[Homeschool/Public School Integration]

Just playing devil's advocate here bc this is something from your side of the process you might not have contemplated, but how does taking classes at the ps incorporate into the reasons you homeschool and why not just enroll in school?

 

One question that many homeschooled college applicants have to answer is why did you choose to homeschool. Make sure that your children are able to articulate why some classes are through the ps and some aren't and why that was the best academic choice for them.

 

This is a great point.  Actually, it was something that the Super brought up, though not in so many words.  He hinted around the idea that, "If you have made the choice to homeschool, why would you want to utilize the PS anyways?"

 

I think that kind of stems from perhaps not understanding all of the reasons people homeschool.  One thing he did point out was that homeschooled kids would be coming into an environment that is drastically different from the morals, values, behavior expectations at home.  

 

I think that's a bit of a misnomer.  Certainly, there are many families for which this is true...but not all families that homeschool have strict expectations for their children's behavior, etc.  Especially with the rise of non-religious folks that are choosing to homeschool...no longer is homeschooling primarily the long-skirt crowd, kwim?  (FWIW, we are actually part of the long-skirt crowd...lol.  Though I wear pants whenever I feel like it).  That isn't to say that only the religious folks have behavior standards, but just that there is a wider variety of families that are choosing to homeschool.  So it isn't necessarily true that a homeschooled kid will be facing different values, etc., for the first time when they enter a classroom.  

 

 

Anyways, I explained to him much of what I've explained here.  And I pointed out to him that part of the reason we WANT to integrate is because we don't want our kids so sheltered that, when they are young adults leaving the home, they are only then experiencing the rest of the world.  And for that matter, our kids integrate with PS kids in a variety of other ways.  Whether it's on the baseball field, or at the park, or at karate, camp, etc.  

 

 

I also pointed out to him that we have chosen to homeschool not because we are anti-homeschool...but as maize pointed out, we wanted the flexibility to modify our children's educational approach to fit THEIR needs, especially in the younger years.  But that as they grow older, and get closer to college age, we recognize that they must learn to take classes, etc.  

 

At the end of the day, I want what's BEST for my kids.  The best that I can get for them.  That may mean acknowledging that I cannot "do" art with them, because I'm awful at it.  It means acknowledging that my student will be better off learning Calculus in a classroom.  I don't think the best educational approach has to be "either or".  A combination of approaches, ultimately, will be best to meet the variety of needs each student has.  

 

 

Thanks for bringing this up, though.  I need to consider all of these aspects...potential roadblocks that may arise, etc.  

 

[Homeschool/Public School Integration]

Washington also allows homeschoolers to participate as much or as little in public school programs (including extracurriculars) as they wish.

 

Honestly, I think the key is going to be how the funding works in your state.  If there is a mechanism for schools to be funded for part time students that isn't too hard on administration, it is far more likely to work.

 

Yeah, I have a feeling it's going to boil down to money as well.  The superintendent quickly pointed out that opening the public school to homeschoolers would necessitate they also do the same for the two private schools in our community.  Honestly, I'm not so sure that's really an issue...one of the schools only goes to 5th grade and they cover art, music, PE, etc.  There aren't any electives in elementary school so that only leaves us with the one christian private school.  At the end of the day, there aren't that many kids that attend there.  They already cover art, music, PE, etc.  The only thing I could see as being appealing to their students would be AP courses in high school.

 

Still though...if a large number of homeschoolers suddenly decide they all want to take art classes at the PS, there could potentially be an issue with class size, etc.  I think it's a minimal concern, however.  Then again, if the school is not receiving funding for homeschooled kids, there again could be an issue.  

 

But I don't think it HAS to be.  

 

 

Here's Vermont's statue:

 

http://education.vermont.gov/documents/EDU-Integration_of_Home_Study_Students_Into_Public_Schools.pdf

Thank you for linking this!  

[Homeschool/Public School Integration]

Not personal experience but from observation, of the states I have been in Utah has the most flexible homeschool/public school interface. Kids can take as many or as few classes at the public school as they want, and can dual enroll between a private school or a charter school and a district school. 

 

A large percentage, I suspect a majority, of homeschooled high schoolers take advantage of this policy at some point. I don't know a lot of families who do partial school enrollment in elementary as the schedules do not so easily lend themselves to taking just a class or two, but there are families who send a child just for music or p.e. etc. 

