Excellent point - an accelerated 1st grader will work longer than an average 1st grader. You really can't compare. Each child has their own speed, too. Mine happen to be very fast, unless we are discussing ... discussions can be hours long, and I love that. But a friend of ours - he likes to take ALL day to do his work. Others like to rush through and get back to playing. That is what I mean by a guideline. You have a system that works for you and that is fantastic!!! Ours changes from day to day because sometimes we wind up in a deep discussion about whatever we just learned in science or social studies, and then it carries on into the next day, and a library trip and then later in the car. So in our household, all of our schedules have not worked. ;) My friend with the son that takes all day - she is very, very scheduled and my style would make her insane!!! :) We all just do it the way we need to. :)

Mine have always had early bed times. :) Your schedule sounds like it works well. :) You guys pack a lot in. It's just a question of time. I mean, there are only so many hours in a day. :D Maybe you can do the "fun" stuff on weekends? Good luck!!! Remember there are no rules. What works for one family, doesn't work for others. You guys will find your groove. :D

Oh sorry, responded before seeing this. Yes, I think it would be very easy to burn yourself out with this schedule. :) If there is no room for flexibility, it adds a lot of pressure on you. I teach full-time from home (as in, employed...hah) and teach my kids... so I HAVE to be flexible. We have a baseline "schedule" which is more like a master to do list for each day/week. It gives me an idea but each day is different. I have found that it is in the moments unplanned that the best learning happens. Like the discussions in the car, the trips to the library, bedtime. Don't be afraid to relax a little too. :)

Ok let's see.... well, I think that is the problem sometimes with too much scheduling. :p All of these things you mentioned are very easy to fit into your day, but you may not be able to write down on paper every five minutes of your school day, ya know? What are your evenings like? Can you do family reads? Sit on the couch, read to your kiddos, discuss, talk, learn, love. The 3 yo is learning more than you realize - get a copy of Einstein Never Used Flashcards. Best book you will ever read as a mom!!! :) If the 3 yo likes to write and do "school work", get them some books to work on - copying letters, drawing shapes, etc. They can work right alongside the big kids. Following interests is easy - they can do this during their free time, or incorporate and associate it to what they are learning. We are actually making an elective out of film making for my oldest - it is his passion right now. So we made it a subject. School doesn't have to fall into certain hours. Our school and home life have very blurry edges - learning is as naturally a part of our day as making dinner and going to bed. It all just sort of blends. :D If your schedule works for you, then keep it. Can you shorten the subject periods? If not, do some of this less formal activity in your evenings. As long as it isn't high pressure and stressful, it's all good. :D

What do you mean 'where are you going wrong'? Does it work for you? If you guys are happy, then keep on keeping on. :)

I really appreciate this insight. After getting some validity in moving forward vs regressing back to basic operations (torture for both my son and myself), we went onward to negative integers. He loved them - and we never cracked the book. We actually learned about these in the car, during discussion. Later when we put a number line on paper, I asked what would happen if we subtracted a negative number from a negative number ... he knew intuitively what would happen based on the direction of the number line and how negatives cancel each other out. He nailed it. He told me he likes math now that we are past the boring parts ... and fractions. :p He will like the next few chapters, and then I think we will revisit fractions. I am just going to make sure he is doing some warm-ups each day using the basic operations. I appreciate all input here. PS - he is even trying to figure out math in stores while we are out without cringing or putting up a math wall. He has never initiated a math question in real life but today figured out 20% on his own, because he wanted to know the price after a sale. This is not major math here but in regard to his attitude - night and day. Love it!!! :p

That is incredible. The little boy did them faster than I could. :) Can you break down this left-to-right computation? For someone who was taught strictly on paper and pencil, I don't know the methods of it - but I am intrigued. Verbalization definitely seems the way to go; especially for my son. Even for me, I have to "see" the problem... even if I am using my finger in the air, or a chalkboard in my head. How can we learn this left-to-right thing? I have been making an extra point to make him figure out the math problems of our day as we are out and about, trying to train his brain to do it mentally. He has a hard time stepping out of his math box ... he is set that there is one way to do a problem, with a textbook in front of you, and just getting it over with - I'm trying to open his windows a little to let that fresh air in, haha. And to show him math isn't just a chore you have to get over. So we are trying to branch out a bit. Thanks so much!!

