Moonhawk
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Posts posted by Moonhawk
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6 minutes ago, Lucy the Valiant said:
I would do just about anything to keep a young teen's trust / heart. That trust is a treasure, and medicine to BOTH of your souls, especially in hard times. If there are rules / schedules she doesn't like, does she have an alternative suggestion? As long as she meets some mutually-agreed-upon baselines (1 shared bathroom so keep it quick, school work done to this particular time & quality standard, helping around house) - can she decide all the rest?
Schedule other than when she can do piano/violin is already at her request. The instruments are the only times that I dictate since other people need them. She filled in the rest of her schedule. I do type it out though, so I guess that's why I say I scheduled it? We added the 2 hours reading, but that was something that happened 2 years ago when we moved to this house and I was fully doing the schedule. It's still on her schedule.
Since then she's telling me when she'll do what, and I do have some standards (x time on math) and the rest is more assignment based now for her (this map, this science assignment). We have a school review on Saturday or Sunday where we go over assignments, for accountability, but since I started at work she does have more leeway/control on what she's actually doing. DH is home but is focused on keeping younger kids on target, not her. Hence why she could get into the tech issue.
I guess I'm not as concerned about her schedule being too controlling because she has so much say in it, and certainly more than she would at a B&M school.
I feel like I'm getting a lot of feedback that 2 hours of reading a day isn't enough, and here I was thinking it was a generous amount of "scheduled, this counts as school reading" time. I guess I should reevaluate.
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7 minutes ago, katilac said:
Why is it she can't have books? I'm not understanding that part. Is it just to neaten the house for better staging? I get that, that's important, but what does "More recently, after our clear out/ getting ready to move all books were boxed up, and the new rule is any books not in boxes and not for school are just sold." mean? Are the books in boxes that she can access, or are all non-school books supposed to be put away? Because I would never have survived that, at any age.
Okay: the books. I'll just type it all out.
We have a TON of books. The house is effectively 800-900 sq ft. For kid fun books alone, we have currently 14 boxes now packed up. For books the kids wanted direct access to, the top 3 boxes of the stack were reserved for books they want to access while we are getting ready to move, I'd say a total of maybe 40-50 books free? (There is a 4th box that the 4yo can access on the ground that is just open all the time for her own books cuz it seemed like a bad idea to have her try and get out of the big stack, and she's in the play reading stage. about 20 books for her, maybe more idk). They got Kindles for Christmas and DD is specifically using hers a lot; I've loaded at least 100 books (and the Kindle isn't part of the tech ban). We have always had the problem of books not being put away at the end of the day, so I figured limiting the number free would at least make it easier to clean up.
"Selling books" consequence was to encourage the boxes getting completely filled and not re-opened again. Honestly I thought that the 3 open boxes on top would be enough that it wouldn't be an issue. I walk into the main room at the end of the day and say something like, "Oh no, I see books all over the couch, I hope they aren't here by the time I'm done brushing Katys' teeth, otherwise they'll have to go to the sell box." and the books are cleaned up. After we got the initial books sorted into sell/keep I didn't expect to actually sell any more books that were elected to keep. Mostly because I figured it would be easy enough for them to keep them in the appropriate times/places.
There's never been a real consequence for reading in the bathroom before, just talking about why we don't want the bathroom monopolized for this.
Selling the books wasn't meant to be a punishment for reading in the bathroom, the two issues were completely separate.
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5 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:
I am hoping there’s more detail here because, to me, through my lens of parenting, the consequences seem overly harsh.
She’s 5 years from adulthood, mama, how do you see this transition going to having an adult who can manage her life—making her own appointments, running her household, managing her time between school/job/work?
Short of trafficking herself on the internet, or running illegal drugs, I don’t know what would make me cut off the internet for five months to a teen. Nor can I imagine telling a teen they have a strict two hour allotment to read.
I am not an overly permissive parent, but it seems like you are in a control battle with your teen and she’s trying desperately to carve out some space for her to be independent of you.
