Classical Katharine
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Posts posted by Classical Katharine
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As others have said, you just need a grammar foundation--not necessarily diagramming. For the best start in Latin, you can also check the program you want to use for any specific English grammar prerequisites.
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Latin's a great place to start if you want your child to eventually study another inflected language, like Greek or Russian. Those two languages are inflected, like Latin, AND involve a different alphabet, AND in the case of modern Russian also involve learning to speak and understand (in real time). Sure, you could skip Latin and just start in on one of those other languages later on, and some children will be okay, but a Latin foundation, in which they get to focus on "inflected" first, but with a familiar alphabet and (in many programs) not a huge amount of pressure to achieve oral fluency, helps a lot.
It's also worth saying that a roots program, unless it's extremely detailed, may not convey all the help that a study of Latin would, even when it comes to helping children learn English vocabulary. Some English words are best understood if you know not just the Latin root, but also the properties of the Latin verb form from which the English word is derived. So "memoranda" is "things to be remembered"--the "mem-" part is of course related to "memory" and "remember," but that only takes you so far; the "-anda" part is a participial ending that conveys the "things to be." (Just as in "memorandum" the "-andum" conveys "thing to be.") And even that is a clunky way of describing the components. I suppose you could just memorize those facts too, but I agree with the poster who suggested that such things sink in better when you're actually manipulating a language, and not just language-component facts.
The OP asks a great question, though.
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You can start Latin with children at just about any age if the program is right for the age of your child.
Programs that work for first and second graders will generally just cover vocabulary, phrases, maybe some disconnected paradigms just learned by sound. Or they will introduce cartoons, simple dialogue, etc. So you can start Latin at this age, but "starting Latin" won't mean grammar and translation, yet.
Because of that, some people just wait till their children are ready to do more. Latin grammar and translation really have to wait until children are solid readers and know a bit of English grammar--for some children, grade 3; for many, grade 4 or 5. (Whether that first happens in grade 3, 4, 5 or even 6 will depend on your child, what you've done for English grammar, and on the pacing of the specific Latin grammar program you're considering--both the pacing in the first book, and also the acceleration from one book to another in the series. Acceleration rate is really important--you don't want to make it through the first book in a series and then discover the series takes off and your child isn't ready for the second book.)
There's no one answer to "when should WE start"; it's a matter of what you want to expose your child to when, and then a matter of choosing an age-appropriate program. But all programs for beginners begin at the beginning; children don't irrevocably lose out on anything by not starting Latin from the cradle . . . it's a great language to study at a range of starting ages!
I've had wonderful experiences sharing Latin grammar and translation with beginners as young as grade 3 and as old as grade 6. None of them had had any Latin at all before.
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It seems to me that different kinds of memorization are good for different purposes, and that the age of the children is a factor, but not a rigidly binding factor.
Memorizing, say, at age 7 a song naming all the bones in the body is fun, legitimate, and useful even if no dissections will be performed in the immediate future. It can awaken an interest in science that will find more comprehensive expression later; it can awaken an interest in words that will have immediate and lasting benefit; it strengthens "memorizing muscles" for future service. There's not much "context" to this memorization, but still, it's hard to argue that the bone song would be of no value.
BUT, I can't accept the idea that there's a rigid "poll parrot" stage in which memorizing is practically the only thing children can do. I'm not saying that that is exactly what Dorothy Sayers said or precisely what Susan Wise Bauer says, but certainly you run into this idea today under the banner of classical education.
If there IS such a stage, in my experience it ends sooner than many might think. I've seen third graders start to sink their teeth into what might be considered "logic stage" Latin thinking and be much the happier for it.
On the whole I lean towards as much of what I'll call "application" as possible: learn facts, and do something with them. Either memorize, then shortly do; or introduce, manipulate, then memorize cold and manipulate some more, but apply as much as possible as often as possible as young as possible. It's motivating, it's fun, it's stretching, and it's where the subject is headed--and where the child is headed--anyway, so why not get started?
(Really, to be a bit heretical, I think we all have some evidence from our own experience that children actually get better at memorizing as they get older. I bet I'm not the only one who, say, memorized dozens of French vocabulary words in one night as a [procrastinating] teenager, which is not something I could have done in second grade when memorizing was supposedly easier . . . so it's not as if failing to learn some fact in grade 2 is going to rob our children of the opportunity to learn it later. So why not stretch their minds young by teaching them to start to use, already, what they are memorizing--and then, as they grow, have them keep memorizing, even more, and keep applying, even more?)
