Can someone explain Barton to me?

[thundersweet]

They really should have better samples for the price you pay: ( Anyway, I suspect my 8yo may be dyslexic. We are going for testing in a few weeks. In the meantime, we have been using LOE. I am considering a switch to Barton because I feel like I will know I am doing everything right, if that makes sense. We skip a lot of LOE and sometimes I wonder if I'm doing it right or if I am missing something.

 

We will be starting in Barton 3. How does a lesson look? Does Barton include drilling the phonograms daily? If not, which I don't think they do, how does the dc learn them? Does it include dictation sentences? Do they write spelling words daily? I love the new app! If someone could help me out, I would appreciate it.

 

Sandy

 

 

Thanks,

Sandy

[chasingbutterflies]

I recently ordered LOE and have been reading the book.

What is it that you are skipping over in it? What seems to not be working?

How old is your child and do they have dyslexia?

I had debated between these two programs. However, that Barton program is simply not worth the price!

[myboyluvsdinos]

Every Barton lesson starts with review. You do not move on until mastery. So in level 4, for example, each lesson starts with reviewing the units. Then you start the lesson. Each lesson consists of: 1. Phonemic awareness warm-up. 2. New teachings 3. Spell real words on tiles 4. Read Nonsense words on tiles 5. Spell nonsense words on tiles 6. Read words on paper 7. Spell words on paper 8. Practice reading sight words 9. practice spelling sight words 10. read phrases 11. spell phrases & sight words 12. read sentences 13. spell sentences 14. read a story. This is for EACH new concept. For example, one lesson in level 4 deals with spelling the /k/ sound in the middle of a word. So first you teach the lesson, then they practice by spelling words like cactus and broken (they've already learned the difference between open and closed syllables at this point.) Then they read nonsense words like slupky and spacken. And you go on through the procedures for just that concept. Barton levels cost $300, and you can resale them for about $250. Depending on the level and the severity of the child, it takes anywhere from 3-6 months to get through levels 3-10. (Levels 1 and 2 can go quicker.) You should NOT start in level 3 unless the student has received prior Orton-Gillingham tutoring. Level 1 is all phonemic awareness, and is crucial. Each level builds upon the previous levels, so you really can't skip them. Hope this helps answer your questions. Sorry, but still not able to form paragraphs from my computer! :)

[thundersweet]

He is 8 and I suspect dyslexia. I usually skip over the grammar because its just too much. We are on lesson 19. We also skip a lot of the excercises in the workbook. He doesn't remember his spelling words from the lesson. It just doesn't seem to be sticking. I feel like maybe it's just an overload. I don't know. Barton just seems to move at a slower pace. I suppose I could just slow down LOE even more but even with that, I think the grammar portion moves to quickly. I also think the dictation sentences get pretty advanced quickly. I thought of just using it for the spelling list, which I may still do, but I would love to hear more about Barton.

 

Sandy

[thundersweet]

Myboy, we used SWR and now LOE which is based off of OG. Susan did send me the posttest and he tested into level 3. Your post was very helpful by the way!

 

Sandy

[Chanley]

I am using Barton with my son and LOE with my older daughter. Using both programs simultaneously, I will say this...the way that the spelling rules are taught in Barton is far more effective than the way they are taught in LOE. Barton is definitely worth the time and price. I would be very careful about skipping 1 and 2. You are laying the foundation for a lifetime of good reading and spelling skills, in the grand scheme of things, a few more months of Barton will pay off if needed.

 

I am teaching my daughter quite a few "tricks" from Barton and her LOE experience is being greatly enhanced by her exposure to some of the ideas behind Susan Barton's work.

 

I also want to add that my Barton using son is also utilizing the LOE phoneme app. It is worth every penny of the $2.99 I spent on it for phoneme drills. I cannot reccomend it highly enough.

[chasingbutterflies]

I should not have read this... I JUST bought LOE and received it a week ago. It was NOT an easy decision to make.

My kids are two years are almost two years behind in their reading levels.

 

I homeschooled my younger kids until they were legally required to attend school (8yrs old).

When they started school, I was told they were on par with everyone else.

The following year I was told they were a year behind in reading. Then this year I was told they are almost two years behind.

I decided to take them out of public school to educate them.

The public school has been VERY much against me doing so.

They blame my kids being behind with reading, on my choice to homeschool till they were 8yrs old.

They said that if I do not make adequate progress, then I will not be allowed to continue homeschooling.

So this year REALLY has everything at stake.

 

I struggled desperately to find a solid and affordable choice.

 

My kids have mastered their phonic sounds (so I am told).

My daughter struggles the most with reading.

I asked her to tell me if the 'a' in stair was long or short. Seemed easy enough. It was a level 1 explode the code question.

She said that she only heard the 's', 't' and 'r' sound. She heard no 'a' sound. "air" sounded like just an 'r' sound to her.

We had to sit with her say the 'r' sound then say "air" a few times till she heard a variation. But she still struggled to recognize the 'a' sound.

This is going to be hard to explain, but my daughter kind of mumbles her words when she talks. Everyone struggled to understand her when she was younger. She is not good at being clear when she speaks. Sometimes I wonder if it is a hearing problem. The doctors say it isn't though.

My son who has none of those specific issues - also is almost 2yrs behind with reading as well. I gave him a list of grade level reading words (200 words) and he got all but 10 right. Of the ten he got wrong, he corrected himself on 9 of them. So technically, he only got 1 wrong. How is that not being 2yrs behind in reading level?

