Gwen in VA
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Posts posted by Gwen in VA
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My kids have each received over $400,000 worth of merit scholarships, but, except for the National Merit one, they have all been scholarships offered by the colleges themselves.
Colleges offer merit scholarships in a variety of different ways. Some colleges automatically consider all applicants. Some require the applicant to check a box and that's it. Some require essays. Some have earlier application deadlines. Some have scholarship competitions that require going to the college and doing interviews.
Read all the information about scholarships on the college websites VERY carefully!
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Ds has a full-ride to a top-20 LAC. FULL-RIDE! :001_smile: But there's a catch -- ds also has a full-tuition scholarship to a top-75 State U (with Honors College).
He prefers the State U. He wants the larger size, access to more research, and what he feels is a stronger program for his desired major (economics).
Our older dd is already at the LAC and having a wonderful time -- profs who know her, help her, encourage her. A prof lined up an absolutely incredible internship for her this summer -- and she is only a freshman! I love the LAC and the individual attention. It even has a debate team, which State U does not. (Ds is passionate about debate.)
I do agree with ds, though, that the econ program could be stronger....
This is ds's decision. But I would love any thoughts folks have -- his preference for Sate U makes no sense to me!
Do you think he is out of his mind, or is there a reasonable argument for attending state U's (since money is not a factor)?
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You are not going to like this answer -- it depends on the class! Dd took multiple classes from PAH one year and the start date depended on the class!
Sorry!
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Thank you all for sharing your thoughts. We appreciate all the different issues that folks have raised. Some of them we would not have thought of -- so we really appreciate the additional brainpower!
We're still scratching our heads! :glare:
I guess that when ds1 gets back from Pittsburgh (UPitt accepted students day) he needs to make a list of questions and start calling econ professors. I guess a lot of the issues need to be answered by people in the individual depts.
We're counting our blessings that he has so many options -- but it is confusing! Ds2 wants to go into engineering -- and at least we know something about that!
Each time ds1 goes to visit a college we are just praying that God shows ds1 exactly what He wants him to see and hear at that college in order that ds1 will make a wise decision!
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Great point, Begonia!
Hey, ds just heard from UVA today -- he was accepted as an Echols Scholar! :001_smile::001_smile: :D
So your dd is enjoying UVA? I must say that the sheer size of it intimidates me. Are the profs accessible? Is there too much partying? How is she finding the other students -- motivated?
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I have heard that it is a bit of a scam. My understanding is that you pay some money in order to say that you are a member, but you don't really get anything for it.
Here is the address of a thread on Collegeconfidential.com (a group that has provided lots of helpful information for us) about the society:
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/39022-national-society-high-school-scholars.html
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Thank you Eliana --
I really appreciate your perspective. I agree with everything you wrote.
Seeing the words in print verbalized by someone else really is helpful to me! Somehow it's so easy to just start spinning around and around on this college issue! I think that my family is so wrapped up in this decision process that we are forgetting common sense!
Thanks again for sharing your thoughts!
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Our local public school requires pretty much the entire 10th grade to take UP Human Geography and then take the exam. Enough kids do well on the exam that the school district finds it worthwhile!
I assume that for the Spanish AP exam there will be a section where the students need to write answers in Spanish. For a younger student with less writing experience, that section will probably be the greatest challenge.
I didn't let my older two kids do any AP classes until their junior year, but my younger kids will start doing AP's in 10th.
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Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Yup -- he is finishing up calculus 2 right now and he is planning on taking at least six math classes in college. He was planning on double-majoring in math but then realized that majoring in math went way beyond the classes recommended for grad school, so he decided that he didn't want to go that route. He likes math, but there is a limit! :-)
His planned career path at this point is rather murky, which is okay. He absolutely loves public policy (from doing all kinds of debating) and loves economics and sees that there is a HUGE crossover between the two. He has considered an MPP.
Now back to contemplating -- U Chicago with LOTS of loans, UVA with no loans but also no scholarships, or UPitt or UDallas with full-tuition scholarships, or Washington & Lee with unknown scholarship (we're waiting.....)
I do wish I knew more about the economics field!
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Ds is planning on majoring in economics, with a possible double major in political science. He is interested in going on to grad school, with a goal of getting a Ph.D. and working in the public policy arena.
My big question -- how important is it for him to get a degree from a "name' school?