In all subjects, people who lean towards the poll-parrot idea of the early years can find programs that assume and support that view, and people who lean more towards application can find programs that support that leaning. What usually doesn't work is having one leaning and trying to use a program that supports the opposite leaning!
I've found that with Latin, choices about what is presented when can dramatically restrict or expand how much application is possible.
(What I mean by "application" isn't identical to what the OP meant by "context," but along with others I've headed into some overlapping territory.)
Thanks, OP, for the interesting question!
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It helps a lot to have a tablespoon or so, at least, of a good fat like extra virgin olive oil for each serving of a rice meal. Having cut dairy you're getting less fat and may have gone too far into non-fat territory inadvertently. A good oil is beneficial nutritionally and will make the meal stick with you. Also, don't be afraid to have more than one cup! Your new foods are higher volume and lower calorie, so portions do end up bigger.
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Well, info about a number of electronic dictionaries, some not expensive, turned up in a recent thread at the list. If you join the list just search the archives for the past five days or so and you'll find lots of good information. The site is latinteach.com. I believe it included a dictionary you can get for free w/ an i-phone, plus some online resources, etc.
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I would recommend two books by Peter Masters, Men of Destiny and Men of Purpose. Each one contains chapter-long biographies of a great variety of interesting Christian men, from scientists to businessmen to converted crooks.
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I agree with you about meaningful memorization. Yes, it's easy to memorize when young, but actually, it's just as easy later. I could memorize more French words in one night at thirteen than I ever could have at six. And younger children can definitely start thinking, reasoning, integrating, applying. I don't see the three stages as absolute at all. I think it's more true to human nature to say that reasoning and articulation skills will increase over time and occupy a greater portion of schoolwork as children grow older, but that reasoning and expression can and should be present in younger children too, in age-appropriate ways.
They don't have to just be containers for information when they are young . . . material can be memorized that they are actually going to use in short order. The application and implementation are just as important as the memorization, and there's no need for application and implementation to wait until children are a certain age.
Well, with two sprained fingers, I am very grateful for Dragon so that I can write this post!
Anyway, MamaBlessedThrice, I know you are not anti-memorization. I just agree with your perspectives on the priority and purposes of memorization.
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Thanks for the encouragement and ideas for my happy friend!
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Any advice? This is not an impulse situation, but it is a sudden opportunity with a tight time frame. Anything from the legal/bureaucratic standpoint they should know about?
Thanks!
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. . . stirring makes it stickier.
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is the only one I know of that tastes as good as you are looking for. It has the highest protein content. More meat, more flavor. The chicken, salted or the beef, no salt, are what we get. We buy by the case from a food co-op to save money.
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is the same plant as red rooibos, just processed differently (not fermented). Susan made me look it up just to be sure. :001_smile: It does taste quite a bit like green tea, though.
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wholesale, Oregon, has green rooibos (no caffeine) and red (some caffeine). They also have stupendous herb teas, nice flavor b/c the flowers etc. are left whole and the volatile oils don't dissipate as fast. Evening Repose is very good cold, and isn't soporific--more a cross between restful and refreshing. No, I don't work for them, I just really like their stuff!
Also, basil and rosemary make a great tea: about two t. basil and one half t. rosemary (crushed), both dried, for 1-2 big glasses depending on how strong you like it. I admit it's really good with honey, but you could try stevia. A splash of lemon juice or cider vinegar is nice--my husband likes that--but it's very good without it, too.
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AllergyBuyersClub.com. I haven't tried a steam mop, but we bought a quiet dehumidifier from them, that's been, well, quiet, so we were satisfied.
Hope you get answers. I'd like to know, too.
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Once hummus is lemony enough, if you still want it lighter (we like that), adding some chicken broth (Health Valley has good strong flavor) works out well. Some cumin and cracked black pepper are good, too.
Bob's Red Mill carries garbanzo bean flour and using their recipe, you can use this to make a super-creamy hummus. But usually we just use chick peas and the broth to make it smooth enough.