Really? What is this all about?? :)

Thank goodness - I was hoping you guys would say that. Because I think *I* would be bored to tears going back to basics... haha. I think we are going to begin working on multiple solutions to the problems we work on. Sometimes he gets so stuck on figure out a problem in one set way, that he has trouble extending outside of that. We'll keep on keeping on.... thanks!

My guess is that it is overwhelming to hold a chapter book and know you have to go through the whole thing. I bet it is visual, as the others mentioned. It's like when I look at my messy kitchen and don't know where to start. :) I tend to believe that reading is reading... and you hate to further the hatred of reading books. Maybe you can do a "real" book less frequently, and together; and let him read whatever he wants the rest of the time. When you read your big book together, tell him what page you are going to read to. If there is an end, maybe he wont feel so overwhelmed? Then again - he is so little still. Maybe just keep reading fun. As the previous poster mentioned, the language in pictures books can be tougher than some chapter books. If you are concerned about reading level, just choose picture books with a big vocabulary. Examine your objective, and go from there. What is more important: reading a chapter book (to build endurance, reading level, comprehension of a novel), or to build fluency, vocabulary, love of reading, etc? Good luck!!! :)

Hi all! I could really use some insight on math knowledge/comprehension. I am an English teacher and can assess a student's knowledge in language pretty easily; almost intuitively, right? But in math ... I just don't have that skill. I feel comfortable teaching math and understand what I am doing, so it's not intimidation. I just don't have the experience in teaching math enough to know when he truly has a concept down. He is 9, and we are working on 7th grade math. I am using the sequencing from a public school book - no formal curriculum. Here is my issue. We are moving into this abstract math and he absolutely gets it. He absorbs concepts like they are water. He understands, he can teach them back to me, he can create and solve his own problems. This is easy for him, and we move along at a quick pace. He may forget vocabulary, or after a few weeks, forget what he is supposed to do - but a quick review snaps him back before I can finish a sentence usually. However. We are having some difficulty in basic math operations. Addition, subtraction, multiplication and division. They are like torture to him. He does his math the loooooonnnngggg way because he wont just suck it up and memorize his facts! He understands these operations ... he just hates doing them. But it is getting to the point where his math stinks because of his attitude. We are getting into math where the facts need to just be known because the focus of the problem is on other things. Like reducing fractions or multiplying negative integers. How can he do those problems and understand them ... yet struggle with 9+7? Is it sheer laziness? Is he being difficult? He says sometimes he will look at a problem like 2+3 and see the answer, but forget the word. Huh? He does this often. I told him that the math we are doing now relies on his knowing these facts stone cold. That they have to just come to him, so he can focus his energy on the other portions. He sees it, and gets it. But there is like a block or something. Long division brings us both to tears ... yet he can explain it, show it, demonstrate it and create/solve problems of division ... but make him write out a long division problem and you'd think I was killing him. And he will not get the right answer. He will shrug and say he doesn't know. It's maddening, I tell you!!! So my idea is to do a Basic Operations Boot Camp. A week of addition, subtraction, multiplication and division. From the beginning. Place value, carrying 1s, associative property. I think he understood the concept of addition but was never able to learn in his public school because of other issues (behavior, boredom, anxiety...). It's like he missed Math 101, but managed to get through because he understood. Is this a common problem? I feel confident he understands the concepts we are working on this year. But when he has to do the basic operations, it's like he shuts down. How can a child do prime factorization, but struggle with simple division??? If I were a math teacher, I could probably pinpoint the issue and fix it. But this isn't an essay... and I am feeling a little clueless. Do I let him do these problems the hard way? Do I keep going forward with new concepts, but continue to do basic operation review each day (this is what I have been doing ... there is small improvement doing this but it is very, very slow going)? Do I stop all current learning and go back to basics? (He would hate this... and be bored out of his mind, but if it is necessary... then I will). Thanks all! :)

