g1234 Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 We plan to use Singapore's Chemistry Matters this year. I've been warned off of trying to use the lab component, though, by several people (including a Singapore rep!). Can anyone recommend a chemistry lab kit that we could use alongside? It wouldn't have to specifically correspond to the curriculum we're using, but I would like the following qualities: 1. Meaty and in-depth, not gee-whiz cursory. 2. Ready to use out of the box, with all the needed supplies and a good manual that leads us through the labs. 3. Offers a good grounding in high-school (non-AP) chemistry lab procedures and subjects. Cost is not a huge issue, as long as it's not obscenely expensive. I know that chem labs, in particular, can be pricey. I have looked at what Home Science Tools has to offer, and it looks like they might have several things that would work, but I don't know how to choose, I don't know if they're as good as they look, and I don't know what other suppliers I should also be considering. Many thanks for any suggestions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I used a kit from labpaq.com, with 20 experiments usable for high school/intro college courses. It is microchem, with good instructions, and the kit contains everything needed except for basic household chemicals (alcohol, hydrogen peroxide) and stuff like qtips. they have several different options for chemistry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie of KY Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I don't have a great suggestion. I would agree with everyone else to not do the lab with Chemistry Matters. It's not doable. I have the knowledge and equipment, but without a teacher guide it can't be done. Most of the labs say mix unknown A with unknown B but nowhere except the teacher guide does it tell what the unknowns are. The teacher guide is not sold in the USA and when I emailed Singapore, they said I couldn't buy it unless I was a registered teacher in Singapore. I teach from Illustrated Guide to Home Chemistry - it is meaty but definitely not open up and go. My second choice behind that had been the BJU chem lab. I don't really remember much about it now. I love everything I've gotten from HST - both kits and individual supplies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The microchem labs are convenient but I've heard from a couple of sources who used them diligently that they don't always turn out as planned, which could be a good or bad thing depending on how willing you are to "try science" vs. how much you want it by the book. Another alternative is the CK-01 kit put out by The Home Scientist, Dr Thompson (author of the all lab no lecture book). We have tried several labs from the smaller kit and they worked well. We had to supply table salt, sugar, distilled water and a soda bottle and a few small things (the kind of things most households will normally have). I haven't figured out yet how to correlate it with Chemistry Matters. We did those few labs using the accompanying manual and referred to the all labs book once in a while. Son has the Chemistry Matters book to read in addition if he wants it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g1234 Posted August 28, 2013 Author Share Posted August 28, 2013 Thank you so much for turning me on the Labpaq, Regentrude! I have already requested the homeschooler login and looked at the packages they offer. I also did an extensive search on WTM and found that generally most people really like them. I am going to call in the morning and ask about seeing some kind of sample, and this may well be the way we go. Julie, thank you for reminding me about the Illustrated Guide to Home Chemistry. My library has it, and I looked at it a few years ago and really liked what I saw, but I had forgotten it. I have placed a hold on it at the library and can't wait to get it back. And thanks, quark, for mentioning CK-101. I am going to look into that in the morning. I feel like I have at least three good options now. Julie and quark, it sounds like you have both done Chemistry Matters. Do you recommend it? Do you have any advice or caution? Do you think it is a high-quality non-AP (first time through) high school course? That is my hope, and I read enough good reviews that I ordered it (it should be here in a few days), but of course I am a little anxious and I would like to go into it (or make the decision to return it) with my eyes wide open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Julie and quark, it sounds like you have both done Chemistry Matters. Do you recommend it? Do you have any advice or caution? Do you think it is a high-quality non-AP (first time through) high school course? That is my hope, and I read enough good reviews that I ordered it (it should be here in a few days), but of course I am a little anxious and I would like to go into it (or make the decision to return it) with my eyes wide open. Sorry for giving you the wrong impression that we have done Chemistry Matters. He has read a couple of chapters and worked on the workbook with his Dad but he is not done with it. I like the book but I do prefer Zumdahl and I think we'll be using the latter when he is ready for a more formal chemistry course. I know a family locally who used Chemistry Matters and had only good things to say about how well the homeschooled child was prepared for chemistry, later in a dual enrollment setting. Only one data point to offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g1234 Posted August 28, 2013 Author Share Posted August 28, 2013 Thanks, Quark. It's nice to know that another family felt good about the curriculum. I just posted this question on another thread that mentions samples, but do any of you know how to get labpaq samples? The representative at HOL seemed to think my question about a sample (even just one screenshot of the lab manual) was mystifying and befuddling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie of KY Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 I really like Chemistry Matters. It gives a great overview of chemistry