them.
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Thanks for posting this. I had not seen it.
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St. Teresa of Avila. She does help with my migraines. But St. Anthony helps out regularly around here too. Right now, I am also really liking St. Joseph.
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SL Catholic on yahoogroups is the group to join, if you go that direction. I will say that SL's latest revisions have been more evangelical and a lot less Catholic friendly. So keep that in mind. Most of the SL Catholic ladies are still using older IGs. But they are an amazing group of ladies.
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Or.... you stand up and say "that's ridiculous" and "you're a fool". Because standing up for something and calling stupid out on stupid can lead to progress. Or I guess during the Civil Rights movement, everyone who supported equal rights should have just stood down and let things keep on keeping on?
Um, here, that us ridiculous may fly. You're a fool breaks board rules that you agreed to when you joined. You have a choice on whether to participate on this board or in any thread on it.
Don't think your moral high horse means you get to be nasty. Plenty of people defend their positions intelligently and civilly without the nastiness.
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Some people's arguments are so abhorrent they don't deserve to be heard. If that makes me a socialist-commie-freedom-hater, so be it.
If you don't want to hear the other side, don't participate on a message board. Or ignore people. Or refute the argument without calling names.
Breaking the board rules and being nasty does not influence anybody or change any minds.
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There is no more conversation once the namecalling starts. It is just a way to bully people into not sharing their opinions. Or is tolerance only for people you agree with?
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Have you looked at Mother of Divine Grace? They sell full syllabi or you can enroll. They are Catholic, classical and CM-influenced. It may work for you. You can combine kids in the science and history, but the skill subjects would still need to be separate. Www.emmanuelbooks.com has all the booklists for each grade, and you can buy most of your list from them, if you want to.
CHC sells syllabi and has some really good materials, but it is not as literature-based. It is not classical. It is more a mesh of CM and traditional. Up through 4th grade has a unit studies twist in history, and those programs are a lot of fun to do. And their religion extras are terrific. But 5th and up moves to pretty traditional textbook, great textbooks, but still textbook.
So it depends on which part of HOD you like and are trying to replicate.
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Now Easter week can officially begin!
Cause it is just not the holidays at WtM until somebody points out that they are pagan and God says not to celebrate them.
Never mind the wieght of history ... That is just irrelevant.
OP, I wish you a meaningful celebration of Holy Week.
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Latin is a core subject in our homeschool....equal to math, LA, history, science. My younger kids are reading more classical lit in full than my older kids did. (my oldest ds's reading lists looked more comparable to Seton's than say Angelicum Academy's.)
We are not a "humanities focused" family, but incorporating the fundamental "content" of classical into our classical "methodology" was a shift. What made me change my mind? Arguing with myself, lots of reading and reflecting, and ultimately my children. My children believed that Latin was a vital subject for classically educating. They are the proof by what I see in the "without" and the "with." :)
Someday, we will convince you to write a book.
I am doing a lot of this. We will all be doing Latin in the fall even. :)
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But, after switching to classical content and classical methodologies, I see a HUGE difference in my children and their mental development **and** their discernment. I was wrong. I have spent more time researching and reading unbiasedly, and now see the full picture and how it all works together. W/o it all, you can still end up well-educated, but it isn't classical education.
Ok. But on a practical level, what did you switch TO that reflects classical content and methodologies, and what made you change your mind?
Keep in mind, I still hate Simmons. But I am a lot less history-focused and more Great Books-oriented than I was two years ago.
:)
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The first year I homeschooled, I tried to do WTM. I bought all the books, but I did them the way I understood school. It was not a bad education. But it was not a *classical* education either.
I took a break, I read, and I came back to classical (honestly, still mostly neo-classical) with a much better understanding of what I was doing and why. And it made all the difference. So when I say you can use all the right resources and still not be educating classically, I say it because I did just that.
But FWIW, I am not 100% classical anyhow. I use what works for each child, and that changes, depending on our strengths, weaknesses and goals. I do have an educational philosophy that overarches whatever I am doing. And like my signature says, curriculum is my tool and not my master. I use it as I see fit to accomplish my goals.
As far as Seton goes, I personally think you can use Seton and incorporate elements of classical into it. It won't look the same as a WTM purist. Or a "true, historical" classical education. And so what? Most people, at some level, mix and match. And that works, if -- in your head -- you know what your methodology really is.
But I don't know if you can really do Seton classically, without adding and changing some things. So I still think the best thing to do is to really ask yourself what your goals are, what of classical really appeals to you, and how you can incorporate that into your homeschool.
I'm Catholic but thinking of attending a protestant church. I feel like this is wrong...
in The Chat Board
Posted
Catholics store the Host in a Tabernacle especially constructed for that purpose. It can then be brought out and consumed at the next Mass. While Jesus is present in the Tabernacle, we bow or genuflect in that direction when we enter that room as acknowledgement of the Real Presence there and as a sign of respect.
The priest or communion ministers drink the wine. The vessels are all rinsed in a special sink that filters into the ground instead of the sewer lines.
Once it is consecrated, it is Jesus. And we treat Jesus as our Lord and Savior.
(Making absolutely no comments or generalizing to any other tradition and what or how they do their communion, BTW.)