Also, any thoughts on balancing the quality of the econ dept with the prestige of the school? What if he finds a program at a "lesser" school where many profs are all doing research in his area of interest? Should he look more at the school's reputation, and leave choosing a school based on profs' research interests until grad school?
And what about a "name" LAC that doesn't have a strong econ program?
I have heard that for investment banking attending a "name' school is almost a prerequisite. Is the name school that important for grad school admissions in economics?
Thank you so much for thinking about this -- Dh and I are engineers, so we are absolutely clueless as to how important the name of the school will be for him. We do know that the presige of the degree can be extremely important in certain fields, such as investment banking. We don't want him to choose the "lesser" school because he likes the research if it will cripple his chances later on
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Thank you for the recommendation. It certainly seems odd that a school in Michigan has a naval architecture program, but U. Mich is a really good school, so we will look into it!
Thanks!
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Two thoughts --
I would be a bit nervous about what the colleges would think of your ds not taking a full load of classes. The colleges do stress that they do not want to see seniors taking it easy. Could you call and talk with an admissions person or two and ask their opinions?
Also, I would be VERY careful about not overloading second semester senior year. Your ds will have college visits, possibly scholarship weekends, possibly finishing up college apps, college decisions......it is a busy time.
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Thank you for sharing this!
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Just to provide another point-of-view --
I have never used Saxon so wasn't going to comment on this thread, but I find the claim that NO math curriculum can prepare a student for the SAT to be questionable.
The SAT involves basic math skills used in bizarre applications. Any curriculum that has the student set up problems from not-immediately-clear information will provide a strong background for the SAT. Curricula that have extensive problems at the end of each section that involve strange applications or are extremely theoretical can really help a student to be very comfortable with the problem-solving approach required by the SAT's.
On the other hand, the more "drill-and-kill" the curriculum, the less it will help the student prepare for the SAT.
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You might poke around on law school websites. I did this a few years ago and was surprised at how explicit many of them were about what kind of background they want an applicant to have.
I poked around on a huge range -- from Harvard and Yale and Stanford to UVA and William & Mary (we're in Virginia) to George Mason and Regents and even Suffolk (in Boston). It took several hours but it gave me much more of a feel as to how I can better provide guidance counseling for ds1!
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This thread should be called "Avoiding thinking about ds1 and his college options and moving right along to ds2....."
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for Naval Architecture?
Ds2 is dreaming of going there. It is TEENY (70 students total -- not per class!) so I think there is some chance they haven't bumped into a homeschooler yet, but before I give them a call I thought I would ask!
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I had no idea! This is a new world to me!
I guess I need to get serious about investigating this approved courses stuff. :glare:
If we do this, I do hope ds2 goes to a school with a sailing team -- that's the only sport he is interested in!
Thank you to all who responded -- I am not happy about this, but knowing this is an issue ahead of time is VERY good.
Thanks again for alerting me to a potential problem!
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How do you find out what the good programs are?
That's a hard one -- but there are ways that you can learn more --
1) Look at the profs' research interests and bios. (All schools have this info buried somewhere). Did they go to strong grad schools in the subject area? Do their research interests somewhat overlap your dc's? (Example -- economics can have a policy bent OR a business bent, a US focus or an international focus, etc.)
2) Talk to the profs. They will actually tell you a LOT -- including that they think you should go to a different school because it has a stronger program than his school does! (Yes, really!)
3) Look at the requirements for a major. They actually do differ surprisingly -- even in subjects like chemistry and math. (And history requirements are ALL over the place -- when dd was thinkiing about majoring in history, she eliminated many many schools on the basis of their history major requirements!)
4) Is there some external accrediting that the program has? (For chemistry, some colleges' programs have something like ACS (American Chemical Society) approval (or maybe the student can get a ACS certificate -- I'm not sure But whatever it is, there is only one school in VA that does it, though another is trying. If dd wanted to major in chemistry and go to grad school, she would have chosen that particular school!). (This isn't quite the whole story -- so don't quote it! Even though dd is a chem major so we listened to a lot of chem presentations, since she is interested in art conservation she isn't going the super-rigorous chemistry route so we didn't pay attention to that part of the speeches!)
5) Ask what the students in the major do AFTER college. Grad school? Teaching? Employment? Where? The departments should have statistics on this; if they don't, they will at least be able to give you anecdotal evidence.
For example, in economics many many of the majors go to law school. That's wonderful, but if you want to go to grad school you want a college that places students in grad school reasonably regularly; the law school admissions statistics don't mean that much to you!
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Thanks, Margaret.....
