CourtneySue
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Posts posted by CourtneySue
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I want to try the purple book. Maybe with the worksheets it can sometimes stand as the whole curriculum? Does the purple book link to specific games? Are there games that only link up to the full curriculum?
I just checked and it actually includes the games, including the instructions on how to play them. It is most likely not exhaustive.
The book includes all major math operations: addition, subtraction, multiplication, division and a few more. It does not seem to cover fractions, but I guess mastering all the others helps with fractions. It is 'mean and lean' but definitely not a full curriculum, IMO.
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You all are making me feel so much better. I saw these free lessons on the apps page and the videos at youtube. I know there are pieces of the al abacus that I do want. The CORE of it.
But the full package scared me. It felt too wide.
I was almost in tears picking between RightStart and Professor B. My hands were literally shaking when I finally put in my order. I didn't feel like I had enough information to KNOW what to do. I went with my gut, which is right more often than wrong. My promise to myself to cut back my spending was just amping up the pressure.
One of my neighbors is looking at the the purple package and games to use with her niece this summer. I'll get to see it soon, if she buys it. I'm sure it will get dumped in my lap first, by the auntie, who'd rather I teach her, than try to read the instructions herself. She liked the abacus better than the fingers work. And I think I do too.
But the full package just...didn't feel right. Notice all the videos are for the games and what is in the purple book, and not the full package.
I was born in the wrong century. I should have been born when Ray's Arithmetic and the rest of the Eclectic series was all CURRENT, and didn't need to be picked through and adapted. The Eclectic series is so systematic and streamlined, and the manual even includes conceptual ideas for all the books. I just don't understand why we don't have a modern equivalent.
After reading how you like to teaching math I definitely don't think you would like the full program. You might like the Activities book though. You'll have to give your opinion when your neighbor gets hers.
I do have the app, but hadn't seen the free lessons. Thanks! Those look awesome.
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I'm a bit late to this thread, but I'll give an opinion.
We started with Singapore 1a and I felt like my son wasn't truly grasping place value even though he could do all the work. We switched to Righstart. I did A and then B. I thought the program was brilliant! My son has such an excellent base now. I know I'm going to do RS next year with my next son. I somewhat dread it because with having more than one child to teach RS makes things more difficult. There are LOTS of game pieces and manipulatives to keep track of, etc. I would enjoy RS much more if I just had one child with which to work.
So I thought, I'll switch back on over to Singapore at level 2 and I would probably like it better than 1 now that we had this excellent base. I also planned to use the Al Abacus activity book and game book to supplement and help me add in new concepts. This WAS the plan. However, I got the materials in the mail a couple of days ago and I still don't want to do Singapore.
So we are going to do MEP. I'll probably still use the Al Abacus activity and game book as it fits. I also use another program for drill and review.
I don't know what you should do exactly. I, too, really liked RS, but I couldn't picture myself continuing with it for the long run. There just isn't enough of me to pull that off. I think the Singapore/ Al Abacus combination could be a great solution.
It's good to know I'm not alone. Thanks for your comments. I totally get what you are talking about. If I had just one child, it wouldn't be a question. But at least you can still used the Al Abacus activity book to introduce topics.
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RS is not my favorite thing to teach either.
My oldest started out with Singapore and we completed most of the 1A workbook, but the understanding for her was not there. Quite skeptically, I switched to RS and we ended up completing B and C. I am amazed at how effective RS is in producing understanding, particularly in the concept of place value.
When my ds became ready for formal math, I started with Singapore (hoping that because I felt like I was a better teacher that I could "do" with the less-intensive program). Nope. He was getting the concepts and could answer the questions and fill out the workbooks, but I could tell that deep understanding that my dd had had with RS was not there. So...we're back to RS. Am I thrilled to be teaching it again? No. But I know that it will be the best for him in the long run.
The abacus is a brilliant manipulative, especially when you start using Side 2. And I love the way the warm-ups review, but also build up to concepts so that by the time they're fully introduced, there is no big conceptual leap.