There was an element of inappropriate messaging/grooming going on with the "definitely not approved sites". That's about as unvague as I'm comfortable with. I can't know the full extent because some of it was password protected but what I could see was alarming.
Re the 2 hour allotment, it's more she has 2 hours in her school day to read; not in her whole day. She has another 2 free hours in the evening she can choose what she does with (usually read or goof off with brothers).
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3 minutes ago, Annie G said:
No advice on your real question, but I will say dh and our two youngest would have had a difficult time parting with books. Is it possible she’s struggling with that?
She got a Kindle for Christmas and a lot of books on there. We have trouble getting rid of books too, so I can understand that feeling, but we had some caveats of "this box can be opened, during hours, etc" to help alleviate that, I just didn't want to have to run through the entire rulebook here lol.
3 minutes ago, 2squared said:Why is she feeling the need to read in the bathroom? I think if you find her motivation and resolve that issue, then you will solve the misbehavior.
My guess is she’s looking for privacy and space to do her own thing. Teens crave privacy and alone time. Does she have her space and time to just exist in that space?It seems to get out of doing stuff she doesn't want to. IE dishes or school or cleanup. She does share a room with her brothers *at her request*, she has a room available to move to but has chosen not to, and we offer it periodically.
She has about 2 hours free time for a day; not much, but she was part of the schedule-making process and added things (more time for piano, another instrument, more time for art) so it's not like her day is full with stuff she doesn't have control over or she doesn't like. About 3 hours of her school time is all alone.
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1 minute ago, plaidpants said:
Can you tell us more about the tech issue?
I feel like this isn't about books or reading, but I'm having trouble putting my finger on it.
She figured out how to get around the blocks on her laptop (ie, she figured out the admin password) and was watching youtube and going to sites that were definitely not approved. At first the stuff she was looking at was harmless enough but it progressed. She was doing this during school and free time and had gotten fast at the switch screen feature.
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Background info:
So, DD is now 13. She hits this milestone in true teenager fashion: we found a Major Rule of tech was broken. Long story short, 5 months no technology for all kids. DD has not apologized and even though she seemed remorseful/embarrassed and is the one who suggested and later agreed with the consequence, it has not seemed to seep in as being a punishment, more just a change as if there was nothing precipitating it. That's ok, I'm not looking to ruin her life or anything, or have her grovel.
Now, over the weekend I found books in the bathroom, hidden in her hamper. Not world ending on any level. However, we only have 1 bathroom for 6 people and so we have addressed this directly in the past. Also, school is school and you're expected to do school during those times. Or when it's time to do dishes, etc. Going "to the bathroom" and staying in there for 10-15-30 minutes can have a domino effect on everyone else in multiple ways. We had added 2 hours/day of reading time to make it more tenable. More recently, after our clear out/ getting ready to move all books were boxed up, and the new rule is any books not in boxes and not for school are just sold. All kids know this and why.
So, she was with me when I found the books. I stopped and just looked at them, and she said, "I'll go put them in the sell box." I said "Ok, then come back." She did this, we didn't discuss it further, just went forward with the task we were doing.
DH and I had noticed long bathroom breaks from her, but we gave the benefit of the doubt that it was her period or digestion issues after asking her directly a couple times if it was books or stomach. We gave her the benefit of the doubt with the tech too, and were consistently asking if things were ok, reminding her of the rules, asking if she needed to tell us anything, explaining the reasoning behind the rules, etc. Like, at least weekly, and for 5 months she consistently lied to us on this.
Current issue:
Last night around 11 PM she thought I was asleep. She crept into the book room, opened up a sealed box, and hid another book in the bathroom. I know where and what the book is (Harry Potter, lol).
As far as beginner teenage rebellion, reading in the bathroom isn't really concerning to me. But in the larger picture of a kid that is getting caught, takes the stated consequence, and then doesn't seem to mind doing the same thing again, I'm wondering if I should come down harder. Or just let her think she's getting away with it because it's better not to block up overall-harmless acts and force riskier behavior, and also be able to monitor what's going on.
