I just tried the taking 7/8 from 1 and he couldn't do it...even with a pie thing I found and cut up. And the problems are like 4 1/6 - 1 1/3 as well. He can add 1/3 plus 1/6. He can subtract unlike denominators, but add in the whole number and we are lost... Where do I find these manipulatives and nest of 3, you lost me with the pennies and dimes.... How does that relate to fractions. I think I need to do converting whole numbers into fractions but I am not sure how to do that with manipulatives. We just got into a head butting match...again...

He didn't get it.

My 5th grader and I are knocking heads over what I think is a simple concept. 10 - 4 7/8. Turning that first number into a number and a fraction so he can subtract just isn't happening. Sigh... To me it is easy. How do I teach this??? Christine

My dad is another energy drainer. He is wheelchair bound pretty much with severe COPD..cannot walk more than a few steps without being totally out of breath, on oxygen 24/7. He never recovered from his broken femur (had to live with us for 6 months during my 2nd year of homeschooling) My daughter and I go to his house while the boys are at piano for 2 hours and take him to Wal-mart, get his haircut, etc. We take him to church and to all doctor appointments. That is another thing that frustrates me...trying to get school done with doctor's appointments, dentist, car inspections or getting tires aligned, mammograms, etc in addition to sports, music, etc. Sigh...

This is a spin-off of the difficult questions thread. I, too, am in my 40's and really struggle with the energy, stamina to keep up with this lifestyle. I have 7th and 5th grade boys and a K girl. This is my 5th year of homeschooling and though easier in some ways (We had major illiness of various relatives with different ones living with us my first two years...what a way to start!) it has been very difficult homeschooling-wise this year. Am I doing what is right for all of my children? Am I really giving them the best education?? And my 5th grader has fallen through the cracks a bit. My oldest is extremely self-motivated and is doing Algebra I and Physical Science well this year. I am using TT Algebra this year, but now I've heard it isn't rigerous enough, so should I change in midstream??? He is very bright and is already past me in many areas. His writing has really improved this year and he has gotten quite good at the essay part of the exams I make up for TOG. Next year he will do Biology labs at the co-op and they are still deciding the schedule, but this year he had a really hard time keeping up with co-op: Texas History, Speech and writing in addition to all of the stuff I gave him. But I NEED the science labs... I cannot do them. He is also gifted in computers and I can't find a class he can take. A few people have suggested having him go to the college, but he is turning 13 this week, and I don't feel comfortable with that. Nor would he. He is EXTREMELY shy. In fact, I sometime wonder if he should go to ps to FORCE him to interact. In kindergarten they put him in speech because he whispered and wouldn't talk to anyone, but eventually he did by the end of the year. He actually skipped speech class once this year because he really didn't want to give his speech. One of the few times he has ever done anything wrong. After severe punishment, apologizing to his teacher he had to give that speech and and oral speech for his Texas history class. Although my 7th grader can and does work independently, my 5th grader is your typical boy. He loves people and misses school and likes co-op. His classes have been fluffy and no outside work, though. I have to constantly check on him to make sure the work is done, and sometimes I forget and don't realize he hasn't done x for a week. He HATES math and he and I were getting so frustrated yesterday. I couldn't get him to understand about borrowing from fractions 10 - 4 3/4 as an example. To me, that is so incredibly easy. I don't know how to teach it... I kept showing him that you borrow and then turn it into an equivilent fraction...anyway. We finally put it away. He is a voracious reader and writes quite well. He read Lord of the Rings again this year. Science has been the forgotton subject. It is hard not doing it together with his brother and it has been haphazard stuff I've found. He had already done the elementary Apologia they were doing at Co-op. He isll read anything, but written work is another thing.. He is just average at math, which makes him feel stupid compared to his brother.. I'm thinking Algebra as a 9th grader for him. He feels very stupid compared to his brother, but their gifts are just different. He has much more athletic talent. Then there is my K girl. Very social and a constant talker. I spend maybe and hour teaching her. We concentrate on phonics, handwriting and math. We made it through the Singapore earlybird and are currently doing 1A, but I don't do math with her everyday. It has been unschooling a lot with her and math. She will bring me coins and we'll play and talk about what they are. She asks me about what time it is and we will play with her clock. We probably do some out of the workbooks 2 days a week. I've never taught anyone how to read and it seems incredibly slow and painful. I keep thinking...you just read that word...don't you just know it by site. She can read cvc words and I will be introducing the silent e next week. But much of the day she entertains herself while I am doing TOG with the older ones. Boy..she would have loved all the interaction and playtime in traditional kindergarten... So I bounce between the very different children...trying to give them what they need and dh says, "if you put them in school you would have more time for the things you want to do.." I don't even remember what that is anymore!! My whole life has become church and homeschooling. And ps...yes my other question was rhetorical. It just seemed like everyone was saying college was bad and don't plan on in the other thread. I am the "stupid" on on both sides as I only have a bachelor's degree with no masters or other advanced degree (med or law) like everyone else on both sides. Most are teachers or college administrators, department chairs at colleges, etc. Christine

