Erica in PA
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Posts posted by Erica in PA
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The mods are likely to make this thread go "poof" if we all don't :chillpill: They've been pretty trigger-happy lately...
Frankly I have no problem with the thread being deleted. Since very few Christians do identify themselves as "fundies," I think this entire thread has become a way for people to express what they don't like about conservative Christians, and to pat themselves on the back for not being one themselves. As someone else pointed out, fundamentalist is basically being defined as someone more conservative/literal/rigid/etc. than I am. Not that useful a term then, in my opinion.
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I'm joining WW Saturday morning. I will have to travel about 20 miles to get to the meeting. There are meetings closer to us (just down the street), but they are in the evenings and that doesn't work with our schedule. Anyway, I will be buying groceries while I'm there, b/c we really don't have a good grocery store here. Can anyone give me some advice on the things to pick up on my grocery trip? Things that fit nicely into the program, that you absolutely love. I'm a big time carb addict. I'm excited.
thanks
Angela
The big must-have snack for me is popcorn. I make a big bowl, coat it with butter spray, then shake popcorn seasoning over it. Ranch and nacho cheese are my favorite. You can have 5 cups for 3 points, which is a very large, filling snack. I use loose kernels in a microwave popcorn container that I bought at Target.
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This has been addressed in this thread (I believe) and I know in the other thread about this multiple times, and in many other threads :). I'm not going to start it all over again, if that's all right. I was simply answering a question on a specific point on science & the Bible agreeing. I don't want to rehash the entire YE/OE issue again. :001_smile:
Yes, you're right. I realized I was covering ground that has been covered elsewhere, but I wasn't sure how to answer your post, because I didn't totally see how it related to my previous post. I didn't pick up that you were answering a question. So, not being sure of your point, I tried to answer what I thought you were saying as well as I could. :)
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Erica, thank you for this. I actually understand better what you're getting at now than I did from your first post on this topic. I'm slow, sometimes it takes restating for it to click. :001_smile: I guess what I was trying to get at, and did not express well, is that I think it diminishes the importance of the Bible when people insist on a literal interpretation (in essence if not in words, holding it up as a science text), because that places the scientific facts about the creation story on the same footing as the spiritual truths concerning the creation story (while I believe that they are not on the same footing, but the latter is far, far more important than the former). As I said before, I believe the point of the story is that the glory for all creation goes to God. And I fear that this message actually gets muddled, not amplified, by insisting on a literal YE interpretation of the story. I hope that makes sense.
I'm glad GretaLynne. I always know that I can interact with you on topics like this, because you are very gracious and respectful! Thank you!
You did make one point that I do not understand. You said, "It diminishes the importance of the Bible when people insist on a literal interpretation (in essence if not in words, holding it up as a science text), because that places the scientific facts about the creation story on the same footing as the spiritual truths concerning the creation story." Why do you think that holding to a literal reading of creation diminishes the importance of the Bible, or the meaning of the creation account? I don't see how it robs the story of its spiritual value, believing that it actually happened the way it says it did. Would you mind elaborating on that?
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So (to go way out on a limb :lol:) what if "mitochondrial Eve" was really Eve, if you believe in Old Earth creationism/theistic evolutionism? The point at which the bodies were finally in the image of God & ready to house our spirits?
Or were you speaking only to the Young Earth literal creationists? :)
What in the Bible would give the impression that there were any other people, with or without souls, before Adam and Eve? I also don't see any reason in the context of Genesis to take the 7 days as millions of years. It seems to me that God would have said many years, if many years passed. But he said it took seven days.
Imo, it is people's desire to not contradict science (again, holding that as the authority that cannot be disputed), that leads them to interpret Genesis in that way. I do not see how it derives from the actual reading of the text itself.
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I see. Thanks for clarifying. So if I'm understanding correctly, your objection is with people who self identify as Christian and yet don't take the bible literally as truth on every matter, including as it relates to what is now commonly called scientific knowledge?
Sort of. It does bother me when those who claim to believe the Bible allow that other kinds of knowledge are more accurate than what the Bible states, in any case. For example, if science weren't claiming that humans evolved from apes, Christians would accept the Bible's teaching that they were the first two people, created directly by God. But people believe instead that science has that part right, *not* the Bible, so they call the part where the Bible says something radically different "figurative". People want to say that it's a matter of interpretation, but in reality, they are saying that parts of the Bible are actually *wrong.* Either God did things the way the Bible says He did, or He didn't. If the Bible has errors about such important things as how the earth and all in it came to be, I have no idea why people should believe anything in it at all. It's all in question, then.
