Worried about mental math - Singapore

[acsnmama]

My son just completed Singapore 3A. He's very good at math overall. I've always thought his mental math abilities were very good. My DH quizzes him often, throwing out numbers (addition & subtraction) and he fairs very well.

 

However, when it comes to 3 & 4 digit numbers +/- another 2, 3, or 4 digit numbers, he can do it, but he insists it's "hard." I've looked over/read the guide on strategies, but me, being terrible at math feels frustrated because of all the different ways to so it. I do to think in those ways, and I recall from an earlier level that however the child feels comfortable getting the answer is ok. Sometimes he rattles answers off quickly, other times he's picturing the equation in verticle form and trying to carry/borrow in his head, which takes too long.

 

I guess what it comes down to is, I am confident in his math abilities, I'm just not sure how to help him be confident in the larger numbers. I feel like I failed somewhere along the way!

 

He was having trouble with subtraction, not fully understanding borrowing, and after a 15 minute review it totally clicked and understood the reason behind it (helped me too). He always managed very well subtracting large numbers, but he didn't fully understand the why, but he knows it now, no problem!

 

I'm just not sure how to address the mental math issue, I want him to have more confidence, but it's not my strong area. I guess my issue is, the guide doesn't seem to give enough examples to help me help him.

[mamaraby]

I can't remember if it's 3B or 4A (I think it's 4A) in the US edition, but one of the Enrichment Activities goes over mental math strategies with larger numbers. I know for sure 3B starts out with more mental math practice for larger numbers. All that to say, I don't think you need to worry just yet. Practice and maturity will probably go a long way.

[acsnmama]

Thank you, I did notice 3B has a mental calculation section. I try to have him do the mental math sheets in the back of the teacher guide and decided not to begin 3B until he completes them, he'll do 2-3 per day and I'll have him do some more IP pages that focus on mental calculations.

[Walking-Iris]

My son just completed Singapore 3A. He's very good at math overall. I've always thought his mental math abilities were very good. My DH quizzes him often, throwing out numbers (addition & subtraction) and he fairs very well.

 

However, when it comes to 3 & 4 digit numbers +/- another 2, 3, or 4 digit numbers, he can do it, but he insists it's "hard." I've looked over/read the guide on strategies, but me, being terrible at math feels frustrated because of all the different ways to so it. I do to think in those ways, and I recall from an earlier level that however the child feels comfortable getting the answer is ok. Sometimes he rattles answers off quickly, other times he's picturing the equation in verticle form and trying to carry/borrow in his head, which takes too long.

 

I guess what it comes down to is, I am confident in his math abilities, I'm just not sure how to help him be confident in the larger numbers. I feel like I failed somewhere along the way!

 

He was having trouble with subtraction, not fully understanding borrowing, and after a 15 minute review it totally clicked and understood the reason behind it (helped me too). He always managed very well subtracting large numbers, but he didn't fully understand the why, but he knows it now, no problem!

 

I'm just not sure how to address the mental math issue, I want him to have more confidence, but it's not my strong area. I guess my issue is, the guide doesn't seem to give enough examples to help me help him.

 

 My ds does this. And I think you can expect it to be difficult for some time. At least my ds has phases where he's cruising right along and then suddenly everything gets brain dumped. I think that's normal.

 

I try to talk him through a mental math problem if he's having trouble. So if the mental math problem is something like 435 + 35+200, then I talk him through a place value strategy. We do the 35 +35 first to get 70 and then we add the 2 hundreds to our 4 hundreds (I use that kind of language) to get to 670. It can be hard for little kids to hold all those numbers in their head. I let mine write one down to recall, so maybe let him write down the 70 to help with memory. Or let him see the numbers as he's thinking about the answer rather than orally giving him the numbers.  I think it's best to build up to mental math skills. 

 

Just keeping all the numbers straight in their minds can be difficult, so break it down into manageable parts. Let part of the problem be written and visual and another part be mental.

