Need help, R&S 6 Grammar, Lesson #115

[nutmeg]

We are having trouble figuring out what to do with 'about ships':

 

The first book on the shelf was about ships.

 

According to the teacher's manual, 'about ships' is a prepositional phrase, modifying 'was'. I assume then we would term it an adverbial phrase, as it is modifying a verb?

 

But as an adverbial phrase, it doesn't seem (to me) to be answering any of the adverb test questions:

 

The first book on the shelf was how? about ships

The first book on the shelf was when? about ships

The first book on the shelf was where? about ships

The first book on the shelf was why? about ships

The first book on the shelf was to what degree? about ships

 

None of those make sense to me.

 

Help?

[Rhondabee]

Oh, I agree it seems like it *should* be a "predicate adjective phrase" referring back to "what kind of book?". After all, it follows the linking verb "was".

 

I even checked the additional adverb questions in R&S-7, and I don't think it really answers those, either. (How long, How much, In spite of what, Under what condition)

 

In cases like these where the world doesn't seem to think I should have the final say, I would have to defer to the rule that says "adjective phrases always have to follow the noun they modify".

 

Or, just say, "oh, whatever" and move on.

 

not that that helps, but...

Rhonda

[Suzanne in ABQ]

I believe that the writer of Descriptive English Grammar agrees with you.

 

On page 237, it reads, "The prepositional phrase immediately following the verb and used as a subjective complement should not be confused with the adverb phrase used as a modifier of the verb. If the verb is a copulative [linking] one, the prepositional phrase will be an attribute (subjective) complement. Often the adjective phrase can be tested by substituting a pure adjective.

 

"Ex. The ring is of gold.

 

"Of gold (equivalent to golden) is an adjective phrase used as a predicate adjective."

 

 

It seems to me (Suzanne), that one could substitute a pure adjective like "nautical" into the sentence, to replace the phrase "about ships", and it would not change the structure or the intended meaning of the sentence. I would agree that the phrase is adjective, not adverbial. It modifies the book, not the verb "was".

[nutmeg]

Thank you, Rhonda and Suzanne. That was very helpful!

 

I can see, however, that I need to spend some time this summer doing R&S 7 myself before trying to teach it to my oldest. Up until this point I've done fine with it on the fly. :001_huh:

 

Thanks again!

[Beth in Central TX]

I've been thinking about this more. How would you diagram this? I think there is an implied portion to this sentence. I'm going to simplify it to: The book was about ships. Really you're saying, the book was a book about ships. We just drop off the second reference to book because we know that's what we are talking about.

 

Here's what I've come up with so far:

 

book | was \ (book)

.......................\

.........................\about

...........................\ships

 

 

What do you think? Or would you just put "about ships" under the subject, book? I don't like it there because then the sentence looks like: The book about ships was.

 

Any grammarians out there? Suzanne, my DEG doesn't address this; I don't have the same information on the page number you referred to. Does DEG have a diagram example?

 

Thanks!

[Rhondabee]

I've been thinking about this more. How would you diagram this? I think there is an implied portion to this sentence. I'm going to simplify it to: The book was about ships. Really you're saying, the book was a book about ships. We just drop off the second reference to book because we know that's what we are talking about.

 

Here's what I've come up with so far:

 

book | was \ (book)

.......................\

.........................\about

...........................\ships

 

 

What do you think? Or would you just put "about ships" under the subject, book? I don't like it there because then the sentence looks like: The book about ships was.

 

Any grammarians out there? Suzanne, my DEG doesn't address this; I don't have the same information on the page number you referred to. Does DEG have a diagram example?

 

Thanks!

 

We have just barely covered "elliptical" sentences in R&S-7, where part of the sentence is implied (if you saw Janice in NJ's video, you'll know what I mean), and before I even clicked on your post, that's exactly what I was thinking - (boat) in the Pred. Adj. position with about boats diagrammed as a prepositional phrase underneath.

 

:iagree:

Rhonda