Also, if God is capable of creating the world, orchestrating all the events in history, providing salvation through His own son, etc., I would think that He could also manage to produce a book about His plan that was actually true and accurate, in all points. If He couldn't even give a simple, real explanation of how He formed the earth, without making mistakes... that's pretty sad for an omnipotent, omniscient God. Or if a person who wrote it down made mistakes in that area, why trust what they wrote in another area? That is why I can understand much more clearly the viewpoint of someone who rejects the Bible altogether.
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Yes, that's right.
I believe it IS just a story. And I believe reason, applied in a scientific manner, is the ultimate way we have of understanding reality.
For the person who has no faith in the Bible as God's Word, that makes sense. I wouldn't expect you to think otherwise. However, it seems to me to be preaching to the choir to use arguments like, "The Bible is not a science text." To the person who believes the Bible, the answer to that is... "True, and....?" It only appeals to those who do hold science texts as being superior to the Bible in terms of accurately expressing reality.
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The explanation that is both far more reasonable, and far more faithful, to me, is to understand that the purpose of the Genesis account was that the "credit" and the glory for all of creation goes to God - it's not about whether He did it in six days or fifteen billion years, the point is He did it. Genesis is meant to teach us about our relationship with God, not to be a science text.
I appreciated your post, but I have to vent a little here: when people make the comment that Genesis is not a "science text," it really bugs me. (And I have seen it all over the place, in just about every conversation on this topic, so I'm not aiming this at you personally, GretaLynne.) To me, that elevates science as being *the ultimate* in terms of reality, and relegates the Bible to a mere story that is to be disbelieved if at any point it seems to contradict what science tells us. If God is who the Bible claims He is, and if He did in fact send His message to mankind in one book, the Bible, He and the Bible itself are far above any science book written by a fallible man. If the two contradict, it is not the Bible that is wrong, it is SCIENCE.
So, no the Bible is not a science text, and I praise the Lord that it is not! It is imminently more reliable and more trustworthy than any science text could ever be. I trust the perspective of the Creator far more than any of the insights of even the most intelligent products of his Creation.
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I think I understand what you are saying: you believe that the death that entered the world through sin (Rom 5:12) does not refer to physical death but rather spiritual death, so that death was always part of the God's creation, including in the garden of Eden? Thus, Adam and Eve would have physically died whether they sinned or not? Have I understood you correctly?
Thank you for bringing up this aspect of the discussion, Tracy. I think it is a crucial point. I think it is almost impossible to conceive that physical death (for all creatures, plant, animal and human) has been God's plan from the beginning. That the death of all of His Creation was part of what God considered "good"?? If not, what did cause death, if not Adam's sin? It's not a point to just toss out the window, or reply with a "gotcha" question of one's own...I think this is a point that people should honestly consider.
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Just wondering about the Scriptural basis for church (ie going to an approved denominational building on a pre-appointed day to worship/hear a sermon) versus home churching. This is all very new and interesting to me and I wondered if anyone here has already hoed this row (as so frequently happens when I think I may finally be having an original thought!:lol:) Recently, someone uttered this shocker to me "Just because people are at church doesn't mean they are the Church. I think Jesus' Church may look alot different than we think it does." Talk about your gear-shifter. (Yeah, I am sure most of you have already figured this out. Took me longer. As usual.:D)
So? Any thoughts, Scripture, dire warnings?
It's clear from Scripture that believers are to join together regularly for worship, teaching, and to celebrate the Lord's Supper. While *where* it is to take place is not important, there is a definite structure in the NT church (decaons, elders, spiritual gifts being used regularly, caring for widows, older people teaching the younger, etc.) that is be in place. Personally, I think would be difficult for many people in today's culture to replicate this in their homes. There is also an accountability and a submission to authority that is called for, that doesn't seem to happen when a group of like-minded friends get together informally.
*Could* a biblical church meet in a home? Yes, that is where the early church met. However, I did want to point out that there is more to a church as described in the Bible than simply getting together and doing worship and bible study together.
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Erica,
You could do Notgrass World History in 9th grade. Start in the textbook where you want to cover 20th century world history. I would add in documentaries, additional non-fiction reading from periods where you want to go more in depth, and some historical fiction. Then in 10th grade you could start at the beginning of the text and complete it in one semester (since it has already been well covered in the past) and then do something like Abeka geography the second semester (it is a one semester course). Then do Notgrass American History in 11th and gov/econ in 12th.
HTH
I have been looking at that option, but there is a lot of overlap between Notgrass W.H. and the time period we're doing this year (world history through 1849). A little more than half of the lessons in Part 2 would be review. In fact, I just pulled Noah from the co-op (CHASE) class where they are doing Part 2 of Notgrass W.H. next year, because of the overlap. I signed him up for health instead, since he still needed that class too.