 

I'm not sure if SM does the turning a 9 into a 10 strategy, but that really helps my ds get to an answer fast. Say it's something simple like 157 + 19. We think of a 20 instead and that makes 177 and then take 1 away (because you added a 1 when you though of a 10 instead of a 9)  so 176. 

 

Mostly I would just focus on making sure a child understood the underlying concepts behind math before pushing mental math. Doing something mentally can be difficult if you haven't had enough manipulative hands on practice and pencil and paper practice. 

[acsnmama]

He has always "understood" it, but it's the larger numbers he gets stuck on, he can do them, but finds them frustrating!

 

I am bad at mental math, I have improved since beginning SM with him, and I'm so happy about they. DH is fantastic at math, but he has trouble expressing how he went about it, he just knows it, but confuses DS when explaining. I personally find the making 9 a 10 easiest for me, DS I believe does this, but when I explain that to him, he gets flustered, I don't know if it's because he feels I'm interrupting his flow or not. However, when he goes word problems he doesn't always show his work, when I ask him to please show his work, he says that some parts were so easy they didn't need to be written.

 

One thing I've noticed with him is that if a math problem is "easy" he tends to get frustrated making it more difficult than it truly is.

 

I certainly want to allow him to continue in math as he is, he rarely struggles with it, it has come "easy" to him. I just wasn't sure how "easy" it should be to. The IP workbooks are a bit more challenging, so I think we'll focus more there, and continue on with 3B, but I won't have him move into 4 until he has done the 3B IP book and brushed up on some CWP.

[mamaraby]

Thank you, I did notice 3B has a mental calculation section. I try to have him do the mental math sheets in the back of the teacher guide and decided not to begin 3B until he completes them, he'll do 2-3 per day and I'll have him do some more IP pages that focus on mental calculations.

I don't think you need to hold him back from 3B necessarily unless you think he's struggling with the underlying math concepts. The mental math sheets were always overwhelming for my ds so we've never done them and if the child understands the concepts/place value otherwise, then I would continue forward.

 

tbh, I'd probably review mental math strategies in 2B and move on to 3B and encourage with lots of "I know it's challenging, but you can do it" while walking through the steps together. Now, if we were talking 1A/B with a child that didn't have their number bonds within 20 down then the answer would be different. YMMV.

 

ETA: We cross-posted. My ds does get frustrated if I interrupt his flow. I've moved towards "Are you stuck?" before breaking in. He also refuses to show his work with word problems, though I do ask that he does so. We dropped CWP in favor of Process Skills in Problem solving because it was a bit more deliberate and forced him to show his work.

[sweetpea3829]

Singapore does have a complementary workbook that works on mental math strategies.  It's called Express Math.  

 

That said...I have to be honest here but...when it comes to the larger numbers (3 digits and above) I personally do not stress out too much about my DS doing them mentally.  I can't think of too many times where I've had to add large numbers in my head where the exact answer was important.  Usually, if I'm faced with such an equation, I can round and add or subtract for an estimate.  

 

But that's just me...

 

When it comes right down to it, my own DS CAN add mentally a lot faster than I can, lol.  But...he has been taught mental math strategies from the beginning whereas I had the typical public school math education with columns, carrying and borrowing.  

[acsnmama]

When it comes right down to it, my own DS CAN add mentally a lot faster than I can, lol. But...he has been taught mental math strategies from the beginning whereas I had the typical public school math education with columns, carrying and borrowing.

Same here! I think I'm anxious because of it, I want him to be able to do what I couldn't/can't, but he's already proven he can :)

[Crimson Wife]

I discovered with my DD that her struggle was not the math part but trying to keep straight the digits when presented with an oral question. As soon as I allowed her to see the problem visually, she could do the math in her head just fine. It was one of the reasons why I took her to an audiologist for the first portion of the Central Auditory Processing Disorder eval.