TarynB
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Posts posted by TarynB
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When my DS was in 4th, we did exactly what you're talking about, and spent one semester on a quick overview of major events in American History. We used The Complete Book of US History as a spine. Inexpensive little book but I was quite pleased with it. Added relevant library books and documentaries, including America: The Story of US. Very little written work, lots of discussion and reading. It was great.
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For history-related literature, we've had good results just choosing from the book lists in WTM and Sonlight.
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I agree with the PP - highly recommend K12's Human Odyssey texts. There are 3 volumes in the series: 1st volume is pre-history to Middle Ages, 2nd volume is 1400 to 1914, 3rd volume is up through contemporary times. Depending on where you are in the history cycle, you might want to look at vol 2 or 3. Note there is no hardcopy student guide or teacher guide for vol 3 because K12's course for vol 3 is online only.
Vol 2 text: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1931728569/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00
Vol 3 text: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1601530188/ref=wms_ohs_product
Vol 2 student guide: http://www.amazon.com/Intermediate-World-History-Student-Semesters/dp/B0068R8CI6/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1356051754&sr=8-5&keywords=intermediate+world+history+b+student
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Check out Evan-Moor's workbook Writing Fabulous Sentences and Paragraphs:
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Just one more thought . . . if you want more grammar review that goes with Easy Grammar, you might consider adding the companion book Daily Grams. It is part of the same program as Easy Grammar and they work together. I didn't think of it until now. Although, it would be another book to add to your list . . . maybe worth considering though.
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http://www.handwriti...raph/index.html
Have you tried this? I like it and its free. (BTW - you don't have to enter your email address to print, just click the print button after you've input your text.)
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I have tried both. We started WWS when my oldest (who struggles) was in 5th. It was way too difficult for him. We are using IEW and he is very proud of his writing now. I would love to go back to WWS when he is older. I agree with the previous poster that the lessons are better suited for Jr. High/High School unless your child is a natural writer, very bright, or you have time to slow it down and work through it with them.
Ditto. Exactly the same here. Both are great programs and both have their place. Teachers just need to make sure they understand the intended audience of each program and be realistic about where the student is as a writer, not where you wish s/he is as a writer. My DS is doing IEW currently -- and has gained SO much confidence in writing -- and he'll use WWS when he's ready, hopefully in 6th grade. It would be painful & pointless for him to try earlier.
ETA: To clarify, for me, WWS is the ideal, but IEW is the incremental, formulaic bridge we needed to cross first in order to get to WWS. Our path has been WWE, then IEW, and planning on WWS next.
FWIW, my DS thinks Pudewa (IEW) is funny and likes his style. I'm just thrilled with the outcome.
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Your "rambling" and your son's input is very helpful!!! Thank You! So..if I use EAsy Grammar, Wordly Wise and SWI B I would be covered right? I am going to do literature either through Sonlight or BF by doing a history study, I believe both of them also cover vocabulary too....
Your plan - with the added lit you mentioned - sounds very thorough and fabulous to me! Glad it was helpful. Best of luck!
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Yep...I agree. Okay, soooo...one thing that is appealing about Hake is the all in one, and the constant review. I personally would NEED the constant review. But..with easy grammar it is the fact that they do NOT diagram that I like and also the preposition approach.
Do you feel Hake covers vocabulary well??
Thanks for talking through this with me!!!! It helps a ton!
1. We don't use Hake as "all in one". We only use the grammar portion. I've looked several times at the writing booklet, and it just doesn't appeal to me compared to other composition programs. I think it is pretty dry and I feel there are better ways to teach writing. But that's just me. It might be exactly right for other students.
2. If you use Hake grammar but don't want to cover the diagramming, it is very easy to just skip those lessons and the subsequent review questions pertaining to diagramming.
3. I liked the preposition approach of Easy Grammar as well, so I hear you on that. My DS did seem to benefit from being familiar with Easy Grammar's preposition approach from last year before starting Hake this year.
4. Personally I wouldn't rely on Hake as a vocab program. It introduces only 2 new vocab words per lesson. It just isn't the focus of the program. In contrast, Wordly Wise teaches 10 new words per lesson, which is a huge difference over a school year. Also, I just asked DS, and he says even though Hake reviews the grammar concepts constantly, he doesn't think Hake reviews the vocab words as well or as thoroughly. Others may disagree though. You could always start with Hake and add a vocab program later if you feel like the vocab in Hake isn't enough.
Hopefully there's something useful for you in my rambling.