What about doing Notgrass US History next year? I'm really liking how this program looks, from what I can see on the website. Then Geography in 10th, World History in 11th, and gov./econ. in 12th? I've seen that most people tend to do American History in 11th grade-- is there a reason why I should wait to do that?
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Thank you all for your posts. I've looked into all of your suggestions, and they have helped me to narrow down exactly what I'm looking for. I am leaning toward the traditional route for high school history, with one year American history, one year world history, a year of geography, and a year of civics/government. So now I have to decide in what order to do them, and which programs to use. I would like to use a program that has some sort of spine-- as much as we love good literature, I just feel more comfortable with a textbook to give structure for the upper levels. I also would still really like to cover 20th century history next year (9th grade). We have led up to this point in the history cycle twice before without really diving in on that fourth year, and I want to do that this time.
I'm thinking of using this order: US History (focusing mostly on 1850s-today), Geography, World History, Civics/government. Does that make sense, or is there a strong reason for doing Geography in 9th, before moving on?
If I do go with that order, I guess this is what I'm looking for: a textbook program that focuses on 20th century history (could be US or world history), that is suitable for a ninth grader. Would Notgrass US History be a good fit?
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That man is just horrifying. I would love to leave a comment on his blog but to do so would require becoming a member and that is something I would never do.
I find it very telling that Pearl claims that all good children, and all well adjusted adults are his. Pearl does not glorify God in any way nor aknowledge that all good comes from Him. To Mr. Pearl I would like to say;
Whenever a mother finds herself going too far in taking your parenting advice and beating her child, may she find a loving counselor to help her do better. That counselor will be one of His.
Whenever a parent finds himself in the unthinkable situation of being incarcerated for having murdered a child by following your advice, may they find a forgiving pastor or minister to help him. That pastor will be one of His.
Whenever a child grows up to be an adult with an empty hole in his heart where safety, security and love from parents should be, and instead finds only fear and pain because, not only did his parents beat him but expressed their delight in doing so on your advice; may he find a friend to lead him to the healer of all sorrows, the Savior, Jesus Christ. That friend will be one of His.
When a young adult finds herself terrified to hold her newborn baby because the only example she has ever seen are those who followed your advice and abused their infants, may she find someone who will show her a better way; the loving way to raise a child. That someone will be one of His.
When you pass from this life, Mr. Pearl, do you expect that the Savior will meet you with a whip around his neck to give you what you deserve? No he will meet you with his palms upraised to show the wounds he received in atoning for your sins so you wouldn't have to feel the whip. Then he will ask you why you caused so much pain and suffering, sorrow and heartbreak in His name. I wonder what the answer will be.
Just my 2 cents,
Amber in SJ
Your post literally gave me chills, Amber. So very, very insightful, and gracious. I hope you will consider emailing this to Mr. Pearl. He needs to read it.
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We are enjoying Sonlight Core 300 for 20th century.
That doesn't answer what you will do for Highschool as a whole though sorry. With J we used History Odyssey (meh) for Medieval, and our own thing for Early Modern. Next son I'm thinking either TWTM suggestions or Sonlight.
I do like the looks of Sonlight 300, so I will have to look into that option a bit more. Would that count as a world history credit?
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Do you want Christian content? If so, then maybe look at My Father's World:
http://www.mfwbooks.com/highschool.html
Their h.s. programs include history, English Lit/Composition & Bible (1 credit in each subject, per year). Then you use whatever you want for science, math, and electives, although they do have recommendations for those subjects.
Thank you. I will check it out!
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Hey Erica,
It depends on what you want to do with the high school years. I am tending to follow a more traditional approach. We are doing goegraphy in 9th with BJU. Then world history in 10th with Notgrass and American in 11th also with Notgrass. Senior year will be American gov. and economics. You could continue doing the 4 year rotation by following the WTM by doing a great books study. There is also TOG out there which follows the 4 year rotation but is pricey. You could also consider Omnibus by Veritas. Lots of choices!!! Hope that doesn't muddy the waters too much ;).
Thank you, Chris. I do think I tend to lean more toward the traditional approach as well. We've been through the history cycle twice, and to be honest, I don't think either of us has it in us to do it all again. :tongue_smilie: I like the way you're breaking it down, with one year of world history, one year of American history, and other social studies-type classes the other two years. When you do it this way, how do you do literature? Do you tie it into what you're learning in history at all, or is it totally separate?