Ok, wow - I can't imagine taking a class of 5-year-olds to the theater to see Titanic!! Aside from content, that is a long movie! You'd think they would have just found a documentary and a museum exhibit somewhere. Movies are so much different than books, too. Especially at that age. My oldest is great about separating out movies from reality. He has never been scared of something he saw on a screen (though I remember once I used poor judgment and let him see a Michael Jackson music video. Jackson has just died and Matthew wanted to know what all the fuss was about, so we looked at the Jackson 5 and then looked at a video... and he was fine watching, but then later it scared him at bedtime. Whoops!) However, my little guy - oh man, my little guy gets spooked by anything that even looks remotely scary. He is scared of scary, haha. He is not one that could watch something because it is too real for him. But like I said, my oldest has a pretty firm grasp. I am not making a point ... I am just rambling, apparently. Not enough adult conversation around here sometimes. :p I remember going to see Schindler's List with my school in 8th grade. It was a bit much for me. I think teachers/parents need to watch these movies first before deciding it is a good idea to bus entire classes of kids to the theater. Although I probably could of handled the movie in my living room, with my parents with their guidance and discussion - security and comfort ... I think watching it anonymously in a dark theater with peers was not the way to go!! Have you ever sat down to watch a movie with your kids and as you get a few minutes into it, realize it is NOT appropriate for them? I have done that. Ratings these days just don't seem accurate. Everything is so foul. I find myself going back in time for family entertainment ... movies like Big or Funny Farm with Chevy Chase. Yah, they are for adults but they are more family-appropriate then comedies today. When did everything get so crude? We are studying the Civil War and I know that movie Lincoln is out. I have heard it is phenomenal but totally not appropriate for children. My husband is deployed right now so I will have to wait until it comes out on DVD, but maybe the next time we swing through the Civil War and my son is older... I love homeschooling for the very reasons we are discussing. The freedom and ability to customize exposure to our children is invaluable.

Well said. :) (Just an aside... I didn't actually mean to expose my son to the shooting footage ... we were in a Jiffy Lube and it was on in the waiting room. I had to just handle it... one of those fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants moments in parenting) Have a great night and thanks for the conversation. :) Jen

First, wow - three deployments to Iraq?! That is an incredible sacrifice your family has made!! Thank you for your service. My husband is in Africa right now, heading home in two weeks!!! We are so excited. :) I think maybe this line I've pasted in above that you wrote is where we differ: I just see it so differently. And this is probably what shapes our decisions in what we expose our children to. The thing is ... nothing in these books is a new concept to my son. However, the people and the way they handle the situations is enlightening. My son knows there is murder, rape, crime, hatred and evil in this world. We are a Christian family and, forgive me if this offends - it is not meant to ... but I bring it up because we believe heavily in what the Bible says in John 16:33. In this world you will have trouble, but take heart, for I have overcome the world. I am not preaching to you. :D I am just sharing our worldview in this household to explain where I am coming from. Example: My son watched the CT shooting on the news and we talked through it. We talked about the troubled man, we talked about the children and the sadness, we talked about this earth and how troubled it is, but that we can't be afraid to leave our houses. We asked why, we discussed gun control and mental illness. My son has a pretty firm grasp of this earth and the people walking it. He has a faith in his God and trusts that very much - he finds comfort there. Now, I didn't let him watch Jaws - even though he begged me over and over - because he loves the ocean, and I don't want to insert a fear into something he loves. I wouldn't just show Jaws when we studied the ocean just because it tied in. I do use parental judgment hah - there are many things I would not and will not expose him to. As he continues to mature, the doors will open more and more. My son is HUGE into film making - this is his passion. And one day, when he is able - we will watch Jaws to study the art of the film making. If he was not where he was maturity wise, and if he did not have the knowledge and understanding he does - I think your points would be very valid. This just happens to be a very worldy kid. It started when he was very, very young. My answers didn't start out at a pre-teen level - I answered age appropriately. And he was never satisfied. In fact, he never found comfort until he felt he knew the truth. And then, knowing the truth, could grapple with what it meant to him in his life. He's a deep kid! I learned I needed to start providing more information. I just don't see these books as exposing him to harsh realities. He knows the realities. But he is looking to the adults around him all the time to model how we handle these difficulties when they arise. He has also been through a lot ... so maybe he grew up faster than others. I wasn't going to even give him the "sex talk" yet - I felt he was too young!!! It felt like taking his innocence away. But, he began having some physical ailments. After a month, my husband and I realized what it was. Hormone surge - pre-puberty. His body was beginning to change and he had no idea why - he was anxious and panicky. We explained it to him; he sought more information. Then this year in science, we went completely in-depth on chromosomes, inherited traits, DNA. Talk about a surprise given less than a year ago, he didn't even know what sex was. But once he learned, he was so relieved. Like, ohhhhh that makes sense! Now he can go on. He understands the world, and why his body is doing that, there is a purpose and a reason, there is a way to cope with it. He has a grip on his reality. I don't know ... it is hard to explain. Sometimes kids just already know things. And we have to help them sort it out. He knows more than I ever thought he would and it is not because he was taught. He just... knows things. Does that make sense? And I did want insight - you are right. I think I became more confident in my decision after I thought about it and said it outloud (well, typed). It just goes to show that we are all different and so are our kids. Some kids need to be very sheltered; some need to make their own way and understand everything - to make sense of it all. My little guy is a shelter kid. He will not be participating in the readings. Who knows how old he will be when he reads them? I have enjoyed this discussion though. Literature is a passion of mine, and I never liked or understood history until I taught my kids ... now I am as fascinated as they are. :)