It doesn't matter... we won't be eligible for any need based scholarships anyway. This is part of the reason we have saved so diligently. We figure that unless he is a National Merit scholar or gets another academic type scholarship, we will be paying the entire amount wherever he/she goes. We won't ever qualify for financial aid on a need based amount, nor should we. We aren't planning on social security either. It will probably be bankrupt by the time we retire. Plus dh wants to do medical missions full time when he retires which will be about the time my youngest starts college. So we consistently save A LOT of our income for retirement and college and one wedding (one girl) so that he can do full time medical missions at 55. We don't have cable, kids don't have cell phones or any of the computer gaming stuff. We grow our own food in a garden, so my grocery bill isn't bad. My kids are in a habit of saying, "Do you have a coupon for that or is it on sale?" I only buy clothes when they are on clearance at the end of the season for the next year. Christine

??? You have completely lost me. Are you saying that 100 percent of the 529 plan must be used...that isn't true. In fact, you can only withdraw what you actually spent. I don't understand what you are saying.... Christine

There I have to disagree. I did have summer jobs in high school, but my parents refused to let me work during the school year. They said that being a student was my full time job and they wanted me in extra-curricular. It paid off as I paid for half of the cost of Baylor my first 3 years and the total cost the last year and a half with scholarships. Likewise, my husband's family paid his way through college and med school, but he had full scholarships the last few years at Baylor as well (I think it was Phi Beta Kappa scholarship or something) We are eternally grateful that our parents provided for it, so we could graduate without any debt. So dh has made it a priority, the minute I got pregnant to start saving. We have always been committed to living debt free as well. My oldest is just like his dad. He has set up a money account where he tracks his savings account and keeps track of extra chore money, b-day money and such.

Grin..no they don't have to go to Baylor. It is just the most expensive option we would entertain. If they want to go to Yale or Stanford or other WAY too expensive school, they have to fund the excess. That is one reason we went the 529 plan, so that if child 1 went to A&M, but child 2 decided to do Baylor and med school like his dad, he could. We would just move the money around to the child who needs it.

I've been reading the college thread with interest. I guess I have always assumed my children will all go to college and get a degree, but even my grandparents had a college degree and I guess I just assumed they did farther back as well. We have saved for college for these children since they were born and now they all have 529 plans. We almost have enough in the boys accounts to pay for Baylor all 4 years (they are 13, and 11) and enough in the 6yo account to pay for half. The money has been automatically deducted since they were babies. It is a given in our house. Is that wrong? My oldest just recently took the ACT as a 7th grader as part of the Duke program and did really well, could possibly get into Baylor with it, but realistically into junior college at this stage. I guess, to me, college is the ultimate goal with med school, law school, master's program or whatever after that... IS that wrong? Christine

Don't forget about the Junior Ranger Program at the National Parks. We travel to various National Parks a lot. Each park does it differently. Some you have to buy for a couple dollars, others give them to you for free. Some have extensive requirements, others do not. When you finish the booklet and requirements, then they give you a pin or a patch. My boys each have a giant 3 ring binder that we keep all of the ones we have done. They love it and now my girl is old enought to start as well. She got to be a Ranger at Yellowstone! Sometimes state parks have something like this as well. Custer State Park has a great program. Also, if you look on the national park website for the ones you will be visiting, check out the educational sections. They often have downloadable teacher's guides to use for field trips to the parks. For Big Bend National Park they had TONS of that kind of stuff: wildlife bingo, etc. We normally take 2 or 3 big trips a year, so I am an expert at learning on the road. We also have the children keep a travel journal as we go. I also came up with a chart for my oldest to track mileage and our trip expenses. Have fun on your trip!!! Christine