I've tried many other maths for early grades (MM, MEP, Miquon, CLE, Saxon) and I keep coming back to RS. In the fall I'll add my younger dd, and therefore will be teaching two kiddos in different places in RS B. :willy_nilly: So, no, I don't love teaching RS, but I love the results.
I think you have articulated why I would want to stay with it, if I can just get over my issues. What do you like for the older grades?
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I ended up sticking with RS B and am very, very glad I did. The teaching got easier, probably because both I and my daughter were very used to the RS "way". RS Level B is superlative - rich, meaty, challenging . . . and I truly think my daughter has a fantastic math foundation. We finished Level B yesterday, in fact!
I've planned all year to drop RS and switch to Math Mammoth, and I am currently very reluctant to let go of RS, just when I see it all coming together. Some of the RS sequence seems a little choppy and bizarre, and then several weeks or months later, you can see *why* she introduced a specific topic how and when she did.
So, no answers, and I'm not clear what level you're doing. I can encourage you to stick with Level B, though - I think it's even better than A and much easier to teach because of the great start we got with Level A last year.
HTH. :)
Lynn, Thank you for your comments. I totally get why it's a good program. And I do get that sense that it's working up to something that *might* payoff. I really just struggle with teaching it. I am in the middle of Level B right now.
And I just wanted to say, the lean mean approach brings BIG test scores. Not that that is the deciding factor, because it is NOT. But doing the lean mean, my youngest son had the highest standardized test scores in our town, which was geographically (not population, but still huge) the largest in the state. So it's not a crazy untested idea, and when the school board asked me what I used and I said yard sale and library books followed up by a couple months of Saxon Algebra 1, they were deeply confused.Hunter, that's so cool! I actually like your approach a lot. I think it's what lead me to buy the Activities for the Abacus. I think it might fit your criteria for 'lean and mean' with some conceptual thrown in. I actually was thinking of using the Activities book as my main curriculum, then I started to feel like I was reinventing the wheel and so went back to RS Level B. But it's only served to remind me that I just don't like teaching it the way they have it scripted out. It nearly drives me batty.
I like to use conceptual methods instead of drill when I can, but often conceptual and wide come together. That's were it got hard for me to find curricula in the past, especially with no money and pre-internet. By the time we had internet, my son was already 2 or 3 years into high school maths, and we just needed to push ahead.So all these narrow, but conceptual methods are brand new to me. Waldorf has some ideas too.
And I want to add in wide, with stand alone resources, that do not require mastery and do not need to be mastered to move on to the next level of the core. I only want to have my students master the core, and play with the rest.
I'm not anti concepts or anti wide. As I said I'm just weird about primary maths :tongue_smilie:
So when you are introducing a new concept, do you focus on just *that* for a while? Or do you generally stick with the flow/s&s of the narrow books you use? (I hope my questions make sense).
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These books looks awesome. Great finds!
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Cool! I can't wait!
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Thank you to everyone for your very thoughtful responses. You have all given me a lot to think about.
I do have the Activities for Abacus book and the Worksheets book that goes with it and it would definitely make a good supplement. I may just go that route. I do like the way RightStart teaches concepts and the Activities for Abacus is much more approachable than their teacher guides. I wish they would make the teacher guides more like it. I can also use it to introduce new concepts when they come up in whatever program I use.
Now I'm on the fence between SM Standards and Math in Focus. I'm also interested in the Professor B books, but I know that they too require some supplementation. Hunter, I'm curious what you think?
Thanks again!
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I seem to have found myself seriously struggling with math this year.
We are currently using Right Start. Pros: I like the way Right Start teaches/explain concepts. I think it really makes sense. I think my son "get's it".
Cons: I hate teaching it. I hate juggling all the manipulatives. I think manipulatives are key at this point, but with RS, there are a lot to keep track of. And sometimes I find I don't even have what I need. The books are wordy. I wish someone would take this book and make it more accessible (bullet points would be nice). I do think there is a lack of mastery. I am also at the point of adding DD and RS is pretty time consuming and not very independent (at least not yet).