Basically, would you go blind eye to the book in the bathroom, because it's healthy for a teenager to have some outlet for rebellion and frankly she doesn't have many outlets at her disposal, or would you address the fact that she is consistently disregarding rules both small and large and feels comfortable lying (even though she's not really good at it yet) (and the fact that the bathroom is really inconvenient to have monopolized by her for this).
I know this depends a lot on parenting styles and "this child in this moment". I have my initial thoughts and inclinations, but before we take action I want to get more perspectives since this teenage creature seems to need careful handling and is a fully different being than I was dealing with this time last year.
Please don't quote; I probably won't delete but I'd like to contain the personal info to one post in case I need to vague it up later.
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Did they by chance leave you, or someone you know, a key to their house to check on things, for emergencies? My new fantasy is to take the key and say that you'll check on dog and food/walk but the dog will be more comfortable in its own home long term and probably won't make that much mess during the day. [If they won't pay for kennel]
Alternately, "that's fine, oh btw the new 2022 prices went into effect on January 15 and pre-payment gets a 10% discount. Let me know if you prefer PayPal or Venmo and I'll send you a link." I'm in a mood today that if you decide to go this way and she goes, "What rates?!", I'll set up a website that just says in plain-text: "DawnM Boarding For Dogs After 1 Month When You Originally Book 10 Days, 2022 New Rates: $150/day plus $20 for food optional." Or whatever you want to charge. If it's on the internet it must be official, right? lol
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Week Two Mini goals
House
- Clean van and get it ready for donation runs. .✅
- Clear out kid clothes that are too small or will be too small for their next season, for donation.✅
Bank account
- Pay all current bills, withdraw expected kid $$ for the year. House subscriptions (insurance, ~utilities) add to calendar and total up. .✅
Bonus goal: 300 days of logged workouts. January goal: 25 days. 😳
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I recruited kid help to get the clothes done this week. The van has been cleaned out (mostly anyway) and the donations of clothes are in there and ready to go. DD13 started a "I want boy clothes, boy haircut, ew pink" stage so I am cringing at some of the nice/multifunctional/longlasting/has-used-forever clothes she's getting rid of, but oh well, and she kept one dress and one skirt for emergencies. The boys, most of their clothes are going to the trash because they are too worn to be recoverable. But thankfully everyone has enough that I don't need to purchase to fill any gaps. Except socks, but that is more of a space-time continuum requirement.
I also instituted a new laundry requirement in how to put clothes away that hopefully will make things more manageable. They do their own clothes but I've noticed a definite drop in quality control since I went to work, so this + less clothes to manage hopefully will get people back to standard.
House subscriptions have been totaled up. Instead of adding to a calendar, they are all just auto-pay now and I've set up a new sub-account at the bank that takes a monthly contribution to cover the annual total.
I have like 5 workouts done this month, lol. I'll try to get back into it and finish strong for the month. Even if I can't hit 25 days, any amount bigger than 5 will be considered a win going forward, lol.
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7 hours ago, popmom said:
I have a question. What happens if you try to get into a hot tub? In winter. Outdoors so briefly barefoot in say 40 degree weather. I’m curious about feet specifically. What would that feel like for someone with Raynaud’s?
For me it hurts like the dickens, lol. It's like all the cold is trying to leave my feet through my nerve endings. Even getting into bed with a hot water bottle by my feet can be painful if my feet are too cold. After the new temperature takes hold though, it is an amazing feeling.
For me I have to be careful of fast temperature changes because it can trigger a confused response: "are we hot, are we cold? IDK, let's cycle through too much and too little blood for a couple hours until we decide."
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"Thanks for letting me know! Rufus misses you but I'm sure he'll be fine. Getting to spend an extra 2 weeks in wine [chocolate/vodka/wool] country must be so amazing, I can't wait to see what goodies you bring back! 😍🤤(btw, just a reminder that I'm allergic to cheap airport gifts and chocolate under $10/lb). See you guys in 10-14 days!😘🐶"
- says the person I wish I was, lol
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I was diagnosed at 18. At the time they were ruling out other things to explain the symptoms, so it helped at the time to determine how serious what I was dealing with was. I was given medication to manage it. The medication, for me, was worse than the symptoms. So, I just self-manage it now.