 

All extracurriculars are also open to homeschoolers.

 

In my opinion, this is a major plus for the state as they are invested in providing the best educational opportunities possible to all students.

 

I totally agree.  In an ideal world, the community would care about providing the best opportunities to all children, regardless of their choice of academic path.  It's a point I hope to stress.

 

Man though...when I hear about other states where homeschoolers have as much or as little access as they want, I can't help but be jealous.  I would be curious how Utah works it out, how they overcome some of the roadblocks, how they deal with potential legal issues, registration issues, funding issues, class size issues, etc.  

[Homeschool/Public School Integration]

Last week, I posted a topic asking for information/experiences with integrating homeschoolers into the public school in the state of NY, in anticipation of a meeting I had scheduled with our District's Superintendent.  I received some good information and wanted to update, plus I figured I'd open this up to folks from other states.

 

 

My husband and I met with our Superintendent yesterday morning.  Our primary purposes for this meeting were to find out exactly what our district allows homeschoolers to participate in at the public school, to understand why the Board of Education in our district decided on these restrictions/rules, and to get an idea of how much support we might have in making some changes.

 

Ultimately, my goal is that homeschooled children within our community will be able to access the public school for art and music at all levels, AP classes, band, chorus, and elective courses in high school.  The bottom line is that this is about providing as much opportunity to our homeschooled kids that public schooled kids have.  Not all of us can afford to provide paid for lessons, and those of us schooling in rural areas have very limited access to free/affordable programs, or even other homeschool groups where these programs may be part of a co-op.  

 

There are some major roadblocks, the biggest being our state's Homeschool Regulations with explicitly prohibit part-time enrollment (thus, making AP classes and elective courses a bit more tricky).  However there are some districts within our state that DO allow some level of integration, utilizing some of the Regulation's gray areas that give Districts flexibility in determining just how much homeschoolers are allowed to participate.  

 

 

Our meeting with the Superintendent went well!  He was courteous, open to our ideas and suggestions and interested in seeing how other districts have successfully integrated homeschoolers into their programs.  He indicated that our Disctrict's policies have been what they are for years and that nobody has really challenged them.  Without a challenge to them, there was never any reason to alter them.  

 

We concluded our meeting with him promising that he would speak with a neighboring district that supposedly allows a higher level of integration, and that he would also speak to the Board of Education to try and get an idea how they might feel towards opening up the restrictions we have in place.  We left feeling positive about our meeting and hopeful that perhaps this might be the start of some changes.

 

However we still have a lot to consider, some issues to address and people to convince.  

 

Several folks commented on my last thread and I appreciate your information!  I would love more information from others, both within NY and outside of NY.  Ideas for how this works!  Examples, etc.  If you are in NY, it would be great if you can tell me which school district so that we can contact them and see exactly what they are doing and how.  

 

I feel as though, if we can provide a lot of examples to our Superintendent, and our Board, we'll have a better chance of convincing them that this can be done.  

 

Please, chime in!  Thanks so much for any help, advice, connections, etc. you can give!  

 

 

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

Thanks for the discussion folks!  I have an appointment tomorrow morning (Wednesday) to sit down with the Superintendent and begin the process of aligning all my ducks, lol.  If you pray, please do.  Pray for an open mind and a willingness to help, on his part.  

 

Thanks again!  

[Progressive Phonics - How Far Does it Go?]

I've used PP with all four of my kids.  I don't begin with it, though.  I begin with HoP with, IMO, lays a better foundation.  So I'll do HoP with my student, learning the basics, phonemes, blending, etc.  Then, once they have mastered CVC words, some (SOME) sight words, and are blending, I switch to Progressive Phonics Intermediate.  

 

For all four of my kids, I've been able to run through PP Intermediate and Advanced by the completion of 1st grade.  My youngest is the only one of the four that's not picked up readily.  And it isn't that he isn't picking it up, it's just taking him a bit longer and he's not fluent yet, where his siblings all were by this point.  

 

I have been pleased with it overall, and I am pleased with where my readers are upon completion.  They have a solid foundation and are usually reading above grade level.  