I haven't use Sonlight Core 6 or 7, but did use Cores 3, 4, and 5 before doing TOG redesigned 1 this year. I think you will find Sonlight A LOT easier than TOG which may be what you want. And you might be able to just open up the schedule and go like they say you can, but I never could. I was always on week 18 with the readaloud, week 20 with readers adn week 16 with history. Actually, most of the time I completely redid their schedule and added in tons more information and made out my own tests and such. I like TOG because all of the research has been done for me. i just pick and choose levels so it was actually less time consuming than trying to beef up Sonlight. I like that TOG has questions for the children to answer about history and worksheets for the literature selections. With Sonlight, you had to retype the questions from the readers and they were NOT in depth at all...basic recall type questions. I just didn't know if my children were learning unless I gave them some extra things to go with it. Mapwork never got done with Sonlight. With TOG I have been amazed!!! My 5th grader aced the Unit III rhetoric level map exam that I gave him. (I picked and chose from among the different exams on evaluations and the internet to make my own.) I like that my 7th grader, 5th grader and K can study the same thing. I like that I can choose from different levels on different weeks if I so choose. On the other hand, some people really like Sonlight and find it easy to use. I just didn't think it was enough so I was trying to come up with my own questions and finding more books for them to read. TOG has been much more challenging. With Sonlight it is basically just reading and no other work unless you do the writing that goes with it. I hope that helps. Christine

Ok , let us look at the week 3 of the Go to Egypt Sample. On page 4 are the selections that are recommended for you to be able to answer the questions. The history and history in-depth will allow you dialectic child to answer the history questions on p. 16 both acountablity and thinking. Now, that said, you can substitute sources if you want as the history questions are about topic. So on p5 they give you alternate resources if you wish. I also take Learning Through History Magazine and that helps. The only think is that the answers to the questions will definitely be found in their first page of resources and they may not be in your own creation. Now , in literature they are reading part of Tales of Ancient Egypt. In this book there are just some questions for them to answer on p. 16. Most weeks, there is a worksheet that goes with the literature selection, but not this week. To be honest, I didn't do the fine arts, but if you want to you need the Ancient Egyptians that they recommend pn p. 4. For Bible Church history on p 4 they are supposed to read Ex. 6-18 and about 6 pages in Understanding Jewish Holidays and customs. On p. 17 you have a chart they are supposed to fill out about the plagues and what they mean and then some questions to answer. I think I had to help them with the meaning of the plagues. Finally, the map assignment is on p. 16 and a Bible Atlas and World Atlas are helpful throughout the year. This particular week, the mapwork is light. You just trace the route as they fled from Egypt. It makes up for the heavier work, the week before. The teacher's notes are basically for you to read, but you could have your child read from them if you don't have the right resources or there aren't any for the week. I lectured from them one week when I told them about the Amalekites (sp) Amorites, Edomites, etc. A lot of the teacher's notes come from the World Book Encyclopedia. Then on p. 29 you will see the dialectic discussion outline. It gives you a guide about what to go over. Now I will be honest. In unit 1 I had a little trouble with the dialectic discussion because it wasn't organized like the rhetoric and it didn't always go over their questions. By unit 2, the discussion outlines were much better for dialectic or maybe I just got better at it. I'm not sure. On p. 31-32 it goes over the answers to their worksheets for literature. On p. 38 it has the dialect Bible discussion. I always read over the rhetoric discussion outlines as well as there is good information in there and sometimes you need it with dialectic. For history and Bible questions, they jot down their answers in a notebook they have. They don't even have to be readable for me, just so they have something written down and have thought about the questions. They hand me their literature worksheets done very neatly on Friday for me to grade and basically I just look over it to make sure it is done. They do not have literature discussion for dialectic and to be honest, there wasn't much great "literature." Look at the rhetoric level and you will see how extensive it is. They are analyzing a poem in detail for meaning. There is a lot of notes and a lot of discussion for rhetoric level. When I get there, I'm thinking I might discuss the history on Thursday and the literature on Friday. Especially in year 3 they are using medieval frameworks and all sort of literary devices and I'm thinking it would take an hour or 2 just to discuss the literature at the rhetoric level. I wasn't sure what you meant by activities...outside activities?? The fine art activities?? To be honest, I'm not artsy craftsy and we hardly did any at all. We did make some pyramids, and assembled a predone Tabernacle, and made a Greek shield, but that has been about it. There are tons of ideas and books they suggest, but I just haven't found/made the time. Christine