You make a really good point. When my friend said, "Aren't those books meant for high school?" I about died. No, they were not written for high school kids. :) They were written for adults! Kids read them in high school because of the issues presented, the art of the literature, the look into time periods... and that is when most kids are ready. Though there were a number of kids in my freshman classroom that did NOT get the books. So, who can assign an age/grade? And since when do homeschoolers follow public school pacing, anyway? :p

Absolutely agree with you. On the other hand, some kids have taken it upon themselves to learn the dirty underbelly of the world because they are so empathetic and compassionate ... and intuitive. Sometimes you have to explain things to give them a sense of understanding or their anxiety is too great. I have one of those kids. The kind that freaks out and worries when he doesn't understand. There are so many things in their lives now that began once upon a time. Sometimes to understand the now, you have to look back at the why. Standing in the middle of Fort Sumter means nothing if you don't understand why the battle began. He is not one to just look at a building and say gee that is nice. He wants to know why, how, when ... and then apply that knowledge to everything else. I think holding back information when they are trying to grasp understanding of the world is counterintuitive. Telling only part of the story seems wonky to me. How can they ever understand if they don't have the details? He knows what sex is - he knows what rape is. He doesn't understand the psychological impact of what rape can do to a woman. But he knows it is unethical and wrong. He doesn't know the technical aspects of mental retardation (though he understands the genetics) - but he has an autistic stepsister and he has to protect her sometimes from people that don't understand. How can you understand the American effort in WWII if we don't explain the Holocaust? Or Pearl Harbor? My grandfathers fought in the war ... why wouldn't I explain it to my child? My son desperately wants to understand the Iraq war (his dad served 18 mths over there) ... but I told him we will come to it at the end of the story. We have a long way to go. But how can we really understand Iraq unless we go through the beginning? I think we don't give kids enough credit sometimes. I agree most 9-year-olds couldn't handle or grasp these books .... but they also wouldn't have an interest in them, either. Mine does. Maybe he is just really different, and I am so accustomed to him, I don't know any better. (Then again... I am a certified teacher - it is my job to know kids! hah). There are so many books and movies I can't wait to show him ... when he is older. There are some he begs to see because he is so intrigued by them, but I tell him he needs to wait a bit. I don't know for how long - when he is ready, I will know. Like I said - Lord of the Flies; that one is too intense for him right now. He doesn't like gore and I think it is a very dark story. I also wouldn't read Animal Farm to him. We read Poe, but I am selective. He loves Poe! He loves how, with words, the author can spook us out and create a reality in our heads. But, I don't let him read Steven King. It's all in the presentation. :) For an English teacher with so many kids disinterested in reading ... I LOVE that my son wants to hear these stories, and soak up the language and characters - and see what they do. Though if anyone has a really good substitute for Of Mice and Men, let me know please. That whole Dust Bowl era is so interesting. My kids and I are from Northern California, where Steinbeck set many of his stories. So that part is kind of fun, too. I love Steinbeck.