 

I will tell you that I also add in Explode the Code as needed.  To clarify...all four have done ETC, but at various times in their reading journeys and not all of them have done the same amount of ETC.  Mostly, I was using ETC to solidify phonics concepts, give them practice reading on their own, and as a written medium to complement PPs mostly auditory/visual approach.  Some of them were assigned advanced ETC pages after they had mostly completed PP.  And others received more ETC throughout the actual learn to read process.  

 

I've also added in Spectrum Phonics as review when necessary, and because our state has standardized testing requirements, I add in Spectrum Reading beginning in the second half of 1st grade.  

 

So far, so good!  

[Pencil Sharpeners - do you love yours?]

So you can clamp it to the table, or can you install it on the wall? I remember the suction cup kind coming loose when I was a kid, or do you hold with one hand and sharpen with the other? Is that something a child can manage?

 

It does come with a clamp, but ours tends to migrate all over the house...usually wherever I am, it ends up, lol.  

 

My kids have had no problem using one hand to hold it while sharpening with the other.  The sharpener has a mechanism that locks (and draws) the pencil in as it sharpens it.  So you don't have to hold onto the pencil at all...just the sharpener.  

[So if you had kids 16 months apart and you wanted to teach them together...]

Depends on the kids, but I think it's doable.

 

My four are all within 3 1/2 yrs. So the ages break down like this:

 

DD10

 

DS9 (11 months younger)

 

DS8 (16 months younger)

 

DS7 (13 months younger)

 

 

DS9 is accelerated and DD10 has LDs in math. They are combined for all language arts and are pretty similar ability. I taught them how to read at the same time and just adjusted accordingly when one advanced past the other, but for the most part, they were easy to keep together.

 

Notice that DS9 and DS8 are 16 months apart! But they are not combined except for history, science, and Bible/character. Their abilities are too spread.

 

The younger two boys....I started them each separately, but after the younger one learned how to read, I began moving them closer together, holding the older one back a bit until the younger one caught up. They are combined for all subjects with the exception of phonics.

[Not ready for this year]

Meeeeee!!!!! I'm usually much more along in planning. I haven't even ordered curriculum, sent school notices, or even finalized what we're doing. I can't find time! Son as I get done with the required daily stuff, it's already past bedtime for me.

[Math Curriculum for Spiral Review]

Prodigy Math...it's excellent for this. It's a "little" more legwork for you, but your kids will WANT to play, so it's totally worth it.

 

So you create a teacher/parent account...and then you create a student profile/account. Your add your student to your class. Then, from the teacher dashboard, you can either allow the game to assess your student's ability and it will adjust accordingly. Or, you can go into assignments and choose from four different curriculum strands (TEKS, MAFS, Common Core and Ontario Standards), grades 1-8. There are hundreds of topics that you can assign. Almost everything you want to review is in there.

 

As your student plays the game (a role playing game), the program populates the assignment questions right into their battles, etc.

 

My kids play about 30 minutes a day and they BEG FOR MORE!

 

It's completely free, too...which is such a great bonus. There is a paid membership option which gives the player more in-game options. If you can connect with a group buy, you can get a year's membership pretty cheap.

 

But yeah...Prodigy has made my spiral review for math so much more simple than it was before.

 

[Pencil Sharpeners - do you love yours?]

Electric? That's kind of like the holy grail of the school supply world. Good, quality electric pencil sharpeners that last are very hard to find.

 

I can't speak to the one linked...but hey...it has great reviews so that's a plus!

 

I sharpen a lot of coloring pencils, which are notoriously difficult with electric sharpeners. I ended up throwing in the towel and bought this one: https://www.amazon.com/CARL-Angel-5-Pencil-Sharpener-Blue/dp/B005D7S9FI/ref=pd_sim_229_4?ie=UTF8&dpID=41RlCEQakbL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR160%2C160_&psc=1&refRID=PKZG9X7Q9JFMBCQRMXSS

 

Best school supply purchase ever. Seriously, so good. One or two cranks and I have a sharp pencil. And although it's not perfect with my coloring pencils, it is so so much better than before. Easy to unjam!

 

So if you decide to throw in the towel with electric sharpeners...give this one a try. I think you'll love it!

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

When I go before the Board (assuming it's feasible to do so), I would like to have answers and solutions for any and all problems they present.

 

Evidence of those solutions working well bolster my argument, lol.

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

When I go before the Board (assuming it's feasible to do so), I would like to have answers and solutions for any and all problems they present.