without getting bogged down in a bunch of details. It is not very mathy. It has the math, but on a simpler format than most high school texts. It goes very well into the concepts. My son used it for 8th grade and is now doing an AP level advanced chemistry. It shows a lot more laboratory chemistry than many texts. I can't comment on how easy this would be to teach if you don't have a chemistry background. I have a strong chemistry and math background and my oldest just absorbs the information naturally. I know one other family in real life that also really enjoyed this text. I think this book would be great for anyone as a first year chemistry course. It prepares well to move on to more advanced chemistry and is a great book if this is the only exposure to chemistry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g1234 Posted August 29, 2013 Author Share Posted August 29, 2013 That is great information, Julie. Thanks a lot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g1234 Posted August 30, 2013 Author Share Posted August 30, 2013 Oh, Quark, I finally looked into The Home Scientist Homeschool Chemistry Laboratory Kit and Lab Manual (CK-01), after beginning to fall a little out of love with Labpaq. Why did it take me so long to follow up on this?! It's wonderful! (For those who don't know, this is written by the same people who wrote the excellent Illustrated Guide to Home Chemistry that Julie mentioned, which I have sitting on my desk at the moment from the library--I think it is an attempt to make that book more open-and-go, though it is a stand-alone resource in itself and does not refer to the book.) I love how the whole lab manual is right there for us to look at, and then the kit is really quite reasonable when you figure you get all the hard-to-get materials for a reasonable price plus the lab manual free! I love that they put it all out there so we can really evaluate it and see if we think it would work. (This is in stark contrast to Labpaq, which three times now--over email and phone--has refused to give me so much as one screenshot of their lab manual, insisting that it's "intellectual property"--as if all the other curriculum providers who generously offer samples on their web sites don't have "intellectual property"?) I love what they say about themselves in the About Us section of the web site. I love the meatiness and clarity and depth of the lab manual. And I love that you (Quark) say a few of the labs you've already tried worked out well. Thank you so much to everyone (and I don't mean to speak ill of Labpaq--I think it's a great concept and has a lot to offer, and clearly it's been very helpful to a lot of WTM families, and certainly would have served us well if we'd gone with it, too). And thank you Quark for introducing me to what I think is going to be my daughter's chemistry lab component this year. It feels so good to find the thing that "fits" our individual families, whatever that is, doesn't it? :hurray: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie of KY Posted August 30, 2013 Share Posted August 30, 2013 Just to note, the labs by the Home Scientist are authored by the same author as the Illustrated Guide. They follow the same progression of topics, but they are not the same. They use much smaller amounts of chemicals and often different chemicals. The labs are good. They have lots of teaching in the labs. They don't teach the use of bigger scale chemistry equipment. It also has the advantage of being cheaper - less equipment and less chemicals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted August 30, 2013 Share Posted August 30, 2013 :hurray: So glad the suggestion was helpful to you! Yes to what Julie says about the material in the manual. It's a little different from the book. We did it in a small group for younger chemistry-hungry kids, for a few months. We really liked the convenience of the kit and we chose it carefully after first weighing between CK-01 and the Thames and Kosmos 3000 kit. We used Thompson's all lab book to familiarize the boys with lab safety and various terminology and apparatus. We didn't stress on the lab notebook component because honestly, it was more for fun than for credit. But DS and a few of the boys kept their own notes in an informal format. We parents split the cost of the kit and used the manual as the main lab resource. It was easier logistically. Then, DS and I couldn't join the group anymore due to time commitments, and that's why we stopped at just several labs and did not do all. DS might be picking it up again with DH later this year or possibly next year. So I would love to know how it goes for your DD if you guys go ahead with it. :) Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnTeaching Posted August 31, 2013 Share Posted August 31, 2013 Wow - I ordered from The Home Scientist today and in less than 30 minutes after I ordered, I got an email from Mr. Thompson stating that it had already shipped! I was not expecting it to ship until next week and then for it to take several days if not into the next week to get to me. I have to say that so far, I am extremely impressed with his customer service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g1234 Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 Nice story, MtnTeaching! I placed my order on Sunday of Labor Day weekend. quark, I will definitely let you know how it goes. We are going to use it, so I'll check in in a few weeks or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnTeaching Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 Wow - I ordered from The Home Scientist today and in less than 30 minutes after I ordered, I got an email from Mr. Thompson stating that it had already shipped! I was not expecting it to ship until next week and then for it to take several days if not into the next week to get to me. I have to say that so far, I am extremely impressed with his customer service. OK - even better - I got my order today! I ordered it and it shipped on Friday of Labor Day weekend. Wow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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