At some point I started supplementing with Singapore and Miquon. I threw in the Singapore because I thought he needed extra practice and the Miquon just because it's fun and challenging. I started dropping the RS mid-year and mainly used SM and Miquon. At some point my DS told me that he liked RS and Miquon the best. I think this was because SM was introducing subtraction and that hadn't been introduced in RS yet.
Here's my main question: Is it worth sticking it out with RS? Have any of you struggled and stayed with it and were glad in the end?
Or should I switch? Is me not liking to teach it enough reason to switch? I'm looking at the SM Standards or Math-in-Focus as alternatives. Or is there something else or combinations that would work better?
Thank you for any insights!! They are greatly appreciated!
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My "secret" theories apparently are not so secret (pretty much what others have said):
1. The tutorial style of education is key. Kids simply do not fall through the cracks like they do in a classroom of 25+ kids.
2. Individualized education. We think long and hard about what's right for each child.
3. How about the fact that kids that are home schooled are doing more at home than just school: chores, gardening, laundry, nature study, cooking, lots of regular field trips, they get to be around when new babies come into the house, and more. All these things make for very well-rounded individuals.
4. All those books and read alouds can't hurt.
5. The love of learning is not squelched by horrible PS history and English teachers.
6. I don't know if this is true for everyone, but at my house, my kids are genuinely interested in what we study. Today a box of books that I've ordered from Rainbow Resource showed up for next year and my kids started going through them right away. I told my DS that I'm planning to start using them in September. He asked me if we could start in July. What public or private school kid wants school to start in July?!?!
My two cents . . .
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Is there a version of Mills you prefer? Is the Memoria Press one good?
I'm actually thinking that the two could be combined in some way--especially since Mills seems to include a lot more on Egyptian history than Guerber. I do like how Guerber begins with the creation of the world.
(Hey, you're on the yahoo group from "the thread" aren't you?)
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I was originally going to use Hilyer, but it just doesn't cover enough, IMHO. I do like his style, though.
After looking at both the Mills and Guerber books, I think my DS could handle either with me reading aloud. I just need to think now about what/how I want to do this. Thanks for the suggestion!
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I think you would need to add info on Egypt. The Guerber book is strictly the history of the Jewish people. There is Joseph in Egypt and Moses, but not a lot of Egyptian history outside of how they interacted with the Jewish people.
Did you read version edited by Miller? It still looks like mostly history of the Jewish people, but she says that she's added in additional information about other ancient civilizations. It's just hard to tell to what extent. Thank you for your response!
You may want to take a look at Dorothy Mills' Book of the Ancient World if you are looking at the same time period but with less emphasis on Bible History. Mills does include Bible History, but she covers all the ancient civilizations on their own merits and faults. The book covers Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, the Hebrews, Hittites, Persia and Phoenicia. She is more of a social historian, and she includes the culture, religion, art and daily life in her work. I like her a lot better than the Miller/Guerber books.It's funny that you mention Mills. I was actually debating between the two. I was mainly leaning toward Guerber only because it seemed geared toward younger kiddos more than Mills. Do you think Mills would work well for a seven year old? I would, of course, use it as a read aloud. I really appreciate your input. Thanks!
:bigear:
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I'm very interested in using this book next year for Ancient History. I've always liked the idea of teaching about Ancient Israel in the same vein as I would Ancient Greek history. The thing I'm trying to find out is if there is a sufficient amount of information on Egyptian history in that or if I need to supplement? I was already planning to include Tales of Ancient Egypt by Green and The Pharoah's of Ancient Egypt by Payne. Maybe that will be enough even if what the Guerber book isn't very extensive. Thoughts? I'd appreciate any input I can get.
Thanks!
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I think this was a good choice. This is limiting in all the ways everyone already mentioned. My name on yahoo is nothing like LutheranGirl; it's 'crosenbladt'
Thanks 8!
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Thank you for all of your thoughts. I do have 1.5 friends that understand and I need to be thankful for that. I am so thankful for this group, and I am glad to have a place like this where I can discuss and learn so much.
Maybe we can all meet up at a CiRCE Conference one of these years!
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Has anyone experienced negative reactions from other homeschoolers in your circle regarding this view (which I think is "the view") of Classical Education.