 

Evidence of those solutions working well bolster my argument, lol.

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

A lot of this has to do with insurance. I ran into this when my son needed speech therapy, among other therapies, from our district. Some therapy groups are 'inclusive' meaning that the therapist can pull kids who don't need therapy into the group. It includes kids who don't have IEPs. That is often done for kids, like my son, who are academically on or above level. The therapist might pull a group of kids who are of similar academic abilities, some who need therapy and some who don't and run an activity. It is generally coordinated with the classroom teacher to make the activity academically relevant to the students.

 

And 'exclusive' group is a therapy group that is only students who have IEPs. It is generally made of students with higher needs, and occasionally with behavior problems. That group excludes anyone without an IEP. Those groups generally meet outside the classroom in a dedicated space.

 

When my son got his first IEP the therapist said he should be in an inclusive group. She would bring him into the classroom (this was kindergarten) and let him participate in an activity while providing speech therapy. I should add that our elementary schools have SLPs incorporated into the K-2 grades. They are in the classrooms for all the kids. They work with the teachers.

 

I was called by someone from the district and told that because my son wasn't enrolled in the school he was not permitted to go into a classroom. Their insurance didn't permit his presence with other enrolled children in a classroom space. So, he had to be switched to an exclusive therapy group. That group had to meet outside the classroom in the office of the speech therapist. That went sort of ok until my son had an emotional breakdown in front of the therapist because he just couldn't stand being in a group of kids with behaviour problems. She was very, very supportive and amended his IEP and put him in private therapy. He went from three group sessions a week to two private, but it was so much better for him.

 

And I know that there is some confusion because the exclusive group does include enrolled kids. It doesn't make perfect sense. But, OTOH, the law says the school must offer services to homeschool students. OTOH, their insurance says they can't be in the classrooms. So, they allow the therapy to happen because they must, but not in a classroom.

 

So, I know this is largely not relevant but it is why a lot of districts don't allow non-enrolled kids in the classroom. Or, at least it is the answer they can fall back on. It is my understanding that when it comes to activities such as band and sports it is up to the principal of the individual school.

 

I thought about this...the insurance issue. That's one of the things I'm wondering how other districts handle. Marcus Whitman, for example, supposedly allows homeschoolers on their swim team. How does that work?

 

They are a neighboring district...the temptation to move is strong.

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

My district does not allow it. In fact, the school board took a vote that specifically banned all non-public school students from any such activities. I have heard that a principal in a neighboring district allowed a former student to continue in the band.

 

I will add that my specific school district has been excellent when it comes to their obligation to provide special ed services to homeschool students. That has not been an issue at all. The high school also did not give me too much hassle when it came to my older boy taking a regents exam...which is allowed as per NY educational regulations. But they were a pain in the butt about it, lol. They clearly had NO idea what the actual regulations are.

 

I'm sure you have done a lot of work on this, but I would suggest that you absolutely know the regulations inside and out. Bring hard copies with you to clear up any questions. It has been my experience that public school people have no idea what the actual regulations are. None. They know what they think the regs are, and it is almost always what someone else told them or what they think they should be. More than once, I have seen friends in neighboring districts have to deal with a district that didn't know that there were NY homeschool regulations. They get a new person in who literally thinks they get to do whatever they want. And take notes. I have had administrators tell me one thing and then literally turn around and tell me the opposite two days later. When I pointed it out, they just shrugged.

 

And a superintendent won't do a thing without talking to the board. So offer to talk to the board. If he says that he needs to talk to them, ask when that will be. Offer to be there to present to the board. Say you want to attend the meeting. They are usually open to the public, but not always publicized. So, don't ask for permission to attend, just say you will be there and ask when and where it is.

One of the reasons I want to meet with the super before the Board, is to get an idea of WHY the district has never allowed integration. Dollars to donuts there are misconceptions on the Board that will need to be addressed.

 

But also, I want to gauge what, if any, support I might have from within. And if that support is paltry, I'd like to work on building relationships and hopefully...support, lol.

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

Any specific reason? I thought there was some way you could take the AP exam as a homeschooler without actually attending an AP class at school, but I could be wrong. However, you definitely can take the Calculus CLEP exam without taking a class:

 

https://clep.collegeboard.org/exam/calculus

 

(I don't have a clue what my district allows or doesn't allow, but taking my kid to therapy at the local public school twice a week (at least three times a week this coming year) is annoying enough to my schedule - I don't want to take him to other things/classes on their schedule)

I'd like him to have the classroom experience, too. Before he leaves home for college and/or other endeavors.