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. . . is an online storefront that gives you access to all manner of used book sellers, but shipping is separate from each seller. Prices are good and you get a description of the book's condition.
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Here's a thread in which one of the posts classified Latin programs by method. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101153
Latin Prep uses the English order of cases, so if you prefer the American order, you'll want to put post-its over the paradigms and use American order.
There are definitely Latin Prep users here, so keep trying and you'll snag one!
I don't know what Andrew Campbell thinks of LP, but he posts here and also has his own forum where you could ask.
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(top of your screen, left-hand end of blue bar) and from there you can manage your subscriptions.
[Edited later to be more complete] Actually, it's a good idea to go to UCP and set up desired thread folders ahead of time. Then each time you subscribe to a thread you can put it right into its folder (you subscribe from Thread Tools). You CAN just put all subscriptions into the same unsorted folder and sort them later, but it's still good to set up the folders before you start to sort that unsorted folder. Otherwise the system makes it kind of complicated.
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If you borrow from any state's tests, you'll have the same task on your hands, namely looking for the questions that cover the topics you want to re-test your son on for the sake of possible exposure to different testing language. But concerning the CA standards, their topic coverage is considered exemplary, along with the standards of a few other states (www.nychold.org: see "exemplary standards"), so it's unlikely that there's any topic your son has covered that you won't be able to find represented there.
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I think you'll find that many of the paradigms and grammar concepts will be familiar at first, but in order to be sure of being able to do all the later work in Wheelock's, you won't be able to just skip W's chapters that cover familiar topics. Your son will need to learn any new vocabulary and you'll want to check the grammar topic coverage in W's for such chapters to see if they present any facts or angles that weren't there in LiCT, even for familiar-seeming topics. If the grammar presentation of a given topic in W's is completely old hat, then you could just have your son learn the new vocabulary in that chapter and translate a subset of the chapter sentences, as a sanity check. (OTOH, if the grammar really IS old hat, then once he learns the new vocab, translating all the chapter sentences should be easy for him and should go quickly.) But the vocabulary will be essential because you won't know where/how often in W's a given word is going to recur.
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Acupuncture done correctly can be very helpful for pain conditions, including migraines. But some people practice it who have less training than others. If you can find an M.D. who does acupuncture (e.g. some physiatrists and others), you might be able to get insurance treatment for the visits.
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Scary thing my husband told me: CDs we burn at home don't have an indefinite life. The commercial ones are very long-lasting, but when we burn them ourselves at home, they are not permanent. Does anyone else have any other information on this? I assume that if a photo service produces the CD, they do it professionally, but this was a wake-up call to me about doing it at home and counting on it as permanent storage.
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Strapless sends a message to guys. They know what it means. The girl doesn't always know what it means, but the guy does.
If he picks up on the message, the girl has trouble on her hands. If she never intended that message and swats him away, that's good as far as it goes, but it's better not to tempt the guys in the first place: safer for her, and more considerate to them.
Your dd may not have a figure now, but she will soon, and besides, if she is palling around with well-endowed-in-strapless friend, if she goes strapless too, they together will be sending the same message.
Less well-endowed is not without its charms. She may be your little girl but the outside world sees what she is growing into.
I'm not a prude. Figures are great and sexual attraction is meant to occur in its time and place. But dd's beauty has power to do harm and to do good, to herself and to others, and she needs you to teach her and protect her so she can save the intimate secrets of her beauty for that one special man some day, in private.
Premature experiences and relationships are just going to damage her, and exposing too much now is a quick path to those experiences and relationships.
Thanks for asking and for thinking about it on your daughter's behalf.
neighbor's daughter had kidney stones, now cannot keep food down, needs leads
in General Education Discussion Board
Posted · Edited by Classical Katharine
Hi all,
Has anyone here faced something similar? Any thoughts on whether the vomiting is actually the kidney stone problem continuing on? Her parents are very concerned. They have their daughter on Ensure and Gatorade so she keeps going, but that's hardly a lifetime diet. College plans are now in doubt.
I'm not sure whether they have been told that the two issues, the past stones and the vomiting, may be linked but from some Googling it looks as if they may be.
Any experiences or advice? I'd like to be able to pass some ideas on and to encourage my neighbors.
Thanks!
P.S. The stones are calcium oxalate.