I have been a part of the same co-op for a few years now, and I've been bringing up some of what I've been learning and tried to pass on some of the audio and articles that I think are worth listening to. It's as if some in the group are mortally wounded. We have always labeled ourselves as "classical", but so few really understand what this means. In our group, it seems to mean (to most) that we're supposed to do a lot of memory work and make things as rigorous as possible. I really want it to be "classical" in the traditional sense, but it's as if they're not even curious.
Has anyone else experienced anything like this? Am I missing something?
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What I want is something I heard Christopher Perrin say in his lecture on "Learning to Love What Must Be Done" on the SLC site: I want my children to be lovers of truth, beauty, and goodness. I think everything that has been mentioned matters--beautiful books and realistic illustrations.
Justamouse-- I totally relate to what you said about "that thread" coalescing everything you've wanted in your life. I have felt this same way. I can't begin to describe what a blessing that thread and this group is for me.
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I was just listening to Christopher Perrin from the free audio available on SCL, it's the one titled "Learning to Love What Must be Done", and it really resonated with the Lewis quotations and this discussion. I thought it was going to be something different based on the title. I thought one of his main points was really good: that we don't necessarily want our children to be lovers of learning, but lovers of truth. He talked a lot about the role of the teacher and importance of having a philosophy. His line was, "practice without philosophy is blind."
Listen to it, if you get the chance. (It could be this one was already discussed and I missed it.)
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These books look amazing. I'm seriously digging that guide. I love this image of what a child's life should look like. http://www.pub22.net/open/uns24857/images/image04-full.png
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I just heard Andrew Kern say in Rhetoric as the Essential Art that "history is not impersonal forces; it is the outworking of human decisions . . . Teach history as a series of decisions." He also explained that history is the account of what different societies have come up with for how to become virtuous (or not).
It seemed liked it related to what was being discussed here.
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OrdinaryTime, Thank you so much for saying what you did. I really do struggle with whether or not I want to put the time into memorizing one of the history timelines out there. I'm starting to think time might be better spent doing other things. I'm wondering if maybe a better assignment/challenge for a student might be finding out at least 2-3 events that were happening at the same time X (event/person) was happening--to get a better scope of history. I'm just thinking out loud.
I was a history (mostly ancient history) major too, and I try to be conscious of not ruining the subject for my kiddos. I'm also hesitant to do Ancient History with six year olds, too because I don't to waste it on them (does that sound bad). I think it's fascinating and I want them to appreciate it, and I think most of it will go over their heads at too young of an age.
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This reminds me of something I heard Andrew Kern say in a talk (I think it was the one on Mimetic Teaching) where he says that "The Teacher is the Curriculum." I know this doesn't help you decide whether or not to buy the guide. But what Faithr said reminded me that no guide can replace the work a teacher does to make a study interesting.
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When people say they hated history in high school, they usually say that it's because it was all "names and dates". I don't remember it being names and dates; I just remember it being pretty dull. I agree 8Fill, it's deceiving to view historical events as isolated events. I like the idea of what Genevieve Foster did with her history books with her "horizontal" view of history--always showing what else was going on at the time.
Maybe having kids create a timeline in which they can show multiple events at a time, as opposed to each event happening in a straight line might be better. Or Charlotte Mason's book of centuries is interesting too--where all that happened in a century is put down on one page.
On the Math Curriculum Ledge (or needing encouragement to stick it out w/ RightStart)
in K-8 Curriculum Board
Posted
I wanted to let everyone know that this thread has actually clarified things for me. Sometimes thread like this can actually make things more confusing, KWIM?
I have realized that I don't have to give up the Right Start method because I have the Activities Book that allows me to use it in a much easier fashion. I also realize that I can use SM as my main curriculum and use manipulatives with that as well. I think one of the reasons my DS was having a hard time with SM was because we went from RS, where I sat with him through each step, to SM, where I was leaving him to do a lot of it on his own. Today I used some manipulatives to introduce the material, then sat with him as he did it. It went great and I didn't hate it!! And I can throw in the Miquon book every so often to mix things up when needed.
Thank you!!