Ugh! Oh dear!
I guess I now need to look at the recent thread about NCAA requirements!
i do have a quick question though --once a student is in college, he's in college. So what does the NCAA do -- ask all athletes to produce their high school diploma?
And what if a student decides to join a sport during their sophomore year? (I know, most students don't -- but where I went to college the sports were pretty poor and lots of non-athletes floated through the NCAA teams!)
I don't mean to be snide -- I was on the sailing team at the college I attended, and no one ever asked about anything related to a high school diploma. Now, I wasn't very good, so maybe that was the reason!
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I think the hardest thing about the whole college decision thing is trying to keep your focus on YOUR child and NOT on what neighbors/parents/friends will think.
It is SO easy to get caught up in the "Harvard hype" -- the obsession with the name brand. But only you and your child can decide if the name school really has really superior offerings for your child and his interests.
IF you decide that the name school is genuinely more desirable than "less well-know college" or State U, only you and your child can decide if "Elite College"'s education is worth the increased cost.
Economics has the concept of "opportunity cost" -- what do you give up when you choose option X? If the tuition difference between more desirable X and less desirable Y is $1000, I think most of us would say to choose X. But what if Y is $5K cheaper? What if Y is $10K cheaper? What if Y is $40K cheaper?
There are families out there for whom the $40K difference would not be that big a deal. So that family might still choose X. But for a $40K difference, most of us would choose Y. But that decision is EXTREMELY personal, depending on retirement plans, size of piggybank, etc.
The funny thing is that state schools do have strong postives as well as negatives. Ds1 may well end up choosing between elite college A that doesn't have a really strong program in his major and state U B that has an incredibly strong program in his major. What will he do? We're waiting for that mailman!
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I am a bit confused. I know NOTHING about sports, so PLEASE bear with me on this one!
My younger junior-high-age son may want to participate on a sports team (sailing) in college, if he ends up going to a college that has one.
Does he need to worry about NCAA eligibility and all that, or is the worry about accredited homeschool programs and the like only of concern for recruited athletes?
(Since he doesn't sail that much, he will NOT be a recruited athlete!):D
(At least twenty years ago, some of the top sailors on my college's sailing team had never sailed before college!)
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There is hope -- I was an absolute slob in high school. I figured that I was rarely in it and no one else came into it, so why did a clean room matter? My mother predicted that I would have the messiest room in college.....
I went off to college, and not only did I spend more time in my room, but other people did too! All of a sudden having a made bed was important, having NO clothes on the floor was important, having everything neat and organized was important. My room in college was literally held up as a "neatnik" room!
Unfortunately haviing four kids dulled my neatnik streak! Now that they are older I'm trying to redevelop that streak!
I think that having "ownership" of the room ( instead of the room just being part of my parents' home) made a huge difference in my attitude toward its cleanliness!
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For us the decision was a joint one.
We waited until ALL the offers came in and then eliminated a few based on money. (While we could have afforded them, they cost enough that we would not have been happy to pay for them, especially since her brother would be starting college the following year!)
This left two schools -- Washington & Lee and U. Delaware, both of which offered her full-tuition scholarships. Dh and dd visited both schools again and talked a lOT with profs. Dh went along on the visits as an extra pair of eyes and ears -- he talked with people independently of her and actually came away with impressions and comments that sometimes surprised her!
Then they came home and talked and talked and talked. They compared academic rigor, they compared course offerings (U. Delaware is the only school in the country to offer her desired major at the undergraduate level). They compared types of students. They compared dollars and cents. They looked at proximity of churches, the religious programs on campus, proximity of F&D corps, other extracurricular offerings. They compared and talked and prayed and talked. On April 28th they were up past midnight talking and talking. Dd finally chose W&L and has been VERY happy there.
Right now we are waiting for the mailman. Ds has some very nice offers, but before we make the airplane reservations we want to see if any can be eliminated on the basis of money. Once we know where we stand financially, ds and dh will start the visits!
As far as prestige U vs state U with money, it all depends on the schools, the amount of money, the programs, etc. I think that is a very individual choice; I don't think anyone can make some grandiose generalization about it.
Praying for LOTS of wisdom for all the graduating seniors and their parents!
State U versus LAC
in High School and Self-Education Board
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Thanks! All good points -- they will help add some specific points to our discussions!
Somehow in retrospect my dd's college decision seemed so obvious -- and by April 1 she was down to considering only two schools.
Oh well.....