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I am trying to decide how to approach high school level history for ds who will be in 9th grade next year. We've mostly used the WTM approach to this point, with SOTW, and we've gone through the cycle twice. I just reread the WTM approach for high school, and I'm not sure that I want to continue with the four year cycle again through high school. Starting with the ancients a third time just sounds really blah to me, and I'm sure to ds as well. The time period we haven't done as much with is 1900 to the present, so I definitely would like to spend some time on those. We've barely done anything with the World Wars, for example. Never did much with Korea or Vietnam or the Cold War or any of the Presidents from the 1900s. I don't want to go through all of the ancients, middle ages, exploration AGAIN before we squeeze in this important modern stuff right before he graduates. Not to say we won't do any of that in high school, but just not right now.
So.... not having WTM to fall back on, I'm at a loss. I don't even really know where to start looking. I need something reasonably priced. Engaging, and challenging. A Christian perspective would be nice. I tend to prefer programs that have a text-style spine, versus entirely literature based, though I would consider anything at this point.
I would love to hear what you are using for high school, if you are not using the chronological 4 year approach. Or even if you are doing that, if you are using materials that could be used in a different order.
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Okay, it's suddenly hitting me that my son is going to be in 9th grade next year, and I haven't given any thought to what how we will cover history in high school!! He has used mostly the Story of the World series, co-op classes, or things I have pulled together on my own, for the past 8 years, and now... I don't know WHAT to do!
The only time period that he has not studied much is the 20th Century, so I know that is something I would like to spend more time on at some point in high school. Other than that, it's just a huge open space, waiting to be filled.
I have no idea about programs, books, courses, anything....Any suggestions?
ETA: Oops, I just realized I should be posting this on the High School Board!!! See, I really don't have my head wrapped around the fact that ds is going to be in HIGH SCHOOL!!! :)
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We don't do youth group because every one we've seen is stupid, immature or downright unscriptural.
Really?? I would have a hard time attending a church which offered stupid, immature, or unscriptural activities to any group of people. How could I respect the leadership if they had such bad judgment regarding young people? Or are you saying that you have never actually attended a church which had a youth group?
I have to wonder what so many of you would think of our church's youth group. From some of the comments, I have to assume that many of you would be very shocked, because it's nothing like what's been described here. We meet Wednesday evenings for and hour and a half of prayer, worship, and Bible study. About every other month we will have a game night or other fun activity, and about that often we will also do a service project. All of the leaders are married, and all but one are parents who are active in the church. We don't seek to supplant the role of parents in discipling their children, but rather to supplement what they are doing, and provide the opportunity to interact with Biblical truth along with their peers in a supportive environment.
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Coming in a little late ;) I'm basing my anwers on the assumption that the hypothetical man and woman are Christians...
Now, aside from a man expecting his wife to submit for fear of not obeying Scripture, why else would a man expect his wife to be the only submissive one?
I'm not sure about a "fear of not obeying scripture" so much as not submitting to God's will. As far as expecting his wife to submit... well, I think our expectations are based on preconcieved notions, so either he believes all wives submit, or his wife has made it clear she would submit, or he assumes they both believe in a wife submitting.
If a man has a smart, hard-working, spiritually mature wife, why would he want a woman who is expected to obey as an adult might expect a child to obey?
I don't think that's what Biblical submission is about and I don't believe that many men would expect their wife to behave or obey like a child, except where the will of God is concerned, in which case we're all supposed to be like unto children.
Why wouldn't a man marry a woman that he considers his equal in both mind and spirit?
He could've been misled, or he could want to protect a woman. I don't know, something like that would really depend on the person. God's will isn't so clear in the whys very often, ime anyway. If he felt it was God's will and she was his soul mate, then it could very well be that she provides him with things he is lacking. I've seen couples like this that boggled my mind, but the spouse that seemed stronger in the brains department really seemed to find fulfillment in their other half.
Is it because they are control-hungry? Is it because all of us prefers to have our own way?
Sometimes, sure, but if we're talking about believing Christians I don't think so.
This post isn't really about whether a man has the Scriptural basis to demand submission, it's about why would he want to (other than fear of disobeying Scripture?)
I want my husband to be who God made him to be. In the case of "why" a husband would want his wife to submit, a good part of it would be, because she is meant to. The good, Godly marraiges I see have a husband that loves and respects his wife. She defers to him and he makes sure not to place stumbling blocks in her way. The husbands do not ask things from their wives that they know their wives could not deliver on and they (husbands) serve their wives, because that is the model that Christ set forth.
I do believe it makes sense, if it's taken with the full spirit and meaning rather than cherry picked. I don't believe the rules change or that scripture loses its meaning, because of cultural changes.