I'm not sure what LL is, so I cannot answer that. I am currently on unit 4 of TOG redesigned year 1 with a 7th grader, 5th grader, and K. My 7th grader has done dialectic, my 5th grader has read all of the dialectic and has done a lot of the dialectic work, but not all. As far as literary analysis, there is not a ton for the dialectic in year 1. It was mainly plot, characterization, setting, etc. and a few literary elements (simile, metaphonr, etc.) I think part of that is because the Bible is a HUGE part of the curriculum this year and there isn't a lot of literature to analyze. I've been skimming my TOG redesigned year 2 and there is a lot more analysis in there. Also... there is a HUGE and I mean HUGE difference between the literature between dialectic and rhetoric. The literary analysis for rhetoric is college level in my opinion. So.. you might be able to look at the rhetoric and add a little bit of it to the dialectic. I am going to do a modified version of the rhetoric literature for oldest who will be 8th grade next year to ease into it for both his and my sake. That is one thing I LOVE about this curriculum. The information is all there and I love being able to modify and take pieces from the various levels as they fit. I honestly do not know that I would use another literature program with TOG. There is SO much in there, it would be overkill. There were some weeks that I stretched out and then there were some weeks that I combined because all there were were Bible readings and my children knew the stories and I did not think knowing all of the judges/kings was all that important!!! We wanted to get on to Ancient Greece!!! As far as scheduling. On Friday afternoons they get out their notebooks. I had already run off all of their student activity pages and reading lists ahead of time. We go over what we will be studying and when things will be due according to what is going on the next week. Generally, I tell them that all of their history reading and questions need to be done by Thursday . On Friday morning we have our discussions over the material. We also go over the maps then as well. Their literature and SAP's must also be done by Friday. Sometimes they finish them up or recopy them on Friday afternoon. Depending on how long the discussion takes in the morning we either plan the next week then or in the afternoon. I schedule my 5th grader as he seems incapable or unwilling to do so. My 7th grader takes out his blank planner and goes to town planning his week. He likes being able to decide when he will read what. We haven't done much of the writing component this year even though it is very good because they have both been taking speech at the co-op and then my oldest was taking an IEW intensive writing class and his Texas history class had a couple of papers each semester so that was enough writing in my opinion. My 5th grader did more of the writing that went with TOG because he has more time. If you have any other questions, let me know. Christine

Maybe I'll get it back out, but it was WAY too abstract for my younger boy when I tried it before. The other day in Horizon they were supposed to borrow and rename a fraction: 7 2/8 = 6 10/8. He couldn't get it. To me it was easy. Eventually after a lot of paper and pencil with me showing him that 1 can be 3/3, 2/2, 6/6 or whatever and you just add it to the other number after you borrow it... See that sounds so confusing. I just KNOW math, but have NO idea how to explain it. My oldest just teaches himself and completely understands my shorthand if he has a problem. I probably should have cut out various fraction circles or something and had him play with them. He seems to need hands on or something. My kindergartener is currently doing Singapore 1A and doing well. I'm just not sure the abstract nature of it will work well for that middle child. I'm just having a REALLY hard time doing what is best for 3 VERY different children. There isn't enough of me to go around. Things are starting to fall through the cracks. Christine