IDK if the diagnosis "helps" anything now. Maybe it helps on my doctor visits and they make sure not to give meds that wouldn't exacerbate it? And if I'm having a bad day at work with it I can legit say it's a diagnosed medical condition.
When I got my diagnosis at 18, I was told I'd probably have RA or lupus by the time I was 35. I'm 35 now and very studiously not Googling symptoms of either, ha.
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1 hour ago, theelfqueen said:
Like we should believe something that was made up by a guy while he had a concussion, a concussion he got from being so absentminded as to sit under a fruit tree during harvest time.
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I last gave in December. It was my first "Power Red" donation, so just the red blood cells I guess. But there was an issue with either the machine (or me?*) and at the end I heard them muttering "contaminated" and I didn't get the return of the rest of the blood solution for the second process. They said it could still be used but I was not left with an assured feeling they were telling the truth.
*They mentioned, after I asked if it was okay, that next time I should try to hydrate before donating because I clotted fast. I was a little surprised because I had been doing extra hydration for a few days leading up to it. They said then it probably wasn't anything to worry about. So IDK if I caused the issue, clotting faster than they expected, or if the machine had an issue (they kept tapping it and checking it and having whispered mutterings, even at the beginning). Some of these mutterings also included one woman telling the other she pulled the thing too far out of me when trying to adjust it, and that seemed to be a not good thing, too.
All this background to ask my question of more-experienced blood donors: if I give again should I just do whole donation or the special Power Red thing? Do you know if 1 session of red cells mixes with 1 session of whole blood, is donation still useable? I'm O-, if that matters. ---> eta question, that is clearer: is the Power Red donation really that much better and useable, that I should try it again?
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Maybe he's tired of having to change the decorations with every holiday and so has decided for a scattershot approach, and now he's covered a few bases all the way through next Christmas!
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37 minutes ago, Terabith said:
LOL This song began literally when I started reading this meme and now I'm convinced I'm either in a Truman Show situation -or- the Matrix is having RAM shortages.
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Kids had chores, no allowance for years. Chores are how we all contribute to living in a good environment and being part of something bigger than ourselves, and just basic standard of living.
When I went back to work and they started to pick up slack from my being gone (prepping dinner, helping little sister in bathroom, etc), I started to pay each kid for helping keeping the house kind of running (effectively, $1/day during the work week). DD12 got a flat $10/week since she was the main person DD4 wanted help from. Boys got $5/week mostly for doing what they could in the kitchen.
Starting this week (which I haven't talked to them about yet), everyone will go to the $1/day model and the extra chores to earn the $1/day will be set (but easier). I figure if I can always have filtered water available, the kitchen counters and table clear for cooking, and the ingredients for dinner pulled/water boiling/oven preheated, it's worth $3/day for me and will save me more than an hour in the kitchen to do it all myself.
But this on top of their regular chores (dishes, vacuum, bathroom, laundry, general pickup) and is only because they are taking on what were effectively some of my chores.
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3 hours ago, BetsyT said:
This is so interesting to me. We were taught that the Civil War was over states rights, full stop. And yes, sure, slavery was wrong, but eventually the states would have surely figured that out, and it was overstepping of the federal government to force the states to do the right thing before they were ready to.
This is what I was taught also. DH was taught this too.
This was covered in elementary school. And middle school. I went through AP US History (and did well on the test). My dad has a masters in history and his pet topic is American wars (albeit 1900s more than before). So my education was simply not an "accidental" slip-through-the-cracks teaching, it was reinforced.