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Okay..so my question is this, if you use SWI B, I have this on vhs, and Wordly Wise, do you need to do Hake Grammar or just do Easy Grammar?
I think you need a grammar program of some sort, because neither SWI nor Wordly Wise teach grammar, but either Hake or Easy Grammar would be excellent. (We used Easy Grammar last year. We switched to Hake only because I wanted more review of concepts than EG provides, and coverage of diagramming, which EG does not teach.) ETA: Sorry, I overlooked in your original post where you mentioned Easy Grammar. I think Easy Grammar is very solid too, it just depends on what approach you prefer. Both are great programs.
Another thought is that you don't have to cover all aspects of LA at the same time. If doing more than one at a time is overwhelming, there's nothing that says you can't rotate among the different areas of composition, vocab/spelling, grammar. Do one area (i.e., grammar) for a week or several weeks, then switch. I do think you want to get thorough coverage in total, though, before they hit high school.
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For your older (12 and 14 year old) kids, I don't see a problem with having separate books that cover the different elements of "language arts", especially if you want them to be working semi-independently and using quality materials. Also, IMO, older kids don't need spelling as a separate subject; instead, focus on vocabulary and ensure correct spelling of the vocab words as they go.
Programs that I'm familiar with and would recommend for your older kids are:
Grammar: Hake as mentioned above, which does include diagramming if you decide you want it. My DS uses it and it is going very well for him. Very thorough, more than enough review, very solid - yet relatively short lessons. Each lesson takes us about 15-20 minutes and we do 3 lessons/week.
Composition: WWS or Excellence in Writing's Student Writing Intensive (SWI) B -- The SWI can be pricey but I think definitely worth it, especially since you can use it for multiple kids as they get to the right age. There's a link in my signature. We did WWE and will be starting WWS next year (6th grade) but SWI has been wonderful for my previously-writing-phobic DS.
Vocabulary: Several independent workbook choices out there. My DS really likes Wordly Wise - link in my signature. Or use Wordly Wise's online program. Or look at Vocabulary from Classical Roots, which is recommended in 3rd edition of WTM.
Hope that gives you some ideas!
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If you want to keep the structure of History Odyssey, how about adding relevant documentaries, and reading & discussing living books related to the time period he is studying? Or if you think he needs a complete change of scenery, have you looked at K12's Human Odyssey? You should be able to find it used inexpensively. (We love it here.)
ETA: By the way, I agree that what I've seen of History Odyssey as it is written looks kinda dry and un-engaging, so just adding a little variety of materials would be my advice. My DS doesn't love history (as much as science), but since he's very visually-oriented and likes to read, he retains a lot from adding documentaries and library books alongside his history spine.
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Just so you know, if you want to try IEW, they have a very generous return policy if you buy from them and decide it's not for you. Their return policy is "unconditional, no time limit, 100% refund guarantee on everything we sell". Also, check the used market - I got it from someone who had used it with all her children and wanted to pass it on.
Best of luck in whatever you decide.
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My DS is exactly the same as you're describing your DD. We finally tried Institute for Excellence in Writing's Student Writing Intensive and it has been a blessing for him. The difference in his attitude, ability and confidence about writing now is a complete turnaround from where he was last year. (SWI provides the topics to write about and gives you a specific framework, so my DS doesn't panic over "WHAT to write about" and "HOW to write about it".) So have you ever considered IEW? http://www.excellenc...iting.com/sid-b I didn't get the teacher's course on Structure and Style, I just watch the SWI DVDs with my son and it works wonderfully for us.
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:iagree:
My DS did SWI-B and is now doing the Ancients theme book. I have the Ancients teacher book but haven't needed to crack it open even once - although I did check to make sure I wasn't missing anything, and I wasn't. If you've read Blended Structure & Style you probably understand the program even better than I do after doing SWI-B, so I think you'd find the Ancients teacher book unnecessary.
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We're using Learning Adventures, vol 3, along with Deconstructing Penguins to add to the literature. LA is an all in one unit study but it can be light for an 8th without supplementing. I do like the grammar, though, and the list of books. We realized with Moving Beyond The Page that my kid gets more out of unit studies than he does with separate subjects and this is the only unit study I found that keeps the history in order while tying in literature, music, art, grammar, and science.
Thank you! This sounds great. Off to check it out! :)
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Literature is taken in small bites, with a grammar piece that goes with.
The literature reading and discussion takes about 45 minutes and the worksheets, 10.
