Writing Struggles

[jibaker103]

For those of you who struggle with:

·       teaching your student writing,

·       your student’s inability to handle your evaluation or criticism very well,

·       questioning whether or not your student’s writing is on grade level, or

·       wondering how an objective third party would view your student’s writing,

 

Would you consider purchasing an evaluation/critique of your students writing, put them in an online class, or enroll them in dual credit at the CC? If classes or CC are not an option because of money or you’re afraid your student would not rise to the challenge, how much would you be willing to pay for a one-draft evaluation? What would you pay for a three-draft critique? I have definitely been struggling with these very issues with my ds 17. I am interested in hearing all ideas, suggestions, and information!

 

Jennifer

[swimmermom3]

What does your student struggle with? Does he dislike writing in general? Is the problem specific to writing for English class or for any class? Can your student answer the prompt for a short-answer essay? What curriculum have you used up to this point? Are you comfortable critiquing his writing and the problem is just his response?

[jibaker103]

He is a fabulous creative writer and that is all he cares about. He is great at writing narrative/descriptive essays because he still gets to tell a story. However, other essays and reports are unorganized with no clear thesis, structure, or support. He does not like taking advice from me or discussing his essays with me. I am a technical and business writer by profession so I have no problems teaching or critiquing him. 

 

We have completed IEW Ancient HBWL, TWSS, The Elegant Essay, and the HSEI Live Workshop. 

 

We have done more than 1/3 WWS 2 but it was like pulling teeth, we were doing the Lively Art of Writing with the syllabus when the book mysteriously disappeared to never be seen again in the middle of chapter 1, we tried Classical Writing which was pretty good for Aesop/Homer for Older Beginners but completely fell apart in Diogenes Maxim (I did not homeschooling him until 7th grade so all of the terminology and stories he just didn't get), and we also tried Writer's Guide to Powerful Paragraphs which he only completed the paragraphs he was already good at.

 

He has Excellence in Literature which he loves and has a WWII History class both requiring a total of 8 essays over the semester. I know he will still need help with these essays so I am now trying to help him based on each assignment he has pulling sections from The Elegant Essay, WttW, and Writing Research Papers as needed (he is familiar with these). I am making WWS 3 Beta a requirement and he uses Writer's Inc. and/or TWSS Manual to look stuff up for himself. I think this may be a good plan but I still think I will need an outside person to evaluate/critique to show him mom is not crazy. He wants to perform for all teachers except me. So can any of you share with me your experience with my questions stated above?

[Mom22ns]

You might see how the essays go in EIL before deciding he needs more outside help. I thought my ds, who wishes to pursue creative writing as a career, but has struggled with academic writing, would fall flat with EIL. Instead, he used the models and wrote the most amazing essays with it his very first year. I do still want him to take outside writing classes to get feedback that isn't mine, but only because he is considering writing as a profession.

[PeterPan]

Well I'll answer, but it may or may not be what you want.  My dd has the elements you've described, even though she's younger.  I've watched your posts over the years and have sort of assumed they were rather similar.  Yes, she enjoys her creative writing, fan fiction, etc., yes she struggles with organization, and yes she had a beef with WWS and CW.  

 

-I would question to yourself whether critique is necessary.  I know that sounds contrary, but I think critique might be kind of the hind end version of what could have been taken care of with more pre-writing structure.

-Structure is something I notice conspicuously missing from your discussion of what you're doing, how you're helping him, and what those materials provide.  NONE of them provide structure to the level a struggling or particular type of writer will require.

-It may be that when he's provided enough structure and assistance in accepting the structure and assistance in making the structure his own that his STRENGTHS as a narrative/creative writer will come out.  After all, it's not like the genres have no overlap.  This is why I suggest you focus less on critique and more on structure.  

-Inspiration software is EXCEPTIONALLY helpful for teaching structure.  It uses a visual method of organization which the student can toggle to an outline.  You can literally help him take HIS thoughts the way HE thinks of the topic, and it will shizam them into an outline.  Gold, pure gold.  You want this.  Takes people who are VSL and helps them come across as more structured, more organized, more linear, without wigging them out and forcing them into a thought process that isn't them.  They aren't linear, so you have to start spatial and help it convert into organized/structured/linear.  