Ok, I just asked my son, hypothetically and out of the blue, back in the old days (we are only up to 1861 in history) ... what did he think would happen if a black man committed a crime against a white person. He stopped what he was doing (Lego's), made a serious/shocked face, and said ohhhhhhhh, that would be BAD! He'd probably get murdered!!! Then I asked if it would be as severe a punishment if it were against another black man/woman, or a white against a white. He understood without me even introducing the concept... I think he'll be fine, haha. :)

I think if you had a chance to sit and chat with my son - to really have a conversation with him - you'd have less concern about him being 9. He will absolutely "get" the nature of a black man raping a white woman. He understands the attitude the whites had. What I meant was, the rape is not our focus point; the life, the culture, the characters, the flour sack dresses, Scout and Jim ... those are the parts of the book that will be emphasized. The character of Atticus standing up for a black man who was falsely accused - yes, I think my son will absolutely deal with all of this, plus some. :) The rape, symbolically speaking, is a small portion of the book. The theme is justice, discrimination, courage to do what is right, etc. (My husband is in law enforcement ... my son has been exposed to these themes before...) Of Mice and Men, like I said, is the only one I am iffy on. And what I am iffy about is ... does the theme overshadow my objective. I need to read it again to see. In the other books, the stories are so immersed in the lifestyle, that we can read them, address the themes, but the primary purpose is to absorb culture - not discuss ethics. It is like reading with a different pair of glasses. And I wonder if, in Of Mice and Men, the friendship of Lenny and George will shine through more than the lifestyle of the time. Like I said... I just need to read it again to really look at it with different eyes. But I know my child, and he will want to engage in conversation. He will not be reading these books on his own - he will be guided. I think that makes a huge difference. It's funny it just never occurred to me that these books could be too much for him until my friend spoke up. They just seemed the natural next step. Books that he reads leisurely or on his own are of a different nature because those he reads on his own, with his own understanding of the world and no guidance ... they need to be simpler. In a more complex novel, I want to be able to explain and discuss as we go. I feel comfortable with it. The beauty is ..... if we start going through it and he is absolutely not there yet ... we can stop. :D

You are all so wonderful and supportive - thanks so much. I don't have many nearby friends who completely "get" it with my oldest. My younger guy is a more traditional thinker - he is 6 and right on target. But my older guy ... he does better with these things than most of my freshmen and sophomores, haha! I wish my students had been exposed to these titles in their earlier years. So many are just reading "real" books for the first time when they are 13 or 14. Sad!

I appreciate your insight (and hope others add their thoughts). My son is practically begging to learn more and more about our history. He is fascinated with these men and women. He loves the stories of humanity: the evil, the good, the motivations, the character, the heroism, the hypocrisy, the right and the wrong, standing up for what you believe in, courage, cowardice. He is soaking it all in. These are real people - just like us! We fought wars and made declarations! We made mistakes and stood for the wrong things. It is fascinating to him. His understanding and reasoning of human behavior is far beyond any child I have known, and it boggles my mind. But - he has always been like this. ;) You should hear him discuss theology ... he was discussing the timelessness of God when he was 5 years old. :p He will love Anne because she was a real person. I will spare him the coming of age portion - good point! :) But the hiding, the insight into what was happening to the people around her, the observations - that is all very good. I don't want to read an account of the camps yet - like Night or Don't Fence Me In. I think those would be too much, still. Mockingbird is such a wonderful story and being falsely accused of a crime based on racism - it is such a great story with great characters!!! The rape part of that is very minimal, really. Of Mice and Men ... this one I may need to re-read with the eyes of a parent. It has been a few years since I last read it. And Huckleberry Finn - even Twain himself said he wasn't sure if it was written for adults or kids, haha. I do think we will audio book that one though because, while I am new to the south (I am a west coaster) and hear the accepts around me... I am not sure I can get that vernacular correct... heh. :p I guess I just really want to expose him to these great works early on. The purpose is to zoom in on life during these events - to focus on the people living them. Later, when he is in middle school/high school, we will read them with a more academic slant. For now ... they are stories about people. And whatever discussions they spark, I will encourage. Maybe I just needed to think it out to re-examine my motivations!