:iagree: I would just add this: While there certainly are men, Christian and otherwise, who want their wives to submit to them for reasons other than a desire to obey Scripture (power trip, abuse, ego, etc.), I think it's faulty reasoning to conclude that there is a bad motive like this among all, or even most, Christian men. My husband wants me to follow the Bible's teaching for wives for the same reason I want him to follow the Bible's teaching for husbands-- because we are all called to obedience, and because we each know the blessings that come from being obedient. There are also other reasons why following God's plan for marriages works well on a practical level, but just even if there weren't benefits and blessings in following God, it's still what we're called to do.
Imo, the fact that I may be intelligent, capable, skilled, etc., has absolutely nothing to do with the issue. My husband knows my strengths, and considers all that I say, very carefully-- more carefully than he would consider the words of anyone else in the world. That is not a weak place to be in-- my knowledge and abilities are put to full use, constantly.
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Yes, I think eveyone CAN be a homeschooling parent.
Do I think that everyone will DO WHAT IT TAKES to be a homeschooling parent-absolutely not. it isn't easy, as you well know.
But, I have seen some parents become what it takes when their dc met a crisis in ps, and they decided to bring them home.
:iagree: My belief is that f you are a good parent, you can be a good homeschooling parent, if you are willing to do what it takes. Not everyone is willing, and if they are not, they should not take on the responsibility. But do I believe that I have a special, particular gift for homeschooling that others do not? No, I don't think so.
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In Ethiopia, no parent can relinquish custody of a child without consent by the parent and a judge in court, on two different occasions. CWA has nothing at all to do with that!! It is all in their courts system. Without the court decree and the parent's signature relinquishing rights, an adoption can not take place!!
I have read this argument elsewhere online, and I find it to be a bit of a straw man argument. I didn't see anywhere in the story where it was claimed that the parents did not sign the papers, or that CWA stole away children without parental consent...rather it was that CWA was being overly aggressive about encouraging poor families to give up their children for adoption. A poor, struggling parent may well sign the papers to give their child what they consider to be a better life, but that doesn't necessarily make the process ethical. On one video, a woman was seen asking a group of villagers on behalf of CWA who would like to send their children to America, and telling them to leave their children there if they did. In the follow-up, the attorney for CWA denied that this was in any way coercive, but I think many people would disagree with that.
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ARG he's driving me crazy! He throws up about 5-8 times per day, sometimes more. It's not hairballs or bile, it's gross food coloured stuff that stains, but thank God it doesn't stink! I'm just sick of cleaning it up and steam cleaning! He is blind and has a heart murmer, but these things have not bothered him. Recently, however, he has begun to take the stairs really slowly, like his joints are in pain. He's not meowing more than usual and apart from the slowness on the stairs, I don't believe he is uncomfortable or in pain, but who's to say. If I was throwing up that often, I'd be beyond miserable!
I'm bringing him to the vet next week, but part of me wants to just put him down regardless of what the vet says. But of course we all love him and would miss him. He's only 8 yrs old and apart from the throwing up, is a wonderful snuggly cat with a gorgeous coat of white and buff. not one to get rid of a pet just because. I do believe we made a commitment to him when we got him.
The thing is, I get enough steam cleaning from my special needs son and his potty issues... I really just have had enough of the cleaning.
What would you do?
*disclaimer* I realize there will be lots of strong opinions on this topic, so please be nice. This is a little hard for me...
Why are you waiting so long to take him to the vet? It sounds from your description that this has been going on for several days at least. He sounds as though he's very uncomfortable, if not actually suffering. I would take him in to the vet tomorrow and find out why he is vomiting 5-8 times per day! Address the euthanasia issue after you at least find out what is wrong with the poor guy.
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I'm wondering if anyone saw this story on the news, and what your reactions were, especially if you have experience with CWA or international adoption in general.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/02/15/cbsnews_investigates/main6210911.shtml
CWA refutes the story here: http://www.cwa.org/cbsnews-response.htm
Googling CWA Ethopian Adoptions brings up quite a few people who say that they were misled by CWA in various ways. I'm curious about this, especially because my sister in law is in the process of adopting from Ethiopia through CWA and expects to bring her son home in the next few months. I found the report troubling, and the response not entirely convincing, but I don't have all the background that some people might. Does anyone have any thoughts or experiences, positive or negative, about CWA?
Do you cook foods you don't like?
in General Education Discussion Board
Posted
:iagree: I might not exclusively make chili the way dh prefers it, but I wouldn't exclusively make it the way I prefer it, either. Just because I do the cooking doesn't mean dh isn't entitled to have some meals that he chooses.