-You may have to sit with him while he uses the software and help him dump his brain onto it.  It's going to be a foreign process for a while.  Those EIL essays might be a good place to start.  Use the Inspiration screen as a brain dump and let him learn how to sift his thoughts and structure them visually, then convert to the outline and let him write.  Then STOP and don't criticize one single little bit.  Just go out to IHOP for pancakes and tell him he did awesome.  Then write another one next month and do another trip to IHOP for pancakes.  No criticism.  Of course it might suck, but if his organization is getting better and he's learning a way he can get his thoughts out, then the rest will come because of his natural verbal strengths.

 

As far as the writing level, you can stop freaking out about that and don't need to pay.  Find some things he's written over the last year, all sorts of things, and enter dabs of it into an online writing level analyzer.  I did this with my dd recently and was pleasantly surprised.  You may be too.  Don't expect the entirety of his writing to be the same level.  You may find his best writing is quite high and some goes quite lower.  My dd can be inconsistent within a project because she wears out or finds it takes her so much energy to do her best writing.  Anyways, google for online writing level analyzers and you'll get some options.  I don't remember which one I used, but you literally just paste your text in and get answers.  

 

 

 

[swimmermom3]

He is a fabulous creative writer and that is all he cares about. He is great at writing narrative/descriptive essays because he still gets to tell a story. However, other essays and reports are unorganized with no clear thesis, structure, or support. He does not like taking advice from me or discussing his essays with me. I am a technical and business writer by profession so I have no problems teaching or critiquing him. 

 

We have completed IEW Ancient HBWL, TWSS, The Elegant Essay, and the HSEI Live Workshop. 

 

We have done more than 1/3 WWS 2 but it was like pulling teeth, we were doing the Lively Art of Writing with the syllabus when the book mysteriously disappeared to never be seen again in the middle of chapter 1, we tried Classical Writing which was pretty good for Aesop/Homer for Older Beginners but completely fell apart in Diogenes Maxim (I did not homeschooling him until 7th grade so all of the terminology and stories he just didn't get), and we also tried Writer's Guide to Powerful Paragraphs which he only completed the paragraphs he was already good at.

 

He has Excellence in Literature which he loves and has a WWII History class both requiring a total of 8 essays over the semester. I know he will still need help with these essays so I am now trying to help him based on each assignment he has pulling sections from The Elegant Essay, WttW, and Writing Research Papers as needed (he is familiar with these). I am making WWS 3 Beta a requirement and he uses Writer's Inc. and/or TWSS Manual to look stuff up for himself. I think this may be a good plan but I still think I will need an outside person to evaluate/critique to show him mom is not crazy. He wants to perform for all teachers except me. So can any of you share with me your experience with my questions stated above?

 

It looks as though you have provided your son with a solid foundation. What about taking a few weeks for a "less is more" approach?  During the last semesters of 8th and 9th grade we spent a significant amount of time reading and analyzing essays and primary source materials that were written by excellent, often professional writers. At one point it dawned on me that ds wasn't doing a ton of writing and I kind of panicked, but kept on with it because he seemed to get a lot out of the discussions.

 

Now that he is taking an AP Eng. Language course, I've realized that he probably got more out of that exercise than many of the writing programs we had used previously, some of which you mentioned. I would take a short lesson and let him apply it to a particular work. I don't know if this makes sense, but with a teen, especially a guy, I try to keep busy work from a minimum to nonexistent.

 

I think if you back off and give him some space to solidify in his mind what really good writing looks like, not just creative writing, he might enjoy the process more and be more receptive to critique.

 

 

[PeterPan]

Just to pick up with Swimmer's line of thought, you might look for collections of essays.  I've got my dd reading from books in this series this year:  The Best American Science and Nature Writing 2012  I've talked with someone who uses editorials from the NYT (online) and analyzes them rhetorically, which also sounds interesting.  It just isn't something we've tried yet.  It seems like you've done more rhetoric, so you have more of those tools at your disposal for analysis.