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

Some here allow AP classes, DE classes, and extracurriculars after school (like drama club).

 

Art, music, band they don't allow as those are "classes" not extracurriculars.

 

No interscholastic sports, but intramural are ok, if your school has those (ours do not).

 

We are invited to attend county wide spelling bees, poetry competitions, science fairs, & things like that (not run by districts).

 

Lots of things take place at the public schools but are not run by the schools, so those are all open to us too (scouts, sports clubs such as elementary school wrestling or basketball)

 

We are North Country upstate (North of the Adirondacks, south of Canada)- lots of small rural districts here, but they mostly all follow the same pattern of above.

 

I would be THRILLED if they would allow us to do AP classes. If that's all I get from this, than I would consider that a win. My eldest boy is on track for Trig in 9th grade. AP calc is a very real probability for him.

 

Music/band/art would be nice. We are Fingerlakes...too far from any of the cities to have any kind of opportunities.

 

But AP, yeah...that would make my day.

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

It varies quite a bit. My local district did not permit my child to participate in a current extracurricular, even though the person running it was enthusiastic about having DS participate. I could have spent some energy fighting this, but I am moving instead.

The district i am moving to apparently permits HS to participate in strictly extracurricular events. That was a nice surprise but I've yet to test it.

Would you mind giving some examples of what they allow in terms of extracurriculars, and which district?

 

When I present to our school board, I'd like to have specific examples of who's allowing what and under what terms to show our Board that it can be done successfully and is being done successfully in xyz districts.

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

Cross-posting...

 

I'm meeting with our superintendent next week to discuss homeschooler integration within our distinct.

 

I'm hoping to advocate for our district to allow as much integration as is allowable under state regulations. So for example, AP classes, art, music, band, etc. But not sports, as that's not allowed per the State's Interscholastic rules.

 

So before I head in with him, I'd like to know what other districts in NY allow or don't allow.

 

Please comment with your district (or other ones that you know of), and what they allow/don't allow.

 

Thanks!

[New Yorkers...What does your district allow for integration?]

Cross-posting...

 

I'm meeting with our superintendent next week to discuss homeschooler integration within our distinct.

 

I'm hoping to advocate for our district to allow as much integration as is allowable under state regulations. So for example, AP classes, art, music, band, etc. But not sports, as that's not allowed per the State's Interscholastic rules.

 

So before I head in with him, I'd like to know what other districts in NY allow or don't allow.

 

Please comment with your district (or other ones that you know of), and what they allow/don't allow.

 

Thanks!

[Summer Math Review for 6th Grader Going Back to School??]

Yeah, Prodigy Math would be really good for this. You can set up a teacher/parent account, create student accounts for them and then add them to your "classroom". Then, in your dashboard, you can go in and hand pick which topics to review, setting assignments for them to encounter as they play the game.

 

And if they're like many other kids...they will WANT to play this game...lol. My crew love it.

[kids getting bored? Mine are liking new online math game -]

Anna...you need 30 I think it is, for a group buy. I kind of stumbled into the one that was offered last spring...she's offered it a couple of times. I imagine she'd offer it again if enough people expressed interest!

[After Singapore 5...]

Well....he took the school's standardized assessment and scored at above 6th grade level and demonstrated beyond proficiency for algebra readiness.

 

So depending on how this coming year goes....I think we'll launch right in to pre-al next year.

[Fun, online math game that's not Prodigy?]

I've found quite a few over the years, but my kids burn out quickly on them because they are not well done. Or...they only target limited math skills, which means I have to find numerous games to cover different topics.

[So now I'm frustrated with Prodigy]

Are they going to change the interface to allow more curriculum flexibility? Or make it more closed? Now I'm worried I'll lose the ability to assign outside my own stream entirely.

 

I guess I should send support an email. And maybe make some suggestions. The homeschool market demands flexibility! lol.

I believe they are going to be making the interface more flexible but did quote me on that. They definitely take into consideration opinions and suggestions! I'm part of a focus group that they've put together for just this purpose!

 

Join their forum and add suggestions!