Hello! I have a 9.5 yr old working well ahead of his age-grade; probably in the 7/8th grade range. We discuss things very in-depth and explore as deep as my son wants to go, then we move forward. I use literature to fill in gaps and comprehension around what we are learning in history (US history this year). I want to read Adventures of Huckleberry Finn (we are beginning the Civil War soon, and will go in-depth on slavery next week). After that, as we progress through the decades, I want to read Of Mice and Men, To Kill a Mockingbird, and The Diary of Anne Frank (we are studying the holocaust and spending a lot of time on WWII). I didn't think twice about introducing these books to my son. I love them, and I am a high school English teacher. My son understands the adult themes of these books - he is incredible mature, wise beyond his years and philosophical. Like I said - it hadn't even occurred to me that he may not be ready for these until a friend of mine criticized it. "Aren't those books meant for high school? Those are way beyond what a 9 year old should be reading." This took me aback. Are they? Am I totally out of touch? He is NOT your average 9 year old. And I wouldn't allow him to watch a movie or read a book that casually discussed rape ... no ... but these are tastefully and beautifully told. These are good quality novels. I trust these novels to teach and show and explain and demonstrate WHY these things matter and how it impacts the world and shapes how we feel about the evils of the world. But more than that, these novels are windows into the time periods we are studying. These are the people, the issues and the life of the time. I don't follow the censored history thing - we learn the good, the bad, and the ugly. :) Am I off my rocker? There are plenty of books I am not introducing because they don't serve a purpose to supplement what we are studying in history, or they are above his maturity level or well, there are many reasons. Thoughts? Now I am questioning myself... haha. :)

This is absolutely my son as well!!! He is incredibly accelerated in many areas, and tested high school level in language/math (even spelling... but it was reading a list and identifying incorrect spellings, not actually writing them). But sometimes he will look at 2+3 and draw a blank. It is maddening. He is working on pre-algebraic concepts and yet simple addition can stump him. What?! Anyway, spelling is tough for us. My son is 9.5. I think it is that difference between writing as a physical motor skill .... and writing to express. If I take away all the pressure of writing correctly, he will write much more for me. He can memorize a spelling list, but then write something later using a spelling word and it will mean nothing. :) It is reassuring to hear he isn't alone. I have always been a good reader and a good speller... but my dad, who is brilliant, is a good reader/crappy speller. Maybe it is just a trait, like others have said. We are going to begin vocabulary and focus on roots, etc, and see if that doesn't help bridge the gap. I wonder though - both my sons were preemies with weeks and weeks of pre-term labor. They both had somewhat traumatic births, though they were healthy (with exception of jaundice) at birth. I always wonder what carries over from those steroids/meds they give you to stop the pre-term labor. Maybe that is a far reach to explain away poor spelling skills... haha. But in the case of a brain injury, my oldest DID in fact have trauma to his neck and had a huge abrasion on his head when he was born as his head was caught in my pelvis somehow. He couldn't turn his head for a few days because his neck was so swollen (poor thing). Makes me wonder...

That's our scenario too - my oldest does not have the patience to do what he knows how to do without their being a purpose. Solving problems for the sake of solving problems drives him batty. (That is why worksheets have never worked for me). I have to it from the assessment approach ... I just need his cooperation so I can see that he really understands it. When he does, I say ok... can you show me this? When he doesn't, I say ... ok, you aren't getting this or you are right there, but I think this is still confusing you. Then we will do another one. I do this for review and never review the same kind of problem more than a few times (in one session). If he can do it, I know he gets it, we move forward. We finally have a good attitude about math when we do this. I tell him if he gets something we don't have to dwell. It makes him a more eager learning - even if it is just so he doesn't have to do more routine problems, ha!

It's sad that you can't just be proud, and have family be proud as well. I fail to see why early reading is a bad thing! I got the lectures and criticism too, though. My oldest was very advanced and I was in awe all the time. I just encouraged and supported. It seems silly to stop that process; think what that teaches them. Jen

I think too, that while more conversation is probably needed, it sounds like homeschool just works better for them. The reasoning is sound. I mean, like you said - they have friends, they like school ... but it is just not engaging and the challenge you can give them individually sounds like it makes them thrive. That would be hard to say no to. Do you have concerns about it? They seem like mature, articulate kids - it doesn't sound like maladjustment or a knee-jerk reaction. :) Jen