For those who maybe were given a slavery-was-reason education, this is a summary of how I remember it being presented:
Slavery was presented as, at most, just the last straw. That really the die was cast as soon as Lincoln was elected regardless of any action he took (this is in conflict with other statements later, btw). Not because the Southern states *really* cared about slavery or defending it, they were standing up to the idea that the federal government could tell them they needed to stop something, anything, for any reason. And that Lincoln could have found a reasonable way to deal with it until the Emancipation Proclamation, and so even if Lincoln was right about slavery being bad, he had no authority to do anything about it, and the southern states were justified in seceding even if there were other less-volatile options (or at least debatably justified given the understanding of the laws/Constitution of the time). And, importantly, they were seceding to prove the right to secede from the Union, because it was only theoretical until they did so.
Also, economically, Lincoln forced their hand because their economy was dependent on "certain costs of production", (ahem, not slavery, just low costs) that by doing anything to touch their economic system there really was no other option other than get poor and starve. Because not only would white Southerners not be able to feed themselves and create or sell goods, there would now be unemployed, unskilled people who have no place to live (because why would anyone regardless of race allow others to live on their land rent free?) or way to support themselves. So you are condemning the entire Southern population to destitution within a matter of years. Anyone rich enough to move out would immediately do so, only making the situation worse.
It wasn't slavery that caused the War, it was the South wanting the right to make their own laws and the necessity to protect their economy. Lincoln could have chosen to outlaw something else and the result would have been the same, therefore slavery was just accidental to the war, not a material cause.
The state's right to disregard Federal intervention/laws, conduct their economy and regulate industries to their best interest, and to secede, were what were at stake. Slavery was not one of the things that was really at stake, and the South wasn't really "fighting for the right to slavery" or really fighting for anything, since their intention was to secede.
Furthermore, the fact that the war ended slavery was just an outcome of it, not the purpose of it, from the North's point of view.
(Please note I see logical inconsistencies in this, and it's been 15 years since I was learning this, but it's basically true to my recollection. I'm sharing so others can hear this perspective if they had a different educational experience, not because I agree with it or because I wish to defend it).
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1 hour ago, Baseballandhockey said:
I am a little confused between the difference between a male dairy spite cow and a spite bull, but I will take the writer's word on it.
Well, according to the writer, a male dairy spite cow has absolutely no purpose, so a bull must be full of it.
....
Of purpose, I mean, of course.
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Update on Week 1 (+2) Goals:
On 1/1/2022 at 11:57 AM, Moonhawk said:House, mini goals by week: 1. Clean van and get it ready for donation runs. 1a. Pack up all kid books not being used for school and break up into sell/store/donate.
Bank account, mini goals by week: 1. make 4-week repeating food schedule, with budget numbers with each meal/week; goal is less than $800/mo, preferably $650-700. 2. Pay all current bills, withdraw expected kid $$ for the year. House subscriptions (insurance, ~utilities) add to calendar and total up.
Bonus goal: 300 days of logged workouts. January goal: 25 days.
The van isn't ready for donation but I got kids books done, and have taken books out and sold already. The kids helped me get the books sorted and we kept more than I had wanted, but everything is in a sealed box now so at least they aren't floating around and making mess. Besides the baby's books. I'll do the van this week in preparation for Week 2 House goals.
I made the 4-week repeating food schedule. After 3 hours gathering ingredient prices, I am shocked that my average dinner now costs $24.78, which × 30 days = $743 per month just for dinners. Yes I can cut this down: smaller portions, focus only on my cheapest on the list, make bulk, only buy on sale, etc. But the reality is that dinners are expensive and have gone up in price since the last time I did this. After looking at other food needs (breakfast, lunch, snacks), my initial grocery budget is $750/month total. So, I'll just have to be crafty and watch my receipts carefully.
I've paid all current bills and have withdrawn all kid cash for the year.
1/25 workouts for January, guess you guys know what I'm doing the rest of the month lol.
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I have grown up on the border of reservations, have gone to church regularly on reservations, I have had classmates that were native. My mother's family has a a fair amount of intermarriage with Native families. The tribes I am familiar with are currently federally recognized.
I did not know this was an issue.
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re: grave tending
I did a clean up this weekend of family graves, clearing of sad-looking gifts, etc. In my mind, once the object is detracting from the grave, and there is no sign that the original leaver is going to come back/take care of it, it's reasonable to clear up the past items.