This was already on page 3!!! Anyone??? Christine

Hey, I have a VERY bright 7th grader who has been thriving this year doing Algebra I and Aplogia Physical Science. That said, this past week he has been ... having senoritis. We normally start school in July. We took a 2 week vacation in August. We took a trip in October, a week off for Thanksgiving, a couple of weeks off for Christmas. IN February they worked with my mom for a week while I was on a trip with dh. We took a sort of break last week...continuing to do math and science but nothing else. He will have a week off for testing at the beginning of April and a week off right after that because his dad is off. So... It weems like we stop and start. He has been staring at his science and says it is hard and he doesn't get it. He has also had bad allergies and has been on medication that makes him sleepy. He has loved science and wanted to do it up until this time. He has blown away the other kids in his co-op (they do labs there and extra fun things) and all the other kids tease him a little about knowing it all. So... I think he has spring fever, doesn't feel well, etc. His last co-op is next week with chapter 15. He was supposed to take his chapter 14 test yesterday but begged off. I agreed because this child never asks to get out of work. He will miss the chapter 16 week at co-op because of the SAT testing. So... what should I do?? Make him continure working? Tell him to just read chapter 15 so he can be ready for experiments next week and then drop science until the middle of April when we get back from vacation with his dad?? That would give us 6 weeks to test over 14 and finish up 15 and 16. Does that sound ok?? He has just seemed stressed this week..math is taking forever, everything is and he just isn't enthusiastic about school right now.. Chrisint

I'm struggling with what to do for next year for math... My concern is with my 2 oldest boys. My oldest is VERY bright and qualified for the DUKE tip program and scored well on the ACT last month. He is in 7th grade. I took him out of school after 3rd grade and got Saxon 54, because that is what they used in school. He finished it in record time. For 5th grade we did Saxon 65, but we both hated it. In fact for both 54 and 65 we skipped half the book because I knew he already knew the material, I would give him the test, he would make 100 or miss one and we would go on without actually doing the material. So...in January we were finished and so we switched to Singapore. I went ahead and started with 3B and we did 3B all the way to 6B from February of his 5th grade year to the end of his 6th grade year. So.... this year for 7th after much agonizing I decided to go with Teaching Textbooks Algebra. I got the Singapore NSM to supplement it, but that was a disaster. Neither he nor I could figure out that book and we ditched it after the first chapter. TT has gone pretty well. He is only a little over halfway through it, however. There was a time when the lessons were taking him forever... well, actually probably standard time for an Algebra lesson...a little over an hour. But he was used to lessons taking him 20 to 30 minutes. So we broke up the lessons over 2 days for a while. But now he is doing one lesson a day. We also spent a month doing ALEX instead of TT to catchi him up on a couple of skills that he had missed with Singapore like graphing (1, 3). He did the 8th grade and almost finished it before the month was up. He also did ACT prep math for a week before he took it. So that is why he is only on 60 right now. Now he is still ahead because he is only a 7th grader so I'm not concerned with his not finishing, but... I have no idea what to do for next year. Also, people keep talking about TT not being rigorous enough so maybe I should supplement, but with what??? I also want something I can use with my younger son. So I finish TT Algebra and then..... what? Do a supplement Algebra? Go on to Geometry?? There is a possibility of his going to public high school in 9th grade, so maybe I should just stick with Algebra since the honors kids take geometry in 9th grade.... Then there is my 5th grader who hates math and thinks he isn't good with it. His standardized scores in math were in the 40th percentile when I took him out of ps, but last go around they were in the 80th. I did a hodgepodge for 2nd grade. Saxon for 3rd. Saxon 54 for 4th which he HATED!!!! We made it about halfway through before we switched to Horizons which he has enjoyed. he is currently in Horizons 5, which is taking us forever!!! He is on lesson 110 of 180. I feel like we will never finish... Sometime he figures out the riddles and fills in the answer and doesn't actually work the problems... TT would be a good fit for him because he isn't math minded and doesn't intuitively see math like my oldest does. That said, he is a little above average, but thinks he is slow and stupid compared to his brother. I've considered switching to TT 7 for him, he has been watching his older brother's Algebra and likes it.. So, I don't know what to do for next year. I've heard Chalk Dust is good and rigerous, but I don't think my younger boy could do it so I hate to spend over 400 dollars for just one child and then 200 dollars on somehting else for another!!! Help Christine