Lily_Grace, what lit program are you using? Thanks!
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I don't have much practical advice, but since my DS is also using Hake, I wanted to mention one thing. I just have him do every other question in the review sections, instead of every question, and I find that he's retaining just as well that way. Even with us reading through the new material and going over each practice question together, a total grammar lesson only takes about 15 - 20 minutes this way. Maybe you're already using Hake this way too, but just wanted to throw an idea out.
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I asked my 11YO what he felt about the poll; he is doing History Odyssey and reading K12 Human Odyssey on the side.
His response: Human Odyssey is really fun to read, and that can help you to remember stuff. However, the assignments of History Odyssey that make you write things down, think about the timeline, and compare things really help you nail it down into your head. Could he do both like I do? Do History Odyssey for the assignments and to organize it, and just read the relevant chapters in Human Odyssey as he goes?
That's a good point about the questions/assignments. K12 Human Odyssey student and teacher guides have offline assignments like that too and DS keeps a timeline as well.
How many of the recommended books on History Odyssey's list does your son use? (I like that Human Odyssey is self-contained.) History Odyssey's book list appears daunting because there are so many, and I'm not sure I like the perspective of Hillyer's book. What do you think?
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Not sure if you're wanting a text, a workbook or something online, but my DS10 used these online "games". He liked Sheppard Software the best.
http://www.sheppardsoftware.com/web_games.htm
http://www.aaawhere.com/geog-usa.htm
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My DS10 is using Visual Link Spanish online independently. http://www.spanishprograms.com/cj_vls/
You can try 11 lessons for free. They also have sales frequently if you sign up for their emails - I didn't pay as much as the current advertised price.
We've tried a few other Spanish programs that he ended up getting bored with, but he has stuck with this one and enjoys it. I bought him a year's access to the level one program and he wants to continue with level two. I don't push it, he does it for fun. He talks to me in Spanish frequently, so it seems to be working.
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I do add in historical literature, using WTM, Sonlight, and other book lists for ideas. Also, my DS really enjoys watching documentaries from Netflix and Amazon and even You Tube, to go with Human Odyssey. Especially once we got up to Ancient Greece, I found lots of videos to choose from. As I said, we don't do a lot of writing for history, as we do it elsewhere and he's on the younger side for logic stage, but I find he learns and retains a ton between Human Odyssey, library books and documentaries. (We do still keep a timeline & do list of facts, verbal summaries, but no outlining yet.) Hope that helps!
ETA: We also use the K12 student/teacher guides that go with Human Odyssey. Here's a recent thread in which I posted: http://forums.welltr...amples-of-them/
As I wrote in the linked thread, I've been pleasantly surprised and pleased with the K12 student and teacher guides. I've found sections that often go beyond just basic fact regurgitation, into deeper connections. One example is the compare/contrast charts over various aspects of the different cultures that have been covered so far and their connections to modern cultures.
This week, the sections I used in the teacher guide included the answers to questions like these:
Who was Pericles and what are some things he is remembered for? What were the main causes of the Pelopennesian War? What was the Delian League and why did Sparta not join the Delian League? What could Athens have done to avoid war with Sparta?
This is why I think the K12 materials are quite good.
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I voted for K12 Human Odyssey. I own three of your options and we've tried all three but we're sticking with K12 Human Odyssey.
Here's why: We read through Builders of the Old World to give a quick overview before we begin a new topic. I really like it, but my DS10 has a higher reading level as well, and the text is too simplistic for him and it just skims the surface of what I want him to learn. So I suspect this would be the case for your DC as well. We tried World in Ancient Times, and I wanted to like it, but DS did not appreciate its level of detail, and it is quite expensive. (He is definitely more a math and science kid, for history he just wants to get it done.) We are now using K12 Human Odyssey as our spine. It is just right for us. The reading level is perfect for DS and includes enough detail but not too much. (Also, I admit we have not tried History Odyssey, but we do the bulk of our writing in other subjects and History Odyssey just looked like a schedule of writing and reading assignments from an encyclopedia spine plus several other books, not what I was looking for. My DS does not enjoy notebooking. Your DC may have different preferences.)
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What have you used up to this point? What do you like and dislike about it?
How do you juggle American history & world history?
in K-8 Curriculum Board
Posted
Kai, I'm planning for the rest of logic stage (and tentatively high school), and I really like the sequence you've laid out above. Could you please recommend any specific geography textbooks/resources for the 8th grade year in your sequence?
Thank you!