If a card is in an envelope, I don't expect it to be opened. If a card is sans envelope, I feel it is okay to read. Just how when you go to offices during the Christmas season, they display the cards they receive: you are allowed to read them, but you can't open their mail and read it even if you know it's a Christmas card.
Our cemetery doesn't have an office where you can turn things in if something blows around or can be kept after being on the actual grave, so maybe this colors my view.
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1 hour ago, SKL said:
We're talking about soldiers here. Is there some assumption that all the soldiers of the side that won were angelic? Isn't it more likely that the soldiers on both sides had more in common than not? But it's OK to honor the Union soldiers' graves (and US soldiers in other wars that the US government entered), but not the Confederate soldiers' graves? Just based on which current rhetoric we believe regarding the war / leaders of the time?
The South had a number of grievances, most of them economic issues other than slavery. Most Southerners were not slave owners, and many wouldn't want to be slave owners even if they could have been. Some of them were actively fighting against slavery.
As for racism, hopefully it's common knowledge that racism always has existed in the North as well ... and the North wasn't always free of slavery either.
The black and white way that this topic has been handled here is kind of disappointing.
It seems a bit of an odd jump you made: that this woman wrote this card about "unwavering devotion" to the Confederate cause he died for, and somehow try to turn it into as if people are saying you can't honor a soldier's grave at all because of "current rhetoric we believe regarding the war / leaders of the time."
There is a difference between honoring the soldier as a man, worthy as a man, and honoring the cause he died for.
She isn't honoring him as a man, she is honoring the Confederate cause and using him as a way to do it. That isn't honoring him. Honoring him would be tending to his grave, putting flowers, etc. Once it becomes about the "cause" he died for, this argument cannot justify her actions.
I don't know why other grievances of the South would be relevant at this point, or racism in other parts of the country. I know you brought it up to show "Southern soldier can be a good guy, too, or at least other people can be just as bad," but it doesn't matter how good or bad he is when he is only being referenced as a part of the cause. You know she isn't honoring him because he lived his life in a Southern state or because he may have been a good guy. She is honoring him because she sees him as an extension/link to the Confederate Cause she believes in. She only saw him as a vessel of her own political beliefs.
In case I'm not being clear: You can honor a soldier, and his grave, regardless of what side he was on. This is separate from honoring his cause (which you don't even know if he agreed with).
What this woman did was not that. She honored the Confederate cause. For all we know, he was completely against whatever she sees him as "standing for", and this is a disgrace to his memory and he could have been rolling over in his grave the entire time the card was on top of him. If we are going to play hypotheticals.
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Thank you for the suggestions, I'm looking at all of them.
I had originally been leaning towards live teacher online, or at least online course, since Mandarin is completely different and a tonal language. I am trying not to let my anger/punishment spill over and affect other things they are interested in, but I am also not interested in finding a miracle if it costs a lot or takes a large investment of my time to be productive. It may just be a natural consequence of things that they have to postpone learning this.
Yes, all tech banned. Previously all machines were already in a visible spot. All computers have been taken into the parent office and stored. iPads for music lessons will be checked out only for the hour they are needed and then returned. I don't want to add another exception to the rule. If it was a different kid maybe I'd bend, but for this kid in particular they have lost all privileges for tech-related stuff.
It really stinks for everyone. It is going to put them behind on different things they had been doing, and things we had been looking forward to teaching/doing with them. We had done a lot of work to make this a kid-tech-friendly environment and prioritizing tech literacy and skills (coding, art-related programs, our own professional programs, etc).
It is what it is.
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Oh no, I have a teenager now. Help me think through this.
in The Chat Board
Posted
Well, the younger kids didn't care about the tech really so that's why we just decided across the board for simplicity; we didn't want her to have access to someone else's tech on the sly, and since we're not sure exactly how she started in terms of working around blocks, passwords, etc., at the time it was found we couldn't kid-proof all the tech. The boys, fwiw, haven't cared at all about the tech being gone. and DD4 wasn't using any tech besides movies on the weekend anyway, which we are still allowing.