The school is right. I am not trained. Right now the kids have the best teachers and work with highly trained specialists in dealing with struggling readers. Yet, they are getting nowhere it seems. I want to figure out the issue and resolve it. Especially since the school denied my son social studies and science over this issue AND wanted to retain my daughter a grade. So, I really need to put 150% into this.

 

Complicating things further, the kids dad + his dad, my dad + my brother - all have dyslexia. The kids dad (and his dad) have severe dyslexia. My dad and brother have a less severe form. I was in a learning disabled class, they never knew what my learning disability was, but in high school labeled me as ADHD. My dad says I have a very mild form of dyslexia - I am not convinced. I asked the school if my kids have it, they INSIST that my kids do not have it, and that their specialists would have picked up on it.

 

If paying $3000.- for Barton meant saving my kids, I would do it. BUT I am NOT convinced that I do NEED to. I will at least start out with the $300 one first. But, what concerns me is that I LOVED what I saw of Barton and hoped LOE was pretty much the same thing.

 

I would LOVE to hear more about the differences.

 

 

 

I am using Barton with my son and LOE with my older daughter. Using both programs simultaneously, I will say this...the way that the spelling rules are taught in Barton is far more effective than the way they are taught in LOE. Barton is definitely worth the time and price. I would be very careful about skipping 1 and 2. You are laying the foundation for a lifetime of good reading and spelling skills, in the grand scheme of things, a few more months of Barton will pay off if needed.

 

I am teaching my daughter quite a few "tricks" from Barton and her LOE experience is being greatly enhanced by her exposure to some of the ideas behind Susan Barton's work.

 

I also want to add that my Barton using son is also utilizing the LOE phoneme app. It is worth every penny of the $2.99 I spent on it for phoneme drills. I cannot reccomend it highly enough.

 

[Chanley]

First of all, and someone please correct me if I am wrong, the vowel sound in "stair" is a vowel team. Get the LOE app and let them work through it.

 

I think LOE is totally doable. I just like the format of Barton better and think it is a bit easier to remember when it comes to the rules. Barton is not $3000 out of pocket. You buy the first level, used if you can. Sell it to pay for the next one and so forth. At the end of all of this, I should only have maybe $100 out of pocket for all of my Barton use.

 

Schools are not trained to deal with dyslexia, of course your children are not getting what they need at public school. No matter how awesome a teacher is, if they do not have the right tools, it is not going to do any good. The best hammer in the world is not going to help me drive a screw.

 

Take a deep breathe. And remember to read to your children. Often. Quite a bit.

[chasingbutterflies]

I was concerned that she didn't hear ANY vowels. That "air" part ONLY sounded like "r" to her.

 

You know what, you ARE correct. I had not even thought about that. UGH! I had also preferred Barton, but went with LOE because of the price difference. But I did notice that Barton sells REALLY well on Ebay. So you ARE correct, it is VERY doable financially speaking. Now I have to reconsider my options.

 

...and thanks for the encouragement.

 

First of all, and someone please correct me if I am wrong, the vowel sound in "stair" is a vowel team. Get the LOE app and let them work through it.

 

I think LOE is totally doable. I just like the format of Barton better and think it is a bit easier to remember when it comes to the rules. Barton is not $3000 out of pocket. You buy the first level, used if you can. Sell it to pay for the next one and so forth. At the end of all of this, I should only have maybe $100 out of pocket for all of my Barton use.

 

Schools are not trained to deal with dyslexia, of course your children are not getting what they need at public school. No matter how awesome a teacher is, if they do not have the right tools, it is not going to do any good. The best hammer in the world is not going to help me drive a screw.

 

Take a deep breathe. And remember to read to your children. Often. Quite a bit.

 

[myboyluvsdinos]

First of all, and someone please correct me if I am wrong, the vowel sound in "stair" is a vowel team. Get the LOE app and let them work through it.

 

 

Yes, ai is a vowel team. But the real problem is the child cannot hear it. That requires auditory discrimination (they will usually test fine on an actual hearing test or they may find CAPD). You can drill it till the cows come home, but if they cannot hear it in a word, it will do no good. If a child cannot accurately perceive the sounds in words, they will struggle mightily with reading/spelling. This child may not be able to pass the Barton screening, and may need the LIPS program first. I would definitely get an eval with either a Barton screener or a neuropsych who says they can diagnose dyslexia (not always easy to find). 95% of the schools won't diagnose or even recognize dyslexia, so don't believe a word they say.

[myboyluvsdinos]

Complicating things further, the kids dad + his dad, my dad + my brother - all have dyslexia. The kids dad (and his dad) have severe dyslexia. My dad and brother have a less severe form. I was in a learning disabled class, they never knew what my learning disability was, but in high school labeled me as ADHD. My dad says I have a very mild form of dyslexia - I am not convinced. I asked the school if my kids have it, they INSIST that my kids do not have it, and that their specialists would have picked up on it.

I would LOVE to hear more about the differences.

 

Your family history is another big red flag, as dyslexia is genetic. Another big reason to get a proper eval. I would love to explain more about the differences for you, but I know nothing about LOE. I can only answer questions about Barton. That's because I tutored my own kids with it, and am now a certified Barton tutor. Sorry! :)